The biblicalness of Bible college

JonathanBentley · Oct 10, 2023

So what do you think of Bible college being biblical? I spent two years in bible college and come to find out some people are against it. Some churches just pick a pastor. Bible college isn't in the Bible. Does anyone think that pastors were trained in bible times or just picked? I think of Timothy and Paul.

maxwel · Oct 10, 2023

JonathanBentley said:

Pastoral Training:

Pastors are always supposed to have training.... if you don't have training, you have nothing to teach.
But there are various ways to get that training.
The church or denomination in which you minister will have it's own requirements for where, and how, they want you to be trained.

You can agree or disagree with the training requirements of any particular church, but they will still choose the training requirements as they see fit.

.

ResidentAlien · Oct 10, 2023

JonathanBentley said:

I'm curious why you ask. Did someone turn you down for a pastorate because you've been to Bible college?

JonathanBentley · Oct 10, 2023

ResidentAlien said:

No. I just encountered a group that is against Bible college and the pastors pick pastors from the congregation.

Magenta · Oct 10, 2023

JonathanBentley said:

Are they voted in to function as elders before they are chosen to pastor?

ResidentAlien · Oct 10, 2023

JonathanBentley said:

In Bible times they were discipled by others who were more mature in the faith. Unfortunately today what passes for maturity is head knowledge. I don't have a problem with Bible college per se; it depends on their approach. Are the staff spiritually mature? Is their primary goal to help their students mature spiritually? Or are they just there to churn out eggheads who can memorize and regurgitate. Unfortunately the latter is more commonplace. On the other hand, in a lot of church groups virtually anyone can become a pastor if they know the right people and say the right things. This is very dangerous in my opinion.

Nehemiah6 · Oct 10, 2023

JonathanBentley said:

The entire practice of making academic qualifications a criterion for suitability to minister the Word came from the Catholic Church. The term is Scholasticism (which also included philosophy). In order to become a Catholic priest, men were supposed to go through their seminaries (which began as monastic schools). At the same time the priests gained special powers and privileges, and there was a distinction between clergy and laity. This also led to clerical abuses.

The Protestant Reformers came from the Catholic church but did not return fully to the NT pattern. So they also adopted this same pattern. But in the New Testament Paul told faithful men to teach other faithful men, which meant that Bible college was within the church itself, not importing men from outside with academic qualifications. Instead those men would have the spiritual gifts to be elders and teachers within the assembly, and would have been a part of the assembly from the start.

None of the apostles had attended the rabbinic schools which existed in Israel, and the Lord specifically told His apostles (and all Christians) that being called "rabbi", or "father". or "master" was unacceptable. That is equivalent to Reverend, Doctor, Father, and all the other clerical titles men receive after going to Bible college or seminary.

Today the great danger of Bible schools and seminaries is that they are hotbeds of false teachings. Even the evangelical schools have been undermining Bible doctrine and attacking the Bible itself, especially Bible inerrancy. This began in the 19th century when the seminaries began promoting theological liberalism, which originated in Germany, and spread rapidly to England and North America. This led to Higher and Lower Criticism, which were basically attacks on the Bible itself. No one talks about it today, but all the mainline denominations succumbed to this liberalism.

The reaction to it by some was Fundamentalism, but the Fundamentalists were forced out of those churches. Today theological liberals are promoting gay marriage and supporting the LGBTQ agenda. And even the Fundamentalist and evangelical churches have compromised on various doctrines and practices. But the compromise comes from the top. IOW it is the pastors in those churches which introduce false teachings. And these men were first trained in their beliefs while in seminary.

John146 · Oct 10, 2023

JonathanBentley said:

Personally, I wouldn't give a penny for most modern day seminary degrees.

Aaron56 · Oct 10, 2023

Biblically, elders care for the saints locally. They have the grace and gifting of a pastor (shepherd). They are established believers with a testimony of faithfully following the Lord. Elders must also rule their own house well. You cannot be called to rule over the house of God if you do not rule over your own house.

