Loss of salvation???
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indeed .
“John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of
repentance
for the remission of sins.”
Mark 1:4 KJV
“I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.”
Luke 5:32 KJV
“for this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.”
Matthew 26:28 KJV
“And Jesus said unto her,
Neither do I condemn thee:
go, and sin no more.”
John 8:11 KJV
“Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures, and said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:
and that repentance
and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. And ye are witnesses of these things.”
Luke 24:45-48
“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins,
and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.”
Acts 2:38
repentance is part of it as well as remission of sins is the point. Repentance comes because of the warnings throughout the word whether Jesus words peters words or Paul’s words of dire warnings to the church the warnings intent is to press on the believer through faith and produce the fruits of repentance
Paul’s writings also consist of repentance and remission of sins in Christ
often like Jesus in chapter 8 of John it came to a sinner as remission of sins offered freely and then instructions to repent and follow him.
Paul actually details a lot of the warnkngs just like the other aspects of his teachings in tbe epistles
“But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks. For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience. Be not ye therefore partakers with them. For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: (for the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth
proving what is acceptable unto the Lord. And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them. For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret. But all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light: for whatsoever doth make manifest is light. Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light. See then that ye walk circumspectly, not as fools, but as wise, redeeming the time, because the days are evil. Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is. And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit; speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord; giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ; submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God.”
Ephesians 5:3-21 KJV
This is a clear informative and instructive section of his letter but often we won’t read what’s there or talk about what’s there as a whole and what it’s really saying because it shakes up our faith a little bit if people told us other things like “ you don’t need to do anything youe already saved and have inherited the kingdom you can’t ever lose your inheritance don’t worry about it .don’t think you need to do anything or stop doing anything “
The messages in the world sound like a sheep’s voice but really it’s a hungry wolfs message “ your saved by faith this means you don’t need to hear Gods word or do anything he said you need to do now “ it’s counter productive to what Paul was really teaching which was in his words
“but shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judæa, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.”
Acts 26:20 KJV
That’s part of his message always It’s that yes the lord is our savior and promised salvation but it’s a promise to Jesus disciples those who learn from and follow him not those who dismiss him
“John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of
repentance
for the remission of sins.”
Mark 1:4 KJV
“I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.”
Luke 5:32 KJV
“for this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.”
Matthew 26:28 KJV
“And Jesus said unto her,
Neither do I condemn thee:
go, and sin no more.”
John 8:11 KJV
“Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures, and said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:
and that repentance
and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. And ye are witnesses of these things.”
Luke 24:45-48
“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins,
and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.”
Acts 2:38
repentance is part of it as well as remission of sins is the point. Repentance comes because of the warnings throughout the word whether Jesus words peters words or Paul’s words of dire warnings to the church the warnings intent is to press on the believer through faith and produce the fruits of repentance
Paul’s writings also consist of repentance and remission of sins in Christ
often like Jesus in chapter 8 of John it came to a sinner as remission of sins offered freely and then instructions to repent and follow him.
Paul actually details a lot of the warnkngs just like the other aspects of his teachings in tbe epistles
“But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks. For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience. Be not ye therefore partakers with them. For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: (for the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth
proving what is acceptable unto the Lord. And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them. For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret. But all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light: for whatsoever doth make manifest is light. Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light. See then that ye walk circumspectly, not as fools, but as wise, redeeming the time, because the days are evil. Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is. And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit; speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord; giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ; submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God.”Ephesians 5:3-21 KJV
This is a clear informative and instructive section of his letter but often we won’t read what’s there or talk about what’s there as a whole and what it’s really saying because it shakes up our faith a little bit if people told us other things like “ you don’t need to do anything youe already saved and have inherited the kingdom you can’t ever lose your inheritance don’t worry about it .don’t think you need to do anything or stop doing anything “
The messages in the world sound like a sheep’s voice but really it’s a hungry wolfs message “ your saved by faith this means you don’t need to hear Gods word or do anything he said you need to do now “ it’s counter productive to what Paul was really teaching which was in his words
“but shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judæa, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.”
Acts 26:20 KJV
That’s part of his message always It’s that yes the lord is our savior and promised salvation but it’s a promise to Jesus disciples those who learn from and follow him not those who dismiss him
That be correct. So God picked all ( Hebrews 10:10), hijacks none gave, gives free choice to believe God in Son for them or not (Believe God, Receive from God and see new) and newer, daily as one grows up into maturity. Son is risen where new life in God's spirit and Truth is given, and governed Spiritually by God, the Holy Spirit, never forcing anything on us, waits patiently for us to see and agree, whatever one is /has done is not good for them to continue in
Thanksgiving and praise to God Father of risen Son Jesus
Thanksgiving and praise to God Father of risen Son Jesus
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indeed .
“John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of
repentance
for the remission of sins.”
Mark 1:4 KJV
“I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.”
