Works Complete Faith?
- Thread starter romans113336
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
- Status
Getting car worked on. Try to make it brief.
It's not about an "amount" of works. If you think of faith as a race, if the runner is running well, but is, somewhere along the way, hindered, that's more of the picture: Each step gets him closer to where he needs to be in the future, but each step he's where he needs to be for now.
It's no different than regular life. You're (ideally) in a family, so you have a base of love, and, in the course of time, you may do well, but you may not, and your family will have opinions about you either way.
It's not about an "amount" of works. If you think of faith as a race, if the runner is running well, but is, somewhere along the way, hindered, that's more of the picture: Each step gets him closer to where he needs to be in the future, but each step he's where he needs to be for now.
It's no different than regular life. You're (ideally) in a family, so you have a base of love, and, in the course of time, you may do well, but you may not, and your family will have opinions about you either way.
-
1
- Show all
A "race" against your own sinful self? And we are invest maximum supreme sweat equity to "get closer to where we need to be"?
Thats it? Thats your formula for salvation?
Well, I say that it is a race that NO son of Adam could EVER win.
And Jesus secured the victory for us anyways. There is no race to obtain salvation for us. Ever.
It is a gift bequeathed by the Victor Himself, who can never lose, never fail, and never forsake us.
FYI, the Apostle Paul NEVER, NOT ONCE questioned his salvation. Never.
He was however concerned about being disqualified from the race......for good and faithful servant crowns.
Thats it? Thats your formula for salvation?
Well, I say that it is a race that NO son of Adam could EVER win.
And Jesus secured the victory for us anyways. There is no race to obtain salvation for us. Ever.
It is a gift bequeathed by the Victor Himself, who can never lose, never fail, and never forsake us.
FYI, the Apostle Paul NEVER, NOT ONCE questioned his salvation. Never.
He was however concerned about being disqualified from the race......for good and faithful servant crowns.
-
1
-
1
- Show all
How long is it (according to your view) between the time that he commits this "sin" (in Rom14:23) and the time that God "condemns" him for it (in Rom14:23, per your view) and he consequently "forfeits" salvation (as you've said)?
Because, you've stated the following things in this thread:
--"It would be unrighteous for God to not condemn sin [...]" (my question to you is, how long between the "sin" committed, and the time that God righteously "condemns" him for the "[if] HE EATS" thing, according to you? A week? 6 weeks? 6 months? Other?);
--"Infractions of this rule are 'sin' which results in 'condemnation'" (but my question to you is, "when" in relation to the committed "sin" does God "condemn" this person, thus meaning they've "forfeited" salvation according to your view?)
I know there are many passages and verses that people *think* are saying a person/member of the Church WHICH IS HIS BODY can "forfeit" their salvation (or can "lose" it), but they don't. Several have been covered in this thread... and I'm certain you believe that we are unaware of the [supposed] TONS OF VERSES MORE that you still haven't yet presented which convince you that we have no idea what we're talking about, and make you think "if you only KNEW of all of them, like I do!" [like you keep saying].
(Not.
)
Because, you've stated the following things in this thread:
--"It would be unrighteous for God to not condemn sin [...]" (my question to you is, how long between the "sin" committed, and the time that God righteously "condemns" him for the "[if] HE EATS" thing, according to you? A week? 6 weeks? 6 months? Other?);
--"Infractions of this rule are 'sin' which results in 'condemnation'" (but my question to you is, "when" in relation to the committed "sin" does God "condemn" this person, thus meaning they've "forfeited" salvation according to your view?)
I know there are many passages and verses that people *think* are saying a person/member of the Church WHICH IS HIS BODY can "forfeit" their salvation (or can "lose" it), but they don't. Several have been covered in this thread... and I'm certain you believe that we are unaware of the [supposed] TONS OF VERSES MORE that you still haven't yet presented which convince you that we have no idea what we're talking about, and make you think "if you only KNEW of all of them, like I do!" [like you keep saying].
(Not.
)
We can also, after being "condemned", acknowledge our error/sin, repent, and move on.
There are different ways people respond to being "condemned" by the Lord.
He punishes us now so as to save us--so we won't be condemned along with the world at the end.