The word "elder" implies wisdom in practice so they must possess a testimony of consistent righteous character and behavior among the saints. These are not necessarily old saints but they tend to be older than most because it takes time to build a testimony. However, young people in authority are encouraged to not let others look down on them because of their youth ("Let no one despise your youth, but be an example to the believers in word, in conduct, in love, in spirit, in faith, in purity.")

They should also be able to teach others the Word of God. So the grace and gifting of a teacher is expected, too.

Out from that, bishops are elders who have local and regional responsibilities. They might, for an entire city, understand the needs for several or all of the households of faith.

There are examples of all this (and more) in the scriptures.

What you will not find are "head pastors", "associate pastors" or pastors of any activity or ministries (Pastor of Children's Ministries). Pastors are ALWAYS to people. It is quite likely a maturing group of saints will have several pastors who care for the people. And, as far as I can tell, there is no one in the home who has more responsibility to raise children up in the Lord than do the parents of the children.

Pilgrimshope · Oct 10, 2023

JonathanBentley said:

“pastors “ are men of the kisitratioj of that office spiritually it’s a spiritual gift and administration

There’s absolutely nothing biblical about seminaries or Bible colleges , that being said I don’t think there’s anything unbiblical about the ones who actually are teaching people the Bible either . But biblically a pastor is meant to be called and annointed by gos and filled with the holy spirit and actually isn’t even meant to be the speaker each “ week “ but there’s an office of prophecy that is another spiritual gift and annointing who are meant to speak a pastor eas more along the lines of the leader or shepherd which was more as administrative

biblically speaking pastors are Called and annointed by God to do what they do ….it is a spiritual gift and what is required is the calling and annointing of God for any office in the church

“Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, And gave gifts unto men. And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; for the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭4:8, 11-13‬ ‭

“Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit. And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord. And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all. But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal. For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit; to another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit; to another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues: but all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will. Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular. And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues. Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles? Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret? But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭12:4-11, 27-31‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The church is truly a beautiful concept when we read what’s being said on scripture and don’t I terpret anything away like above there that concept is lovely

Biblically the new testement laye our a very ordered account of the operation of the body ( the church ) on earth it’s all sources and enables by the working of Gods spirit in believers . There’s never an account of anyone instructing anyone else to go to a Bible college but there also is Paul’s instruction to Timothy to “study the word to shew himself approved “ which is probably what most people who attend a Bible college are actually doing is looking to study and understand Gods word

aid we are learning what’s in the Bible without any interpretations I’d say it’s a good thing but isn’t “ biblically “ approved , required , or neither disppproved of or condemned

air probably ends up mattering what it is the college is teaching ? Is it the word of God ?

“Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.”
‭‭John‬ ‭18:37‬ ‭

Or this ? Which also is on the world

“For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; and they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.”
‭‭2 Timothy‬ ‭4:3-4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

There’s nothing on the Bible to establish seminaries or Bible colleges but for sure the pastor needs to be annointed with the spirit and called of God to be an effective pastor or whatever thier foft and service is of the many mentioned in the New Testament we all have roles in his body the church and he’s given us gifts to do those things

Dino246 · Oct 10, 2023

Nehemiah6 said:

The entire practice of making academic qualifications a criterion for suitability to minister the Word came from the Catholic Church. The term is Scholasticism (which also included philosophy). In order to become a Catholic priest, men were supposed to go through their seminaries (which began as monastic schools). At the same time the priests gained special powers and privileges, and there was a distinction between clergy and laity. This also led to clerical abuses.

The Protestant Reformers came from the Catholic church but did not return fully to the NT pattern. So they also adopted this same pattern. But in the New Testament Paul told faithful men to teach other faithful men, which meant that Bible college was within the church itself, not importing men from outside with academic qualifications. Instead those men would have the spiritual gifts to be elders and teachers within the assembly, and would have been a part of the assembly from the start.

None of the apostles had attended the rabbinic schools which existed in Israel, and the Lord specifically told His apostles (and all Christians) that being called "rabbi", or "father". or "master" was unacceptable. That is equivalent to Reverend, Doctor, Father, and all the other clerical titles men receive after going to Bible college or seminary.

