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On the contrary, that is not a translation, that is simply you saying what you think and pretending it is what others think in the same way you interpret the Bible.
I will not banter on this topic on this forum because it is a completely ineffective way to actually study the Bible or learn it. If you feel you have a strong case to be made by all means, make an hour long video on the topic, post it to youtube and share the link.
I am currently finishing my project, I wrote a summary on the Bible references concerning the rapture. I am now creating an index for the verses used. Volume 1 is done with about 500 verse references, it will probably take me another 3 weeks to complete the index of verses on the other 9 volumes. But when I have finished I will be able to look at your dissertation on this subject.
I would recommend, if you don't wish to be dismissed immediately, that instead of relying on Hosea you focus on Romans and Revelation to make a case that Israel has been kicked to the curb. If you do not deal with what Paul says in Romans on the matter and on what is said in Revelation I would not have any interest in your video.
Thanks
A whole volume of 500 verses?? Really?? And then nine more volumes??? So it'll take you a bit of time until you can get around to what I've shared, I take it? hmm..I guess I'll have to patiently wait. What you're doing seems awfully important...that IS the reason why you shared all of that right?
So I wouldn't be accurate to say, "Translation: Even though I had time to dismiss what you said, I don't have time to actually address anything or prove why I dismissed it because I want to make seem like I have far more important things to do right now. And i don't want to go back and for about it"?
lol I kid, I kid!
I've been here a long time friend. I've seen all manner of behavior and responses. Believe me, I don't stay awake at night vying for anyone's approval here. My approval comes from on high. But I won't stop sharing the truth, no matter how uncomfortable it gets.
2 Timothy 2:15 [brackets mine]
[actually] Study to shew thyself approved unto God [not just reference verses], a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the [whole] word of truth [from Genesis to Revelation].
The ten volumes have already been written. I am just going through the books and tabulating the verses that were referenced for an index. It takes me about 2-3 days to go through the first volume so I estimate about 21 to 28 days to do the next 9 volumes. I have been working on this since 2020 and am nearing the end of the work.
Seriously? I asked him to take some time and "share the truth" in detail. I told him I would listen to him give a 1 hour presentation on his bible interpretation as long as he was referencing the New Testament as well, particularly Romans and Revelation and his response was a dodge.
Should the video be in color or black & white? What about using sound vs subtitles? Graphics or whiteboard? Double-spaced text?
lol no, I'm not going to make an hour-long video on YouTube specifically for you, and not doing so isn't a dodge and doesn't invalidate the argument I've made. Your request is simply to construct hoops to jump through to avoid providing any counter-proof yourself (because you're "so busy") while trying to establish yourself as a supposed authority on "true study". It is in fact the true dodge.
Like I said, I've been here a while and seen a lot. That's why I made the comment. If you can read 500+ verses in a book or on a screen you're perfectly capable of reading less than 1000 characters per post here. So how about you share what you disagree with (since obviously you do), and then provide reasons why you think it's bunk as many here have.
C'mon, it'll be fun!
D
daisyseesthesun
Guest
"And to you and your descendants I will give the land where you are residing--all the land of Canaan--as an eternal possession; and I will be their God."
'And now, thou Israel, hear the behests and dooms which I teach thee, that thou do those, and live, and that thou enter and wield the land which the Lord God of your fathers shall give to you. (And now, O Israel, listen to the statutes and laws, or judgements, which I shall teach thee, so that thou do them, and live, and so that thou can enter and take the land which the Lord God of your fathers shall give to you.'
The Mosaic Covenant was clear that living in the Land of Israel was a benefit of walking in obedience with God, and that even after exile, repentance would lead to Israel’s return. However, the Hebrew prophets spoke of a day when God would sovereignly gather His children back to the Land, not because of anything they had done, but to be a witness to the gentiles and to vindicate His name. The timing was up to Him (Psalm 102:13); He would do it (Jeremiah 23:3), and He would even use the gentiles to make it happen (Isaiah 49:22–26; 60:8–12).
God vindicates His name because it has been profaned before the nations through the disobedience and exile of His people (Ezekiel 36:22). He will demonstrate His holiness (Ezekiel 36:22–23) and His faithfulness, whether His children are deserving or not. It reflects His love and mercy toward them (Isaiah 60:8–10), as well as toward the world He plans to redeem and fill with His truth and glory for eternity (Psalm 102:16–22).
God had the Israelites scatter to the four wind, and now he calls them back. This is all at our fathers's will. “let God be true, and every man a liar,” as scripture says. For the truth of God lasts ever' He will fulfil every one of his promises. I know the Arab are angry about this but you have to remember Esau sold his inheritance to his brother jacob and though the Arabs cannot possess the land of the israelites that doesn't mean God doesnt love them. He is the Father of us all.
