Do you believe in (OSAS) Once Saved, Always Saved?

[kenallen]

Beckie, you say that people are being 'resaved' for their sins. Why would they need to be resaved if they've already been saved and that that salvation can't be taken from them? OSAS is a one shot salvation, not a resaving, time after time.

Covid shot was a one time deal too. See how well that worked.

 

[Nehemiah6]

so i will rethink my position if the evil is raptured first.

No evildoers will be raptured "first". Or at any time.

 

[JAPOV]

[QUO
This doctrine is new; it was never taught or even discussed prior to the 1830’s. It seems to have first come from a “prophetic vision” by Margaret Macdonald, a woman in 1830, who was a part of the cult group the “Irvingites,” while having an emotional experience. Through a “mingled prophecy and vision” (breakdown), and saying “the power of the Holy Spirit,” she came up with this. She was very ill and delusional according to physicians and learned observers at the time. How, how, how did this get to doctrinal status? In spite of her condition, people believed her. Not ministers trained in the Word, not those who were pious Christians, not those with discernment, but those seeking a new fad and emotional experience, just as so many do today. By the way, she was a cultist! Then another cult group in England picked this up by the name of “The Catholic Apostolic Church,” headed by Edward Irving (1792-1834). After that, another cult group called the “Millerites,” predicted the return of Christ on October 22, 1844. It did not happen; that should have been a clue, but this would not die.

At the same time, this belief was then picked up by Irish born minister, lawyer, evangelist and author, John N. Darby in 1930, who took this new fad to America in 1862 to 1877. He was looking for a “hook” in his motivational Bible speeches to attract crowds in England and on his visit to the Americas, USA, and Canada. People who knew him said he was not well schooled in the Bible or original languages, read into the Bible all kinds of ridiculous ideas. Many people today still believe in him.
What does the bible say?
Revelation 20.
4And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. 5But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. 6Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

The Parable of the Weeds Explained
36Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying, Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field. 37He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man; 38The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; 39The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels. 40As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. 41The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; 42And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. 43Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

Verse 37. He that soweth the good seed is the SON OF MAN
Verse 38 What is the field? The world. If you do not want to believe that it is ok, just remember these are the words of Jesus. The good seed "wheat" are the children of the kingdom "GOD" The tears are the children of the wicked one. Who is the wicked one?
Verse 39 will tell us. Jesus said I will never leave you wanting "I have foretold you all things" The enemy that sowed them" the tares, the children of the wicked one" is the devil "Satan" The Harvest is the END OF THE WORLD the reapers are the angles.
Verse 40. As therefore the tares are gathered. Who does Jesus say is the first one taken from the field "the world" and burned in the fire so shall it be at the end of the world.
Verse 41. The Son of man "Jesus" sends his angles to gather out of the kingdom "the world" ALL things that offend, and them that do inequity
Verse 42. They shall be cast them into the furnace. I am going to get rid of them.
Verse 43. WHO IS Left? The righteous and they shell shine forth as the son in the kingdom of their Father.
NO WHERE in this does Jesus say there will be a pre, mid, post, rapture. There is no rapture at all ever.


TE="JAPOV, post: 4847917, member: 312574"]You missed one...

[/QUOTE]
Revelation 20-
4Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom the authority to judge was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection. 6Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for a thousand years.

The Defeat of Satan

7And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be released from his prison 8and will come out to deceive the nations that are at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea. 9And they marched up over the broad plain of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city, but fire came down from heavenb and consumed them, 10and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

**their number is like the sand of the sea** Many are going to die during the tribulation and the final war**

Judgment Before the Great White Throne

11Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. From his presence earth and sky fled away, and no place was found for them. 12And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Then another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to what they had done. 13And the sea gave up the dead who were in it, Death and Hades gave up the dead who were in them, and they were judged, each one of them, according to what they had done. 14Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. 15And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

**And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to what they had done. The dead are judged first. Sound familiar? Tares?

Revelation 21-
The New Heaven and the New Earth

1Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. 2And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling placea of God is with man. He will dwell with them, and they will be his people,b and God himself will be with them as their God.c 4He will wipe away every tear from their eyes, and death shall be no more, neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain anymore, for the former things have passed away.”

