How the Pre-Trib Rapture Became Popular in the Modern Church

[DavidTree]

Because you put forth erroneous understandings on 90 percent of all your posts. And when things like the LAST TRUMP are explained, you then just DUCK IT and continue with your own beliefs.

My posts are 95-99% Scripture - i say very little and never duck any questions.

Our Great Hope in CHRIST when HE said: "IAM the Resurrection"

Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does corruption inherit incorruption. 51Behold, I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed— 52in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54So when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: “Death is swallowed up in victory.”

55“O Death, where is your sting?
O Hades, where is your victory?”

56The sting of death is sin, and the strength of sin is the law. 57But thanks be to God, who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

58Therefore, my beloved brethren, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your labor is not in vain in the Lord.

 

[GaryA]

That is very basic because before those alive are caught up, those who are dead will be resurrected.

However, the way you wrote "THE resurrection" makes it seem like there will be only one moment in time where someone or a group is resurrected.

Where you miss it: JESUS was resurrected. When? It will turn out to be around 2000 years before the church dead will be resurrected. Now we have TWO resurrections with nearly 2000 years between. However, around 7 years after the dead in Christ are resurrected, it will be time for the Old Testament saints to be resurrection. Their time will probably be at the 7th vial.
Then the Two Witnesses will be resurrected too. Do you know when their time is?
There will also be those beheaded that will be resurrected. Again, do you know when?

Revelation 20:

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

I don't think the Resurrection of Christ is intended to be included...

 

[GaryA]

There is no such thing as 'the Church Age' - this is a man-made doctrine of error

Hmm. Do you deny the trinity because "trinity" is not found?
Do you deny the rapture because "rapture" is not found?

Did you not read?

17 For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me. (1 Corinthians 9) (Emphasis added.)

2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward: (Ephesians 3) (Emphasis added.)

25 Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God;
26 Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints:
27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory: (Colossians 1) (Emphasis added.)

Paul is talking about the church age or the age of grace. You can deny it all you want but who are you? It still exists but will soon end with the pretrib rapture. "time" will then be Day of the Lord. These are back to back events, with no time between. It is and will be church age but a moment after the rapture The Day of the Lord will have started.

I highly recommend that you look up the Strong's definition of 'dispensation'.

 

[ewq1938]

Revelation 20:

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

I don't think the Resurrection of Christ is intended to be included...

True because those of the first resurrection are priests that serve Christ. He can hardly be a priest to himself.

People always confuse Christ as the first resurrection with Revelation 20's first resurrection which is the first of two groups of the dead that resurrect. The first group is called "the first resurrection" and "the rest of the dead" are the second resurrection.

 

[Absolutely]

lol
Both sides of the debate indicating devine illumination.

Too funny.

Psssssst.....we dont know or trust what you think is leading you.

Grab a bible.

See if it fits.

Most of you omit rapture verses, then claim the lord is "leading" you.

Face palm

 

[Absolutely]

Yeah, I never intended this to become an argument. I was just stating what was true.

Uh

Nobody believes a rapture thread is going anywhere but into a passionate debate.

You are kidding i hope

 

[iTheophilus]

lol
Both sides of the debate indicating devine illumination.

Too funny.

Psssssst.....we dont know or trust what you think is leading you.

Grab a bible.

See if it fits.

Most of you omit rapture verses, then claim the lord is "leading" you.

Face palm

Uhhh… could you post a rapture verse and give me a chance to tackle it?

 

[DavidTree]

lol
Both sides of the debate indicating devine illumination.

Too funny.

Psssssst.....we dont know or trust what you think is leading you.

Grab a bible.

See if it fits.

Most of you omit rapture verses, then claim the lord is "leading" you.

Face palm

CORRECT - alot of Blah Blah Blah with no Scripture that underscores a pre-trib rapture

Here is my Oath to God before the LORD Jesus Christ:
If you can bring it forth from Scripture, out of the Mouth of God that Christ will pre-trib rapture His Elect before the Resurrection or before His Second Coming THEN i will joyfully repent and embrace His Word - should you or anyone find IT - AMEN

i call upon the HOLY SPIRIT of GOD and the Lord Jesus Christ and His Holy Angels this day as a Witness.

Do you have this kind of Faith and Trust in Christ???

Should this occur - will you embrace your Brother and forgive and Love him as Christ does for us even now???

Who is wise and understanding among you? Let him show it by his good conduct, by deeds done in the humility that comes from wisdom. But if you harbor bitter jealousy and selfish ambition in your hearts, do not boast in it or deny the truth. Such wisdom does not come from above, but is earthly, unspiritual, demonic. For where jealousy and selfish ambition exist, there will be disorder and every evil practice.