12 And he shall raise (up) a sign to (the) nations, and shall gather together the fleers-away of Israel; and he shall gather together the scattered men of Judah from [the] four coasts of [the] earth (yea, he shall gather together all those of Judah who be scattered unto the four corners of the earth).
'Fear not, for I am with you;
I will bring your descendants from the east,
And gather you from the west;
6 I will say to the north, ‘Give them up!’
And to the south, ‘Do not keep them back!’
Bring My sons from afar,
And My daughters from the ends of the earth '
15 but, The Lord liveth, that led [out] the sons of Israel from the land of the north, and from all lands to which I casted them out; and I shall lead them again into their land which I gave to the fathers of them. (but, As the Lord liveth, who led out the Israelites from the land of the north, and from all the lands to which I threw them out; and I shall lead them again into their land which I gave to their forefathers.)
'And now, thou Israel, hear the behests and dooms which I teach thee, that thou do those, and live, and that thou enter and wield the land which the Lord God of your fathers shall give to you. (And now, O Israel, listen to the statutes and laws, or judgements, which I shall teach thee, so that thou do them, and live, and so that thou can enter and take the land which the Lord God of your fathers shall give to you.'
The Mosaic Covenant was clear that living in the Land of Israel was a benefit of walking in obedience with God, and that even after exile, repentance would lead to Israel’s return. However, the Hebrew prophets spoke of a day when God would sovereignly gather His children back to the Land, not because of anything they had done, but to be a witness to the gentiles and to vindicate His name. The timing was up to Him (Psalm 102:13); He would do it (Jeremiah 23:3), and He would even use the gentiles to make it happen (Isaiah 49:22–26; 60:8–12).
God vindicates His name because it has been profaned before the nations through the disobedience and exile of His people (Ezekiel 36:22). He will demonstrate His holiness (Ezekiel 36:22–23) and His faithfulness, whether His children are deserving or not. It reflects His love and mercy toward them (Isaiah 60:8–10), as well as toward the world He plans to redeem and fill with His truth and glory for eternity (Psalm 102:16–22).
God had the Israelites scatter to the four wind, and now he calls them back. This is all at our fathers's will. “let God be true, and every man a liar,” as scripture says. For the truth of God lasts ever' He will fulfil every one of his promises. I know the Arab are angry about this but you have to remember Esau sold his inheritance to his brother jacob and though the Arabs cannot possess the land of the israelites that doesn't mean God doesnt love them. He is the Father of us all.
12 And he shall raise (up) a sign to (the) nations, and shall gather together the fleers-away of Israel; and he shall gather together the scattered men of Judah from [the] four coasts of [the] earth (yea, he shall gather together all those of Judah who be scattered unto the four corners of the earth).
'Fear not, for I am with you;
I will bring your descendants from the east,
And gather you from the west;
6 I will say to the north, ‘Give them up!’
And to the south, ‘Do not keep them back!’
Bring My sons from afar,
And My daughters from the ends of the earth '
15 but, The Lord liveth, that led [out] the sons of Israel from the land of the north, and from all lands to which I casted them out; and I shall lead them again into their land which I gave to the fathers of them. (but, As the Lord liveth, who led out the Israelites from the land of the north, and from all the lands to which I threw them out; and I shall lead them again into their land which I gave to their forefathers.)
Here we go! Some bible study! I appreciate you engaging the topic.
Amen.
Amen. "...not because of anything they had done..."
Ephesians 2:8-9
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
^ This is that promise. There's no work Israel can do to rectify their violation. Instead, they must believe in the Messiah. This is what that prophecy means. There will be no effort they can do to restore themselves.
And yet look at the current situation. The Israelis are themselves:
- Cleansing the land (by bombing and sniping innocent women & children and bulldozing cultural centers)
- Bribing other "Jews" to return with free money and free housing
- Warring with neighbors using their army and weaponry to expand territory
Assuming for the moment that they are the descendants, they're doing a lot. Doing everything themselves. Even their statehood comes as a result of their military action in 1947. Their actions contradict prophecy.
As you say He will vindicate his name from being profane by their disobedience and exile. Now think for a moment. How is The Sovereign, HOLY God vindicated in the eyes of the nations if His people are being regathered through acts He considers abominable (Proverbs 6:16-19) and acts the nations consider abominable? Everything we know about the Almighty must remain true. All the word is true. We can't overlook any part.
Next, when we read of the promised regathering from OT prophecies, we know that the Messiah and Paul repeated the same prophecies. Matthew 24:30-31 is the very same regathering of the people from the four winds promised in the OT:
Then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. And then all the peoples of the earth will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory.
And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.