He often referred to faith as a race, and compared the reality that he could be disqualified by sin, despite having been saved, to the time the Jews were saved, yet sinned, and fell under God's wrath, and forfeited the Promise (1 Co 9:26, 1 Co 10).
See, I don't want "extra parts" laying around.
See, I don't want "extra parts" laying around.
-
1
- Show all
I know there are many passages and verses that people *think* are saying a person/member of the Church WHICH IS HIS BODY can "forfeit" their salvation (or can "lose" it), but they don't. Several have been covered in this thread... and I'm certain you believe that we are unaware of the [supposed] TONS OF VERSES MORE that you still haven't yet presented which convince you that we have no idea what we're talking about, and make you think "if you only KNEW of all of them, like I do!" [like you keep saying].
(Not. )
(Not.
)
Works Complete Faith?
The Moment God, stepped inside and Entered into Your heart, He, "Continued" the [Works] that He began in You and will keep Working in You, until He Resurrects You.
All we are doing, by doing anything, outside of getting the Sense I should do this, I should tell this person something about God that uplifts, I should feed the person, maybe I need to give this one here some money and say, God, Loves You...is...allowing God, inside of us, to do His Works, by giving us the feeling we should give, or help, or say something that reflects God.
We really are not doing any work at all.
Just like Jesus, the Father dwelled in Him, doing the works, even though, it was Jesus Who looked like He was doing the Works [He is the Exact Image of God...what God does...Jesus was doing because He is God]...
but in us, God dwelling in us, is we get a feeling, idea to help, do something. because GOD, wants to WORK, but He, wants You to be the VESSEL He works through!
i've never done a thing for Jesus!
Jesus, inside of me, gave the ideas to do what HE wanted to do. and it got done because I allowed it and obeyed. it looked like me doing it. but it was Jesus doing what He wanted to do Himself.
the Faith part: when i get the idea from Jesus to give money, i know the idea is from Jesus. so i give because my Faith says this is of God and i will obey and SEE the Miracle in the end.
Paul planted many Churches, but never saw them grow like John did.
The Moment God, stepped inside and Entered into Your heart, He, "Continued" the [Works] that He began in You and will keep Working in You, until He Resurrects You.
All we are doing, by doing anything, outside of getting the Sense I should do this, I should tell this person something about God that uplifts, I should feed the person, maybe I need to give this one here some money and say, God, Loves You...is...allowing God, inside of us, to do His Works, by giving us the feeling we should give, or help, or say something that reflects God.
We really are not doing any work at all.
Just like Jesus, the Father dwelled in Him, doing the works, even though, it was Jesus Who looked like He was doing the Works [He is the Exact Image of God...what God does...Jesus was doing because He is God]...
but in us, God dwelling in us, is we get a feeling, idea to help, do something. because GOD, wants to WORK, but He, wants You to be the VESSEL He works through!
i've never done a thing for Jesus!
Jesus, inside of me, gave the ideas to do what HE wanted to do. and it got done because I allowed it and obeyed. it looked like me doing it. but it was Jesus doing what He wanted to do Himself.
the Faith part: when i get the idea from Jesus to give money, i know the idea is from Jesus. so i give because my Faith says this is of God and i will obey and SEE the Miracle in the end.
Paul planted many Churches, but never saw them grow like John did.
-
1
- Show all
My concern is YOUR opinion. Not mine. Works-salvation is a dead end.
Think of the Jor Dan river, the river of sin and death, that starts at Adam and ends at the dead sea, out of which nothing escapes.
Those who do not pass over it end up there.
Jos 3:16
That the waters which came down from above stood and rose up upon an heap very far from the city Adam, that is beside Zaretan: and those that came down toward the sea of the plain, even the salt sea, failed, and were cut off: and the people passed over right against Jericho.
Think of the Jor Dan river, the river of sin and death, that starts at Adam and ends at the dead sea, out of which nothing escapes.
Those who do not pass over it end up there.
Jos 3:16
That the waters which came down from above stood and rose up upon an heap very far from the city Adam, that is beside Zaretan: and those that came down toward the sea of the plain, even the salt sea, failed, and were cut off: and the people passed over right against Jericho.
- Status