Election teaches that salvation comes from the Lord.
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20 He was foreknown before the foundation of the world but was made manifest in the last times for the sake of you
21 who through him are believers in God
In your verses from Ephesian 1:1-7.
Remove Jesus from the verses and how are the Saints saved, Blessed, Chosen in HIM, predestined to be children of God, and redeemed by the BLOOD?
If you remove Jesus you see it's all about Jesus Paul is talking about. He is the ONE before the foundation of the world to fulfill verses 1-7.
So remove Jesus from these verses and how can Saints be all of those things in verses 1-7 without Jesus?
They can't!!
So we know Paul is talking about JESUS here.
21 who through him are believers in God
In your verses from Ephesian 1:1-7.
Remove Jesus from the verses and how are the Saints saved, Blessed, Chosen in HIM, predestined to be children of God, and redeemed by the BLOOD?
If you remove Jesus you see it's all about Jesus Paul is talking about. He is the ONE before the foundation of the world to fulfill verses 1-7.
So remove Jesus from these verses and how can Saints be all of those things in verses 1-7 without Jesus?
They can't!!
So we know Paul is talking about JESUS here.
That is twisting scripture. Making scripture say what want.
Jos 24:15 And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.
Choice, we are not robots.
Jos 24:15 And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.
Choice, we are not robots.
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No, we don't know that.
Your post makes doesn't make sense to me.
[Rom 8:28-30, 32-33 KJV]
28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to [his] purpose.
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate [to be] conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified. ...
32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? [It is] God that justifieth.
Your post makes doesn't make sense to me.
[Rom 8:28-30, 32-33 KJV]
28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to [his] purpose.
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate [to be] conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified. ...
32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? [It is] God that justifieth.
From Theologians. I do not trust Scholars because many are atheist but Theologians are Bible Professors in Bible Colleges.
(Rom 8:29-30) Notice the conjunction, “for”’; it ties what is about to be said with what has just been said. We know what God has done for the Old Testament saints, those that He “already knew, He predestined, (aorist indicative, completed action) to be conformed to the image or likeness of His Son. They died long before Jesus was even born but they are still a part of the promises of God! God planned from the beginning to bring their salvation to completion in Christ Jesus. Moreover, those He predestined (aorist indicative, completed action) He justified (aorist indicative, completed action) and those He justified He glorified (aorist indicative, completed action). If Paul had any intended notion that he was speaking to the Roman Christians he would have used the same tense he used previously in verse 16, that being the aorist passive subjective. He did not do so because he was speaking here of the Old Testament saints who had already died but God had provided hope for.
Theologians claim Paul in Romans 8:29-30 are speaking about the Old Testament Saints who God FOREKNEW and PREDESTINED to be conformed to be like Christ.
(Rom 8:29-30) Notice the conjunction, “for”’; it ties what is about to be said with what has just been said. We know what God has done for the Old Testament saints, those that He “already knew, He predestined, (aorist indicative, completed action) to be conformed to the image or likeness of His Son. They died long before Jesus was even born but they are still a part of the promises of God! God planned from the beginning to bring their salvation to completion in Christ Jesus. Moreover, those He predestined (aorist indicative, completed action) He justified (aorist indicative, completed action) and those He justified He glorified (aorist indicative, completed action). If Paul had any intended notion that he was speaking to the Roman Christians he would have used the same tense he used previously in verse 16, that being the aorist passive subjective. He did not do so because he was speaking here of the Old Testament saints who had already died but God had provided hope for.
Theologians claim Paul in Romans 8:29-30 are speaking about the Old Testament Saints who God FOREKNEW and PREDESTINED to be conformed to be like Christ.
I don't care what "theologians" say. The Bible needs no assistance outside of what it already provides us with.
[2Ti 3:15-17 KJV]
15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
16 All scripture [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
[2Ti 3:15-17 KJV]
15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
16 All scripture [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
Jesus’ words in John 6:65
John 6:65
He went on to say,
“This is why I told you that no one can come to me
unless the Father has enabled them.”
He went on to say,
“This is why I told you that no one can come to me
unless the Father has enabled them.”
If Calvinists were correct with their claim for 'irresistible grace?"
Then John 6:65 would need to be worded differently.
It would have to read more like this...
He went on to say,
“This is why I told you that no one can come to me
unless the Father has forced them.”
“This is why I told you that no one can come to me
unless the Father has forced them.”
Grace enables. Never forces!
How does grace enable a person to believe?
By paralyzing the sin nature while that person is being presented the Gospel.
That grace application by God's power does not guarantee one will believe.
It only guarantees that they have been made able to believe if they so choose.
We need clear thinking...... not legalism.
grace and peace .............
If you were in Christ before the foundation of the world, then there never could have been a time when your were a child of wrath.
Ephesians 2
1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
Ephesians 2
1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
They are different.
KJV
The KJV translates Strong's G1325 in the following manner: give (365x), grant (10x), put (5x), show (4x), deliver (2x), make (2x), miscellaneous (25x).
[Jhn 6:65 KJV] 65 And[G2532] he said,[G3004] Therefore[G1223][G5124] said I[G2046] unto you,[G5213] that[G3754] no man[G3762] can[G1410] come[G2064] unto[G4314] me,[G3165] except[G3362] it were[G5600] given[G1325] unto him[G846] of[G1537] my[G3450] Father.[G3962]
ESV
[Jhn 6:65 ESV] 65 And he said, "This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father."
KJV
The KJV translates Strong's G1325 in the following manner: give (365x), grant (10x), put (5x), show (4x), deliver (2x), make (2x), miscellaneous (25x).
[Jhn 6:65 KJV] 65 And[G2532] he said,[G3004] Therefore[G1223][G5124] said I[G2046] unto you,[G5213] that[G3754] no man[G3762] can[G1410] come[G2064] unto[G4314] me,[G3165] except[G3362] it were[G5600] given[G1325] unto him[G846] of[G1537] my[G3450] Father.[G3962]
ESV
[Jhn 6:65 ESV] 65 And he said, "This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father."
Roger adheres to a doctrine called 5 Graces.
But believes God does not give Grace to basically 80% of His OWN Offspring known as His Creation.
Ever heard anything more ridiculous than that? To believe in something that only happens to less than 20% of Creation?
The doctrine literally sounds like a drunk man in a bar trying to preach repentance.
But believes God does not give Grace to basically 80% of His OWN Offspring known as His Creation.
Ever heard anything more ridiculous than that? To believe in something that only happens to less than 20% of Creation?
The doctrine literally sounds like a drunk man in a bar trying to preach repentance.