Demon possession in the old testament?

[The_Watchers_2017]

i see the steven anderson disciple has made himself known <3

 

[Magenta]

Enoch is NOWHERE listed.

Nowhere is Enoch listed on that list of Apocrypha.

Wow, way to miss the point. Enoch is nowhere listed historically as being accepted as inspired/part of Hebrew Scriptures.

From Reason #3 ~ please note: 22 books means Enoch is not included. At. All.

Origen (AD 250). Origen stated that there were 22 books in the OT canon. Origen did however
“included the apocryphal Letter of Jeremiah in his Old Testament canon.” Origen’s disciples (e.g.
Cyril of Jerusalem, Athanasius, Hilary of Poitiers, Gregory of Nazianus, Rufinas”) “all have a 22-book
Old Testament like the one Origen had attributed to the Jews.”

Eusebius (AD 317). He agrees with Josephus that the OT only contains 22 books, and no
books were added after the time of Artaxerxes (Ecclesiastical History, 3.10.1-5).

Cyril of Jerusalem (AD 350). He wrote, “Read the divine Scriptures, these twenty-two books of the
Old Testament… Read their twenty-two books but have nothing to do with the apocryphal writings.”

Hilary of Poitiers (AD 367). He published “a canon of the Old Testament in the prologue to his commentary
on the Psalms. It consists of the twenty-two books of the Hebrew Bible and of our present Old Testament.”

Athanasius (Bishop of Alexandria, AD 367). Athanasius listed all of the books in our Bible (minus Esther).
He writes, “There are other books besides these not indeed included in the Canon, but appointed by the
Fathers to be read by those who newly join us, and who wish for instruction in the word of godliness.
The Wisdom of Solomon, and the Wisdom of Sirach, and Esther, and Judith, and Tobit, and that which
is called the Teaching of the Apostles, and the Shepherd. But the former, my brethren, are included in
the Canon, the latter being [merely] read; nor is there in any place a mention of apocryphal writings.
But they are an invention of heretics, who write them when they choose, bestowing upon them their
approbation, and assigning to them a date, that so, using them as ancient writings, they may find occasion
to lead astray the simple” (Athanasius, Paschal Letter Letter 39). Historian Gregg Allison does note that
Athanasius did, however, include “the Letter of Jeremiah and Baruch in his canonical list.”

Epiphanius (AD 368). He was a disciple of Athanasius, who also “endorsed a canon limited to the twenty-two
books of the Hebrew Bible.” In his first list (Panorion, 1.1.8.6), Epiphanius includes the epistle of Jeremiah
and 1 Esdras (and in one manuscript, he adds Judith and Tobit to Esther). However, Beckwith writes, “By the
time that he wrote De Mensuris et Ponderibus… Epiphanius seems to have known better…
The contents of the lists appear to be exactly identical to the contents of Jerome’s.”

Rufinus (AD 390). He affirms the twenty-two book canon.

Jerome (AD 400). Jerome studied under a Jewish rabbi in Palestine, and he was a Hebrew scholar. He firmly
believed that there were only 22 books in the OT. He writes, “As then the church reads Judith, Tobit, and the
books of Maccabees, but does not admit them among the canonical Scriptures, so let it read these two
volumes for the edification of the people, not to give authority to doctrines of the church.”

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

What makes spirits demonic is that they are lying spirits, and those have been recorded from the creation of man. This is mainly why I believe 'the one who lets (restrainer) will continue to do so until he is taken out of the way' isn't speaking of the Holy Spirit. The man with the mute spirit that Jesus cast out in Luke 11:14, when it left him, spoke. The spirit that had been restraining him left, and he was loosed from the belief in its however convincing lie that he could not speak.

a person must be receptive, looking into something of a "source" to power for obvious self gain and desire, to make contact to such an entity.

Deuteronomy says people were sacrificing and worshiping demons. these people clearly saw these Fallen Angels, saw they had some kind of Power, Evil Power, but they could easily be duped into thinking it was Good at first. Then end up worshiping these.

we really don't know by written example until Jesus get's here, the "spirits" are living inside people and controlling them. Surely, this had been happening all along. People just avoided them or used them for profit.

But, what do you think is happening here about "Retraining" until gone and etc?

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

Wow, way to miss the point. Enoch is nowhere listed historically as being accepted as inspired/part of Hebrew Scriptures.

From Reason #3 ~ please note: 22 books means Enoch is not included. At. All.

