Jesus is God

[Gideon300]

Which verse shows Jesus plainly saying "I am Lord God Almighty?" I am not talking about verses that can be interpreted based on opinion. Where does Jesus plainly, undeniably, unequivocally say "I am Yahweh."

Like all things in the Bible, clear and direct answers are very important.

John 8:
57Then the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and You have seen Abraham?”

58“Truly, truly, I tell you,” Jesus declared, “before Abraham was born, I am!”

59At this, they picked up stones to throw at Him. But Jesus was hidden and went out of the temple area.
Exodus 3:
13Then Moses asked God, “Suppose I go to the Israelites and say to them, ‘The God of your fathers has sent me to you,’ and they ask me, ‘What is His name?’ What should I tell them?”

14God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I AM has sent me to you.’ ”

Not all things in the Bible are clear and direct. That's why we have prophets and teachers.
Acts 18
24Meanwhile a Jew named Apollos, a native of Alexandria, came to Ephesus. He was an eloquent man, well versed in the Scriptures. 25He had been instructed in the way of the Lord and was fervent in spirit. He spoke and taught accurately about Jesus,e though he knew only the baptism of John. 26And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue. When Priscilla and Aquila heard him, they took him in and explained to him the way of God more accurately.

 

[Gideon300]

John 8:
57Then the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and You have seen Abraham?”

58“Truly, truly, I tell you,” Jesus declared, “before Abraham was born, I am!”

59At this, they picked up stones to throw at Him. But Jesus was hidden and went out of the temple area.
Exodus 3:
13Then Moses asked God, “Suppose I go to the Israelites and say to them, ‘The God of your fathers has sent me to you,’ and they ask me, ‘What is His name?’ What should I tell them?”

14God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: ‘I AM has sent me to you.’ ”

Not all things in the Bible are clear and direct. That's why we have prophets and teachers.
Acts 18
24Meanwhile a Jew named Apollos, a native of Alexandria, came to Ephesus. He was an eloquent man, well versed in the Scriptures. 25He had been instructed in the way of the Lord and was fervent in spirit. He spoke and taught accurately about Jesus,e though he knew only the baptism of John. 26And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue. When Priscilla and Aquila heard him, they took him in and explained to him the way of God more accurately.

 

[Runningman]

Hmm

Jeremiah 9:24
But let him who glories glory in this, That he understands and knows Me, That I [am] the LORD, exercising lovingkindness, judgment, and righteousness in the earth. For in these I delight," says the LORD.

This is clearly speaking of YHWH


Paul quotes it here:

1 Corinthians 1:30-31
But of Him you are in Christ Jesus, who became for us wisdom from God—and righteousness and sanctification and redemption— that, as it is written, "He who glories, let him glory in the LORD."

Clearly identifying it as speaking of Christ.

In the context of 1 Corinthians 1, Paul is speaking of two persons: God and Jesus Christ. Paul said God chose the foolish things of this world and it is because of Him you are in Christ Jesus. The Him is referring to God. Paul always makes a distinction between God and Jesus Christ.

If Paul actually quotes scripture, the original context doesn’t change. YHWH is still YHWH of course, but Paul doesn’t call Jesus that.

1 Cor. 1
27But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong.
30It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God—that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption.


Again:

Joel 2:32
And it shall come to pass [That] whoever calls on the name of the LORD Shall be saved. For in Mount Zion and in Jerusalem there shall be deliverance, As the LORD has said, Among the remnant whom the LORD calls.

Clearly speaks of YHWH

yet:

Romans 10:10-11
For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. For the Scripture says, "Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame."

Paul quotes it as clearly referencing Jesus

Again… the same thing here. In the context Paul is speaking of two persons: God and Jesus Christ. Here’s the proof:

Romans 10
9If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Paul said the one to believe in is God. Then in verse 11 he quotes OT scripture confirming who that one to believe in is:

11As Scripture says, “Anyone who believes in him will never be put to shame.”

Seems to me Paul clearly preaches that Jesus is YHWH manifest in the flesh.

I don’t see that anywhere personally.


1 Corinthians 8
6yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.

Ephesians 1
3Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ.

Ephesians 4
6one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

Matthew 23
9And do not call anyone on earth ‘father,’ for you have one Father, and he is in heaven.


This isn’t just a one-off thing Paul said. There are more examples and he is consistent about it.

 

[TheLearner]

I am in a lot of pain today. I am very puzzled how one can understand what someone doesn't say ???

