Transfiguration is the key

[Diakonos]

If the appearing of Moses and Elijah was pertaining to Acts 1 = that would of been the place and time for their appearing with Him.

Non-sequitur fallacy

 

[Diakonos]

uh no I don’t bother getting into arguments over things made plain nor an I insisting anyone needs to agree with me.

“who appeared in glory, and spake of his decease which he should accomplish at Jerusalem.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭9:31‬ ‭

“who appeared in glory, and spake of his decease which he was about to accomplish at Jerusalem.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭9:31‬ ‭ASV‬‬

“They spoke about his departure, which he was about to bring to fulfillment at Jerusalem.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭9:31‬ ‭NIV‬‬

“who appeared in glory, and were speaking of His departure [from earthly life], which He was about to bring to fulfillment at Jerusalem.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭9:31‬ ‭AMP‬‬

“They were glorious to see. And they were speaking about his exodus from this world, which was about to be fulfilled in Jerusalem.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭9:31‬ ‭NLT‬‬

It’s notable that after this Jesus began to preach about his death at Jerusalem though

Good to hear. I've just come across so many KJV onlyists that insist on ridiculous terms for common ground in Bible discussion. I'm glad to hear that is not the case here. I used the NASB because of the consistency with the Greek Luke used.
So the word Luke used here is ἔξοδος (exodus), which is literally translated as "departure".
Euphemistically, it may refer to death, but not necessarily. Jesus did go on to die, and that was the beginning of His departure, which was fully accomplished in His ascension. His departure was from this world back to heaven (unless it refers to his departure to Sheol...I'll have to check that out). So the departure He referred to was a series of events, which included the cross, but not only the cross.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

If the appearing of Moses and Elijah was pertaining to Acts 1 = that would of been the place and time for their appearing with Him.

This is a scriptural 'no-brainer' and I love Brother Post Human.

It would of misleading for us, for God to have Moses and Elijah appearing at this moment in the Gospel for it to pertain to Acts 1.

Dwell on that...

yeah plus he was in Galilee when he was taken up to heaven Afterwards they returned to Jerusalem

“And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭1:9-12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

So if they were speaking of what he was about to accomplish in Jerusalem it’s about his death and resurrection

 

[DavidTree]

Non-sequitur fallacy

Mose and Elijah spoke of His ascension in Acts 1 = 100% non-sequitor fallacy

THINK dear Brother think GOSPEL and not beyond what JESUS came to ACCOMPLISH in Jerusalem.

"And behold, two men talked with Him, who were Moses and Elijah, who appeared in glory and spoke of His decease which He was about to accomplish at Jerusalem."

Learn your ABC's = A comes before B comes before C

Accomplish - They spoke about what HE was going to Accomplish = His death/crucifiction = exodus from His earthly body.

Before his ascension He first had to suffer and be cruicified = Matthew 16:31

Crucifiction - From that time on Jesus began to show His disciples that He must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things at the hands of the elders, chief priests, and scribes, and that He must be killed and on the third day be raised to life.

 

[DavidTree]

yeah plus he was in Galilee when he was taken up to heaven Afterwards they returned to Jerusalem

“And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭1:9-12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

So if they were speaking of what he was about to accomplish in Jerusalem it’s about his death and resurrection

RICH with Truth

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Good to hear. I've just come across so many KJV onlyists that insist on ridiculous terms for common ground in Bible discussion. I'm glad to hear that is not the case here.
So the word Luke used here is ἔξοδος (exodus), which is literally translated as "departure".
Euphemistically, it may refer to death, but not necessarily. Jesus did go on to die, and that was the beginning of His departure, which was fully accomplished in His ascension. His departure was from this world back to heaven. So the departure He referred to was a series of events, which included the cross, but not only the cross.

Yeah translations all
Say the same things at least most of them do I just prefer the kjv form myself used to love the niv but find the language better for myself in the kjv these days

but what about the fact he didn’t ascend from Jerusalem ? There shouldn’t be a debate about them saying he would accomplish this at Jerusalem right ?

Remember he told them to go to Galilee ? On mount Olivet?

“And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭1:10-12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Jesus did accomplish one thing at Jerusalem remember he kept saying it just before and after the transfiguration it became a focus of what he was teaching ?

He says this immediately after talking with them in transfiguration

“And they asked him, saying, Why say the scribes that Elijah must first come?

And he answered and told them, Elijah verily cometh first, and restoreth all things; and how it is written of the Son of man, that he must suffer many things, and be set at nought.

But I say unto you, That Elijah is indeed come, and they have done unto him whatsoever they listed, as it is written of him.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭9:11-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Matthew account adds an important detail

“But I say unto you, That Elijah is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them.

Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭17:12-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬


But what I’m saying is he began to tell them he had to go to Jerusalem and be out to death and rise again. When he was taken into heaven it wasn’t in Jerusalem

but everyone has to come to their conclusions and like I was saying no one needs to agree with me or anything. If we forget about which word says what In greek and just look at the context of everything they were docsuccing hisnsuffering and death which would happen at Jerusalem

Notice how much more detail
He gave them of this after his discussion with Moses and Elijah

“saying, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be delivered unto the chief priests, and unto the scribes; and they shall condemn him to death, and shall deliver him to the Gentiles: and they shall mock him, and shall scourge him, and shall spit upon him, and shall kill him: and the third day he shall rise again.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭10:33-34‬ ‭

the transfiguration was just before that

 

[Diakonos]

Mose and Elijah spoke of His ascension in Acts 1 = 100% non-sequitor fallacy

THINK dear Brother think GOSPEL and not beyond what JESUS came to ACCOMPLISH in Jerusalem.

"And behold, two men talked with Him, who were Moses and Elijah, who appeared in glory and spoke of His decease which He was about to accomplish at Jerusalem."

Learn your ABC's = A comes before B comes before C

Accomplish - They spoke about what HE was going to Accomplish = His death/crucifiction = exodus from His earthly body.

Before his ascension He first had to suffer and be cruicified = Matthew 16:31

Crucifiction - From that time on Jesus began to show His disciples that He must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things at the hands of the elders, chief priests, and scribes, and that He must be killed and on the third day be raised to life.

You make a good point.

I'm currently reconstructing my understanding of this now because of your comments. Previously, I thought of the ascension due to my understanding of the word "departure". But after reviewing it, I now see that Peter uses the same word to refer to his own death (2 Pet 1: 15). Also, I thought the Mt. of Olives (the location of the ascension) was considered a part of Jerusalem, but it is not (1 King 11:7, 2 King 23:13, Zech 14:4, Act 1:12).

Thank you for redirecting me, brother.

 

[DavidTree]

Yeah translations all
Say the same things at least most of them do I just prefer the kjv form myself used to love the niv but find the language better for myself in the kjv these days

but what about the fact he didn’t ascend from Jerusalem ? There shouldn’t be a debate about them saying he would accomplish this at Jerusalem right ?

Remember he told them to go to Galilee ? On mount Olivet?

“And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭1:10-12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Jesus did accomplish one thing at Jerusalem remember he kept saying it just before and after the transfiguration it became a focus of what he was teaching ?

He says this immediately after talking with them in transfiguration

“And they asked him, saying, Why say the scribes that Elijah must first come?

And he answered and told them, Elijah verily cometh first, and restoreth all things; and how it is written of the Son of man, that he must suffer many things, and be set at nought.

But I say unto you, That Elijah is indeed come, and they have done unto him whatsoever they listed, as it is written of him.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭9:11-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Matthew account adds an important detail

“But I say unto you, That Elijah is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them.

Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭17:12-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬


But what I’m saying is he began to tell them he had to go to Jerusalem and be out to death and rise again. When he was taken into heaven it wasn’t in Jerusalem

but everyone has to come to their conclusions and like I was saying no one needs to agree with me or anything. If we forget about which word says what In greek and just look at the context of everything they were docsuccing hisnsuffering and death which would happen at Jerusalem

Notice how much more detail
He gave them of this after his discussion with Moses and Elijah

“saying, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be delivered unto the chief priests, and unto the scribes; and they shall condemn him to death, and shall deliver him to the Gentiles: and they shall mock him, and shall scourge him, and shall spit upon him, and shall kill him: and the third day he shall rise again.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭10:33-34‬ ‭

the transfiguration was just before that

This confirms why the Father sent Moses and Elijah at that time = Luke ch22

And He was withdrawn from them about a stone’s throw, and He knelt down and prayed, saying, “Father, if it is Your will, take this cup away from Me; nevertheless not My will, but Yours, be done.” Then an angel appeared to Him from heaven, strengthening Him.
And being in agony, He prayed more earnestly.
Then His sweat became like great drops of blood falling down to the ground.

We cannot fathom the depth of His agony, knowing what HE had to endure for vile sinners like myself.

 

[Diakonos]

Yeah translations all
Say the same things at least most of them do I just prefer the kjv form myself used to love the niv but find the language better for myself in the kjv these days

but what about the fact he didn’t ascend from Jerusalem ? There shouldn’t be a debate about them saying he would accomplish this at Jerusalem right ?