^ This is the long-awaited second coming of the Son detailing that He will gather his Elect (i.e., the remnant of Israel - Romans 11:5, 7, 28) from the four corners they were scattered to, signaled by a loud trumpet. This is the very same event Paul explains in 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
There aren't two separate gatherings for two different flocks. There is one flock and one Shepherd (John 10:16) and one gathering which will be supernatural, coinciding with a resurrection of the dead. This is why the Valley of Dry Bones scene in Ezekiel 37 immediately follows the promise of the regathering you reference in Ezekiel 36. The valley of dry bones is the same resurrection event of Matthew 24:30-31 and 1 Thess 4:16-17; the same regathering of Israel promised in the OT that Gentile believers will be a part of.
How are they there and we are not?
Amen. It's not up to man's money or military or UN declaration on a specific date. However, we are told that it will be when the fullness number of Gentiles comes into the fold and when the Gentiles' time is over. All of it ties together.
Luke 21:24
They will fall by the sword and will be taken as prisoners to all the nations. Jerusalem will be trampled on by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.
Romans 11:25
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in
Is the time of the Gentiles over yet? If the answer is "yes" then where is the Messiah?
If the answer is "no" then we must conclude that those currently in control of Jerusalem...are Gentiles.
Jer 23:3
I myself will gather the remnant of my flock out of all the countries where I have driven them and will bring them back to their pasture, where they will be fruitful and increase in number.
Amen. He will do it. The Lord Himself will do it. Not governments.
1 Thess 4:16
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: ...
Notice how Isaiah 49:22 starts:
Thus saith the Lord God, Behold, I will lift up mine hand to the Gentiles, and set up my standard to the people: and they shall bring thy sons in their arms, and thy daughters shall be carried upon their shoulders.
This mirrors the same scene found in Isaiah 11:6-12:
The wolf will live with the lamb, and the leopard will lie down with the goat; the calf and young lion and fatling will be together and a little child will lead them.
7 The cow will graze with the bear, their young will lie down together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox.
8 The infant will play by the cobra’s den, and the toddler will reach into the viper’s nest.
9 They will neither harm nor destroy on all My holy mountain, for the earth will be full of the knowledge of the LORD as the sea is full of water.
10 On that day the Root of Jesse will stand as a banner for the people. The nations will seek Him and His place of rest will be glorious. 11 On that day the Lord will extend His hand a second time to recover the remnant of His people from Assyria, from Egypt, from Pathros, from Cush, from Elam, from Shinar, from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea.
12 He will raise a banner for the nations and gather the exiles of Israel; He will collect the scattered of Judah from the four corners of the earth.
Isaiah's passage gives us more details about the event:
- The Messiah himself will be here.
- He will stand as a sign to the Gentiles (not only as a rallying point for Gentile believers but one could also assume as proof that The Almighty is real and that the bible is true). And ye shall see the sign of the son of man in heaven and all the people shall mourn...
- It will be a time defined by peace, not constant war.
- We're even given specific areas the Messiah will regather His remnant from...and there's no mention of Germany, Poland, or other eastern European lands. One could argue the "islands of the sea" could be interpreted to include Britain and The Americas (Turtle Island), but what's striking is the lands that ARE mentioned are currently Arab/Muslim lands. Isaiah 11 says the lost tribes are there.
I think this will be interesting to discuss. I believe the people who are currently in control of the land are a mixture of Edomites, Hamites, and Japhethites (Europeans). I'll work on my argument as to why, so stay tuned.
Amen.
Amen. "...not because of anything they had done..."
Ephesians 2:8-9
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
^ This is that promise. There's no work Israel can do to rectify their violation. Instead, they must believe in the Messiah. This is what that prophecy means. There will be no effort they can do to restore themselves.
And yet look at the current situation. The Israelis are themselves:
- Cleansing the land (by bombing and sniping innocent women & children and bulldozing cultural centers)
- Bribing other "Jews" to return with free money and free housing
- Warring with neighbors using their army and weaponry to expand territory
Assuming for the moment that they are the descendants, they're doing a lot. Doing everything themselves. Even their statehood comes as a result of their military action in 1947. Their actions contradict prophecy.
As you say He will vindicate his name from being profane by their disobedience and exile. Now think for a moment. How is The Sovereign, HOLY God vindicated in the eyes of the nations if His people are being regathered through acts He considers abominable (Proverbs 6:16-19) and acts the nations consider abominable? Everything we know about the Almighty must remain true. All the word is true. We can't overlook any part.
Next, when we read of the promised regathering from OT prophecies, we know that the Messiah and Paul repeated the same prophecies. Matthew 24:30-31 is the very same regathering of the people from the four winds promised in the OT:
Then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. And then all the peoples of the earth will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory.
And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.
