Some of the reasons I pulled away from Dispensationalism.

[Beckie]

Dispensations are not in The Word of Truth? Yes, IF that is your opinion of what you wish to choose. Why not choose What God Actually Says About This Doctrine?

These Are "why I believe" In "God's Dispensations":

1Co_9:17 "For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against
my will, A Dispensation of The Gospel is committed unto me."

Eph_1:10 "That in The Dispensation of the fulness of times
He might gather together in one all things in Christ, both
which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in Him:"

Eph_3:2 "If ye have heard of The Dispensation Of
The GRACE Of God Which is given me to you-ward:"

Col_1:25 "Whereof I am made a minister, according to
The Dispensation of God Which is given to me for you,
to Fulfil [Complete] The Word of God;"

No opinion needed. Amen?

Yes the word dispensation is in the Scriptures . I too believe in God's dispensations.
Here are Scofield's notes of what he believed about dispensations


DISPENSATION
A dispensation is a period of time during which man is tested in respect of obedience to some specific revelation of the will of God. Seven such dispensations are distinguished in Scripture. (See Scofield on Gen_1:28), note 5.

And God blessed them
The First Dispensation: Innocency. Man was created in innocency, placed in a perfect environment, subjected to an absolutely simple test, and warned of the consequence of disobedience. The woman fell through pride; the man deliberately. 1Ti_2:14 God restored His sinning creatures, but the dispensation of innocency ended in the judgment of the Expulsion Gen_3:24 See, for the other dispensations;
Conscience (See Scofield on Gen_3:23).
Human Government (See Scofield on Gen_8:21).
Promise (See Scofield on Gen_12:1).
Law (See Scofield on Exo_19:8).
Grace (See Scofield on Joh_1:17).
Kingdom (See Scofield on Eph_1:10).

I do not find any place in Scripture that says, expounds, etc of these ideas of Scofield's. Is there any Scripture passage says what Scofield says?

The 4 times the word dispensation is used, as you posted, The Strong's # is G3622
οἰκονομία
oikonomia
oy-kon-om-ee'-ah
From G3623; administration (of a household or estate); specifically a (religious) “economy”: - dispensation, stewardship

 

[Dino246]

However, dispensationalism falls apart when men say "That won't happen again because it already happened".

Some prophecies are 'done and dusted'. For example, Jesus already came and fulfilled hundreds of specific prophecies. By what criteria would you determine whether some prophesied event will or won't "happen again"?

 

[Nehemiah6]

I agree with you on this (bolded) statement, which is why I reject dispensationalism with its allegorical treatment of the seven letters in Revelation 2 and 3. They were literal letters to literal congregations, not fantastical prophetic allusions to the future states of the Christian church.

Actually Dispensationalism FIRST takes those letters in their plain literal sense, and then some try to project a prophetic application to them. Both can be true, if we see (for example) the current apostasy in Christendom reflected in the condition of the Laodicean church. As we know, there are layers in Scripture, but that does not preclude the plain literal sense.

 

[Nehemiah6]

I do not find any place in Scripture that says, expounds, etc of these ideas of Scofield's. Is there any Scripture passage says what Scofield says?

No one is so naive as to expect the Bible to say "Scofield is correct" or "There are seven dispensations in the Bible"! One can use his or her own discernment to see that there are indeed several biblical dispensations which generally correspond to the covenants in the Bible. However, "the dispensation of the fulness of times" does not have any specific covenant tied into it, although indirectly it is an extension of the New Covenant period. I would differ from Scofield in some particulars but that does not change the fact that God has had different ways of relating to humanity at different times. The most obvious is the Dispensation of the Law of Moses vs the Dispensation of Grace under Christ. We are still in the "Age of Grace" since the Gospel continues to be preached at this time bringing the grace of God to all mankind. But this will not last forever.

 

[Jocund]

Those that don't believe in dispensations...I would ask you, where's your ark? Didn't God command to build an ark? Do you offer animal sacrifices? Why not? There are divisions to be made according to audience and time period. God's word has been dispensed throughout human history. What God gave Noah was not the same as He gave Adam. What God gave Abraham was different than what He gave Noah, etc..

