Can homisexuals be saved?

[AndrewMorgan]

Have you read Romans chapter 1 for yourself?

Romans chapter 1

[26] For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
[27] And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
[28] And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
[29] Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
[30] Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
[31] Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
[32] Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

What about those who have been given over to a reprobate mind?

Can they be saved?

You know, fornicators, the covetous, deceivers, backbiters, boasters, those who are disobedient to their parents, etc., etc., etc.

If you ask me, then the key thing to understand here is the following:

"WHO KNOWING THE JUDGMENT OF GOD, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them."

Do you honestly believe that all homosexuals, fornicators, deceivers, backbiters, and the like KNOW that the judgment of God comes upon such and yet not only continue in the same themselves, but also take pleasure in others who do likewise?

OR is is possible that they don't yet possess such KNOWLEDGE and are doing things that seem acceptable to them based upon this world's standards?

As Christians, we're called to preach the gospel to every creature.

There's a HUGE DIFFERENCE between those who are IGNORANT (or who genuinely don't yet possess this type of KNOWLEDGE) and those who are WILLFULLY IGNORANT.

Anyhow, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if Steven Anderson winds up in hell himself, even though I take absolutely no pleasure in even suggesting the same.

Seriously, avoid that guy (unless you're going to try to reason with him that he might be saved) like the plague that he is.

As a somewhat side-issue -re. hypocrisy in the church, have you come across Donnie Romero of Stedfast Baptist Church? Apparently, he was a friend of Anderson's and frequently ranted on about things such as homosexuality an godliness.
A while ago, he was caught going with prostitutes (the sex of which was undetermined - I've no reason to believe they were men) and gambling. I got the impression it was with church money, but I'm not sure.
He seems a classic case of not practising what you're preaching!

Have you read Romans chapter 1 for yourself?

Romans chapter 1

[26] For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
[27] And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
[28] And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
[29] Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
[30] Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
[31] Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
[32] Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

What about those who have been given over to a reprobate mind?

Can they be saved?

You know, fornicators, the covetous, deceivers, backbiters, boasters, those who are disobedient to their parents, etc., etc., etc.

If you ask me, then the key thing to understand here is the following:

"WHO KNOWING THE JUDGMENT OF GOD, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them."

Do you honestly believe that all homosexuals, fornicators, deceivers, backbiters, and the like KNOW that the judgment of God comes upon such and yet not only continue in the same themselves, but also take pleasure in others who do likewise?

OR is is possible that they don't yet possess such KNOWLEDGE and are doing things that seem acceptable to them based upon this world's standards?

As Christians, we're called to preach the gospel to every creature.

There's a HUGE DIFFERENCE between those who are IGNORANT (or who genuinely don't yet possess this type of KNOWLEDGE) and those who are WILLFULLY IGNORANT.

Anyhow, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if Steven Anderson winds up in hell himself, even though I take absolutely no pleasure in even suggesting the same.

Seriously, avoid that guy (unless you're going to try to reason with him that he might be saved) like the plague that he is.

 

[kaylagrl]

I Corinthians chapter 6

9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,
10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.
11 Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

P.S.

I've personally been involved in the conversions of two former lesbians, and I personally know former homosexuals who are now Christians.

And.... that right there is the end of the discussion. Such were some of you. Can't get around that verse. Jesus saves.

 

[AndrewMorgan]

I'm happy that you see my point, so let me expound upon it a bit.

Romans chapter 1

[20] For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
[21] Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
[22] Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
[23] And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
[24] Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
[25] Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
[26] For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
[27] And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

For what cause?

Well, just read the verse IN CONTEXT.

Paul was talking about those who "were without excuse" or those "who knew God", and then "became vain in their imaginations" or those who "changed the truth of God into a lie".

Again, do you HONESTLY believe that this describes all homosexuals?

Of course, it doesn't.

Context is everything.

Steven Anderson is a hate-filled heretic.