Today the great danger of Bible schools and seminaries is that they are hotbeds of false teachings. Even the evangelical schools have been undermining Bible doctrine and attacking the Bible itself, especially Bible inerrancy. This began in the 19th century when the seminaries began promoting theological liberalism, which originated in Germany, and spread rapidly to England and North America. This led to Higher and Lower Criticism, which were basically attacks on the Bible itself. No one talks about it today, but all the mainline denominations succumbed to this liberalism.

The reaction to it by some was Fundamentalism, but the Fundamentalists were forced out of those churches. Today theological liberals are promoting gay marriage and supporting the LGBTQ agenda. And even the Fundamentalist and evangelical churches have compromised on various doctrines and practices. But the compromise comes from the top. IOW it is the pastors in those churches which introduce false teachings. And these men were first trained in their beliefs while in seminary.

Well... when we can't find actual evidence to support our preconceived notions, we'll just make up some generalized vitriol and throw it on the fire to make sure nobody does anything ever.

Or, to put it more succinctly, WHO HURT YOU?

seekingthemindofChrist · Oct 10, 2023

John 7:14-17

"Now about the midst of the feast Jesus went up into the temple, and taught. And the Jews marvelled, saying, How knoweth this man letters, having never learned? Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me. If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself."

Acts 4:13

"Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were unlearned and ignorant men, they marvelled; and they took knowledge of them, that they had been with Jesus."

2ndTimeIsTheCharm · Oct 10, 2023

I don't think Bible college is required but it shouldn't be automatically rejected when a church is looking for a pastor. I'm thinking of Dr. Charles Stanley who had gone to seminary for study, but he also had a close walk with the Lord.

💐

maxwel · Oct 10, 2023

JonathanBentley said:

Really Basic Info on This Topic:

Some Areas of Pastoral Training mentioned in Scripture:
1. We know the shepherds are to give themselves to study of scripture... study... so they are ABLE to lead and teach.
2. We know some of the topics they are commanded to study, like doctrine... which covers a LOT.
3. We know they must meet certain CHARACTER QUALIFICATIONS.... so they have the proper life and walk.
4. We know teachers must be gifted for teaching... so they can actually do the work.
5. We know they require ordination (laying on of hands) to show they have the approval of the congregation and leaders, so everyone believes they're qualified.

The bible doesn't talk much about WHERE you do your study... as long as you study, and know the scripture.

Study in the Early Church:
1. Most of the early believers were devout Jews, who would have thoroughly learned the OT at the synagogue, before becoming Christians.
2. A pharisee like Paul would have had special training, and would have MEMORIZED the vast MAJORITY of the Old Testament.
(He studied directly under the famous Rabbi Gamaliel.)
3. Gentile Christians would have studied directly under their local church leaders, as would Jewish believers after conversion.

How do we translate these bible principles, and early church practices, into the modern age?
1. First, the Bible principles still stand exactly the same: you need training, study, character qualifications, special gifting, and approval of the congregation.
2. However, the Bible seems to show people getting their "practical training" in local ministry (in the local church) while it shows people getting their "theological training" in various ways... sort of whatever is available.
3. Ultimately, the Bible doesn't mandate any particular place to study. But it does show people gaining practical experience, through ministry in the local church, before being giving a position of leadership.
4. For the record, there doesn't seem to be any way around the fact that pastors in the early church must have received most of their training in church, and at home... as there weren't any Christian seminaries.

Final Thoughts:
A. Some Bible Colleges are good, some are awful... that's just reality.
B. Some Seminaries are good, some are awful... that's just reality.
C. Some churches have time and resources to do their own education and training, and some don't. If they can, that's probably good.
D. Some varieties of ministry, and some denominations, simply require a particular seminary degree, and some do not... that's just the way it is.
* The information here is NOT EXHAUSTIVE, and not particularly clever... it's just really basic info scribbled down so people can think about it.

God Bless.

.

GRACE_ambassador · Oct 10, 2023

op: Biblicalness of Bible college?

Probably not so much, especially if they ignore God's Command for studying?:

oyster67 · Oct 10, 2023

maxwel said:

It is the Holy Spirit who is the giver and source of enlightenment and discernment. It is the Holy Spirit that is the giver of gifts such as teaching and preaching.

