If the Earth were flat---

[TheLearner]

LOL, your so smart, who could understand anything you say?

I am a retired Teacher who knows how to break things down for Students. I taught Kindergarten thru University -- Madonna University, Both Michigans, Wayne State, Community Colleges, and Ohio State.

 

[TheLearner]

I have faith that six born again Christians, at least one of whom went on to be an evangelist, would not lie about what they saw. Ive been over most of the earth, by sea and/or by air. I was even paid to do it. The earth is a globe. I don't why you can't accept this. It is so obvious that a child could understand it. It does not require faith. Believing something obviously not true is not faith, it is cuckoo.

When I was in the USAF, I flew around the earth many times in all directions. The earth is egg shaped.

 

[TheLearner]

God's word is never irrelevant unless you make it so.

Anti-Intellectualism is a Sin.

Matthew 22:37
Jesus answered, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, and all your mind.’

“And all who heard him were amazed at His understanding and his answers” (Luke 2:47).

"
4. Anti-Intellectualism is not virtuous.

“God is no fonder of intellectual slackers than of any other slackers.”
—C. S. Lewis

“Intellectual slothfulness is but a quack remedy for unbelief. . . .”
—J. Gresham Machen

“At root, evangelical anti-intellectualism is both a scandal and a sin. It is a scandal in the sense of being an offense and a stumbling block that needlessly hinders serious people from considering the Christian faith and coming to Christ. It is a sin because it is a refusal, contrary to Jesus’ two great commandments, to love the Lord our God with our minds. Anti-intellectualism is quite simply a sin. Evangelicals must address it as such, beyond all excuses, evasions, or rationalizations of false piety.”
—Os Guinness

"https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/justin-taylor/5-theses-on-anti-intellectualism/
An anti-intellectual church that says, “I have no need of you” (1 Corinthians 12:21).
Matthew 12:3, 5; 19:4; 22:31
https://www.relevantmagazine.com/faith/christianity-anti-intellectual/
https://crossexamined.org/8-ways-that-anti-intellectualism-is-harming-the-church/

Some books to consider reading:

J. P. Moreland, Love Your God with All Your Mind: The Role of Reason in the Life of the Soul
John Piper, Think: The Life of the Mind and the Love of God
James W. Sire, Habits of the Mind: Intellectual Life as a Christian Calling
Mark Noll, Jesus Christ and the Life of the Mind
Gene Edward Veith Jr., Loving God with All Your Mind: Thinking as a Christian in the Postmodern World
John Stott, Your Mind Matters: The Place of the Mind in the Christian Life
Harry Blamires, The Christian Mind: How Should a Christian Think?

Four Reasons to Reject Anti-Intellectualism
"
2. The intellect and the “heart” aren’t really alternatives to each other.
There’s a kernel of truth in the old “head belief vs. heart belief” contrast. It’s possible to acknowledge that a conclusion makes sense but not actually embrace it as truth. It’s possible to acknowledge that an idea is true, yet attach no personal importance to it. It’s easy to accept something as true but fail to accept how that truth relates to who we are and how we live, then accept those implications, and act.

But none of these problems are actually failures of elevating intellect over “heart.” They really aren’t “head vs. heart” problems. They can’t be, because Scripture shows us that our emotions, affections, and values (“heart”) are so intertwined with our reasoning, analysis, and gaining of knowledge (“head”) that a good bit of the time we can’t really tell where one ends and the other begins.

The most common word for “heart” in the Old Testament is the Hebrew lev. In Proverbs, the lev feels the whole range of emotions (15:13, 15; 13:12; 14:10) and makes choices (3:1, 5; 5:12). But it also understands (2:2), devises plans (6:18; 16:9), studies (15:28), teaches (16:23), and ponders (23:7). So when Proverbs 4:23 warns us to diligently keep our hearts (lev), it’s calling us to guard (natsar) our entire inner man—including both the intellectual and the nonintellectual.

The most common word for “heart” in the NT (kardia) shows a similar pattern. Along with its connection to a range of emotions and attitudes, the kardia thinks (Matt. 9:4) understands (Matt. 13:15) questions (Mark 2:8, Luke 3:15), ponders (Luke 2:19)—even reasons (dialogismos, Luke 9:47).

Since the Bible reveals that our intellectual and non-intellectual capacities are complementary, trying to pit them against each other to produce a winner is foolish.

3. The Bible doesn’t teach that the heart is trustworthy."
https://sharperiron.org/article/bible-anti-intellectual

https://www.gotquestions.org/Christian-intellect.html

 

[TheLearner]

I've been all around the world.
I've seen the sun appear in the sky from 35,000 feet in the sky and it did not come over a curve, it just appeared, gradually.

While setting on a Ocean Beach in Florida, I can see the curve.

Please note that the right side is higher than the left. The view from 10,000 feet one can clearly see a gradual curve. This is what I saw in the many flights ...

 

[Gideon300]

When I was in the USAF, I flew around the earth many times in all directions. The earth is egg shaped.