 

[Beckie]

Beckie, you say that people are being 'resaved' for their sins. Why would they need to be resaved if they've already been saved and that that salvation can't be taken from them? OSAS is a one shot salvation, not a resaving, time after time.

You misunderstood or I did not make clear. Back in my old Assemblies of God days . Church members would weep over their sins . So worried they would be left behind should rapture happen. Knowing those folks ,having conversations one knew their understanding was not repentance but to be saved again. Having lived under that fear and now knowing He has my salvation. Salvation belongs to the Lord.

 

[JAPOV]

promoting Five Point Calvinism (as an example)? A false gospel is essentially a lie. If God offers salvation to all and you (meaning anyone) come along and say He does not, is that not a lie?

With my military upbringing and subsequent career, I had to move every 2yrs or less. I've been non-denominational since childhood because of all the different churches I've attended. I've really never paid much attention to denominations because I always got more from the Bible by READING IT, and the Spirit has always led me to Christ from the beginning. "What about good Christian people.....?" They're in every denomination, even Catholicism lol...

 

[kenallen]

Revelation 20-
4Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom the authority to judge was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection. 6Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for a thousand years.

The Defeat of Satan

7And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be released from his prison 8and will come out to deceive the nations that are at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea. 9And they marched up over the broad plain of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city, but fire came down from heavenb and consumed them, 10and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

**their number is like the sand of the sea** Many are going to die during the tribulation and the final war**

Judgment Before the Great White Throne

11Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. From his presence earth and sky fled away, and no place was found for them. 12And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Then another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to what they had done. 13And the sea gave up the dead who were in it, Death and Hades gave up the dead who were in them, and they were judged, each one of them, according to what they had done. 14Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. 15And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

**And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to what they had done. The dead are judged first. Sound familiar? Tares?

Revelation 21-
The New Heaven and the New Earth

1Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. 2And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling placea of God is with man. He will dwell with them, and they will be his people,b and God himself will be with them as their God.c 4He will wipe away every tear from their eyes, and death shall be no more, neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain anymore, for the former things have passed away.”[/QUOTE]
Well just like anything else God will not force you to do anything you do not want to do. He will not twist your arm to make you follow him.
I just wish you would address the parable of the wheat and the tares. That is teaching from Jesus own mouth. I know it goes against what you believe and you might be faced with the possibility that you have been sold a bill of goods,

 

[ResidentAlien]

"What about good Christian people.....?" They're in every denomination, even Catholicism lol...

What about JWs? LDS? Christian Science? Are there good Christian people in these groups?

 

[Blain]

The resurrection. We will all die because of our sins, and we do deserve that, but the Lord God will rise us out of the grave at the end of time as he promised. This is the entire point of our faith.

Then please explain

The resurrection. We will all die because of our sins, and we do deserve that, but the Lord God will rise us out of the grave at the end of time as he promised. This is the entire point of our faith.

then please explain this Ephesians 2:8
For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—
According to scripture we are saved by one thing faith not the resurrection. For salvation is not a physical issue but a spiritual one if it were a physical one then yes a perfect new body would be required one that is flawless and without sin but it is a matter of the heart not body it is a matter of faith that we are saved.

 

[JAPOV]

Revelation 20-
4Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom the authority to judge was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. 5The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection. 6Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for a thousand years.

The Defeat of Satan

7And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be released from his prison 8and will come out to deceive the nations that are at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea. 9And they marched up over the broad plain of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city, but fire came down from heavenb and consumed them, 10and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

**their number is like the sand of the sea** Many are going to die during the tribulation and the final war**

Judgment Before the Great White Throne

11Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. From his presence earth and sky fled away, and no place was found for them. 12And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Then another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to what they had done. 13And the sea gave up the dead who were in it, Death and Hades gave up the dead who were in them, and they were judged, each one of them, according to what they had done. 14Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. 15And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

**And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to what they had done. The dead are judged first. Sound familiar? Tares?

Revelation 21-
The New Heaven and the New Earth

1Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. 2And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling placea of God is with man. He will dwell with them, and they will be his people,b and God himself will be with them as their God.c 4He will wipe away every tear from their eyes, and death shall be no more, neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain anymore, for the former things have passed away.”

