Believers Sins Are Forgiven & Washed Away Forever

[studentoftheword]

Jesus came to fulfill the law:
Matt 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
(MY NOTE: Jesus sin atoning death & resurrection FULFILLED heavens law requirement for sin.)

Jesus took all sin for all people this is true ----but unless your a Born Again Christian you are not free from the Law ----unbelievers still are under the law ------unbelievers remain under the curse of the Law --Jesus came to bring the Blessing back into play -----all were under the Curse of the law until Jesus came and fulfilled the law to free Believers from the Curse of the Law ----there are 613 laws ---and they remain for unbelievers today --

The law was given to show and increase sin and unbelievers remain under the laws -----so they remain sinner and in sin because they cannot keep the laws ---if you broke one Law --you broke them all -----

the only way to be a righteous man is to receive Jesus as your Lord and saviour ----otherwise your unrighteous in God's eyes -----your not in right standing with God -----

1 TIMOTHY 1:9
KJ21
knowing this: that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,

AMP
understanding the fact that law is not enacted for the righteous person [the one in right standing with God], but for lawless and rebellious people, for the ungodly and sinful, for the irreverent and profane, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers,

 

[Snacks]

Does one need to understand all what you wrote of the "gospel" to be saved? Or can one call upon the Lord in believing what He accomplished for them at the cross for the forgiveness of sins and be saved? Heck, even the disciples had no clue about the d,b,r until after it happened.

Faith like a child is too difficult a concept for some folks, but not for God.

 

[brightfame52]

flying dove

No contradiction, there are pre-conditions to salvation:

Yes it is a contradiction. The only pre conditions to Salvation are met by Jesus Christ the Surety of the Everlasting Covenant.

So if you mean there are pre conditions apart from the conditions Christ fulfilled, you are in contradiction.

 

[FlyingDove]

I believe the key phrase here is in verse 4...

Hebrews 6:4

“For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,”

>

Hello again,
Heb 6:4-6 context is not about losing salvation.

To begin with; here are just 7 of many scriptures. That make it abundantly clear that salvation is eternal. (Jn 3:16 & 6:47; Jn 10:27-29; Rom 8:35; 38-39 & 10:9-13; Phil 1:6)

Some background: 1st who is the book written to? Hebrews. The main theme throughout the book of Hebrews is NEW ""BETTER"" COVENANT.

Christ is better: Better than angels, because they worship the Christ. Better than Moses, because He created Him. Better than the Aaronic priesthood, because Christ's sin sacrifice is once for all time. Better than the law, because Christ mediates a better blood covenant.

These Jews who were having a hard time making a break from total indoctrination in a legalistic religion. Judaism's temple worship, daily sacrifices & personal sin sacrifices. Many are reversing course and choose to continue in their religion to avoid persecution, often being totally ostracized.

Background 2: The parable of the Sower Matt:13 & Mk 4:5

4 Jesus said, a Sower sowed, some seeds fell by the wayside, the fowls came & devoured them

5 Some fell upon stony places, they had not much earth: they sprung up, because they had no deepness of earth:

6 when the sun was up, they were scorched; because they had no root, they withered away

7 And some fell among thorns; the thorns sprung up, & choked them

8 Other fell into good ground, & brought forth fruit, some a hundredfold, some 60-fold, some 30-fold

Background 3: Pro 26:11 & 2 Pet 2:20-22 "A dog goes back to its vomit"

Now let's parse Heb 6:4 (A) For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened.
(MY NOTE: Enlightened definition: having been showed a rational well-informed outlook. Just because a person has been shown how to get someplace. Doesn't mean they will choose to go there)

Heb 6:4 (B) For it is impossible for those who have "tasted" the good Word of God,
(MY NOTE: To taste something: Means just that, "TASTE IT" not consume or accept the whole meal. But, to "TASTE". And now you can decide if you want to finish eating it or not)

Heb 6:4 (C) Were made partakers of the Holy Spirit
(MY NOTE: Jn 12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.
Jesus was in fact lifted up on a cross & ultimately from the grave. Heb is written post resurrection. He/His drew these Jews via His Holy Spirit & they rejected Jesus's sin atonement by returning to Temple sacrifices)

Ok, Jesus Holy Spirit sowed the Word (they TASTED), the Holy Spirit confirmed (enlightened) the truth into their hearts

After TASTING the WORD of God. Like the seeds that fell by the wayside onto stony ground or were choked by thorns/Pharisees. They rejected God's Grace/Word/Jesus Christ)

Again, Heb 6:4-6 scriptures are about the price of rejection & UNBELIEF! NOT losing salvation!