Remember he told them to go to Galilee ? On mount Olivet?

“And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭1:10-12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Jesus did accomplish one thing at Jerusalem remember he kept saying it just before and after the transfiguration it became a focus of what he was teaching ?

He says this immediately after talking with them in transfiguration

“And they asked him, saying, Why say the scribes that Elijah must first come?

And he answered and told them, Elijah verily cometh first, and restoreth all things; and how it is written of the Son of man, that he must suffer many things, and be set at nought.

But I say unto you, That Elijah is indeed come, and they have done unto him whatsoever they listed, as it is written of him.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭9:11-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Matthew account adds an important detail

“But I say unto you, That Elijah is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them.

Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭17:12-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬


But what I’m saying is he began to tell them he had to go to Jerusalem and be out to death and rise again. When he was taken into heaven it wasn’t in Jerusalem

but everyone has to come to their conclusions and like I was saying no one needs to agree with me or anything. If we forget about which word says what In greek and just look at the context of everything they were docsuccing hisnsuffering and death which would happen at Jerusalem

Notice how much more detail
He gave them of this after his discussion with Moses and Elijah

“saying, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be delivered unto the chief priests, and unto the scribes; and they shall condemn him to death, and shall deliver him to the Gentiles: and they shall mock him, and shall scourge him, and shall spit upon him, and shall kill him: and the third day he shall rise again.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭10:33-34‬ ‭

the transfiguration was just before that

See my comment in post #47.
I had assumed the Mount of olives was considered part of Jerusalem, but I discovered that it is not (1 King 11:7, 2 King 23:13, Zech 14:4, Act 1:12)

 

[DavidTree]

You make a good point.

I'm currently reconstructing my understanding of this now because of your comments. Previously, I thought of the ascension due to my understanding of the word "departure". But after reviewing it, I now see that Peter uses the same word to refer to his own death (2 Pet 1: 15). Also, I thought the Mt. of Olives (the location of the ascension) was considered a part of Jerusalem, but it is not (1 King 11:7, 2 King 23:13, Zech 14:4, Act 1:12).

Thank you for redirecting me, brother.

PLEASE forgive me whenever I come across either too direct or short.

I am not eloquent in speech nor writing = your patience with me is great love = Thank You for your Love in Christ for the Body

 

[DavidTree]

You make a good point.

I'm currently reconstructing my understanding of this now because of your comments. Previously, I thought of the ascension due to my understanding of the word "departure". But after reviewing it, I now see that Peter uses the same word to refer to his own death (2 Pet 1: 15). Also, I thought the Mt. of Olives (the location of the ascension) was considered a part of Jerusalem, but it is not (1 King 11:7, 2 King 23:13, Zech 14:4, Act 1:12).

Thank you for redirecting me, brother.

Something we all overlooked until now = "EXODUS"

Why the word EXODUS is used with Moses and Elijah speaking to Jesus.

EXODUS is the PASSOVER LAMB for the PURCHASE of FREEDOM of God's People

WOW WOW WOW - HALLELUYAH

 

[DavidTree]

yeah plus he was in Galilee when he was taken up to heaven Afterwards they returned to Jerusalem

“And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭1:9-12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

So if they were speaking of what he was about to accomplish in Jerusalem it’s about his death and resurrection

Something we all overlooked until now = "EXODUS"

Why the word EXODUS is used with Moses and Elijah speaking to Jesus.

EXODUS is the PASSOVER LAMB for the PURCHASE of FREEDOM of God's People

WOW WOW WOW - HALLELUYAH

 

[DavidTree]

​

And behold, two men talked with Him, who were Moses and Elijah, ​

who appeared in glory and spoke of His departure which He was about to accomplish at Jerusalem.​

(Luke 9:30-31)​

​

that word 'departure' is 'exodon' -- literally, His exodus.
kjv & nkjv and some other translations put 'His decease' here, taking it to figuratively refer to His crucifixion.

Something we all overlooked until now = "EXODUM = EXODUS"

Why the word EXODUS is used with Moses and Elijah speaking to Jesus.

EXODUS is the PASSOVER LAMB for the PURCHASE of FREEDOM of God's People

The LAMB slain from the foundation of the world.............