Well just like anything else God will not force you to do anything you do not want to do. He will not twist your arm to make you follow him.
I just wish you would address the parable of the wheat and the tares. That is teaching from Jesus own mouth. I know it goes against what you believe and you might be faced with the possibility that you have been sold a bill of goods,[/QUOTE]
That parable is basically repeated in Revelation....

 

[Beckie]

What about JWs? LDS? Christian Science? Are there good Christian people in these groups?

If there are Christians in those groups , i believe there are, they will get out .

 

[JAPOV]

What about JWs? LDS? Christian Science? Are there good Christian people in these groups?

Come on man... They're not even preaching from the Bible...
I've never sensed the Spirit in any JW I've ever argued with, they're cultists.

 

[BeeThePeace]

Again? Okay.

Acts 23:6
6 But when Paul perceived that the one part were Sadducees, and the other Pharisees, he cried out in the council, Men and brethren, I am a Pharisee, the son of a Pharisee: of the hope and resurrection of the dead I am called in question.

No, not again. Because that excerpt does not sustain your claim.

Remember, when you study scripture or any topic within, context is vital to understanding.

 

[BeeThePeace]

If there are Christians in those groups , i believe there are, they will get out .

I don't believe it is the group a person is member of that pertains to their faith. Rather, I believe it is a matter of God within the individual that makes the difference.

Yes, there are Christians in those groups. ☺️

 

[Beckie]

I don't believe it is the group a person is member of that pertains to their faith. Rather, I believe it is a matter of God within the individual that makes the difference.

Yes, there are Christians in those groups. ☺️

I dont believe a Christian would blend his name with a group that believes the book of mormon is above the Bible or that Jesus and satan are brothers . How about Jesus not being God? JW

I know nothing about Christian Science

 

[posthuman]

Isn't it true we must be in Christ to be "saved?" Hebrews 3:14 says we are partakers of Christ if we're steadfast. It couldn't be simpler. Your arguments don't make a lick of sense.

Steadfast in our CONFIDENCE

=]

 

[posthuman]

What if we die before he finds us?

How good at finding things is omniscient God from Whom nothing can possibly be hidden?

 

[PennEd]

Galatians 5 2Look: I, Paul, say to you that if you accept circumcision, Christ will be of no advantage to you. 3I testify again to every man who accepts circumcision that he is obligated to keep the whole law. 4You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace. 5For through the Spirit, by faith, we ourselves eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness. 6For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through love.

The other Bible versions all say the same thing.
These are christians who were beguiled into believing they must be justified by the Law.
This is why Paul wrote so much about Judiazers' warning about them.

That's right. Those that attempt to justify themselves by the Law are not His.

Paul doesn't say all those Galatians he is talking about have been born again. In fact, MANY Epistles deal with these guys that "crept in unawares" to sow destructive doctrines like the need to be circumcised.

Nothing to do with born again believers losing their salvation.

 

[Chester]

So, would it be possible that an individual weaves in and out of Gods salvation based on any transgression committed and the amount of repentance they have? I mean we sin almost daily whether through actions or thoughts.

Our salvation is not based on our works. Thus we do not "weave in and out of" salvation bases on our actions or thoughts. Not even close!!!!!! Salvation is always based simply and factually on this: Are you believing in Jesus Christ?

 

[Chester]

Well, there is a difference between Deadly/Mortal sin and Non-deadly sin, that does not lead to death. Adultery/Apostasy etc are deadly sins.
.

Romans 6:23: The wages of sin is death

All sin leads to death: whether murder, adultery, or a tiny lie. It takes only one sin and a person is guilty before God: and eternal death is the result. James 2:10: If a man keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all

But, thanks be to God, Jesus came as the atoning sacrifice, and we are offered forgiveness and eternal life by putting out faith in him.

 

[Chester]

Not one person i know that is of the OSAS camp thinks or behaves that way.... I remember a million Sunday nights people getting resaved for their sins over the week..

Unfortunately I do know people in the OSAS camp who live this way - and a few who talk this way.