JonathanBentley said:

Yes. Paul says this to Timothy...

1 Timothy 4:12
“Let no man despise thy youth; but be thou an example of the believers, in word, in conversation, in charity, in spirit, in faith, in purity.”

It does mention a certain laying on of hands, but that sounds more like a Spiritual blessing...

1 Timothy 4:14
“Neglect not the gift that is in thee, which was given thee by prophecy, with the laying on of the hands of the presbytery.”

JonathanBentley said:

I would say that the only danger is in becoming beholden to them to preach their particular set of distinctives. If you can resist that and keep an open mind and be Berean, then good on you, brother Bently.

maxwel · Oct 10, 2023

oyster67 said:

You said this as a response, a kind of a gentle rebuttal, to what I said about TRAINING and STUDY.

Reconciling Spiritual Things with Earthly Things:

A.) I don't think we need to place everything into opposition - I don't think we need to view God's spiritual work in our lives as something separate or incompatible with our training and study.
B.) We know that the Spirit leads and God gives gifts, but we also see God commanding us to STUDY, and you see disciples put through extensive TRAINING before leadership.
C.) I don't believe these are things which are supposed to be in opposition... I think God's plan is for his leading and gifting to draw us toward the proper study and training... and so in the end it all works together in harmony, in order to prepare a useful vessel for ministry.

God Bless.

.

Adstar · Oct 10, 2023

JonathanBentley said:

Depends on who is running a particular ""Bible College"" cults can run Bible colleges.. False teachers can have positions in Bible colleges leading the students into believing doctrines of demons..

So going to a ""Bible college"" is not iron clad guarantee that the student will come out of it with a true understanding of the Word of God..

oyster67 · Oct 10, 2023

maxwel said:

You said this as a response, a kind of a gentle rebuttal, to what I said about TRAINING and STUDY.

Reconciling Spiritual Things with Earthly Things:

A.) I don't think we need to place everything into opposition - I don't think we need to view God's spiritual work in our lives as something separate or incompatible with our training and study.
B.) We know that the Spirit leads and God gives gifts, but we also see God commanding us to STUDY, and you see disciples put through extensive TRAINING before leadership.
C.) I don't believe these are things which are supposed to be in opposition... I think God's plan is for his leading and gifting to draw us toward the proper study and training... and so in the end it all works together in harmony, in order to prepare a useful vessel for ministry.

God Bless.

.

Yes. I believe that we should use every resource that He makes available to us. Sometimes He makes different sets of resources available to different folks?

TheLearner · Oct 10, 2023

JonathanBentley said:

https://www.ijern.com/journal/August-2013/31.pdf
https://www.academia.edu/5669106/The_Church_Fathers_and_Classical_Education
Abstract: The Church derives part of her philosophy, spirituality and mission of education from the mandate of Christ, “Go therefore and make disciples of all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you, and thus, I am with you always, to the end of times” (Mt. 28:19-20). The Church has played a major role in the history and evolution of quality education as an important component of human civilization and evangelization. The church’s historical survey of educational theory and practice shows that Christian teaching, ethical values and witnessing ethos are necessary for holistic development of quality education for all. This type of education was defined by the early Fathers of the Church and is still relevant today. This education with a difference and prioritized ethos, based on Catholic Intellectual Tradition is recommended for Institutions of Higher learning in Africa and global contexts. The paper discusses the external and internal factors hindering quality and holistic education according to Divine Wisdom and Gospel values as taught by the Church Fathers who regarded informative, formative and transformative (Patristic and Paideia Education) as a means deeper evangelization and sustainable development in Africa. The study argues that Patristic education which is characterized by value and moral character development is of paramount importance and should be implemented for promoting lasting intellectual prioritization, justice and integrity for all, and transformative life-experiential imprints in the church and society.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/341822150_PATRISTIC_EDUCATION_AS_EVANGELIZATION

The biblicalness of Bible college

Active member

Senior Member

Well-known member

Active member

Senior Member

Well-known member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Senior Member

Casting down imaginations

Well-known member

Senior Member

Well-known member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Well-known member