I find this comment confusing. Can you break this down?

 

[Aaron56]

oikonomia
oy-kon-om-ee'-ah
From G3623; administration (of a household or estate); specifically a (religious) “economy”: - dispensation, stewardship

This is a really important part: a dispensation is an economy, or, how the grace of God vests among men. It is fruitless to attempt to work within an old economy once the new has been given.

 

[Jocund]

Getting back to Dispensationalism. This sound system of Bible interpretation rests on the premise that the Bible should be taken in its plain literal sense unless there are figures of speech involved. Which means that nothing should be allegorized or treated as symbolic unless there is a perfectly good reason to do so. The reason Dispensationalism gets a bad rap is because it exposes the weakness of Covenant Theology (generally held by Protestant Denominations).

One of the biggest errors which Dispensationalism addresses is Replacement Theology -- the substitution of the Church for Israel, and the assumption that God has no future plans for redeemed and restored Israel. Another major error is Amillennialism. A third major error is Preterism. People who hold to these erroneous ideas hate to give them up, and rather become defensive. Therefore they attack Dispensationalism.

You seem like a reasonable person that is willing to speak logic for logic. In your view, how does dispensationalism address Romans 9 and Galatians 3?

Specifically we see the concept that only those in Christ are the heirs of Abraham's promises. In some dispensationalism views that have been advocated on this site, there have been false claims presented that Christ is not the sole heir of the promises to Abraham (in contradiction to Gal 3:16).

How do you reconcile that contradiction?

 

[John146]

I find this comment confusing. Can you break this down?

Dispensations is the teaching that God has dispensed His truth to mankind throughout human history, not all at once. What God dispensed to Abraham was not the same as what God had dispensed to Moses, etc...

What God gave to man to be responsible for at any given time in history. Recognizing these different time periods and audience will help us understand what God wants from us today as part of the body of Christ after the cross.

 

[Beckie]

So to claim that Christ will NOT set up an earthly Kingdom in the future is not only foolish but unbiblical.

Joh_18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

 

[Artios1]

I don't need the originals. I have the preserved word of God in English. Never emphasize the "originals" more than God. If God thought the "originals" were needed, He would have preserved them.

(emphasis mine)

I don’t… and didn’t

I merely made a statement in regard to the OP statement, which was → “Thinking a Scofield Bible was THEE Word of God.”

I then went on about different versions we have…but I apparently struck a nerve with someone #5 regarding the KJV who probably knew what I was referencing, but rather than ask, he decided to use it as a springboard to project his agenda…….

The whole thing on originals was not my focus. …..and I am sorry that I allowed this to sidetrack the heart behind the OP.

 

[Beckie]

Referring back to posts # 3&4 ... Do any of you see a difference in the Kingdom of God and the Kingdom of Heaven? Has anyone search the Scriptures to read about the Kingdom... Does the Bible tell us what His kingdom is? if so where?

 

[Journeyman]

The OT Jews under the law were required by God to obey the law to be part of God's physical people Israel.

The law was given to show the Jews that they and all people are sinners in need of Gods' mercy. And Jesus expected everyone to fulfill the purpose of the law by repenting and loving God and mankind.

 

[John146]

The law was given to show the Jews that they and all people are sinners in need of Gods' mercy. And Jesus expected everyone to fulfill the purpose of the law by repenting and loving God and mankind.

The law was given so Israel would be a nation separated unto God. The sacrificial system was added to forgive sins against the law.

No sacrifice…no forgiveness of sin.

 

[John146]

Referring back to posts # 3&4 ... Do any of you see a difference in the Kingdom of God and the Kingdom of Heaven? Has anyone search the Scriptures to read about the Kingdom... Does the Bible tell us what His kingdom is? if so where?

Kingdom of heaven = Kingdom promised to Israel come down to earth with the rightful King on the throne of David.

Kingdom of God = Spiritual kingdom that lives within the believer.

Both were at hand during the earthly life of Christ.