Under the old covenant (Jews only) the only sin that couldn't be covered was, IDOLATRY

Under the new covenant (covers all believers) the only unforgivable sin is, UNBELIEF!

Conclusion:
These Jews rejected Christ, God's saving grace. Accessed thru Faith (Rom 5:2). They NEVER were SAVED. After HEARING & TASTING the WORD of ENLIGHTENMENT they REJECTED it = UNBELIEF. And returned to their legalistic traditions/the law. Most notably animal sacrifices!

1 Jn 2:19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

anytime we try to make salvstion “ unconditional “ we have to then erase half the Bible and say it doesn’t apply

“Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die:

but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8:12-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

if we do this and if we do this other thing that changes the result from life to death the deeds he’s talking about mortifying is sin

“This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭5:16, 19-21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

If we keep serving sin we’re headed where sin leads which is death if we repent and accept the truth well live

“What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey;

whether of sin unto death,

or of obedience unto righteousness?

But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you. Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭6:15-18‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The gospel is either going to call us to repentance and belief of Christs word or it’s going to be rejected by us and twisted into an excuse of why we can keep sinning and never be held accountable

there are two forms of grace mentioned in the Bible one of them Is true it calls us to repentance and obedience to the lord and has the rewards he himself promised

and then There’s a grace that says now nothing I do wrong will ever be held to my account I’m saved if I keep sinning I’m already forgiven I don’t need to repent and live upright I’m saved I’m saved I have faith , I’ll never need to do anything he said I need to do I’m saved I’m saved

One grace is true and teaches us repentance and to live right and live lives being accountable for the things we do wrong not pretend don’t we’re not accountable now can you imagine Gods children on earth sinning against everyone and claiming I’m saved I’m Gods child I can live anyway I wish d inherit salvstion anyways

what a spoiled group of children it would be to reject the words of thier father and pretend they don’t apply to the gift he’s giving

You are preaching eternal deliverance accomplished by works, because you are not dividing the salvation scriptures in a correct manner. salvation = a deliverance, saved = delivered, and save = deliver. There is an eternal deliverance, which was accomplished by Jesus's death on the cross for all of God's adopted children, that God gave to him to die for, and Jesus said that none of them would be lost, because he will raise them up at the last day. (John 6:39) His last words were, "it is finished", meaning that he had finished the work that his Father had sent him to do.

There are many salvations (deliverances) for his adopted children as they sojourn here on earth, which you are applying to their eternal deliverance. The deliverances that the adopted children of God receive here on earth are accomplished by their good works.

Those works are noted in the scriptures as; repentance, accepting Jesus as their Saviour, teaching the gospel, praying, loving each other, etc.

Scriptures do not contradict each other, they all harmonize with each other, if you are interpreting them correctly If you would just deny your own entelect, and ask the Holy Spirit within yourself, I feel confident that he would reveal the right interpretation of the scriptures to you.

At 50 years old, I bought a Strong's concordance, thinking that I was smart enough to figure the scriptures out where they did not, seemingly, contradict each other, After 12 years of diligent study, I gave up, and told God that I was not smart enough to figure it out.

I did not ask the Holy Spirit within me for help. but not too long after, he began to reveal a few things gradually. I am now 88 years old.


The sacrifice of Jesus was offered to God, for God's acceptance, in which he accepted


Actually, God's adopted children are saved by God's sovereign grace, without any action (works) from mankind.

