How the Pre-Trib Rapture Became Popular in the Modern Church

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Aug 2, 2021
7,317
2,048
113
And He never said the Church is going through the tribulation! He never said it is the Church that is resurrected after the resurrection!

Be careful how you use "lol" when disagreeing with someone, Laura doesn't like it!
God said from Genesis thru Revelation that His People/His Elect/His Saints will suffer Tribulation as we wait for His Second Coming.
 

ewq1938

Well-known member
Oct 18, 2018
4,995
1,264
113
No doubt you never read my earlier post on what "apostacy" really means, or you just chose to ignore it!

That was not what Apostasy means. This is what it means:

2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away (apostasia) first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

The word "falling away" is apostasia from where we get the words Apostate and Apostasy. Obviously it means a moral and spiritual religious "departure" not a physical departure.


Don't believe anything that says this event is the rapture. Here are 5 expert sources that prove the "departure" in 2 Thess 2:3 is the Apostasy:

Strong's definition G646

apostasia

ap-os-tas-ee'-ah

Feminine of the same as G647; defection from truth (properly the state), (“apostasy”) : - falling away, forsake.

Total KJV occurrences: 2


Thayer Definition:

G646 apostasia


1) a falling away, defection, apostasy

Part of Speech: noun feminine

A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: feminine of the same as G647

Citing in TDNT: 1:513, 88

Total KJV occurrences: 2





Abbott-Smith Manual Greek Lexicon of the New Testament

Apostasia

defection, apostasy, revolt; in late Gk. (MM, Exp., viii; Lft., Notes, 111; Cremer, 308) for cl. ?p?stas?? , freq. in sense of political revolt, in LXX (e.g. Joshua 22:22, 2 Chronicles 29:19, Jeremiah 2:19) and NT always of religious apostasy: Ac21:21, II Th 2:3.







Liddell and Scott:

A defection, revolt, v.l. in D.H.7.1, J.Vit.10, Plu.Galb.1; esp. in religious sense, rebellion against God, apostasy, LXX Jo.22.22, 2 Ep.Th.2.3 .





Winer's Grammar:



Apostasia, a falling away, defection, apostasy; in the Bible namely, from the true religion: Acts 21:21; 2 Thessalonians 2:3 ; ((Joshua 22:22; 2 Chronicles 29:19; 2 Chronicles 33:19); Jeremiah 2:19; Jeremiah 36:(29) 32 Complutensian; 1 Macc. 2:15). The earlier Greeks say Apostasis; see Lob. ad Phryn., p. 528; (Winer's Grammar, 24).
 

Charlie24

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2021
998
270
63
God said from Genesis thru Revelation that His People/His Elect/His Saints will suffer Tribulation as we wait for His Second Coming.
The tribulation of life, living for Christ! Not the wrath of God on sinful man in the end.

Surly you know the difference?
 

ewq1938

Well-known member
Oct 18, 2018
4,995
1,264
113
Oh, you now think I'm playing games, do you?

The "falling away" is the rapture/resurrection of the Church! That is what is "taken out of the way" in vs. 7. Then the anti-christ is revealed and the book of Rev begins to unfold.

Pre-trib has the church rapturing away before the man of sin is revealed but Paul said the rapture would not happen until the man of sin was revealed.

2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, (the rapture)
2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, (the day of the rapture) except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;


Pre-trib: church raptured BEFORE the man of sin is revealed.
the bible: church raptured AFTER the man of sin is revealed.

This proves rapture cannot happen before man of sin is revealed which proves the Great Tribulation will have started before the rapture occurs.
 

iTheophilus

Well-known member
Oct 28, 2021
436
471
63
Oh, you now think I'm playing games, do you?

The "falling away" is the rapture/resurrection of the Church! That is what is "taken out of the way" in vs. 7. Then the anti-christ is revealed and the book of Rev begins to unfold.

It is the presence of the Church/ the true believers, and the presence of the Holy Spirit in the believers that hold back the darkness until the appointed time.

Fairly simple I think!
Do you really believe that the falling away is the rapture? You’re actually right, then. The rapture theory does lead to the great falling away—the great Apostasy.
 
Aug 2, 2021
7,317
2,048
113
The tribulation of life, living for Christ! Not the wrath of God on sinful man in the end.

Surly you know the difference?
CORRECT - Tribulation is not the Wrath of God.

1 Thess 1:10 and to wait for His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead, even Jesus who delivers us from the wrath to come.
 

Charlie24

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2021
998
270
63
Pre-trib has the church rapturing away before the man of sin is revealed but Paul said the rapture would not happen until the man of sin was revealed.

2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, (the rapture)
2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, (the day of the rapture) except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;


Pre-trib: church raptured BEFORE the man of sin is revealed.
the bible: church raptured AFTER the man of sin is revealed.