 

[TheLearner]

Okay, but a Jesus said his Father is greater than him. This isn’t supposed to go round and round, it’s supposed to stop where scripture asserts the authoritative last word, but have it your way.

Acts 1:7-8

J.B. Phillips New Testament



7-8 To this he replied, “You cannot know times and dates which have been fixed by the Father’s sole authority. But you are to be given power when the Holy Spirit has come to you. You will be witnesses to me, not only in Jerusalem, not only throughout Judea, not only in Samaria, but to the very ends of the earth!”

Question
I recently enquired of a pastor about church membership. He gave me a list of doctrinal statements which I had no problem with, except that I questioned him about one which had to do with Jesus being equal to God the Father in terms of knowledge, power and authority. I have gleaned from my study of the Bible that Jesus does not know everything that the Father knows (e.g. Jesus does not know the time of the end of the age [Matt. 24-26]). Further, by Jesus' own admission, he does not have the authority to make appointments to office in the kingdom of heaven (Mark 10:40). Also, 1 Corinthians 15:24-28 explains that while Jesus is given all authority in heaven and earth with respect to the everlasting kingdom, this is not inclusive of power over God the Father, to whom Jesus is still subject. It seems perfectly clear from the Bible that while Jesus and God the Father may well be equal in terms of their divinity because they are both members of the divine family, there is no suggestion that they are equal in all other respects.
Answer
Let's start with an affirmation of the doctrine of the ontological Trinity, which states that God exists in three persons and one essence. This is a careful way of conveying the following truths: 1) there is only one God; 2) the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit are all God; and 3) the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are different persons. With the possible exception of a couple technical attributes generally ascribed only to one or another person of the Godhead, and which are aspects of the way God exists in three persons, all those attributes native to God's being are shared equally by the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. In his divine nature, Jesus the Son of God is fully God (John 1:1; Tit. 2:13; 2 Pet. 1:1), possessing all the attributes native to God in his essence, that is, all the attributes that God possesses just because he exists as God. Omniscience and omnipotence are of this category, so that Jesus possesses both, making him equal to the persons of the Father and of the Holy Spirit in knowledge and power.

However, Jesus also has a human nature. Because omniscience and omnipotence are infinite by definition, and because man is finite, man cannot possess these attributes. Thus, in his human nature, Jesus the Man cannot be equal to any of the persons of the Godhead in knowledge or in power. Generally, the Bible speaks of Jesus from the perspective of his human nature, as in the passages you stated. Granted, the distinction between what Jesus knows in his human nature and what he knows in his divine nature is a difficult one to fathom. It is one of the mysteries of the hypostatic union (the union of a divine nature and a human nature in the one person Jesus Christ) that is beyond our experience and normal patterns of thinking.

The question of authority is more complicated. It involves issues related to the hypostatic union, the economic Trinity, and the ontological Trinity. The economic Trinity describes the way in which the persons of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit interact with and relate to one another, as opposed to the ontological Trinity which describes the way they exist. Authority is often described in terms of right and power. Inasmuch as Jesus is divine, he possesses equal power to the Father and the Holy Spirit. His divine right over creation is absolute as well. Moreover, his authority even in his human nature is now absolute over creation. This, I believe, is what Paul was saying in 1 Corinthians 15:28 -- the context specifically refers to Jesus' human nature (1 Cor. 15:21). I believe this is also the perspective expressed in Mark 10:40. It is safe to conclude that all members of the Godhead hold equal authority over creation.

But is there an inter-Trinitarian authority heirarchy? Yes. In the economic Trinity, the Son willingly submits to the Father's authority, and the Holy Spirit submits to both the Father and the Son. Most people would understand this to demonstrate that the Father's economic inter-Trinitarian authority is greater than the Son's and the Holy Spirit's, and that the Son's is greater than the Holy Spirit's. I suppose there might be some who argue that all persons of the Trinity are ontologically equal in authority, while being economically unequal, but I am unfamiliar with anyone who actually makes this case. Equality of authority is not something generally asserted in statements of faith, creeds or confessions.

https://thirdmill.org/answers/answer.asp/file/40398

 

[Runningman]

Acts 1:7-8

J.B. Phillips New Testament



7-8 To this he replied, “You cannot know times and dates which have been fixed by the Father’s sole authority. But you are to be given power when the Holy Spirit has come to you. You will be witnesses to me, not only in Jerusalem, not only throughout Judea, not only in Samaria, but to the very ends of the earth!”

In that same vein, Matthew 24:36 proves that the Father knows something that the Son does not know. That means the Father knows more than the Son.

