In your opinion do you believe world is about 6000 years old

[Moses_Young]

Why on earth would you think that the "Days" of Genesis are literal 24 hour days?

Why on Earth (or under the Earth) would you not?

 

[Fundaamental]

There are things in this world God has not explained to us. If he thought it was critical for us to know these things he would have told them to us. However one of the issues being discussed is not a major point for discussion. God has already made known to us clearly what the answer is. God was particular to mention that when he finished creating certain things, the day would end and there would be darkness then light again, then he would create, then there would be darkness and light again. God is explaining the setting and rising of the sun. Although the explanation is more simplistic than the reality taking place , God has explained it to us in a way that a simple man can understand.

I think the lord does want us to know what he knows about all things

Remember we didn't really have a choice in one reguard because mankind gained all knowledge of good and evil. Which the lord wanted to prevent.

Mankind where not suppose to know all things is probably more fitting.

When the earth is destroyed one thing in this earth will still remain

Samuel 2:8 (ESV)
8 He raises up the poor from the dust;
he lifts the needy from the ash heap
to make them sit with princes
and inherit a seat of honor.
For the pillars of the earth are the Lord’s,
and on them he has set the world.

The pillars (are also the foundations) will remain for the new earth to be laid upon.

As these pillars are the lord's.

Something that is the lords is eternal.

But from which point it was eternal remains mystery.

But that doesn't mean to say we don't know, because we clearly do in one regard we understand the mystery

 

[Moses_Young]

Correction: Adam dies SPIRITUALLY as soon as he threw God under the bus, and sided with satan. The 980 years he lived AFTER that are unimportant.

The word means "dying, you shall die". Adam's process of dying started when he ate the fruit. We are already dead in our sins, without Christ.

 

[Moses_Young]

Nobody that I know if is disputing that.

The dude below is disputing it.

Why on earth would you think that the "Days" of Genesis are literal 24 hour days?

That is your understanding of it.... it still doesn't fit with God telling man and woman (created at the same time) on the 6th day to be fruitful and multiply.

Why not? God made Adam and Eve on the 6th day, and told them to be fruitful and multiply?

You want to understand it as "zooming in"..... what if those verses are the beginning of the story of the "sons of God" that are chronicled in the Bible as we know it?

The sons of God spoken of in Genesis 6 are the angels. Certain evil angels came down to Earth and took human wives, and produced giants.

 

[DJT_47]

Why on Earth (or under the Earth) would you not?

As I posted above, the moon and the sun weren't created and placed in the heavens until day 4 and its by them that the 24hr day is determined as well as order celestial signs and events. So how long were days 1, 2, and 3? Read the post and Gen 1:14


14And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:

 

[Moses_Young]

As I posted above, the moon and the sun weren't created and placed in the heavens until day 4 and its by them that the 24hr day is determined as well as order celestial signs and events. So how long were days 1, 2, and 3? Read the post and Gen 1:14


14And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:

Lol. A day is a day is a day. 24 hours. With or without the sun and moon. Does time cease passing in the North during the Northern Winter, simply because there is no sun? The sun and moon are timepieces, not time itself.

(i.e. the tree still falls in the forest, irrespective of whether anyone is there to hear it, or no).

 

[Fundaamental]

Lol. A day is a day is a day. 24 hours. With or without the sun and moon. Does time cease passing in the North during the Northern Winter, simply because there is no sun? The sun and moon are timepieces, not time itself.

(i.e. the tree still falls in the forest, irrespective of whether anyone is there to hear it, or no).

this is based on your belief the earth is motionless

 

[Moses_Young]

this is based on your belief the earth is motionless

It's based on my belief that the scriptures are God-breathed, and that He knows what He's talking about.

(And yes, the Earth is motionless, but I think that is a topic for a separate thread).

 

[DJT_47]

Lol. A day is a day is a day. 24 hours. With or without the sun and moon. Does time cease passing in the North during the Northern Winter, simply because there is no sun? The sun and moon are timepieces, not time itself.

(i.e. the tree still falls in the forest, irrespective of whether anyone is there to hear it, or no).

A day is not necessarily a 24hr day.


2 Peter 2:8

8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

 

[Fundaamental]

It's based on my belief that the scriptures are God-breathed, and that He knows what He's talking about.

(And yes, the Earth is motionless, but I think that is a topic for a separate thread).

well no the sun determines the day and moon determines the night.

I understood why DT was saying

So you must have some thought of motion in mind.

If the earth spun faster or in your belief if the sun orbited the earth a lot faster or slower the days would be shorter or longer.

If there was no sun or moon to begin with there would be no day or night.

And how do you know the sun and moon don't also determine the clockwork of earth seeing as there going round like a clock.

Why couldn't of God designed that way

 

[Moses_Young]

A day is not necessarily a 24hr day.


2 Peter 2:8

8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

You need to read it in context. The word "day" in scripture can have multiple meanings. It can mean a literal 24-hour day, a period of time (e.g. in my father's day), or the light portion of the 24-hour day.