^ This is the long-awaited second coming of the Son detailing that He will gather his Elect (i.e., the remnant of Israel - Romans 11:5, 7, 28) from the four corners they were scattered to, signaled by a loud trumpet. This is the very same event Paul explains in 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
There aren't two separate gatherings for two different flocks. There is one flock and one Shepherd (John 10:16) and one gathering which will be supernatural, coinciding with a resurrection of the dead. This is why the Valley of Dry Bones scene in Ezekiel 37 immediately follows the promise of the regathering you reference in Ezekiel 36. The valley of dry bones is the same resurrection event of Matthew 24:30-31 and 1 Thess 4:16-17; the same regathering of Israel promised in the OT that Gentile believers will be a part of.
How are they there and we are not?
Amen. It's not up to man's money or military or UN declaration on a specific date. However, we are told that it will be when the fullness number of Gentiles comes into the fold and when the Gentiles' time is over. All of it ties together.
Luke 21:24
They will fall by the sword and will be taken as prisoners to all the nations. Jerusalem will be trampled on by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.
Romans 11:25
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in
Is the time of the Gentiles over yet? If the answer is "yes" then where is the Messiah?
If the answer is "no" then we must conclude that those currently in control of Jerusalem...are Gentiles.
Jer 23:3
I myself will gather the remnant of my flock out of all the countries where I have driven them and will bring them back to their pasture, where they will be fruitful and increase in number.
Amen. He will do it. The Lord Himself will do it. Not governments.
1 Thess 4:16
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: ...
Notice how Isaiah 49:22 starts:
Thus saith the Lord God, Behold, I will lift up mine hand to the Gentiles, and set up my standard to the people: and they shall bring thy sons in their arms, and thy daughters shall be carried upon their shoulders.
This mirrors the same scene found in Isaiah 11:6-12:
The wolf will live with the lamb, and the leopard will lie down with the goat; the calf and young lion and fatling will be together and a little child will lead them.
7 The cow will graze with the bear, their young will lie down together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox.
8 The infant will play by the cobra’s den, and the toddler will reach into the viper’s nest.
9 They will neither harm nor destroy on all My holy mountain, for the earth will be full of the knowledge of the LORD as the sea is full of water.
10 On that day the Root of Jesse will stand as a banner for the people. The nations will seek Him and His place of rest will be glorious. 11 On that day the Lord will extend His hand a second time to recover the remnant of His people from Assyria, from Egypt, from Pathros, from Cush, from Elam, from Shinar, from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea.
12 He will raise a banner for the nations and gather the exiles of Israel; He will collect the scattered of Judah from the four corners of the earth.
Isaiah's passage gives us more details about the event:
- The Messiah himself will be here.
- He will stand as a sign to the Gentiles (not only as a rallying point for Gentile believers but one could also assume as proof that The Almighty is real and that the bible is true). And ye shall see the sign of the son of man in heaven and all the people shall mourn...
- It will be a time defined by peace, not constant war.
- We're even given specific areas the Messiah will regather His remnant from...and there's no mention of Germany, Poland, or other eastern European lands. One could argue the "islands of the sea" could be interpreted to include Britain and The Americas (Turtle Island), but what's striking is the lands that ARE mentioned are currently Arab/Muslim lands. Isaiah 11 says the lost tribes are there.
I think this will be interesting to discuss. I believe the people who are currently in control of the land are a mixture of Edomites, Hamites, and Japhethites (Europeans). I'll work on my argument as to why, so stay tuned.
Act 3:21 - “whom heaven must receive until the times of restoration of all things, which God has spoken by the mouth of all His holy prophets since the world began.
What did you think? That Peter is speaking to gentiles and the Church? I think not.
Acts 3 is a record of before the destruction of the temple (and even before Cornelius' conversion and the gentiles inclusion into the Church), so using this to support your claim that there are separate covenants for Jews and the Church post the New Covenant/Testament is logically flawed.
My claim? No, that is not my claim. That is your claim.
Your problem is that you do NOT know or understand my claims, despite my hundreds to posts meant to define them.
Dear friend, I appreciate your greeting.
The Israelites are The Almighty's chosen people...but those people currently in control of the land are not the Israelites. They are liars and murderers and thieves. The Messiah is a Jew, but they are not and do lie. It was prophesied that in the end times, there would be those who claim to be Jews who are not. And it's really coming down to whether folks actually believe ALL of the scriptures or whether they rather believe the lie (like Paul warned would occur during the falling away).
If I may, do you believe they are Israelites because you studied the scriptures and history to prove they are or because you were born into a world where you saw or heard them called that; born into a world where you were told they were "God's chosen people" (by pastors, preachers, televangelists, etc)?