Luke 5:32 KJV
“for this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.”
Matthew 26:28 KJV
“And Jesus said unto her,
Neither do I condemn thee:
go, and sin no more.”
John 8:11 KJV
“Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures, and said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:
and that repentance
and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. And ye are witnesses of these things.”
Luke 24:45-48
“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins,
and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.”
Acts 2:38
repentance is part of it as well as remission of sins is the point. Repentance comes because of the warnings throughout the word whether Jesus words peters words or Paul’s words of dire warnings to the church the warnings intent is to press on the believer through faith and produce the fruits of repentance
Paul’s writings also consist of repentance and remission of sins in Christ
often like Jesus in chapter 8 of John it came to a sinner as remission of sins offered freely and then instructions to repent and follow him.
Paul actually details a lot of the warnkngs just like the other aspects of his teachings in tbe epistles
“But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks. For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience. Be not ye therefore partakers with them. For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: (for the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth proving what is acceptable unto the Lord. And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them. For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret. But all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light: for whatsoever doth make manifest is light. Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light. See then that ye walk circumspectly, not as fools, but as wise, redeeming the time, because the days are evil. Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is. And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit; speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord; giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ; submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God.”
Ephesians 5:3-21 KJV
This is a clear informative and instructive section of his letter but often we won’t read what’s there or talk about what’s there as a whole and what it’s really saying because it shakes up our faith a little bit if people told us other things like “ you don’t need to do anything youe already saved and have inherited the kingdom you can’t ever lose your inheritance don’t worry about it .don’t think you need to do anything or stop doing anything “
The messages in the world sound like a sheep’s voice but really it’s a hungry wolfs message “ your saved by faith this means you don’t need to hear Gods word or do anything he said you need to do now “ it’s counter productive to what Paul was really teaching which was in his words
“but shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judæa, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.”
Acts 26:20 KJV
That’s part of his message always It’s that yes the lord is our savior and promised salvation but it’s a promise to Jesus disciples those who learn from and follow him not those who dismiss him
“John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of
repentance
for the remission of sins.”
Mark 1:4 KJV
“I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.”
Luke 5:32 KJV
“for this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.”
Matthew 26:28 KJV
“And Jesus said unto her,
Neither do I condemn thee:
go, and sin no more.”
John 8:11 KJV
“Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures, and said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:
and that repentance
and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. And ye are witnesses of these things.”
Luke 24:45-48
“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins,
and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.”
Acts 2:38
repentance is part of it as well as remission of sins is the point. Repentance comes because of the warnings throughout the word whether Jesus words peters words or Paul’s words of dire warnings to the church the warnings intent is to press on the believer through faith and produce the fruits of repentance
Paul’s writings also consist of repentance and remission of sins in Christ
often like Jesus in chapter 8 of John it came to a sinner as remission of sins offered freely and then instructions to repent and follow him.
Paul actually details a lot of the warnkngs just like the other aspects of his teachings in tbe epistles
“But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks. For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience. Be not ye therefore partakers with them. For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: (for the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth
proving what is acceptable unto the Lord. And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them. For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret. But all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light: for whatsoever doth make manifest is light. Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light. See then that ye walk circumspectly, not as fools, but as wise, redeeming the time, because the days are evil. Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is. And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit; speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord; giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ; submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God.”Ephesians 5:3-21 KJV
This is a clear informative and instructive section of his letter but often we won’t read what’s there or talk about what’s there as a whole and what it’s really saying because it shakes up our faith a little bit if people told us other things like “ you don’t need to do anything youe already saved and have inherited the kingdom you can’t ever lose your inheritance don’t worry about it .don’t think you need to do anything or stop doing anything “
The messages in the world sound like a sheep’s voice but really it’s a hungry wolfs message “ your saved by faith this means you don’t need to hear Gods word or do anything he said you need to do now “ it’s counter productive to what Paul was really teaching which was in his words
“but shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judæa, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.”
Acts 26:20 KJV
That’s part of his message always It’s that yes the lord is our savior and promised salvation but it’s a promise to Jesus disciples those who learn from and follow him not those who dismiss him
Thank you, I see that too. I also see the taking it for granted, is a debauchery.
That is what the Corinthians did, they got the thought from the evil realm, to go ahead and do as they wanted to do,. hey your forgiven, go ahead take her, them, have sex, it is okay, since you are forgiven. Oh and all that food, go ahead eat, who cares if others need it.
That is what Paul wrote to Sosthenes 1 From: Paul, chosen by God to be Jesus Christ’s missionary, and from brother Sosthenes.
The leader of the Corinthian fellowship gathering this letter was given him to read it to the people for them to see this grace given is not meant to be taken for granted as was being done
then, Written, spoken and repented of by them, Read 2 Cor 7 about that
Thank you for standing up for truth, Brother in risen Son, that unifies us
“we are forgiven in his one done work for us all?”
yes we are forgiven because Jesus died for our sins and rose for our justification but also what he said about forgivness is eternally true and will always be true Jesus death which pays for all sin makes it possible for him to say this with Gods authority
“For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
but if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.”