Whenever a number precedes the word day, the scriptures are talking about a 24-hour day. Whenever a day is used with reference to its evening and morning, it's talking about a 24-hour day. Let scripture interpret itself:

Genesis 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
Genesis 1:8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.
Genesis 1:13 And the evening and the morning were the third day.

And so on. Note the reference to evening and morning, and the number indicating which day is being spoken of? All indications of 24-hour days. There is no way for God to have been any clearer than He was to indicate His intention that the days were the normal, 24-hour days we are used to.

The passage referred to in Peter just indicates God is outside of time. It has nothing to do with Genesis. Are you trying to say God created in 7000 years? Adam and Eve would have been 1000 years old by the 7th day, were this true. Given Adam died before reaching the age of 1000, this is clearly incorrect. Also, God rests on the 7th day as an example to us, that we too can rest on the 7th. Were these days really 1000 years each, there would be no reason for us to have a rest day every week (or even a 7 day week, rather than a 7000 year week).

well no the sun determines the day and moon determines the night.

Re-read the scripture. God created the light first. There was day and night without the sun and moon, for 3 days.

 

[Fundaamental]

You need to read it in context. The word "day" in scripture can have multiple meanings. It can mean a literal 24-hour day, a period of time (e.g. in my father's day), or the light portion of the 24-hour day.

Whenever a number precedes the word day, the scriptures are talking about a 24-hour day. Whenever a day is used with reference to its evening and morning, it's talking about a 24-hour day. Let scripture interpret itself:

Genesis 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
Genesis 1:8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.
Genesis 1:13 And the evening and the morning were the third day.

And so on. Note the reference to evening and morning, and the number indicating which day is being spoken of? All indications of 24-hour days. There is no way for God to have been any clearer than He was to indicate His intention that the days were the normal, 24-hour days we are used to.

The passage referred to in Peter just indicates God is outside of time. It has nothing to do with Genesis. Are you trying to say God created in 7000 years? Adam and Eve would have been 1000 years old by the 7th day, were this true. Given Adam died before reaching the age of 1000, this is clearly incorrect. Also, God rests on the 7th day as an example to us, that we too can rest on the 7th. Were these days really 1000 years each, there would be no reason for us to have a rest day every week (or even a 7 day week, rather than a 7000 year week).

Re-read the scripture. God created the light first. There was day and night without the sun and moon, for 3 days.

you just said God lives outside of our time zone which I agree upon so why are you using his time zone to determine ours in another instance

For everyday that passes for us could be explained as time moving a lot slower in God's kingdom.

So for instance if you put the earth in God's place of dwelling we really would experience longer days, it could be untill the sun and the moon where put in place the foundations of earth where actually experiencing those long days but the lord referred it to our time zone and not his.

 

[Moses_Young]

you just said God lives outside of our time zone which I agree upon so why are you using his time zone to determine ours in another instance

For everyday that passes for us could be explained as time moving a lot slower in God's kingdom.

So for instance if you put the earth in God's place of dwelling we really would experience longer days, it could be untill the sun and the moon where put in place the foundations of earth where actually experiencing those long days but the lord referred it to our time zone and not his.

God is outside of time. It doesn't mean He doesn't know what time is. He told us as clearly as could be stated that He created the Earth in 7, 24-hour days. Any belief to the contrary is not supported by scripture.

Men dream up lots of coulds, and woulds, and might-haves. But the days of creation are not one of these, as God has stated it outright.

 

[Fundaamental]

God is outside of time. It doesn't mean He doesn't know what time is. He told us as clearly as could be stated that He created the Earth in 7 days. Any belief to the contrary is not supported by scripture.

Men dream up lots of coulds, and woulds, and might-haves. But the days of creation are not one of these, as God has stated it outright.

he would tell us the earth was created in our time zone as not to confuse us.

That's what your not seeing.

But until the sun and moon where put in place the actually true time zone for us may have only have started at that point.

Then of course there's the foundations of the earth.

We know that there separate,, from scripture there identified as two separate creations

We don't exactly know when they where put in place.

 

[Fundaamental]

You need to read it in context. The word "day" in scripture can have multiple meanings. It can mean a literal 24-hour day, a period of time (e.g. in my father's day), or the light portion of the 24-hour day.

Whenever a number precedes the word day, the scriptures are talking about a 24-hour day. Whenever a day is used with reference to its evening and morning, it's talking about a 24-hour day. Let scripture interpret itself:

Genesis 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
Genesis 1:8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.
Genesis 1:13 And the evening and the morning were the third day.

And so on. Note the reference to evening and morning, and the number indicating which day is being spoken of? All indications of 24-hour days. There is no way for God to have been any clearer than He was to indicate His intention that the days were the normal, 24-hour days we are used to.