But the wisdom from above is first of all pure, then peace-loving, gentle, accommodating, full of mercy and good fruit, impartial, and sincere. Peacemakers who sow in peace reap the fruit of righteousness. James ch3

 

[DavidTree]

Yeah, I never intended this to become an argument. I was just stating what was true.

Please take note of Post #3,868

 

[lamad]

CORRECT - alot of Blah Blah Blah with no Scripture that underscores a pre-trib rapture

Here is my Oath to God before the LORD Jesus Christ:
If you can bring it forth from Scripture, out of the Mouth of God that Christ will pre-trib rapture His Elect before the Resurrection or before His Second Coming THEN i will joyfully repent and embrace His Word - should you or anyone find IT - AMEN

i call upon the HOLY SPIRIT of GOD and the Lord Jesus Christ and His Holy Angels this day as a Witness.

Do you have this kind of Faith and Trust in Christ???

Should this occur - will you embrace your Brother and forgive and Love him as Christ does for us even now???

Who is wise and understanding among you? Let him show it by his good conduct, by deeds done in the humility that comes from wisdom. But if you harbor bitter jealousy and selfish ambition in your hearts, do not boast in it or deny the truth. Such wisdom does not come from above, but is earthly, unspiritual, demonic. For where jealousy and selfish ambition exist, there will be disorder and every evil practice.

But the wisdom from above is first of all pure, then peace-loving, gentle, accommodating, full of mercy and good fruit, impartial, and sincere. Peacemakers who sow in peace reap the fruit of righteousness. James ch3

Any of us could say the same thing only of pretrib:
"If you can bring it forth from Scripture, out of the Mouth of God, that shows clearly and plainly that Paul's rapture will be posttrib, then our disagreements will be over: the entire church will become posttrib believers. "

Let's see: how long has this argument been ongoing: a hundred years? Two hundred years? Apparently NO ONE YET has produced a clear verse that teaches either a pre or post trib rapture. Many people imagine they have accomplished this, but few agree with them. Why is this? It is simple: God chose NOT TO INCLUDE a clear verse that shows when Paul's rapture will take place. The closest any verse shows us is Paul himself showing us that his rapture/gathering will be just before wrath. But then, there are some that will disagree with that basic statement. Others, knowing it is true, then MOVE the start of Wrath from before the trib to after the trib IN THEIR OWN THINKING. And they they accuse those that disagree with them of twisting the scriptures.

Maybe Paul ended this disagreement for us here: 1 Corinthians 14:38

One day soon the pretrib rapture will take place, and those caught up will then know as they are known. There will be no more disagreements! What a day that will be!

 

[DavidTree]

Any of us could say the same thing only of pretrib:
"If you can bring it forth from Scripture, out of the Mouth of God, that shows clearly and plainly that Paul's rapture will be posttrib, then our disagreements will be over: the entire church will become posttrib believers. "

Let's see: how long has this argument been ongoing: a hundred years? Two hundred years? Apparently NO ONE YET has produced a clear verse that teaches either a pre or post trib rapture. Many people imagine they have accomplished this, but few agree with them. Why is this? It is simple: God chose NOT TO INCLUDE a clear verse that shows when Paul's rapture will take place. The closest any verse shows us is Paul himself showing us that his rapture/gathering will be just before wrath. But then, there are some that will disagree with that basic statement. Others, knowing it is true, then MOVE the start of Wrath from before the trib to after the trib IN THEIR OWN THINKING. And they they accuse those that disagree with them of twisting the scriptures.

Maybe Paul ended this disagreement for us here: 1 Corinthians 14:38

One day soon the pretrib rapture will take place, and those caught up will then know as they are known. There will be no more disagreements! What a day that will be!

Your argument is founded upon the same argument the Jews brought against the Lord and still do to this day.

Matthew ch24 is CLEAR - NO Symbolism involved and is the SAME message from the Apostles and Prophets.

 

[DavidTree]

Any of us could say the same thing only of pretrib:
"If you can bring it forth from Scripture, out of the Mouth of God, that shows clearly and plainly that Paul's rapture will be posttrib, then our disagreements will be over: the entire church will become posttrib believers. "

Let's see: how long has this argument been ongoing: a hundred years? Two hundred years? Apparently NO ONE YET has produced a clear verse that teaches either a pre or post trib rapture. Many people imagine they have accomplished this, but few agree with them. Why is this? It is simple: God chose NOT TO INCLUDE a clear verse that shows when Paul's rapture will take place. The closest any verse shows us is Paul himself showing us that his rapture/gathering will be just before wrath. But then, there are some that will disagree with that basic statement. Others, knowing it is true, then MOVE the start of Wrath from before the trib to after the trib IN THEIR OWN THINKING. And they they accuse those that disagree with them of twisting the scriptures.

Maybe Paul ended this disagreement for us here: 1 Corinthians 14:38

One day soon the pretrib rapture will take place, and those caught up will then know as they are known. There will be no more disagreements! What a day that will be!

