What does John 3:16 mean?

[Runningman]

The Spritual Circumcision of Christ . . . is the answer.

Have you received the Circumcision of Christ? Does Colossians 2:9-15 explain why you have been totally Transformed by Christ? Does Colossians 2:9-15 explain why you are a "New Man"? Do those verses explain why you reflect the Glory of Christ more and more and more?

I sure hope that the answer is yes, because if there is no Transformation, well . . .

I love Colossians 2:9-15, but like John 3:16, Colossians 2:12 says that faith is required:

Colossians 2:12
12Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

This whole circumcision of Christ is an operation performed by God, there's nothing you or I can do to facilitate that process except have faith in Christ. Colossians 2:9-15 goes into unnecessary, but interesting, details, John 3:16 just tells the person what they need to do and what their gift will be for obedience. If someone has sincere faith in Christ then God will keep His promises and each individual will get eternal life. Am I wrong?

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

I love Colossians 2:9-15, but like John 3:16, Colossians 2:12 says that faith is required:

Colossians 2:12
12Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

This whole circumcision of Christ is an operation performed by God, there's nothing you or I can do to facilitate that process except have faith in Christ. Colossians 2:9-15 goes into unecessary but interesting details, John 3:16 just tells the person what they need to do and what their gift will be for obedience. If someone has sincere faith in Christ then God will keep His promises and each individual will get eternal life. Am I wrong?

Beautiful expression of what you and I believe the Bible is clearly teaching.

I see John 3:16 as one-third of the Gospel. It explains the Purpose of Christ.

I see Colossians 2:9-15 as another third of the Gospel (not entirely, but a significant portion of it), for it explains the Work of Christ.

That's really, really cool to hear you say that you "love Colossians 2:9-15." That is amazing, for few are even aware of its existence.

 

[Nehemiah6]

God is not the author of confusion...

Well then you should not be sowing seeds of spiritual confusion on a Christian forum.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

Well then you should not be sowing seeds of spiritual confusion on a Christian forum.

Do you find value in Runningman . . . God's Creation?

 

[Magenta]

Some contradict what Scripture explicitly states, to say man was created with an immortal soul.
They extrapolate from this that once consigned to the LoF, the soul cannot die, though death is
from beginning to end of Scripture expressed as the end of the wicked in a multiplicity of ways.

Some will add to what is explicitly stated and say Adam ate from the Tree of Life before eating
from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil; hence man is born with an immortal soul.

Either stance willfully ignores that eternal life is in Christ alone.

 

[Runningman]

Some contradict what Scripture explicitly states, to say man was created with an immortal soul.
They extrapolate from this that once consigned to the LoF, the soul cannot die, though death is
from beginning to end of Scripture expressed as the end of the wicked in a multiplicity of ways.

Some will add to what is explicitly stated and say Adam ate from the Tree of Life before eating
from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil; hence man is born with an immortal soul.

Either stance willfully ignores that eternal life is in Christ alone.

well said. That really is the bottom line. One can only get eternal life and forgiveness of sins through Christ.

I’m getting a little psychological here, but I think everyone understands this but can’t accept it easily because it means that the majority of Protestants and Catholics got this particular thing wrong.

Im sure by now, Christianity with its hundreds of denominations, has many heresies abounding, but most of the denominations seem to possess a truth that the others don’t share.

 

[Runningman]

Well then you should not be sowing seeds of spiritual confusion on a Christian forum.

What exactly about John 3:16 do you think was confusing? I asked you and anyone who read my OP, nicely, to read it like a child. I’m not interested in what your denomination says or what Nehemiah says or even what Runningman says. I’m interested in what the gospel says.

Forget everything you thought you knew about John 3:16. You’re so confused you’re to the point of accusing people of evil because you’re blinded by ignorance of the truth.

I know that sounds difficult for your ego to accept, but your lack of humility is not something I can account for.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I love Colossians 2:9-15, but like John 3:16, Colossians 2:12 says that faith is required:

Colossians 2:12
12Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

This whole circumcision of Christ is an operation performed by God, there's nothing you or I can do to facilitate that process except have faith in Christ. Colossians 2:9-15 goes into unnecessary, but interesting, details, John 3:16 just tells the person what they need to do and what their gift will be for obedience. If someone has sincere faith in Christ then God will keep His promises and each individual will get eternal life. Am I wrong?