I've always thought his take on Romans1 was counter-intuitive - the idea had those who "hate God" had therefore become homosexual.
One extra point is that this seems especially strange in the UK, where religion is considerably less ingrained in society. I find it hard to believe the homosexuals here are as a result of hating God.

 

[Live4Him3]

And.... that right there is the end of the discussion. Such were some of you. Can't get around that verse. Jesus saves.

I was wondering (for real) when you would chime in.

Was it my persuasive Grizzly Bear powers that drew you to this thread or just the topic itself...lol.

I hope that you're doing well.

 

[kaylagrl]

I have NO LOVE for Steven Anderson., but as for separating oneself from his teachings, wouldn't you say a view should be judged on its merits, rather than from whom it came?

Not what the Bible says, by their fruits you will know them. His fruits are rotten. He leads people from the truth. I wouldn't listen to a thing he says.

 

[kaylagrl]

I was wondering (for real) when you would chime in.

Was it my persuasive Grizzly Bear powers that drew you to this thread or just the topic itself...lol.

I hope that you're doing well.

A little of both, we all love the bear of course. I am doing well, thank you. Just back from vacation. Hope you are well too brother.

 

[studentoftheword]

There is only one unforgivable sin today and that is rejecting Jesus Christ as your Lord and Saviour -----all sin is forgivable if you accept Christ by and through the right Faith ----that is God's promise ---------

 

[Hazelelponi]

I've come across differing views on this and would like to see others' biblical evidence one way or another, if any would like to comment.

Anyone can be saved. The Bible has already been shown.

 

[Live4Him3]

I've always thought his take on Romans1 was counter-intuitive - the idea had those who "hate God" had therefore become homosexual.
One extra point is that this seems especially strange in the UK, where religion is considerably less ingrained in society. I find it hard to believe the homosexuals here are as a result of hating God.

There are SO MANY different potential factors involved when it comes to homosexuality and lesbianism, and I've shared some on this very topic before.

For example, I know one Christian man who is now married with five children who used to be a homosexual.

Why?

Because he hated God?

NO!

Because his own brother sexually molested him when he was a child, and he wound up psychologically damaged.

I have a Christian friend whose son had a full-blown sex change operation, and he is now a "she". Wait, it gets worse. He's married to a lesbian. For real. Meditate on that for a moment or two. In his case, he was the oldest of two children, and he always felt that his parents loved his baby sister more than they loved him. He told his parents on many occasions, "I wish that I had been born a girl". Well, now, he is one...in a perverted sort of way.

One of my own nieces was in a lesbian relationship for a while.

Why?

Because she "hated God"?

NO!

She felt rejected by her parents her whole life, she was bullied at school, and she had nothing but abusive relationships with boys/men. In her case, as the old song goes, she was simply "Looking for love in all the wrong places". In other words, I'm firmly convinced that everyone is born into this world with a desire/need to be loved and accepted. If those desires/needs aren't met in the traditional way, then they'll seek to have them met in untraditional ways.

Then there's the whole indoctrination thing in our schools, Media, entertainment industry, in music, etc., etc. where homosexuality and lesbianism are normalized and "the binary" (male or female) is damned.

Anyhow, these people can be saved if the gospel is presented to them in a compassionate sort of way.

 

[Live4Him3]

A little of both, we all love the bear of course. I am doing well, thank you. Just back from vacation. Hope you are well too brother.

I'm doing well...contrary to popular opinion...lol.

 

[AndrewMorgan]

And.... that right there is the end of the discussion. Such were some of you. Can't get around that verse. Jesus saves.

Sorry - it's not as simple as that. I don't know if you've read my point about 1Cor6. There I said that "

Not what the Bible says, by their fruits you will know them. His fruits are rotten. He leads people from the truth. I wouldn't listen to a thing he says.

Good point - to an extent - a point he's made himself about whether a "bad fruit" can save anybody - even with right teaching if I understand him.
One note of caution, 'though - if he's leading people away from the Truth, is it because he's stating untruths, or is it because they don't like hearing what he says and how he says it?