This proves rapture cannot happen before man of sin is revealed which proves the Great Tribulation will have started before the rapture occurs.
I guess you haven't read 1 Thes. 2:8 " and then shall that Wicked be revealed"

This comes AFTER that is taken out of the way in vs. 7.
 
Aug 2, 2021
7,317
2,048
113
I guess you haven't read 1 Thes. 2:8 " and then shall that Wicked be revealed"

This comes AFTER that is taken out of the way in vs. 7.

And now you know what is restraining, that he may be revealed in his own time. For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He who now restrains will do so until He is taken out of the way.

HE is the Holy Spirit, the Restrainer, who will step aside at the unction of the FATHER.

HE never leaves His Elect - the Saints.
 
Aug 2, 2021
7,317
2,048
113
Where does God say you are right?
Matt ch24, 1 Thess & 2 Thess , 1 Tim 4:1 , 1 John 2:14-19 , the Prophets Enoch, Noah, Daniel, Job, Elijah , James ch5
and Revelations ch1-3, 6:9-11 , ch7 , ch12, ch13, 14:9-13, ch19-20
 

ewq1938

Well-known member
Oct 18, 2018
4,995
1,264
113
Do you really believe that the falling away is the rapture? You’re actually right, then. The rapture theory does lead to the great falling away—the great Apostasy.
Yes and those in that errant doctrine actually want to commit Apostasia! Fiction isn't this creative! Nevermind the real Greek definition of the word. They will make up their own definition, place the rapture at the time of the Apostasy, move the rapture from after the revealing of the man of sin to BEFORE the revealing of the man of sin and POOF, instant-bad-theology just add hot water and it's ready to be swallowed whole with some spiritual gagging!
 

ewq1938

Well-known member
Oct 18, 2018
4,995
1,264
113
I guess you haven't read 1 Thes. 2:8 " and then shall that Wicked be revealed"

This comes AFTER that is taken out of the way in vs. 7.

Pre-trib: church raptured BEFORE the man of sin is revealed.
the bible: church raptured AFTER the man of sin is revealed.

Your beliefs are contrary to bible.
 

Charlie24

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2021
998
270
63
Hey, you guys are gang-banging ol' Charlie. That's not fair, is it?
 

Charlie24

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2021
998
270
63
Pre-trib: church raptured BEFORE the man of sin is revealed.
the bible: church raptured AFTER the man of sin is revealed.

Your beliefs are contrary to bible.
You are mistaken, let's read it! Slooooowly.

2 Thes. 2:6-8

"And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
 

ewq1938

Well-known member
Oct 18, 2018
4,995
1,264
113
You are mistaken, let's read it! Slooooowly.

2 Thes. 2:6-8

"And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

That's not the rapture. Paul already said rapture would not happen until the man of sin was revealed. Pre-trib goes against what Paul taught.

Pre-trib has the church rapturing away before the man of sin is revealed but Paul said the rapture would not happen until the man of sin was revealed.

2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, (the rapture)
2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, (the day of the rapture) except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;


Pre-trib: church raptured BEFORE the man of sin is revealed.
the bible: church raptured AFTER the man of sin is revealed.

This proves rapture cannot happen before man of sin is revealed which proves the Great Tribulation will have started before the rapture occurs.
 

Charlie24

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2021
998
270
63
That's not the rapture. Paul already said rapture would not happen until the man of sin was revealed. Pre-trib goes against what Paul taught.

Pre-trib has the church rapturing away before the man of sin is revealed but Paul said the rapture would not happen until the man of sin was revealed.

2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, (the rapture)
2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, (the day of the rapture) except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;


Pre-trib: church raptured BEFORE the man of sin is revealed.
the bible: church raptured AFTER the man of sin is revealed.

This proves rapture cannot happen before man of sin is revealed which proves the Great Tribulation will have started before the rapture occurs.
No, that's not it, my friend! You do not understand the pre-trib belief.

2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ,//// and by our gathering together unto him,

Paul is speaking of the Second Coming and the Rapture here. Notice!

"by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ," is the Second coming.

"and by our gathering together unto Him," is the rapture.

Do you see the "coma" between the two statements? Paul is referring to two different happenings!
 

ewq1938

Well-known member
Oct 18, 2018
4,995
1,264
113
No, that's not it, my friend! You do not understand the pre-trib belief.

2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ,//// and by our gathering together unto him,

Paul is speaking of the Second Coming and the Rapture here. Notice!

"by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ," is the Second coming.

"and by our gathering together unto Him," is the rapture.

Do you see the "coma" between the two statements? Paul is referring to two different happenings!
Everyone knows those are two different events but what you don't understand is they happen the same day.


"for that day shall not come" Paul is speaking of a single day not two different days like you believe.



You are also sidestepping the fact that Paul said the gathering to Christ happens after the man of sin is revealed. That makes pre-trib impossible.