We are commanded to "prove all things, and holdfast to what is good." (1 Thessalonians 5:21). Did you prove it out or just accept it as fact? It is one thing to start at zero and then through a study of scripture and history reach that conclusion. I can't fault you for that. But often times believers begin studying from the starting point that Israelis and "Jewish" people are descendants of Israelites and then they force prophecy to fit them.
If Israel is in the land then Messiah is already here, so who's the Messiah?
I hope it is terribly brutal. It is the harshest condemnation I can possibly communicate without dishonoring myself. No, I do not mention October 7th or the most recently killed 6 hostages because no one who defends these pretenders will mention the multiple children who were sniped for fun by the IOF during the last week of September 2023, during a Gazan march/protest for freedom. Look it up. No one mentions the IOF purposely shooting young children because then it would damage the narrative. Notice how much rage was manufactured from the lie that Jewish babies were burned in ovens. Never happened. How do you think one should feel after witnessing their children shot for no reason? October 7th was retaliation against terrorists who shoot children for fun.
Messiah said, "judge not lest ye be judged by the same measure...Judge righteously".
Mentioning October 7th is akin to the Pharisees going to The Messiah with the woman caught in adultery, wanting Him to condemn her. Messiah wouldn't, He told the men there to cast the first stone if they were without sin. When you look at the text closest to the original you'll see He actually said something close to "he who is without THIS sin, cast the first stone." How did those men possibly know she was committing adultery? How was she "caught in the act"?? They KNEW her. They were very familiar with her. They were just as guilty of adultery but wanted to be partial with the law and with judgment. So if Messiah condemned her He would also condemn them. They knew it. He knew it. So they walked away.
So likewise, I'm not going to pass judgment on what Hamas did on October 7th because Israeli soldiers are equally as, if not more so, guilty of the same during the last week of September. I'm not going to judge Hamas for 6 killed Israeli hostages when 40 THOUSAND known civilians have been indiscriminately bombed and starved (to say nothing of the tens of thousands of undocumented deaths), most of which were children. Absolutely not. The only reason why there is outcry for these 6 is because the world values Jewish people and believes the Palestinians are absolutely worthless. And if I know anything about the God of scripture, His sentiment is ALWAYS the opposite of the world's because the world has fallen and He is righteous.
So while the world plays identity politics, He remains the same. This is why He said through Paul that He doesn't care about any claimed Jewish ethnicity on the outside. He sees all and knew there would be people who'd claim some benefit through the identity. He warned us.
^ Statements like this is what I'm talking about when I ask "who told you..." Where did you hear this from? Did you hear this from Israelis? Where is your proof of this or did you hear someone say it and then accepted it as gospel? Where is the proof that Gazans are teaching their children to hate and kill Israelis? Where? Meanwhile, I can direct you to proof that it is Israelis who are taught as kids and continue to teach their kids that the Palestinians hate them and will stop at nothing to kill them.
If people are taught from their formative years that their neighbors down the street want nothing more than to kill them as soon as they get the chance what type of people do you think Israeli children will grow into? How do you think they'd treat those neighbors? This is one of the beast's powers that was prophesied.
Revelation 13:15
The second beast was given power to give breath to the image of the first beast, so that the image could speak and cause all who refused to worship the image should be killed.
^ This passage prophesies how potent propaganda will be in the end times, our times. "The Israeli" is the image that is worshipped as "god's chosen" (instead of Christ = replacement Christ = anti-Christ) and anyone who doesn't support that image is framed as a terrorist who "should be killed".
1-2 million Israelis just fled Tel Aviv to other countries. Do you suppose that's by the will of The Almighty then?
D
daisyseesthesun
Guest
Yahshua,
I have read your replies and I find there are many errors.
First of all Let's sum up what you believe.
Your don’t believe that the people that are occupying Israel are the true Jews but the synagogue of Satan. You also believe the prosperity that the Jews possess is given to them by the devil. And that even if they are the real Jews they do not deserve the promised land because they have not repented and do not keep the covenant of Moses "God has divorced them" You also believe that "absolutely anyone else would be able to claim the land instead. And it doesn't matter what those people call themselves. They never broke the covenant so they aren't restricted from the land." You also believe the restoration of the Jews to Israel happens at the same time as the second coming of the Lord Christ Jesus.
Doesn't Jesus say I will sort my sheep from the goat? now let's look at the characteristics of the goat. they're rebellious and unruly and difficult to be lead.
But look at the sheep. They listen to the shepherd. Meek and obedient.
God says "Do not be like the horse or the mule, which have no understanding but must be controlled by bit and bridle"
God also say "For the natural man percieveth not the things of the spirit of God. For they are but foolishness unto him. Neither can he perceive them"
But anything is possible with God just like the old man is made anew so too can anyone be made new when they repent and come to our Lord Christ Jesus.