Origen (AD 250). Origen stated that there were 22 books in the OT canon. Origen did however
“included the apocryphal Letter of Jeremiah in his Old Testament canon.” Origen’s disciples (e.g.
Cyril of Jerusalem, Athanasius, Hilary of Poitiers, Gregory of Nazianus, Rufinas”) “all have a 22-book
Old Testament like the one Origen had attributed to the Jews.”

Eusebius (AD 317). He agrees with Josephus that the OT only contains 22 books, and no
books were added after the time of Artaxerxes (Ecclesiastical History, 3.10.1-5).

Cyril of Jerusalem (AD 350). He wrote, “Read the divine Scriptures, these twenty-two books of the
Old Testament… Read their twenty-two books but have nothing to do with the apocryphal writings.”

Hilary of Poitiers (AD 367). He published “a canon of the Old Testament in the prologue to his commentary
on the Psalms. It consists of the twenty-two books of the Hebrew Bible and of our present Old Testament.”

Athanasius (Bishop of Alexandria, AD 367). Athanasius listed all of the books in our Bible (minus Esther).
He writes, “There are other books besides these not indeed included in the Canon, but appointed by the
Fathers to be read by those who newly join us, and who wish for instruction in the word of godliness.
The Wisdom of Solomon, and the Wisdom of Sirach, and Esther, and Judith, and Tobit, and that which
is called the Teaching of the Apostles, and the Shepherd. But the former, my brethren, are included in
the Canon, the latter being [merely] read; nor is there in any place a mention of apocryphal writings.
But they are an invention of heretics, who write them when they choose, bestowing upon them their
approbation, and assigning to them a date, that so, using them as ancient writings, they may find occasion
to lead astray the simple” (Athanasius, Paschal Letter Letter 39). Historian Gregg Allison does note that
Athanasius did, however, include “the Letter of Jeremiah and Baruch in his canonical list.”

Epiphanius (AD 368). He was a disciple of Athanasius, who also “endorsed a canon limited to the twenty-two
books of the Hebrew Bible.” In his first list (Panorion, 1.1.8.6), Epiphanius includes the epistle of Jeremiah
and 1 Esdras (and in one manuscript, he adds Judith and Tobit to Esther). However, Beckwith writes, “By the
time that he wrote De Mensuris et Ponderibus… Epiphanius seems to have known better…
The contents of the lists appear to be exactly identical to the contents of Jerome’s.”

Rufinus (AD 390). He affirms the twenty-two book canon.

Jerome (AD 400). Jerome studied under a Jewish rabbi in Palestine, and he was a Hebrew scholar. He firmly
believed that there were only 22 books in the OT. He writes, “As then the church reads Judith, Tobit, and the
books of Maccabees, but does not admit them among the canonical Scriptures, so let it read these two
volumes for the edification of the people, not to give authority to doctrines of the church.”

I never said Enoch was a Book.

I said it was a Oral Tradition and ALL throughout the BIBLE you find parts of Enoch's Words in written format.

 

[SpeakTruth101]

https://www.gotquestions.org/canon-Bible.html

The first “canon” was the Muratorian Canon, which was compiled in AD 170. The Muratorian Canon included all of the New Testament books except Hebrews, James, 1 and 2 Peter, and 3 John. In AD 363, the Council of Laodicea stated that only the Old Testament (along with one book of the Apocrypha) and 26 books of the New Testament (everything but Revelation) were canonical and to be read in the churches. The Council of Hippo (AD 393) and the Council of Carthage (AD 397) also affirmed the same 27 books as authoritative.

Yet YHWH tells us how to test one who speaks in His name, no one seems to care for the criteria He told us to follow....

 

[Mem]

a person must be receptive, looking into something of a "source" to power for obvious self gain and desire, to make contact to such an entity.

Deuteronomy says people were sacrificing and worshiping demons. these people clearly saw these Fallen Angels, saw they had some kind of Power, Evil Power, but they could easily be duped into thinking it was Good at first. Then end up worshiping these.

we really don't know by written example until Jesus get's here, the "spirits" are living inside people and controlling them. Surely, this had been happening all along. People just avoided them or used them for profit.

But, what do you think is happening here about "Retraining" until gone and etc?

Direct reference to Him, whether Father, Son, or Holy Spirit, is normally indicated by capitalization, which is missing in that particular verse, which is commonly presented to be speaking of the Holy Spirit, though subject context clearly shows is actually that of the liar.