Matthew 6:14-15 KJV
jesus paying for our sins doesnt then make his judgements irrelevant or non binding his death and resurrection are what makes his word binding and final bout these things
Do you see how this can’t save a sinner ?
“Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.”
Ezekiel 18:4 KJV
But this can save a sinner
“Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful. Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall be given into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.”
Luke 6:36-38 KJV
Jesus dying and rising up is the source of why he’s able to forgive us and give us eternal life but his words are the ways of God
yes we are forgiven because Jesus died for our sins and rose for our justification but also what he said about forgivness is eternally true and will always be true Jesus death which pays for all sin makes it possible for him to say this with Gods authority
“For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
but if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.”
Matthew 6:14-15 KJV
jesus paying for our sins doesnt then make his judgements irrelevant or non binding his death and resurrection are what makes his word binding and final bout these things
Do you see how this can’t save a sinner ?
“Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.”
Ezekiel 18:4 KJV
But this can save a sinner
“Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful. Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall be given into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.”
Luke 6:36-38 KJV
Jesus dying and rising up is the source of why he’s able to forgive us and give us eternal life but his words are the ways of God
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So what do you think it means if God says someone can have their name blotted out of the book of life? It seems to me that their name WAS in the book of life (they had life) and it was blotted out (they no longer have it).
Or, if someone “falls from grace” it means they had received grace (unmerited favor from God) and they fell away from that grace due to their acceptance of a false Gospel of works.
Or if someone is “cut off” it means they once belonged to the vine and were attached to Christ, but then were “cut off” such that they are not longer part of that family tree.
If someone ”loses“ what they have received or if Paul claims to have “wasted my time on you” it means that they had what was promises and “lost” it. Or that the Galatians had received the Gospel (to the point that they were willing to pluck out their own eyes and give them to Paul due to the gratitude they had for the message they had heard and believed) but now his preaching appears to be a “waste of time” because they were “abandoning” the gospel for a false gospel. If their salvation was indeed once for all, then why would it be a waste of time? Even their abandoning the gospel would result in their salvation since they had received it at one point…so their eternal salvation would certainly not be a waste of Paul’s time even if they had turned away from the Gospel at a later date.
The concept of “perseverance of the saints” is based on a philosophical view, not a Biblical one, imo. It was based in the idea of total depravity and that God must quicken the unbeliever and cause them to believe. Thus if God quickens someone, it is his work, not theirs. Thus if God quickens and saves someone, they cannot be lost because God had chosen to save them. However, this philosophical progression is based on a faulty starting point and philosophical conclusions. Biblical texts are explained around this basic presupposition rather than accepting these texts at face value.
Again, if those who are arguing that the Bible “clearly” teaches eternal security and that God grants faith would like to post there passages, I’d be happy to discuss further and change my mind based on what the Bible says. However, to suggest these verses do not teach on the issue of salvation and the dangers of wandering, falling, or embracing a false Gospel I think is false. Please explain what they are teaching if not salvation.
Or, if someone “falls from grace” it means they had received grace (unmerited favor from God) and they fell away from that grace due to their acceptance of a false Gospel of works.
Or if someone is “cut off” it means they once belonged to the vine and were attached to Christ, but then were “cut off” such that they are not longer part of that family tree.
If someone ”loses“ what they have received or if Paul claims to have “wasted my time on you” it means that they had what was promises and “lost” it. Or that the Galatians had received the Gospel (to the point that they were willing to pluck out their own eyes and give them to Paul due to the gratitude they had for the message they had heard and believed) but now his preaching appears to be a “waste of time” because they were “abandoning” the gospel for a false gospel. If their salvation was indeed once for all, then why would it be a waste of time? Even their abandoning the gospel would result in their salvation since they had received it at one point…so their eternal salvation would certainly not be a waste of Paul’s time even if they had turned away from the Gospel at a later date.
The concept of “perseverance of the saints” is based on a philosophical view, not a Biblical one, imo. It was based in the idea of total depravity and that God must quicken the unbeliever and cause them to believe. Thus if God quickens someone, it is his work, not theirs. Thus if God quickens and saves someone, they cannot be lost because God had chosen to save them. However, this philosophical progression is based on a faulty starting point and philosophical conclusions. Biblical texts are explained around this basic presupposition rather than accepting these texts at face value.
Again, if those who are arguing that the Bible “clearly” teaches eternal security and that God grants faith would like to post there passages, I’d be happy to discuss further and change my mind based on what the Bible says. However, to suggest these verses do not teach on the issue of salvation and the dangers of wandering, falling, or embracing a false Gospel I think is false. Please explain what they are teaching if not salvation.
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