Now let's talk about your beliefs.
The restoration of the Jews and the second coming of the Lord are two separate events
Ezekiel 36:35-37 This land that was desolate is become like the garden of Eden; and the waste and desolate and ruined cities are become fenced, and are inhabited.
It just so happens that the land Palestine/ Israel was fought over since the sacking of Jerusalem in 70 CE and no one lived within the wall of Jerusalem for centuries.
I know you believe that God, not the government restored Israel. But is not the government also in God's hands?
When the devil asked to test Jobs' faithfulness did he not ask God's permission first? Can not the God that directed Baalam and Nebuchadnezzar direct others too? I believe God used T.E. Lawrence (Lawrence of Arabia) to unite the Arabs against the Ottoman Empire which controlled Palestine for 400 years. Which lead to the English taking control of the holy land and the Jews returning to Israel. He wrote in his letters that "the points that strike me are that the Arabs came into the war without making a previous treating with us and have consistently refused to listen to the temptations of other powers."
There is a clear difference between the blessing of the Israelites which is holy and the blessing of the devil which is evil.
What did the devil say to Jesus in the desert? '8 Again, the devil took Him up on an exceedingly high mountain, and showed Him all the kingdoms of the world and their glory. 9 And he said to Him, “All these things I will give You if You will fall down and worship me.”
"Highly esteemed by men but an abomination to God" What does this mean?
It means that those in power, with influence, and highly admired by men are not of God.
if you want to see people blessed by satan Look no further than Hollywood. People have said for years that to become famous a sacrifice is needed. The gift of the devil are evil and lead to unhappiness” ‘’I have no true happiness though I have wealth, fame, and power.” 80% of Hollywood proclaim themselves Jews.
the wicked man will not care for the law or the scriptures it will not even come to their mind. But it is not so for the righteous. They will meditate and the scripture and it will be in their heart. The Israelites meditate upon God's Laws and scriptures. The Torah is read publicly and the synagogues are visited multiple times a day.
The Palestinians are upheld by the world is evident by the liberals standing up for Palestinians. Only the Christians stand with the Israelites. But know this God even loves the Palestinians. Wasn't there a report where many saw visions of our Christ Jesus?
However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come.
All Christians will believe and understand many truths The delusion that you speak of doesn't affect the elect. Christ Jesus is not a God that tells one servant the truth and another a lie.
I have read your replies and I find there are many errors.
First of all Let's sum up what you believe.
Your don’t believe that the people that are occupying Israel are the true Jews but the synagogue of Satan. You also believe the prosperity that the Jews possess is given to them by the devil. And that even if they are the real Jews they do not deserve the promised land because they have not repented and do not keep the covenant of Moses "God has divorced them" You also believe that "absolutely anyone else would be able to claim the land instead. And it doesn't matter what those people call themselves. They never broke the covenant so they aren't restricted from the land." You also believe the restoration of the Jews to Israel happens at the same time as the second coming of the Lord Christ Jesus.
Doesn't Jesus say I will sort my sheep from the goat? now let's look at the characteristics of the goat. they're rebellious and unruly and difficult to be lead.
But look at the sheep. They listen to the shepherd. Meek and obedient.
God says "Do not be like the horse or the mule, which have no understanding but must be controlled by bit and bridle"
God also say "For the natural man percieveth not the things of the spirit of God. For they are but foolishness unto him. Neither can he perceive them"
But anything is possible with God just like the old man is made anew so too can anyone be made new when they repent and come to our Lord Christ Jesus.
Now let's talk about your beliefs.
The restoration of the Jews and the second coming of the Lord are two separate events
Ezekiel 36:35-37 This land that was desolate is become like the garden of Eden; and the waste and desolate and ruined cities are become fenced, and are inhabited.
It just so happens that the land Palestine/ Israel was fought over since the sacking of Jerusalem in 70 CE and no one lived within the wall of Jerusalem for centuries.
I know you believe that God, not the government restored Israel. But is not the government also in God's hands?
When the devil asked to test Jobs' faithfulness did he not ask God's permission first? Can not the God that directed Baalam and Nebuchadnezzar direct others too? I believe God used T.E. Lawrence (Lawrence of Arabia) to unite the Arabs against the Ottoman Empire which controlled Palestine for 400 years. Which lead to the English taking control of the holy land and the Jews returning to Israel. He wrote in his letters that "the points that strike me are that the Arabs came into the war without making a previous treating with us and have consistently refused to listen to the temptations of other powers."
There is a clear difference between the blessing of the Israelites which is holy and the blessing of the devil which is evil.
What did the devil say to Jesus in the desert? '8 Again, the devil took Him up on an exceedingly high mountain, and showed Him all the kingdoms of the world and their glory. 9 And he said to Him, “All these things I will give You if You will fall down and worship me.”