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

Wow, way to miss the point. Enoch is nowhere listed historically as being accepted as inspired/part of Hebrew Scriptures.

From Reason #3 ~ please note: 22 books means Enoch is not included. At. All.

Origen (AD 250). Origen stated that there were 22 books in the OT canon. Origen did however
“included the apocryphal Letter of Jeremiah in his Old Testament canon.” Origen’s disciples (e.g.
Cyril of Jerusalem, Athanasius, Hilary of Poitiers, Gregory of Nazianus, Rufinas”) “all have a 22-book
Old Testament like the one Origen had attributed to the Jews.”

Eusebius (AD 317). He agrees with Josephus that the OT only contains 22 books, and no
books were added after the time of Artaxerxes (Ecclesiastical History, 3.10.1-5).

Cyril of Jerusalem (AD 350). He wrote, “Read the divine Scriptures, these twenty-two books of the
Old Testament… Read their twenty-two books but have nothing to do with the apocryphal writings.”

Hilary of Poitiers (AD 367). He published “a canon of the Old Testament in the prologue to his commentary
on the Psalms. It consists of the twenty-two books of the Hebrew Bible and of our present Old Testament.”

Athanasius (Bishop of Alexandria, AD 367). Athanasius listed all of the books in our Bible (minus Esther).
He writes, “There are other books besides these not indeed included in the Canon, but appointed by the
Fathers to be read by those who newly join us, and who wish for instruction in the word of godliness.
The Wisdom of Solomon, and the Wisdom of Sirach, and Esther, and Judith, and Tobit, and that which
is called the Teaching of the Apostles, and the Shepherd. But the former, my brethren, are included in
the Canon, the latter being [merely] read; nor is there in any place a mention of apocryphal writings.
But they are an invention of heretics, who write them when they choose, bestowing upon them their
approbation, and assigning to them a date, that so, using them as ancient writings, they may find occasion
to lead astray the simple” (Athanasius, Paschal Letter Letter 39). Historian Gregg Allison does note that
Athanasius did, however, include “the Letter of Jeremiah and Baruch in his canonical list.”

Epiphanius (AD 368). He was a disciple of Athanasius, who also “endorsed a canon limited to the twenty-two
books of the Hebrew Bible.” In his first list (Panorion, 1.1.8.6), Epiphanius includes the epistle of Jeremiah
and 1 Esdras (and in one manuscript, he adds Judith and Tobit to Esther). However, Beckwith writes, “By the
time that he wrote De Mensuris et Ponderibus… Epiphanius seems to have known better…
The contents of the lists appear to be exactly identical to the contents of Jerome’s.”

Rufinus (AD 390). He affirms the twenty-two book canon.

Jerome (AD 400). Jerome studied under a Jewish rabbi in Palestine, and he was a Hebrew scholar. He firmly
believed that there were only 22 books in the OT. He writes, “As then the church reads Judith, Tobit, and the
books of Maccabees, but does not admit them among the canonical Scriptures, so let it read these two
volumes for the edification of the people, not to give authority to doctrines of the church.”

here is what I am saying about Enoch:

According to a video done by Zachary Bauer, the Book of Enoch is the most quoted Book in the Bible and has over 200 quotes in the Old Testament and over 100 quotes in the New Testament...


Psalms (68 times)

Isaiah (55 times)

Deuteronomy (44 times)

Genesis (35 times)

Exodus (31 times)


Jesus quotes Enoch 8 separate times.

Paul, Peter, Jude, John all quote Enoch.


Enoch is Scripture and Inspired and quoted OVER 300 TIMES in the Bible!

 

[Magenta]

But this Thread is about Demons in Old Testament.

Correction: demon possession.

 

[Magenta]

here is what I am saying about Enoch:

According to a video done by Zachary Bauer, the Book of Enoch is the most quoted Book in the Bible and has over 200 quotes in the Old Testament and over 100 quotes in the New Testament...

Make up your mind. Are you talking about the book, or not???

Doesn't matter either way because it was not considered
inspired and was not included in the Hebrew Scriptures.

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

Make up your mind. Are you talking about the book, or not???

I only ever said Enoch. I am using it as the Jews would use it, which is PROPER.

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

Direct reference to Him, whether Father, Son, or Holy Spirit, is normally indicated by capitalization, which is missing in that particular verse, which is commonly presented to be speaking of the Holy Spirit, though subject context clearly shows is actually that of the liar.