Did the word of God originate with you? Or are you the only ones it has reached? If anyone considers himself a prophet or spiritual person, let him acknowledge that what I am writing you is the Lord’s command. But if anyone ignores this, he himself will be ignored.

AMEN = 1 Thessalonians & 2 Thessalonians & Matthew ch24 & 1 John 2:18-19 & 1 Timothy 4:1 & Revelation chs 6, 7, 11, 12, 13, 19/20.

Though religious men may choose to ignore me, the LORD never will, for He knows me, my heart and the Truth He placed there.

FYI - the Apostle Paul was loved at First but then hated and ignored once religious men crept into the church.

So much so, that Paul retreated to his own place and only permitted a few to see him.

 

[Absolutely]

Uhhh… could you post a rapture verse and give me a chance to tackle it?

1 thes 4.
" the dead in Christ rise first then the living are caught up to meet them"
Rapture verse

 

[Absolutely]

Matthew 3:12
Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

Remember when postribbers thought the one gathered/left were taken to hell???
They claimed as their basis some notion " remember the wicked are ALWAYS gathered FIRST.

But then came the bible;

Luke 3:17
Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and will gather the wheat into his garner; but the chaff he will burn with fire unquenchable.

The word of God

 

[DavidTree]

1 thes 4.
" the dead in Christ rise first then the living are caught up to meet them"
Rapture verse

100% TRUTH - CHRIST, at His Coming, at the last Trump Raises the Dead in Him - RESURRECTION FIRST.

AFTER That - those who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with those in the clouds with Christ.

Brothers, we do not want you to be uninformed about those who sleep in death, so that you will not grieve like the rest, who are without hope. For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again,
we also believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep/died in Him.

By the word of the Lord, we declare to you that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord
will by no means precede those who have fallen asleep/died.
For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise.

After that, we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.
And so we will always be with the Lord.
1 Thessalonians 4:13-18

 

[lamad]

My posts are 95-99% Scripture - i say very little and never duck any questions.

Our Great Hope in CHRIST when HE said: "IAM the Resurrection"

Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does corruption inherit incorruption. 51Behold, I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed— 52in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54So when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: “Death is swallowed up in victory.”

55“O Death, where is your sting?
O Hades, where is your victory?”

56The sting of death is sin, and the strength of sin is the law. 57But thanks be to God, who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

58Therefore, my beloved brethren, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your labor is not in vain in the Lord.

Our big disagreement is not with the words in this passage but answered the question WHEN. WHEN will Jesus come for His church? (This passage is pointed to Gentile believers.)

 

[lamad]

Did the word of God originate with you? Or are you the only ones it has reached? If anyone considers himself a prophet or spiritual person, let him acknowledge that what I am writing you is the Lord’s command. But if anyone ignores this, he himself will be ignored.

AMEN = 1 Thessalonians & 2 Thessalonians & Matthew ch24 & 1 John 2:18-19 & 1 Timothy 4:1 & Revelation chs 6, 7, 11, 12, 13, 19/20.

Though religious men may choose to ignore me, the LORD never will, for He knows me, my heart and the Truth He placed there.

FYI - the Apostle Paul was loved at First but then hated and ignored once religious men crept into the church.

So much so, that Paul retreated to his own place and only permitted a few to see him.

You can lump all those verses together AS IF they all happen at the same time, but all you are really doing is showing your ignorance of scripture.

Question: are the signs in the Sun and Moon in Matthew 24 are the same very signs of the sun and moon John wrote at the 6th seal?

 

[lamad]

Uhhh… could you post a rapture verse and give me a chance to tackle it?

1 Thes. 4&5: Paul's classic rapture passage: study it and then tell us WHEN in relation to other end time events: such as the Day of the Lord, the start of God's wrath, the start of the 70th week, ETC.

 

[lamad]

True because those of the first resurrection are priests that serve Christ. He can hardly be a priest to himself.

People always confuse Christ as the first resurrection with Revelation 20's first resurrection which is the first of two groups of the dead that resurrect. The first group is called "the first resurrection" and "the rest of the dead" are the second resurrection.

This is not rocket science: there are always and forever only TWO resurrections: one for the righteous and one for the damned.
ALL the righteous (Jesus included) will take part in the CHIEF of all resurrections - the one john called "the first" in most English translations.

Next, ALL the unrighteous will take part in the last resurrection John told us of.

 

[lamad]

I highly recommend that you look up the Strong's definition of 'dispensation'.

It is another word for stewardship and in the case of earth, GOD'S stewardship over earth - which has changed over time.

For example:
Luke 16:16
The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.

One method of stewardship ENDED: the LAW—and another dispensation or method of stewardship begain: the dispensation of Emmanuel: GOD living with man. It only lasted around 32 years.