"Highly esteemed by men but an abomination to God" What does this mean?
It means that those in power, with influence, and highly admired by men are not of God.
if you want to see people blessed by satan Look no further than Hollywood. People have said for years that to become famous a sacrifice is needed. The gift of the devil are evil and lead to unhappiness” ‘’I have no true happiness though I have wealth, fame, and power.” 80% of Hollywood proclaim themselves Jews.
the wicked man will not care for the law or the scriptures it will not even come to their mind. But it is not so for the righteous. They will meditate and the scripture and it will be in their heart. The Israelites meditate upon God's Laws and scriptures. The Torah is read publicly and the synagogues are visited multiple times a day.
The Palestinians are upheld by the world is evident by the liberals standing up for Palestinians. Only the Christians stand with the Israelites. But know this God even loves the Palestinians. Wasn't there a report where many saw visions of our Christ Jesus?
However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come.
All Christians will believe and understand many truths The delusion that you speak of doesn't affect the elect. Christ Jesus is not a God that tells one servant the truth and another a lie.
^ ad hominem.
^ strawman, ad hominem.
To read this boggles the mind because there are literally known towns and villages where Palestinians primarily resided before being massacred and ethnically cleansed.
Wikipedia: List of Palestinian towns and villages depopulated
I'm asking you for proof. I'm asking you to verify this rather than say it's a fact. Meanwhile, I can share with you Israeli historian Ilan Pappe testifying to his people being indoctrinated in their school system. I can also share with you proof that Palestinians welcomed Jewish people into their land when they were fleeing Nazi persecution and lived in peace with them until the Zionist immigrants started taking land and property.
I can also share with you proof that historically Muslim Arabs have always protected and blessed the Jews persecuted by Rome and Christians because of their shared ancestry. They were the reason why Jews were originally allowed to return to Jerusalem. When the Caliphate conquered the land back from Rome they granted Jews the right of return for no reason but because of who they were.
Ask me for proof and I'll share it.
Is there a Palestinian historian or recorded history of children being taught in school to hate Israelis, proof that's not from the mouths of Israelis? Please provide proof.
I'll provide proof if you want. But regardless the point is still made. So, let's accept 1611's English translation for now. You condemn October 7, 2023. I do not because Israeli soldiers shot at little children on September 19, 2023. The law prescribes an eye for an eye (Ex 21:24; Lev 24:20). Hamas' sin isn't greater than Israel's sin in this case.
Israel resumed the deliberate use of excessive and lethal force against Palestinian protesters in Gaza, killing one and injuring eight
The Guardian: Influx of injuries may suggest deliberate targeting by Israel’s army, which human rights groups say is unlawful
Do you condemn what Israeli soldiers did on September 19, 2023?
^ Heresay.
I have heard more than once during bris, that Rabbis commit a lewd oral act to boys just before circumcision.
Do you see how worthless statements like this are?
The rest of this isn't even worth addressing.
Wow, you're able to determine that so quickly?? But you just got here! I think I do ok.
See my added brackets, but ok.
Yup. He also says to let both exist together until the harvest and He will separate them then (Matthew 13:24-30). The harvest is at the end of the world.
Can you share your argument why the restoration of the Jews and the second coming are two separate events?
It's incorrect to say no one lived within Jerusalem for centuries after 70 CE. If you mean no Jews then ok, but immediately after 70 AD three groups lived in Jerusalem, yes amongst the ruins (someone had to rebuild):
Roman Soldiers: https://drivethruhistoryadventures.... there the,; Eusebius, Ecclesiastical History).
Roman Immigrants: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aelia...sures (which,) and stone vessels, disappeared.
Christians: (Same link as Roman Soldiers link)
Also, I want to point out that Jerusalem =/= the entire land of Israel/Palestine or even Judea...just to make sure we're not conflating terms. It's easy to read the fate of Jerusalem and assume that fate was for the entirety of the land. Jerusalem is but one city. There remained Jewish populations in the land of Israel after the destruction of the temple in Jerusalem (source: Jewish communities in other parts of Israel).
No, I don't believe the Almighty reestablished the Kingdom of Israel yet. I believe what we're seeing is an invention of man to deceive the world and gain riches.
Truly, governments/nations rise and fall at His will (Job 12:23; Romans 13:1), but He allows evil nations that should never have been, to exist for a time until their sins reach full measure, using them as instruments of judgment when necessary. When their time is up He uses those nations to display His glory (as vessels for destruction).
What does sovereignty mean? Does it mean the Almighty is micromanaging everything and it is impossible for man or principality to exercise their own wills? Or does it mean that His will will be done regardless of what man or principality does or intends to do and that they will never succeed in the end?
