Did Jesus Die on The Cross for The Just/Elect/Saved Whose Names Are Written in The Book of Life OR

[7thMoon]

What are those two verbs for hearing in the Greek?

I will search for them.

 

[7thMoon]

What are those two verbs for hearing in the Greek?

οὖς, genitive ὠτός, plural ὦτα, dative ὦσιν, τό (cf. Latinauris,ausculto, audio, etc.; akin to ἀΐω, αἰσθάνομαι; cf. Curtius, § 619; Vanicek, p. 67); from Homer down; Hebrew אֹזֶן; the ear;

And;
Lexicon :: Strong's G191 - akouō
ἀκούω

It would seem the other verb is not used in the New Testament. Hearing ἀΐω without understanding.

 

[Rufus]

Wrong. No one could any number of nones. Just like all can be all of some group rather than all mankind. Reading the bible is not as simple as you think.

"No one" is all of a specific class of the human race. Hint: And that class isn't any born again child of God.

 

[HeIsHere]

Hmmm? I agree with you. It doesn't say they were given some different hearing from what they had had before Peter spoke.

I have learned over the years this all stems from a misunderstanding of the word "dead" it does not mean they cannot respond.. dead means separated, that is how it was used back then.

Again, they make another assumption that at the "Fall" mankind his/her faculties are so damaged that we are all born morally incapable of being persuaded something is truth.

I just wonder why God has to blind some people who are already born morally incapable to respond positively to the Gospel, I guess He had to make doubly sure. sigh!

 

[7thMoon]

"No one" is all of a specific class of the human race. Hint: And that class isn't any born again child of God.

No one is French for no human being in the English language. The Greek says "not one". What one group or thing? It is a group, what group? Calvinists believe none are righteous, but we have Abraham who simply by trusting God became righteous.

 

[PaulThomson]

οὖς, genitive ὠτός, plural ὦτα, dative ὦσιν, τό (cf. Latinauris,ausculto, audio, etc.; akin to ἀΐω, αἰσθάνομαι; cf. Curtius, § 619; Vanicek, p. 67); from Homer down; Hebrew אֹזֶן; the ear;

And;
Lexicon :: Strong's G191 - akouō
ἀκούω

It would seem the other verb is not used in the New Testament. Hearing ἀΐω without understanding.

My Liddel- Scott Greek dictionary says aiO used only in the present and imperfect (esp. to hear: but also aion) to perceive, become aware of, esp. to hear: but also to see, observe, know, c. gen and also acc.

It doesn't support your case. AkouO has a wide semantic range as does the English hear, depending on context.
e.g. I hear a bird in the distance.
I hear my mother calling me but I can't make out what she is saying.
I hear what you are saying and agree completely.
She hears me, but she doesn't really hear me.

 

[7thMoon]

My Liddel- Scott Greek dictionary says aiO used only in the present and imperfect (esp. to hear: but also aion) to perceive, become aware of, esp. to hear: but also to see, observe, know, c. gen and also acc.

It doesn't support your case. AkouO has a wide semantic range as does the English hear, depending on context.
e.g. I hear a bird in the distance.
I hear my mother calling me but I can't make out what she is saying.
I hear what you are saying and agree completely.
She hears me, but she doesn't really hear me.

I don't have a case to make, but I was just surprised that only akouo is used for hear in the New Testament. It means simply to both hear and understand.

 

[Magenta]

Matthew 13:10-17.

Matthew 13:16-17

 

[7thMoon]

I hear my mother calling me but I can't make out what she is saying.

That covers the other verb which seem not be used in the New Testament.

 

[7thMoon]

I don't have a case to make, but I was just surprised that only akouo is used for hear in the New Testament. It means simply to both hear and understand.

The Greek verb for harken, αιω is used only once and in Luke. After looking at the lexical entries, I found it.

Secondly, I thought wrongly that AkouO meant to hearkin. It seems to be a common mistake, but I apologize.

 

[PaulThomson]

I don't have a case to make, but I was just surprised that only akouo is used for hear in the New Testament. It means simply to both hear and understand.

Matt.13:13 Therefore speak I to them in parables, because they seeing (blepontes), see not (ou blepousin); and hearing (akouontes) they hear not (ouk akouousin) neither (oude) do they understand (suniousin).

If akouO means to hear AND UNDERSTAND, why does Matthew say neither do they understand.
The sense is clear. They see but they pretend they are not seeing, they hear but they pretend they are not hearing, and they are cannot correctly interpret what they are seeing and hearing.

 

[7thMoon]

Matt.13:13 Therefore speak I to them in parables, because they seeing (blepontes), see not (ou blepousin); and hearing (akouontes) they hear not (ouk akouousin) neither (oude) do they understand (suniousin).

If akouO means to hear AND UNDERSTAND, why does Matthew say neither do they understand.
The sense is clear. They see but they pretend they are not seeing, they hear but they pretend they are not hearing, and they are cannot correctly interpret what they are seeing and hearing.

You are correct, but check post #3,470.

 

[PaulThomson]

The Greek verb for harken, αιω is used only once and in Luke. After looking at the lexical entries, I found it.

Secondly, I thought wrongly that AkouO meant to hearkin. It seems to be a common mistake, but I apologize.

Where in Luke?

 

[7thMoon]

Where in Luke?

Whatever the definition of the word, it is in Luke 9:5?

 

[PaulThomson]

Whatever the definition of the word, it is in Luke 9:5?

Hearing isn't mentioned in Luke 9:5 and aiO is not there. Please, cut and paste the version that has it.

 

[7thMoon]

Hearing isn't mentioned in Luke 9:5 and aiO is not there. Please, cut and paste the version that has it.

αἴσθωνται V-2ADS-3P is the form. It is an odd form though.
The TR Stephanus is quoted.

blueletterbible.org was used.

 

[PaulThomson]

View attachment 262006
αἴσθωνται V-2ADS-3P is the form. It is an odd form though.
The TR Stephanus is quoted.

blueletterbible.org was used.

Thanks. That was not Luke 9:5, as you pointed to earlier.
Nor does that have any bearing on the use of akouO everywhere else in the NT. Nowhere does akouO necessarily imply understanding what is heard. One can 1. hear without paying attention "akouO"; or 2. hear and pay attention "akouO; or 3. hear and pay close attention, obey, submit "hupakouO".

Hence one can use akouO in the same sentence, the same word twice with meanings 1 and 2 i different places, without implying understanding or obedience meaning 3. hupakouO..

 

[7thMoon]

Thanks. That was not Luke 9:5, as you pointed to earlier.
Nor does that have any bearing on the use of akouO everywhere else in the NT. Nowhere does akouO necessarily imply understanding what is heard. One can hear without paying attention "akouO"; or hear and pay attention "akouO; or hear and pay close attention, obey, submit "hupakouO".

I made a mistake. As you can see, Luke 9:45

 

[PaulThomson]

I made a mistake. As you can see, Luke 9:45

I forgive you.

 

[Everlasting-Grace]

Am I the only one who sees the Israelites and Jews as different, and that there was condemnation of Israel in the New Testament?

They are different in a way

Israel refers to all the 12 tribes of Israel. Which consisted of the northern kingdom of Israel and the southern kingdom of Judah.

Where as a Jew was a person who lived in the southern kingdom of Judah (hence the name jew) at the time of Christ. there were people from all twelve trives who lived in Judah, so they all would have been called "jews"