36No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father.

 

[TheLearner]

not keeping up, each person please give your summary of your positions please.

 

[TheLearner]

In that same vein, Matthew 24:36 proves that the Father knows something that the Son does not know. That means the Father knows more than the Son.

36No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father.

I understand it was Jesus chosing not to know.

Isaiah 41:4
Who has performed and carried this out, calling the generations from the beginning? I, the Lord—the first and will be with the last —I am the One!”
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
Isaiah 43:10
“You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord, “and my servant whom I have chosen, so that you may know and trust me and understand that I am the One. Before me no God was formed, nor will there be one after me.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
Isaiah 43:13
“I am God; also from ancient days I am the one. And there is no one who can deliver out of my hand; when I act, who can reverse it?”
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
Isaiah 43:25
“I, I am the one who blots out your transgression for my own sake, and I’ll remember your sins no more.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
Isaiah 45:8
“Shout, you skies above, and you clouds, and let righteousness stream down. I am the one who says to the earth, ‘Let salvation blossom, and let righteousness sprout forth.’
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
Isaiah 46:4
Even until your old age, I am the one, and I’ll carry you even until your gray hairs come. It is I who have created, and I who will carry, and it is I who will bear and save.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
Isaiah 47:8
“Now hear this, you wanton creature, lounging with no cares, and saying to herself: ‘I am the one, and there will be none besides me; I won’t live as a widow, nor will I see the loss of children.’
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
Isaiah 47:10
Self-Deception of the Babylonians
“You trusted in your own knowledge. You said, ‘No one sees me.’ Your wisdom and knowledge have misled you. You said in your heart, ‘I am the one, and there will be none besides me.’
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
Isaiah 48:12
The Lord Calls Israel
“Listen to these things, Jacob, and Israel, whom I have called. I am the One: I am the first, I am even the last.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
Isaiah 51:12
“I—yes, I—am the one who comforts you. Who are you, that you are so afraid of humans who will die, descendants of mere men, who have been made like grass?
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
John 18:8
Jesus replied, “I told you that I am the one, so if you are looking for me, let these men go.”
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
Revelation 2:23
I will strike her children dead. Then all the churches will know that I am the one who searches minds and hearts. I will reward each of you as your actions deserve.

 

[Magenta]

I am in a lot of pain today.

I am sorry to hear that Also, how is Larry doing?

 

[TheLearner]

1. Isaiah 41:13
   A Call to Courage
   “For I am the Lord your God, who takes hold of your right hand, who says to you, ‘Don’t be afraid. I’ll help you.
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
2. Isaiah 43:3
   “I am the Lord your God, the Holy One of Israel, your Redeemer. And I’ve given Egypt as your ransom, Cush and the people of Seba in exchange for you.
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
3. Isaiah 43:11
   I, yes I, am the Lord, and apart from me there is no savior.
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
4. Isaiah 43:15
   I am the Lord, your Holy One, Creator of Israel, and your King.”
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
5. Isaiah 44:24
   “This is what the Lord says, your Redeemer and the one who formed you in the womb: ‘I am the Lord, who has made everything, who alone stretched out the heavens, who spread out the earth— Who was with me at that time?—
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
6. Isaiah 45:5
   I am the Lord, and there is no other besides me: and there are no gods. I’m strengthening you, although you have not acknowledged me,
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
7. Isaiah 45:6
   so that from the sun’s rising to the west people may know that there is none besides me. “I am the Lord, and there is no other.”
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
8. Isaiah 45:7
   God is Sovereign
   “I form light and create darkness, I make goodness and create disaster. I am the Lord, who does all these things.
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
9. Isaiah 45:18
   For this is what the Lord says, who created the heavens— he is God, and the one who formed the earth and made it, and he is the one who established it; he didn’t create it for chaos, but formed it to be inhabited— “I am the Lord and there is no other.
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
10. Isaiah 48:17
    “This is what the Lord says, your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel: “I am the Lord your God, who teaches you how to succeed, who directs you in the path by which you should go.
    In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
11. Isaiah 49:23
    “Oh, yes! Kings will be your foster fathers, and their queens will be your nursing mothers. They will bow to you with their faces to the ground, and lick the dust from your feet. Then you will know that I am the Lord; those who hope in me will not be disappointed.
    In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
12. Isaiah 49:26
    “I’ll make those who mistreat you eat their own flesh, and they will get drunk on their own blood, as with new wine. “Then all mankind will know that I am the Lord your Savior and your Redeemer, the Mighty One of Jacob.”
    In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
13. Isaiah 51:15
    A Promise of Restoration
    “For I am the Lord your God, who churns up the sea, so that its waves roar, ‘The Lord of the Heavenly Armies is his name.’
    In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
14. Isaiah 60:22
    The least of them will become a thousand, and the smallest one a mighty nation. “I am the Lord; When the time is right, I will do this swiftly.”
    In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

 

[TheLearner]

I am sorry to hear that. Also, how is Larry doing?