“For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness: All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭7:21-23‬ ‭KJV‬‬

his word and us believing is how the circumcision works it changes what’s in our heart he can take those type of hearts and this enters in through belief in Jesus and his word

“For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4:12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The circumcision is this and all we can do

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel ( his instrument of circumcision )to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

It works in us through faith to change a sinners hesrt to a righteous one because what’s in our heart of faith is going to bear fruit whether good or evil God is able to change us at the core through the hearing of faith

“So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭10:17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

as we grow in faith we learn that there are many things to do but we operate by faith as we grow and are changed those works begin to come out of us , just like the works of the flesh used to because of our hearts condition

Jesus is a heart surgeon , his word his scalpel and man always operates by the understanding and belief in the heart as he changes our Will it changes our actions by faith

“Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.”
‭‭Philippians‬ ‭2:12-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

your right it’s belief but to believe we have to hear what he said and let it become what we believe

 

[Oblio]

We are saved...but for what? I've been struggling, knowing that the past 20+ years of my life have been spent struggling with health issues. So I must look forward. Surely, this life is just a stage in our journey. We were not created for this life only.
The Lord has allowed me a few glimpses into the next stage, though these quickly faded. I so want to get on to what I've been saved for.
"9Rather, as it is written: “ No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no heart has imagined, what God has prepared for those who love Him.” 10But God has revealed it to us by the Spirit. The Spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God.…" - 1 Corinthians 2:9,10

 

[Pilgrimshope]

We are saved...but for what? I've been struggling, knowing that the past 20+ years of my life have been spent struggling with health issues. So I must look forward. Surely, this life is just a stage in our journey. We were not created for this life only.
The Lord has allowed me a few glimpses into the next stage, though these quickly faded. I so want to get on to what I've been saved for.
"9Rather, as it is written: “ No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no heart has imagined, what God has prepared for those who love Him.” 10But God has revealed it to us by the Spirit. The Spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God.…" - 1 Corinthians 2:9,10

Amen This life and our time here is like a trial to decide where we’re going

“Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: (For we walk by faith, not by sight)

We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭5:6-8‬ ‭KJV‬‬

in this life we’re all gonna have trials and troubles face temptations and tribulations ect

“These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.”
‭‭John‬ ‭16:33‬ ‭KJV‬‬

ultimately we need to compare our present struggles with the surpassing glory of eternal life with God the Father so we can see it’s not comparable

“For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.

For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.

For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for? But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it.

And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us? Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.

I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭8:18-19, 24-25, 28, 31, 34-35, 37-39‬ ‭KJV‬‬

this world is temporary just a place to hear and believe the gospel so we can have faith and get to real life with Jesus after we leave our worldly tabernacle this world is dying like our body but we are going to live

it’s a place to share the gospel with others so they can hear his call

 

[BroTan]

You might have come to this thread thinking, “Oh this is an easy one.” But I ask you to resist the urge to not read past the title. What I am about to say requires a truth-seeker’s heart, humility, and a thirst for the rightly-divided Word of God.

One of the most well-known verses inside and outside of Christendom is also one of the least understood.

Jesus asks us in a number of places to drop our preconceived notions, to stop thinking too much, and just believe like a child does. That’s the only way to really understand the Word of God.

John 3:16 KJV
16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

“…whosoever believeth in him should not perish…”
The physical bodies of all mortals perish, whether they are unrighteous or righteous. The unrighteousness soul and spirit will not live forever under any circumstances because they did not believe. They will cease to exist, they will perish, they will not be conscious and alive like the righteous are.

“…but have everlasting life…”
Therefore, the promise of never perishing applies to the soul and spirit of the person who believes in Christ. The person who believes in Christ will have a soul and spirit that has everlasting life. They will be living forever in eternal conscious communion with God.

Concisely: believe in Jesus and you’ll live forever. Don’t believe in Jesus and you won’t live forever. Full stop.

According to the scriptures those who don't believe in Jesus and had pleasure in unrighteousness will live forever in the lake of fire. Let's take a in Isaiah 66: 22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain. 23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD. 24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

Even the worms will live forever eating off these people who transgressed against the lord. Notice verse 24 says that people shall go forth to look upon the people. These people are burning alive and still living.

 

[Runningman]

According to the scriptures those who don't believe in Jesus and had pleasure in unrighteousness will live forever in the lake of fire. Let's take a in Isaiah 66: 22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain. 23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD. 24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

Even the worms will live forever eating off these people who transgressed against the lord. Notice verse 24 says that people shall go forth to look upon the people. These people are burning alive and still living.

Where does it say they live forever in the lake of fire?
Revelation 20:14-15 says the LoF is the second death. 🤔

Isaiah 66:22-24 says they are carcasses of men, that means they're dead bodies. It also says the worms don't die, the fire doesn't goes out, and that they [their carcasses] will be an abhorring to all flesh (all people who are alive and not carcasses.) Doesn't say they live forever burning while being consumed by worms.

If anything, this suggests that there are so many bodies to burn the fire doesn't go out and they worms never stop eating and they never go away and cease to be an abhorrence to people.

 

[Oblio]

So the Father that has revealed His love for me to me is going to allow His creation to suffer agony forever when He doesn't have to...I don't think so. He's far better than that! Sounds to me like an an enemy made that one up!
But others have the right to believe whatever they want to.

 

[justbyfaith]

So the Father that has revealed His love for me to me is going to allow His creation to suffer agony forever when He doesn't have to...I don't think so. He's far better than that! Sounds to me like an an enemy made that one up!
But others have the right to believe whatever they want to.

