Doctrine of Unconditional Election

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Beckie

Beckie

Well-known member
#4,841
Feb 15, 2022
2,516
939
113
#4,841
Years as a dispensationalist i prayed to God, for salvation of others . I think it was about the same prayer we all pray salvation of loved ones , friends the country the world... telling the people you better choose .. Now my prayer is down the lines of God please speak to their heart draw them unto You. Though it may not seems so different to some i understand the differences
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#4,842
Jan 13, 2016
17,162
3,699
113
#4,842
Cameron143 said:
God's will always comes to pass. It's immutable.
I'm glad God blessed you with healing but I believe it was always His intention and for His glory.
Click to expand...
Everything that happens is not God's will, but the natural course of human history. God's will is found in scripture. It will come to pass. I don't think me getting cancer was God's will. People get cancer. How we react to our circumstances should be according to God's will. God has all power to hear our prayers and bring healing.
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

Well-known member
#4,843
Mar 1, 2022
20,075
6,882
113
62
#4,843
John146 said:
Everything that happens is not God's will, but the natural course of human history. God's will is found in scripture. It will come to pass. I don't think me getting cancer was God's will. People get cancer. How we react to our circumstances should be according to God's will. God has all power to hear our prayers and bring healing.
Click to expand...
Was it God's will that a man be blind from birth so that Jesus would heal him and the glory of God be made known?
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#4,844
Jan 13, 2016
17,162
3,699
113
#4,844
Cameron143 said:
Was it God's will that a man be blind from birth so that Jesus would heal him and the glory of God be made known?
Click to expand...
Was it God's will? Yes, God got the glory for his healing, but what if man did not respond properly? Man is faced with a decision when faced with the word of God.

See post #4,834
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

Well-known member
#4,845
Mar 1, 2022
20,075
6,882
113
62
#4,845
John146 said:
Everything that happens is not God's will, but the natural course of human history. God's will is found in scripture. It will come to pass. I don't think me getting cancer was God's will. People get cancer. How we react to our circumstances should be according to God's will. God has all power to hear our prayers and bring healing.
Click to expand...
The Lord's Prayer begins with the praise and recognition of God. Next that His will is done on earth. The rest of the prayer is prayed with this in mind.
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

Well-known member
#4,848
Mar 1, 2022
20,075
6,882
113
62
#4,848
John146 said:
Was it God's will? Yes, God got the glory for his healing, but what if man did not respond properly? Man is faced with a decision when faced with the word of God.

See post #4,834
Click to expand...
All things accomplish God's purposes. Even Satan is accomplishing God's purposes.
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#4,849
Jan 13, 2016
17,162
3,699
113
#4,849
Cameron143 said:
The Lord's Prayer begins with the praise and recognition of God. Next that His will is done on earth. The rest of the prayer is prayed with this in mind.
Click to expand...
Not the Lord's prayer. He never prayed those words, but it should be recognized as his Jewish disciple's prayer. They were to pray for the promised kingdom to come down to Israel on earth as was promised to them.
 
R

rogerg

Well-known member
#4,852
Jul 13, 2021
3,882
645
113
#4,852
VARob said:
It is God's will for everyone to be saved (1 Tim 2:4; 2 Pet 3:9). Will that come to pass?
Click to expand...
No. If it was God's will for everyone to become saved, they would become saved, but they don't become saved so that was never His will.

[Psa 115:3 KJV] 3 But our God [is] in the heavens: he hath done whatsoever he hath pleased.

[Job 23:13 KJV] 13 But he [is] in one [mind], and who can turn him? and [what] his soul desireth, even [that] he doeth.
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

Well-known member
#4,853
Mar 1, 2022
20,075
6,882
113
62
#4,853
John146 said:
And yet, God can be touched with our prayers even changing the natural course of history.
Click to expand...
Yes. But never anything He doesn't choose.
Look...we disagree about the sovereignty of God. It's not a salvation issue. I truly appreciate your candor and time. Grace and peace.
 
R

rogerg

Well-known member
#4,854
Jul 13, 2021
3,882
645
113
#4,854
Cameron143 said:
All things accomplish God's purposes. Even Satan is accomplishing God's purposes.
Click to expand...
So based upon that, it cannot be God's will for everyone to become saved, or they would be.
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

Well-known member
#4,855
Mar 1, 2022
20,075
6,882
113
62
#4,855
John146 said:
Is it God's will that we sin?
Click to expand...
It was God's choice to allow sin. That means He chose to let it be as opposed to not permitting it. I'm comfortable with whatever you want to call that.
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#4,857
Jan 13, 2016
17,162
3,699
113
#4,857
Cameron143 said:
It was God's choice to allow sin. That means He chose to let it be as opposed to not permitting it. I'm comfortable with whatever you want to call that.
Click to expand...
It is not God's will that I sin, yet I sin daily.

1 Thessalonians 5:18 In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.

Unfortunately, I sometimes fail to give God thanks in everything.
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

Well-known member
#4,858
Mar 1, 2022
20,075
6,882
113
62
#4,858
John146 said:
It is not God's will that I sin, yet I sin daily.

1 Thessalonians 5:18 In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.

Unfortunately, I sometimes fail to give God thanks in everything.
Click to expand...
Sin falls under what God allows. He could stop you at any moment.
It is sin that called for the sacrifice of Jesus. In this sacrifice, the love of God is more fully known. God is more and more glorified as more of Himself is revealed. So it is in this sense that in the sovereign purposes of God, He chose to allow sin.

In like manner, God could make you holy as He is holy. He has chosen to work through the Holy Spirit and over time to perfect us. In this sense, sin still accomplishes His purposes.

God can both allow something and desire you to be free of it.
 
V

VARob

Banned
#4,859
Dec 21, 2020
1,825
474
83
#4,859
Cameron143 said:
Yes
Click to expand...
Interesting... So you believe everyone is going to be saved?

Who is going to be thrown into the lake of fire? Who are those whose names will not be written in the book of life?
 
J

John146

Senior Member
#4,860
Jan 13, 2016
17,162
3,699
113
#4,860
Cameron143 said:
Sin falls under what God allows. He could stop you at any moment.
It is sin that called for the sacrifice of Jesus. In this sacrifice, the love of God is more fully known. God is more and more glorified as more of Himself is revealed. So it is in this sense that in the sovereign purposes of God, He chose to allow sin.

In like manner, God could make you holy as He is holy. He has chosen to work through the Holy Spirit and over time to perfect us. In this sense, sin still accomplishes His purposes.

God can both allow something and desire you to be free of it.
Click to expand...
God's will is plainly stated, yet, God's will is not always performed. Of course, God allows it because he has given us free will to choose to give him thanks in everything or to not give him thanks in everything.

1 Thessalonians 5:18 In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.