Larry has a new hernia in his digestive track. We keep telling Larry we do not want him to be out of sight. He does have a doctor's appointment coming up.

 

[Magenta]

Larry has a new hernia in his digestive track. We keep telling Larry we do not
want him to be out of sight. He does have a doctor's appointment coming up.

A new hernia? So another one?

 

[Dino246]

I haven't contributed yet to this thread, but I want to affirm the thread title...

Yes and Amen!

 

[Cameron143]

I am in a lot of pain today. I am very puzzled how one can understand what someone doesn't say ???

Some call that discernment.
Some call that malarkey.
First time I've heard it called pain but frankly that's as good as either of the others.

 

[Cameron143]

I am in a lot of pain today. I am very puzzled how one can understand what someone doesn't say ???

I apologize. I thought you were connecting the 2 thoughts. I didn't intend to make light of your suffering. I'll keep you in prayer.

 

[gb9]

I haven't contributed yet to this thread, but I want to affirm the thread title...

Yes and Amen!

same for me.

 

[Runningman]

I am in a lot of pain today. I am very puzzled how one can understand what someone doesn't say ???

Sorry to hear you’re in a lot of pain.

I understood the non verbal cue as well, I just didn’t want to feed into the mocking.

 

[wattie]

I agree with the Father being distinct to the Son. Not one persona. Two personas. And with the Holy Spirit .. three distinct personas. But actual seperation I don't see. Because the way the interelate isn't of seperateness. What the Father does, the Son does and the Holy Spirit does.

Jesus sends the Comforter-- yet it is Jesus who can be 'in the midst' of a church.

So.. just to clarify I don't see Jesus as the Father. But because they are part of the one triune God.. they are not seperate in that way.

 

[notonmywatch]

This has been covered already, there is another at least one thread called 'Christ is God', but I think there is too much lowering of Jesus' status in these forums at the moment.

When the Pharisees wanted to stone Jesus, it was for blasphemy. Jesus was making Himself equal with God. So.. that does not mean that He *wasn't* God. It means He is equal. Jesus is distinct from the Father.. but not inferior. Inferiority.. and you are getting into Polytheism.

Jesus also says to them 'before Abraham was, I AM'... that is a clear reference to God talking to Moses at the burning bush. He is again making Himself equal with God.. and saying those words from God are His words. He is identifying Himself with Yahweh.. the national God of Israel... and beyond that.

Jesus saying 'The Father is greater than I'

With this verse, in the passage He ascends to be one with the Father later, after saying it.

If I say.. the president is greater than I.. is he an ontologically superior being?

No.. he is not. He is a flawed human being like I am, but he is in a greater position.

In Revelation.. this is Jesus' words to the churches.. it also the Holy Spirit's word to the churches.. and then Jesus is referred to with 'Alpha and Omega' terms.. which is used for the Father.

You can't avoid this! Jesus DID claim, indirectly to be God!

Then there is also the Jewish concept of agency.. the messager taking an originators message.. the agent becomes equal to the messenger. So when Jesus says 'by the hand of the Father'.. 'and I and the Father are one'.. things like that... to the Jews... that is saying 'I am God'.. His words are equal to the Fathers.

It goes on and on.. such as 'all the fullness of the Godhead dwells in Him bodily'

And also that Jesus accepted worship of Himself.

'Son' meaning 'image' 'expression' 'manifestation' of God.. not 'inferior, born out of'

If anyone is going to claim Jesus is not God.. equal to the Father.. that is not christianity. It's something else.

Jesus is fully God, but he is also fully man. He needed to partake of human nature in order to redeem mankind or in order to be the only true mediator between God and men in that he himself is both God and man. In his humanity, the Father is greater than Jesus the son. In his divinity, they are equal.

 

[wattie]

Jesus is fully God, but he is also fully man. He needed to partake of human nature in order to redeem mankind or in order to be the only true mediator between God and men in that he himself is both God and man. In his humanity, the Father is greater than Jesus the son. In his divinity, they are equal.

But now Jesus isn't limited by the flesh.. so they should be equal now.