WOW WOW WOW - HALLELUYAH

 

[Pilgrimshope]

See my comment in post #47.
I had assumed the Mount of olives was considered part of Jerusalem, but I discovered that it is not (1 King 11:7, 2 King 23:13, Zech 14:4, Act 1:12)

oh brother it’s not needed to look back , I can’t tell you how many times I’ve overlooked a detail and someone here else caught it. We’re all students and pressing toward a better grasp of everything in the word. Though none of us have the perfect view

it’s a blessing to be able to share the word with each other in hopes we come to a better understanding and let the lord teach us with his word. Bringing us together and not driving us apart

it’s huge blessing when we aren’t too
Proud to adjust because k the reuse we could never learn anything from each other. I enjoy reading your posts a lot and find good value for myself in them. And the example Of your humble spirit expressed so often

I hope you feel the same God bless and keep you in all the things of your lord and savior Jesus Christ, until we’re home in him

 

[Pilgrimshope]

This confirms why the Father sent Moses and Elijah at that time = Luke ch22

And He was withdrawn from them about a stone’s throw, and He knelt down and prayed, saying, “Father, if it is Your will, take this cup away from Me; nevertheless not My will, but Yours, be done.” Then an angel appeared to Him from heaven, strengthening Him.
And being in agony, He prayed more earnestly.
Then His sweat became like great drops of blood falling down to the ground.

We cannot fathom the depth of His agony, knowing what HE had to endure for vile sinners like myself.

Amen good stuff

I think there are a few circumstances where we also see him struggling with what he was going to endure . To
Me it shows his humanity during his earthly life he was strengthened through prayer , through angels , through his two witnesses Moses and Elijah and then finally we see him facing the cross in his own strength asking the father if it was possible to let it pass from him but if not let it be done

his stress seems to build through his ministry as more details were given of his suffering to the point of sweating drops of blood. Something scientifically happens under the most incredible moments of stress

Thank God he endured what he did and didn’t rather fall down legions of angels to destroy everything. He did it to fulfill
The salvation of man written in the prophets

“Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels?

But how then shall the scriptures be fulfilled, that thus it must be?”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭26:53-54‬ ‭KJV‬‬

His divinity is unquestionable but I find great fellowship in the truth of his humanity as well the e only place where God and man truly meet is Jesus Christ

 

[posthuman]

Something we all overlooked until now = "EXODUM = EXODUS"

Why the word EXODUS is used with Moses and Elijah speaking to Jesus.

EXODUS is the PASSOVER LAMB for the PURCHASE of FREEDOM of God's People

The LAMB slain from the foundation of the world.............

WOW WOW WOW - HALLELUYAH

Elijah's body could not be found
Moses body cannot be found
Jesus body likewise, not on the earth

 

[posthuman]

Moses body cannot be found

hidden by God

 

[posthuman]

Amen good stuff

I think there are a few circumstances where we also see him struggling with what he was going to endure . To
Me it shows his humanity during his earthly life he was strengthened through prayer , through angels , through his two witnesses Moses and Elijah and then finally we see him facing the cross in his own strength asking the father if it was possible to let it pass from him but if not let it be done

his stress seems to build through his ministry as more details were given of his suffering to the point of sweating drops of blood. Something scientifically happens under the most incredible moments of stress

Thank God he endured what he did and didn’t rather fall down legions of angels to destroy everything. He did it to fulfill
The salvation of man written in the prophets

“Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels?

But how then shall the scriptures be fulfilled, that thus it must be?”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭26:53-54‬ ‭KJV‬‬

His divinity is unquestionable but I find great fellowship in the truth of his humanity as well the e only place where God and man truly meet is Jesus Christ

Remember, 'for the joy set before Him'

He wept for us, what we will endure
There is no fear in Love

When I think of my own departure, it is the ones I leave behind, and their suffering, that I mourn

 

[Pilgrimshope]

hidden by God

amen contended over between Michael and Satan but never seen again

“Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.”
‭‭Jude‬ ‭1:9‬ ‭

no question who won the body of Moses

 

[DavidTree]

​

And behold, two men talked with Him, who were Moses and Elijah, ​

who appeared in glory and spoke of His departure which He was about to accomplish at Jerusalem.​

(Luke 9:30-31)​

​

that word 'departure' is 'exodon' -- literally, His exodus.
kjv & nkjv and some other translations put 'His decease' here, taking it to figuratively refer to His crucifixion.

Elijah's body could not be found
Moses body cannot be found
Jesus body likewise, not on the earth

Have we forgotten who the IAM is that spoke to Moses?

"On the fourteenth day of the first month, you must celebrate the LORD’s Passover."

Exodus/Passover was from God and given to us = for God so loved the world HE gave His only begotten Son....

When Moses and Elijah appeared to Jesus they were, once again, on the mount with the LORD.
the LORD appeared to Moses on Mount Hebron
the LORD came to Elijah on Mount Hebron also
the LORD again is on the Mount with Moses and Elijah and they are speaking to HIM about HIS Exodus = HIS Passover