You would be wise to heed the doctrine that you are rejecting as a warning.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Forget everything you thought you knew about John 3:16. You’re so confused you’re to the point of accusing people of evil because you’re blinded by ignorance of the truth.

This is rich. First you promote the false doctrine of Annihilationism through John 3:16, and then you accuse me of being blinded -- BY IGNORANCE -- to the truth! Since Christians in general reject that nonsensical doctrine, why don't you stop promoting lies?

FROM THEOPEDIA
Annihilationism is the belief that the final fate of those who are not saved is literal and final death and destruction. It runs counter to the mainstream traditional Christian understanding of hell as eternal suffering and separation from God.

In contrast to the more traditional view, which holds that the wicked will remain conscious in hell forever, annhilationism teaches that, whether or not God may use hell to exact some conscious punishment for sins, he will eventually destroy or annihilate the wicked completely, leaving only the righteous to live on in immortality.

MARK 9 KJV: HELL (GEHENNA) IS ETERNAL TORMENT
42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
44 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

 

[Oblio]

You would be wise to heed the doctrine that you are rejecting as a warning.

I would be wise to do 2 things:
1. Follow the leading of the Holy Spirit.
2. Allow others the freedom to believe what they do, so peace is kept and I treat others as I want to be treated. Shalom

 

[Runningman]

This is rich. First you promote the false doctrine of Annihilationism through John 3:16, and then you accuse me of being blinded -- BY IGNORANCE -- to the truth! Since Christians in general reject that nonsensical doctrine, why don't you stop promoting lies?

FROM THEOPEDIA
Annihilationism is the belief that the final fate of those who are not saved is literal and final death and destruction. It runs counter to the mainstream traditional Christian understanding of hell as eternal suffering and separation from God.

In contrast to the more traditional view, which holds that the wicked will remain conscious in hell forever, annhilationism teaches that, whether or not God may use hell to exact some conscious punishment for sins, he will eventually destroy or annihilate the wicked completely, leaving only the righteous to live on in immortality.

You're creating a strawman and then attacking my character over an alleged promotion of annihilationism. I am not promoting any doctrines of the sort; I am just telling you what John 3:16 literally says. The reason I am responding to you like this is because you're aggressively attacking my character rather than defeating me with scripture. Your antagonistic personality only attracts opposition.

If you find that John 3:16 compliments annihilationism then you wouldn't be the first. "Conditional immortality" is a better term to use because not everyone lives forever. Surely you see that, if you don't then you're blind. It's very simple.

No offense of course, I do love you and wish the best for you. I'm here for you if there's ever anything you want to discuss.

MARK 9 KJV: HELL (GEHENNA) IS ETERNAL TORMENT

42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.
43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
44 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

Your supporting verses don't actually say what you claim they do. Where do those verses just say "They'll have eternal torment" or something like that? They don't. That's the problem with false teachers like yourself. If God asked you right now "Where in the Bible does it say I'll torment all unrepentant sinners forever?" then which verse would you show Him?

If you can't even defend your doctrine against a nobody like myself in a random forum then what makes you think you can stand against an all-knowing all-powerful God?

 

[justbyfaith]

I would be wise to do 2 things:
1. Follow the leading of the Holy Spirit.
2. Allow others the freedom to believe what they do, so peace is kept and I treat others as I want to be treated. Shalom

You would also be wise to heed as a warning, the doctrine that you are rejecting.

Mat 5:27, Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
Mat 5:28, But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
Mat 5:29, And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
Mat 5:30, And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

 

[BroTan]

Where does it say they live forever in the lake of fire?
Revelation 20:14-15 says the LoF is the second death. 🤔

Isaiah 66:22-24 says they are carcasses of men, that means they're dead bodies. It also says the worms don't die, the fire doesn't goes out, and that they [their carcasses] will be an abhorring to all flesh (all people who are alive and not carcasses.) Doesn't say they live forever burning while being consumed by worms.

If anything, this suggests that there are so many bodies to burn the fire doesn't go out and they worms never stop eating and they never go away and cease to be an abhorrence to people.

Let's take a look at something here to explain that people and or angels will be alive tormented in the lake of fire. Let's start in Isaiah 33: 14 The sinners in Zion are afraid; fearfulness hath surprised the hypocrites. Who among us shall dwell with the devouring fire? who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings?

What does everlasting mean? Read the whole chapter in Isaiah 33 and it will date this everlasting burning. In Mark, here is a unclean spirit (evil angel) asking Jesus not to torment him. Remember angels are spirits and can be also tormented.

Mark 5:7 And cried with a loud voice, and said, What have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of the most high God? I adjure thee by God, that thou torment me not. This is future in Luke. Why? We have not had the first resurrection yet and Abraham is still in the grave.

Let's go to Luke 16:23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. 24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame. 25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented. 26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence. 27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house: 28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. 29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them. 30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent. 31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

Who rose from the grave? Jesus, and they did not believe his report. This guy doesn't even know he has been judged. If he looks around he would probably find his family burning along with him.

 

[Magenta]

What does everlasting mean?

"Forever"