 

[FlyingDove]

flying dove



Yes it is a contradiction. The only pre conditions to Salvation are met by Jesus Christ the Surety of the Everlasting Covenant.

So if you mean there are pre conditions apart from the conditions Christ fulfilled, you are in contradiction.

Again, NO contradiction:
Faith/Belief is the Conduit/Key/Path/ to accessing God's grace. Rom 5:1-2

Each verse below the Lord Jesus Himself is speaking:

Jn 8:24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

Jn 11:40 Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?

Jn 3:15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

Jn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Jn 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Jn 6:47 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.

Faith/Belief is a Prerequisite to eternal life/salvation

 

[brightfame52]

Again, NO contradiction:
Faith/Belief is the Conduit/Key/Path/ to accessing God's grace. Rom 5:1-2

Each verse below the Lord Jesus Himself is speaking:

Jn 8:24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

Jn 11:40 Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?

Jn 3:15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

Jn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Jn 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Jn 6:47 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.

Faith/Belief is a Prerequisite to eternal life/salvation

Yes its a contradiction, its too bad you dont realize that Christ, the Surety of His People fulfilled all the conditions needful to save His people from their sins. Even Faith/Believing are benefits given to them Christ fulfilled all conditions for. Phil 1:29

29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake; So believing isnt a requirement, its a Gift given on behalf of Christ.

 

[oyster67]

I realise how impactful these words can be, but I've heard others, including Pastor Steven Anderson, say this means the opposite to what you and I seem to believe it clearly says. I've heard to many people state with such conviction that they believe OSAS that I really wonder if I've missed something.
A similar verse is - paraphrasing - "If we sin wilfully after finding the truth, there is no sacrifice for sin left, but a certain expecting of wrath."
May I ask - Do you believe "believe", as in common parlance, is sufficient to become saved, for the present or eternally, or that something else, eg - movement by the Holy Spirit, a "change of heart" is required, as many, many people vehemently assert?

Good point.

Biblical belief-unto-salvation is much more than just the English dictionary definition of common belief. It does indeed involve a change of heart. This is clear from scriptural context. Glorious hope is another example. This is not just the flippant "I hope so" hope of the lost world around us.

Sinning willfully is more than a momentary stumble. The Bible speaks of it as a dog retuning to its vomit. It is a willful choice to return to the old, wicked way and deny and reject what we once held dear.

It is truly sad how so many will turn away from the truth and opt for the lie that they can go on living for the flesh after being cleansed by the blood of Jesus. The Bible refers to these people as pigs who have returned to the mire of the pigpen.

It is true that there is much heresy and apostacy going on today under the guise of the modern church, but we should not be surprised. The Bible has told us and warned us of these things. That is why it is so important to stay close and contend for the true faith together.

>

 

[oyster67]

Hello,
Many cling to certain verses like the Heb 6:4 verse you cited. You are free to promote your heart, as I am Mine.

Ya, I do tend to cling to stuff (it's an oyster thing, I guess.) The Bible in particular. I am at such a disadvantage, not being a Greek seminarianite 'n all.

All I got's is the Holy Spirit to guide me through.

_

 

[oyster67]

Hello again,
Heb 6:4-6 context is not about losing salvation.

Only the saved are made partakers of the Holy Ghost. This is a basic, elementary, and widely understood truth.

Please re-evaluate your stance.

 

[GRACE_ambassador]

I've heard to many people state with such conviction that they believe OSAS that I really wonder if I've missed something.

Precious friend:

Yes, I am one with a Very HIGH Biblical Conviction, Under God's GRACE, That
His ETERNAL Life Is Indeed ETERNAL, and NOT "an UNbiblical temporary" life.
These studies Of Plain And Clear Scriptures are "my reasons" for such
Conviction (may be "what you are missing?):

God's ETERNAL Life/Assurance!
+
God's OPERATION On All HIS New-born babes In CHRIST!!
+
GRACE And Peace!!!...

Precious friend, please Be Very RICHLY Encouraged And Edified In
The LORD Jesus Christ, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly Divided!