 

[AndrewMorgan]

There are SO MANY different potential factors involved when it comes to homosexuality and lesbianism, and I've shared some on this very topic before.

For example, I know one Christian man who is now married with five children who used to be a homosexual.

Why?

Because he hated God?

NO!

Because his own brother sexually molested him when he was a child, and he wound up psychologically damaged.

I have a Christian friend whose son had a full-blown sex change operation, and he is now a "she". Wait, it gets worse. He's married to a lesbian. For real. Meditate on that for a moment or two. In his case, he was the oldest of two children, and he always felt that his parents loved his baby sister more than they loved him. He told his parents on many occasions, "I wish that I had been born a girl". Well, now, he is one...in a perverted sort of way.

One of my own nieces was in a lesbian relationship for a while.

Why?

Because she "hated God"?

NO!

She felt rejected by her parents her whole life, she was bullied at school, and she had nothing but abusive relationships with boys/men. In her case, as the old song goes, she was simply "Looking for love in all the wrong places". In other words, I'm firmly convinced that everyone is born into this world with a desire/need to be loved and accepted. If those desires/needs aren't met in the traditional way, then they'll seek to have them met in untraditional ways.

Then there's the whole indoctrination thing in our schools, Media, entertainment industry, in music, etc., etc. where homosexuality and lesbianism are normalized and "the binary" (male or female) is damned.

Anyhow, these people can be saved if the gospel is presented to them in a compassionate sort of way.

There's so much in the way of science/ speculation as to way someone becomes gay.
There's Anderson's Rom1 explanation, with which I have great problems, there's the seemingly prevailing theory in non-biblical circles that it's related to a combination of one's genes and the hormones to which one is exposed in the womb.
There's also the nurture theory that it can be influenced by dreadful drama, such as you cited.
I tend to think that men are considerably more entrenched in their sexuality than women. I think with women, sexuality is more influenced by emotion than is the case with men. I could cite cases where women have changed in this way.

 

[Live4Him3]

I tend to think that men are considerably more entrenched in their sexuality than women. I think with women, sexuality is more influenced by emotion than is the case with men. I could cite cases where women have changed in this way.

I used to work with a young woman who was not only a lesbian, but she was also "married" to another woman. A female co-worker of ours who was a Christian informed me of the situation, and she and I prayed for this woman. To make a long story short, my female Christian co-worker wound up leading this lesbian to the Lord, and I bought her a Bible and started having Bible studies with her in her home on Saturdays. She not only wound up "divorcing" the woman that she was previously "married" to, but I actually attended her water baptism earlier this year.

In her particular case, she had not only felt rejected by her own family her entire life, but she was in an abusive situation with a man with whom she had two daughters. When that relationship finally ended, she was very vulnerable, and this other lesbian woman took advantage of her vulnerability, and the rest, as they say, is (well, now "was") history.

At that same job, I had an ongoing conversation on this topic with a male co-worker of mine that I was witnessing to (I bought him a Bible as well). We actually had a VERY DOMINEERING female manager that was above us, and she, too, was a lesbian who was "married" to another woman. Well, one day at start-up (a brief meeting before we started our daily work routines), this lesbian decided to grab a microphone and to tell all of us a little something about herself. One of the things that she shared with us was that her father was a Marine who told her for her entire life that he wished that she had been a son instead of a daughter. Fast forward, and "Voila!", she's not only married to a woman, but also VERY MILITANT in her personality.

Coincidence?

I don't think so.

 

[AndrewMorgan]

It's experiences like that tend to make me believe that there is a significant nurture element to this issue and it's not simply a "born this way" situation.
Incidentally, I don't want to burden you with commitments, but it you did want to comment, I'd be interested to know whether you thought my take on 1Cor6 were valid, if you felt inclined to comment.

 

[Komentaja]

...easier than the self-righteous.

Why, oh why do we Christians keep pointing to this as some kind of super sin?

Because it is a super sin. Read Romans 1.