 

[Journeyman]

Referring back to posts # 3&4 ... Do any of you see a difference in the Kingdom of God and the Kingdom of Heaven? Has anyone search the Scriptures to read about the Kingdom... Does the Bible tell us what His kingdom is? if so where?

There is no difference. The Kingdom is all around us, but people can't see it or become a citizen of it until they are born of Gods'Spirit

 

[Rhomphaeam]

Background:
Dad was in Bible School when i was born. Glad Tidings was a Assemblies of God school. The blessings of being born into a Christian family I will ever be thankful for. The family lived and breathed Dispensational thinking. Some of my earliest memories are making sure i was right with Jesus because the nation of Israel had formed and it was now about 7 years beyond 1948. So scared i had sinned and would be left, mind you i was 9 -10 . The secret rapture ... if Mom was not home for some reason when school got out the fear of being left behind would hit again time after time... Didn't expect Dad to be home he was a tree faller along with pastoring a small Pentecostal church. The point here is i grew up with a heavy dose of Dispensationalism. Thinking a Scofield Bible was THEE Word of God.

I am not a good writer, struggle with making myself clear. Because of this reply from a fellow poster i will attempt this thread.
Rhomphaeam


I could list a mess of urls, that is not my plan although i will use others notes.

Please lets not go to the yes no yes no postings

Thanks Beckie for the heads up. You know I had a strong feeling that the left behind issue was going to be an issue in this for you. I didn't expect that would have been as you have cited it here. My word - sister.

Fear

Now I see as through a wood darkly,
Trees all panted round,
And in the midst uncertain thought,
An unsuspecting sound.

by Rhomphaeam

Well I'm having a coffee then ill pay attention.

 

[Beckie]

Kingdom of heaven = Kingdom promised to Israel come down to earth with the rightful King on the throne of David.

Kingdom of God = Spiritual kingdom that lives within the believer.

Both were at hand during the earthly life of Christ.

Scripture support please?

 

[Amanuensis]

I don't need the originals. I have the preserved word of God in English. Never emphasize the "originals" more than God. If God thought the "originals" were needed, He would have preserved them.

He did. In Greek and Hebrew. The copies that we have would be considered "preserved by God" in the sense that you seem to be applying to an English translation that relied on these copies to translate to English which would mean those copies are the authority and not the English translation. But you probably knew that.

 

[Amanuensis]

Background:
Dad was in Bible School when i was born. Glad Tidings was a Assemblies of God school. The blessings of being born into a Christian family I will ever be thankful for. The family lived and breathed Dispensational thinking. Some of my earliest memories are making sure i was right with Jesus because the nation of Israel had formed and it was now about 7 years beyond 1948. So scared i had sinned and would be left, mind you i was 9 -10 . The secret rapture ... if Mom was not home for some reason when school got out the fear of being left behind would hit again time after time... Didn't expect Dad to be home he was a tree faller along with pastoring a small Pentecostal church. The point here is i grew up with a heavy dose of Dispensationalism. Thinking a Scofield Bible was THEE Word of God.

I am not a good writer, struggle with making myself clear. Because of this reply from a fellow poster i will attempt this thread.
Rhomphaeam


I could list a mess of urls, that is not my plan although i will use others notes.

Please lets not go to the yes no yes no postings

I think you are a great writer. Don't underestimate yourself. I was getting a good vibe from your story. An uncommonly good vibe. Your writing style stands out and you aren't even really trying. You should write your story as a book and leave it for your grand children.

I just started reading this book "The End of History: Pentecostals and a Fresh Approach to the Apacolypse" by Robert Menzies a well known scholar on Lucan Pneumatology with a background in the Assemblies of God. He promises to present scholarly reasons why the AG should improve their theology about Eschatology and dispensationalism inherited from their early days.

It just came out this year. I expect it will stir up some conversations in the AG this year. He is a well respected theologian.

https://www.amazon.com/End-History-.../ref=tmm_kin_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=

 

[John146]

Scripture support please?

First of all, the word kingdom and the word God is not the same. Two things that are different are not the same. God is a spirit. Heaven is a created place. Let's start with...

Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.