Honestly on one hand you say anything out of scripture is contrary to belief, and the other you post unhappy mojos.

but are you not also making suggestions out side of scripture to

genesis 1 .5 refering to the first day of creation only says God called the first day, day and night.

it doesn't say a true 24 hour period started from that point


Can you see now ? Yes no. How your determining one instance of God's time zone to ours in one instance but not in another,

and really moses I have to say, to go down the road of not being open to ponder and wonder with an open mind in this discussion is a little unfair

 

[Moses_Young]

Honestly on one hand you say anything out of scripture is contrary to belief, and the other you post unhappy mojos.

but are you not also making suggestions out side of scripture to

genesis 1 .5 refering to the first day of creation only says God called the first day, day and night.

it doesn't say a true 24 hour period started from that point


Can you see now ? Yes no. How your determining one instance of God's time zone to ours in one instance but not in another,

and really moses I have to say, to go down the road of not being open to ponder and wonder with an open mind in this discussion is a little unfair

Scripture should be interpreted with scripture. There are 3 definitions used for day. The only consistent definition for the days of creation is a 24-hour day. That you should invent a special definition for the first 3 days, without any cause or reason, is adding to scripture. It's as simple as that.

(I don't think I posted any unhappy mojos. Lol. I didn't know they were called that. Just crosses, when something is outright wrong. Think of your teacher in primary school when you got an answer incorrect. I'm like that teacher. Only better. At least, sometimes. )

 

[Fundaamental]

Scripture should be interpreted with scripture. There are 3 definitions used for day. The only consistent definition for the days of creation is a 24-hour day. That you should invent a special definition for the first 3 days, without any cause or reason, is adding to scripture. It's as simple as that.

(I don't think I posted any unhappy mojos. Lol. I didn't know they were called that. Just crosses, when something is outright wrong. Think of your teacher in primary school when you got an answer incorrect. I'm like that teacher. Only better. At least, sometimes. )

lol speaking in tongues it is then.

A special definition would be when where the foundations of the earth layed.

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters

Can you see the foundations are missing.

Can you also see there's more than one understanding of beginning.

 

[hornetguy]

The point is the supposed "generic men/women" would be sinless, as sin came through Adam. Why then would they be subject to dying in the flood?

You are sort of presuming a lot, saying they would have been sinless. How long did it take Adam and Eve to sin?
I imagine that generic man and woman were sinning from the very start.... it is human nature, after all.
Adam and Eve are how sin came into the world for God's chosen people.
How do you think the serpent became crafty? It just all of a sudden became crafty and deceitful when Eve showed up?

 

[hornetguy]

Why not? God made Adam and Eve on the 6th day, and told them to be fruitful and multiply?

That is what has been taught by most people. It does not, however, line up with the Gen 2-3 full story of Adam's creation, then Eve's creation, their disobedience after being lied to by the serpent, and then the discussion with God, followed by expulsion from the garden. Nowhere in that story did God tell them to be fruitful and multiply. He simply said that pain in childbirth would be increased, and that they would have to work for their sustenance.

In Gen 1, He created man and woman, presumably at the same time, and sent them out into the world to subdue it and fill it. Nowhere is there a mention of a prelude in a garden, followed by disobedience and expulsion... which is what led me to thinking that perhaps we've misunderstood how it all came about.

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

ok I will let it go. But you did play a bit unfair.

Theese two passages confirm my vision

Job 38.4
Where were you when I laid the foundation of the earth?
Tell Me, if you have understanding,

Samuel 2:8 (ESV)
8 He raises up the poor from the dust;
he lifts the needy from the ash heap
to make them sit with princes
and inherit a seat of honor.
For the pillars of the earth are the Lord’s,
and on them he has set the world.

Both scripture clearly point to the foundations of the earth
Being a separate creation to the earth.

Samuel points toward the foundations being created in heaven.

And there's no way of knowing how old those foundations are.

Those foundation could well have been created in heaven and even and forged in fire for billions of years.

The scripture you posted about Enoch also points in the same direction.

However since that book is not in the bible which you knew befor posting it.

Enoch could not be used for validation.

However you said your quoting from Enoch at first.

You should have said the book of Enoch.

There's a person in the bible called Enoch who is described as walking with God, So who is he I can't find much on him.

This is who I thought you ment.

My guess this is possibly the same Enoch, am I correct ?

But if Enoch and Samuel and job both indicate the same thing then surely Enoch must have some credibility.

It's good to have usage of Job and Samuel

Isaiah 48:13
“Surely My hand founded the earth,
And My right hand spread out the heavens;
When I call to them, they stand together.

When He set for the sea its boundary
So that the water would not transgress His command,
When He marked out the foundations of the earth;

Psalm 104:5
He established the earth upon its foundations,
So that it will not totter forever and ever.

Jeremiah 31:37
Thus says the Lord,
“If the heavens above can be measured
And the foundations of the earth searched out below,
Then I will also cast off all the offspring of Israel
For all that they have done,” declares the Lord.