(Genesis 50:20). He is the ultimate chess player.
Do you believe that the devil possessed all the kingdoms of the world and their glory when he tempted the Messiah? Do you believe the devil still possesses them?
For comparison, note the following passage:
Revelation 11:15
And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever
The word "become/becoming" signals that the previous state isn't true after Messiah reigns. So until the Messiah comes to reign over all kingdoms does the devil possess ALL kingdoms of the world including the modern State of Israel and their glory?
Go back to Daniel 2 and the statue showing all the empires of the world. The only kingdom that is called The Almighty's is depicted as a stone descending from heaven that crashes down on the toes of the statue (representing a mixture of nations) and then grows into a mountain.
Again, all the scriptures are true so we can't ignore one letter. So where does this modern state of Israel fit? Is it part of the mixed nations, or is it the stone that descends from heaven? If it is the stone, again WHERE IS THE MESSIAH?
We must always take scripture as our base and then fit what we see in the world to scripture, not the other way around.
Yes, indeed. They own the mainstream media and approve what is fed to the masses.
According to a 2015 study, 65% of all Israelis identify as "not religious" or "convinced atheists". Only 12% are religious/orthodox. But this was in 2015. I wonder what it is today. But seems the majority of Israelis are "wicked" then.
Can you share a source for this? "The Palestinians are upheld by THE WORLD". Are the liberals "the world"?
Arab Countries that ally with Israel:
Bahrain.
Egypt.
Jordan.
Morocco.
Saudi Arabia.
United Arab Emirates.
Countries that recognized Israel:
Argentina, Australia, Bolivia, the Byelorussian SSR, Canada, Chile, China, Colombia, Costa Rica, Cuba, Czechoslovakia, the Dominican Republic, Ecuador, France, Guatemala, Haiti, Honduras, Iceland, Liberia, Luxembourg, Mexico, the Netherlands, New Zealand, Nicaragua, Norway, Panama, Paraguay, Peru, the Philippines, Poland, the Ukrainian SSR, South Africa, the Soviet Union, the United States, Uruguay, Venezuela, and Yugoslavia
Countries that aid Israel financially and militarily:
USA
Germany
Italy
Britain
Countries that have free trade deals with Israel (at least before all this genocide):
United States, Canada, Mexico, Turkey, Ukraine, Egypt, Jordan, the European Union, Australia, Bahrain, China, Eurasian Economic Union, India, Japan, Moldova, Costa Rica, Argentina, Brazil, Paraguay, Uruguay, and Venezuela (list not exhaustive)
^ Palestinians don't get this much support, and only recently has there been an outcry for the Palestinians (thanks to our ability to finally see what's going on through social media). Before social media, the mainstream media (Hollywood; 80% Jewish) controlled the narrative.
Also, did you know that not all Palestinians are Muslims? There are Christian Palestinians who are equally mistreated by Israelis. From a 2017 census, 47000 Palestinians identified as Christian, 98% of whom live in the West Bank (which is currently the next target of ethnic cleansing. IOF already started ramping up attacks and accusing civilians of being "militants").
"By late April 2024 it was estimated that Israel had dropped over 70,000 tons of bombs over Gaza, surpassing the bombing of Dresden, Hamburg, and London combined during World War II. "
I read this and thought it had to be fake news. Upon fact checking, I was wrong, and this is reported as true by every fact checker I went to. This is absolutely absurd at this point. I understand there is "hatred of the Jews" but no mention of the hatred of the Palestinian civilians. Any support for the Palestinian civilians is conflated by the people who hate them with accusations of being "Pro-Hamas". A brilliant, yet deceitful, tactic to vilify those who believe Palestinians have the right to live.
I read this and thought it had to be fake news. Upon fact checking, I was wrong, and this is reported as true by every fact checker I went to. This is absolutely absurd at this point. I understand there is "hatred of the Jews" but no mention of the hatred of the Palestinian civilians. Any support for the Palestinian civilians is conflated by the people who hate them with accusations of being "Pro-Hamas". A brilliant, yet deceitful, tactic to vilify those who believe Palestinians have the right to live.
Absolutely disgusting.
There is absolutely no justification for the use of that much ordnance unless you're purposely trying to level the entire infrastructure, which they have done. I'll have to find it again but I came across a video of Jewish groups in the USA conducting real estate bids on land in Gaza. It was always clear what their true intentions were from the start of this death and destruction.
Several times Hamas offered to return all the hostages if Netanyahu agreed to a permanent ceasefire but he refused. This is why the families of hostages blame him more than Hamas. They never cared about hostages.
Agreed brother. What really hit hard for me is that Gaza is merely a fraction of the size of those other cities... making the damage exponentially more destructive to innocent Palestinian civilians.