So, the Holy Spirit, that inspired this writing, is saying, this is a lie that will be believed?

 

[Magenta]

I only ever said Enoch. I am using it as the Jews would use it, which is PROPER.

From Book of Enoch:

^ From your very first post in this thread.

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

^ From your very first post in this thread.

that's because the definition listed Book of Enoch so i copied their suggestion

From Book of Enoch:
Azazel is the rebellious angel at the head of a heavenly plot to take over the earth. The First Book of Enoch < the definition calls it First Book of Enoch.

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

One such spirit endorsed Paul:

Acts 16:16-17, “16 As we were going to the place of prayer, we were met by a slave girl who had a spirit of divination (Python) and brought her owners much gain by fortune-telling. 17 She followed Paul and us, crying out, “These men are servants of the Most High God, who proclaim to you the way of salvation.”

“divination” is word #G4436 - puthón: Python, a mythical serpent slain by Apollo, divination, Original Word: Πύθων, ωνος, ὁ, Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine, Transliteration: puthón, Phonetic Spelling: (poo'-thone), Definition: Python, a mythical serpent slain by Apollo, divination, Usage: a divining spirit, Python, called after the Pythian serpent said to have guarded the oracle at Delphi and been slain by Apollo.

Paul didn't want any "help" from a devil regardless of the kind.

My take away from this passage is that even if a demon speaks the truth about something, they are to be rebuked and authority established to not permit them any part in the church's ministry. I know of examples that some Christians would regard as "unchristian." They mistakenly are taught that you should allow anyone into the congregation and that they should be given opportunities to influence others.

A literal lesbian/ bi pagan was allowed to teach young children in an evangelical church. That should not happen. The woman actually was caught praying to demons.

A man possessed with a demon calling itself "Michael the Archangel" insisted the pastor read what it had written to the congregation. The demon timed his attack perfectly in sinc with the demonically influenced staff members that were leading others astray and being fired at that moment.
The demon was cast out of the church and the pastor charged with being a meanie.
The world loves their own and want feminized men in pulpits and men who submit to the devil in the name of their view of Jesus from a movie or somewhere unbiblical.

My former church had a demonized woman enter and take over a part of the service and try to cast a spell before the whole congregation. We ushers escorted her out as she raved.

So called believers and the media agree with the demons by insisting that they are allowed to speak to the churches. Then they demonize those who rebuke them. Some demons are smart and know how to manipulate. However, their strategy is often predictable.
Jesus rebuked them, told them to shut up and threw them out of the lost into pigs to be cast into the sea until they would be cast into the lake of fire at a later time.


Here's one that someone was able to video record.

Demon Insistent on Changing the Name of the Lord

You'll find people who are highly influenced by these demons, like the one above, in this and other forums. Listen to hear if it sounds familiar.

 

[Magenta]

From Book of Enoch:
Azazel is the rebellious angel at the head of a heavenly plot to take over the earth. The First Book of Enoch < the definition calls it First Book of Enoch.

To quote you: who cares?

It was not considered inspired and was not included in their Scriptures.

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

To quote you: who cares?

It was not considered inspired and was not included in their Scriptures.

it is in 300 of their Scriptures.

it is listed in over 300 specific Verses, more than all 5 Sections of Enoch together.

it is all over the Jewish Bible.

300 Verses is more than 20 of the Books in the Bible itself.

 

[Magenta]

it is in 300 of their Scriptures.

it is listed in over 300 specific Verses, more than all 5 Sections of Enoch together.

it is all over the Jewish Bible.

300 Verses is more than 20 of the Books in the Bible itself.

Not the Book of Enoch. The book of Enoch was never included in the list of inspired Hebrew Scriptures.

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

Not the Book of Enoch. The book of Enoch was never included in the list of inspired Hebrew Scriptures.

take all 300 Verses and put them as what you do read in Book of Enoch and Parts 1 and 2 are Completely in the Bible.
Actually, maybe, all of the first 3 Parts of Enoch can basically be read word for word by taking the 300 Verses and putting them together.

So the first THREE Parts or Book Sections of Enoch are most definitely in the BIBLE!

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

That makes Enoch, the first 3 Sections, at least first 2, INSPIRED!

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

And Azazel and the WATCHERS + Fallen Angels, like Genesis/Leviticus/Deuteronomy mentions, that is sections 3 and 4.

So, Enoch, has Inspired parts all over.