It is a super sin because unlike "natural lust" which is to the opposite gender, this is "unnatural" lust. Against the very order of Creation.

Never let any New Age teacher convince you that "all sin is equal" that teaching is not biblical. What is biblical is that yes if you violate the law, you are now a law breaker and need salvation. However we have different punishments under the law of Moses for different sins, due to the difference in severity of the violation, just as we do today in our countries we live in. The new testament also speaks of this in the letter of John where certain sins are "Unto death" and are not to be prayed for, and others are not.

 

[John146]

And.... that right there is the end of the discussion. Such were some of you. Can't get around that verse. Jesus saves.

Agreed. A believer has the imputed righteousness of Jesus Christ. Jesus was never any of those things being mentioned…and that’s anyone who is in him, in Christ. Praise the Lord!

 

[AndrewMorgan]

Because it is a super sin. Read Romans 1.

It is a super sin because unlike "natural lust" which is to the opposite gender, this is "unnatural" lust. Against the very order of Creation.

Never let any New Age teacher convince you that "all sin is equal" that teaching is not biblical. What is biblical is that yes if you violate the law, you are now a law breaker and need salvation. However we have different punishments under the law of Moses for different sins, due to the difference in severity of the violation, just as we do today in our countries we live in. The new testament also speaks of this in the letter of John where certain sins are "Unto death" and are not to be prayed for, and others are not.

I have never believed all sin is equal. If that were the case, why would Job and Judas Iscariot have been described so differently?

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

As a somewhat side-issue -re. hypocrisy in the church, have you come across Donnie Romero of Stedfast Baptist Church? Apparently, he was a friend of Anderson's and frequently ranted on about things such as homosexuality an godliness.
A while ago, he was caught going with prostitutes (the sex of which was undetermined - I've no reason to believe they were men) and gambling. I got the impression it was with church money, but I'm not sure.
He seems a classic case of not practising what you're preaching!

Would you also point out how Romero was caught and exposed, and held accountable by Pastor Anderson; and that PUBLICLY??

You wouldn't know about Romero if it weren't for Anderson. He handled it Biblically, did he not?

That's more than I can say for the little boy raping Roman Catholic priests that get covered up and moved around to different parishes to lead many thousands in churches throughout the world.

 

[AndrewMorgan]

Agreed. A believer has the imputed righteousness of Jesus Christ. Jesus was never any of those things being mentioned…and that’s anyone who is in him, in Christ. Praise the Lord!

Are you sure there are no exceptions? What about homosexuals with reference to Rom1? (I personally am not convinced either way by this belief) What about the "sin unto death"? (I believe in James) What about the unforgivable sin?
I am uncertain as to these issues.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I've come across differing views on this and would like to see others' biblical evidence one way or another, if any would like to comment.

all sinners can be saved it’s up to them if they are willing to accept the gospel which in the case of homosexual would require them to stop acting in sin the same as a liar who lies a thief who steals an adulterer who commits adultery or someone who happened to pick up a stick for a fire on a sabbath thy day.

sin is sin we have to repent to be saved a homosexual or a straight pervert both have to repent an adulterer has to repent a liar has to repent ect sinners can be saved if we will allow God to bring us to repentance and not choose love for sins of the flesh like sexual perversions or any other fleshly thkngs over the lord and his promises

homosexuality is not Gods Will for mankind think about it God created a species to reproduce and full earth if they were two males he created they would have only lasted one generation and then ended with two dead bodies

it is at the very foundation against Gods design for mankind a perversion that came from mans sin this is where homosexuality began to come into mans mind

“And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: and likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭1:23-32‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Its based on and comes from the place of sin it’s a curse that man received because we rejected gods image and glory planned for us he then gave us up to our perverted minds which we chose over his plans for us it is a rotten fruit of sin we have to rod our lives of the rotten fruits before they disease the whole tree

gay people are tempted by sin like anyone else they have tomobercome by accepting the gospel like everyone else does they are just sinners like the rest of mankind their sin is different than others but we’re all in the same boat