It is not flat! If you want to be pedantic, the surface is quite uneven and more like a potato shape.

 

[Gideon300]

I've been all around the world.
I've seen the sun appear in the sky from 35,000 feet in the sky and it did not come over a curve, it just appeared, gradually.

Well some Christians have seen it from the moon. That's about 380,000 km away. I've been in an airliner at 35,000 ft too. It's not quite the same as looking from the moon.

 

[Lynx]

It is not flat! If you want to be pedantic, the surface is quite uneven and more like a potato shape.

Well actually...

 

[Lighthearted]

 

[RealScience]

The following describes an experiment, which demonstrates that between Summer and Winter, there is no movement of the Earth. It relies on the visibility of certain stars between Summer and Winter, which should be impossible, if the Earth was angled as heliocentricity requires (facing totally opposite directions).

"Take two carefully-bored metallic tubes, not less than six feet in length, and place them one yard asunder, on the opposite sides of a wooden frame, or a solid block of wood or stone: so adjust them that their centres or axes of vision shall be perfectly parallel to each other. Now, direct them to the plane of some notable fixed star, a few seconds previous to its meridian time. Let an observer be stationed at each tube and the moment the star appears in the first tube let a loud knock or other signal be given, to be repeated by the observer at the second tube when he first sees the same star. A distinct period of time will elapse between the signals given. The signals will follow each other in very rapid succession, but still, the time between is sufficient to show that the same star is not visible at the same moment by two parallel lines of sight when only one yard asunder. A slight inclination of the second tube towards the first tube would be required for the star to be seen through both tubes at the same instant. Let the tubes remain in their position for six months; at the end of which time the same observation or experiment will produce the same results--the star will be visible at the same meridian time, without the slightest alteration being required in the direction of the tubes: from which it is concluded that if the earth had moved one single yard in an orbit through space, there would at least be observed the slight inclination of the tube which the difference in position of one yard had previously required. But as no such difference in the direction of the tube is required, the conclusion is unavoidable, that in six months a given meridian upon the earth's surface does not move a single yard, and therefore, that the earth has not the slightest degree of orbital motion." -Samuel Rowbotham, "Zetetic Astronomy"

So, have you actually done this "experiment"?
It is mere words until there is empirical data.
Actually the opposite is the truth, as observed by any telescope setup 6 months apart to observe the stars.
We live on a farm in Western NSW, Australia, and the visible constellations are different in June and December. That is because the Earth moves, and you see different parts of the Milky Way Galaxy from different places in the Earth's orbit around the sun.
Let's not appeal to unskilled "scientists" who died in 1884. Rowbotham tried to measure the curvature of the Earth by measuring long drainage ditches in Bedford. He "did not observe" any curvature of the Earth, so concluded it was flat.
Doubtless, his measurement techniques in the mid 1800's were not adequate for the task. His conclusion was false, based on inadequate measuring technique and faulty assumptions.
"I can't see the curvature, so the Earth MUST be flat" is simply irrational.

 

[GaryA]

The first video illustrated how that it is impossible on a ball earth for the 2017 eclipse across-the-USA moon shadow to go from west to east.

With regard to the 'I'd love to see it' statement at the end of the video --- count me in...

 

[Gideon300]

Well actually...


View attachment 233591

It's flat where I'm standing. But apart from that, it is roughly spherical.

 

[Gideon300]

So, have you actually done this "experiment"?
It is mere words until there is empirical data.
Actually the opposite is the truth, as observed by any telescope setup 6 months apart to observe the stars.
We live on a farm in Western NSW, Australia, and the visible constellations are different in June and December. That is because the Earth moves, and you see different parts of the Milky Way Galaxy from different places in the Earth's orbit around the sun.
Let's not appeal to unskilled "scientists" who died in 1884. Rowbotham tried to measure the curvature of the Earth by measuring long drainage ditches in Bedford. He "did not observe" any curvature of the Earth, so concluded it was flat.
Doubtless, his measurement techniques in the mid 1800's were not adequate for the task. His conclusion was false, based on inadequate measuring technique and faulty assumptions.
"I can't see the curvature, so the Earth MUST be flat" is simply irrational.

The ancient Greeks were better at this. They believed that the earth was curved in the 5th century BC. Mariners have always known that the earth is curved. I can tell from a place I visit from time to time. I can see the city of Melbourne, which is next to the bay, from where I live. When I travel about 40 km away, I can see only the upper half of the buildings. Mariners have a similar effect as a vessel comes over the horizon.

"The earliest documented mention of the concept dates from around the 5th century BC, when it appears in the writings of Greek philosophers. In the 3rd century BC, Hellenistic astronomy established the roughly spherical shape of the Earth as a physical fact and calculated the Earth's circumference."

The shadow of the earth as it moves across the moon is round. How do flat earthers explain that?

 

[RolloTamasi]

The ancient Greeks were better at this. They believed that the earth was curved in the 5th century BC. Mariners have always known that the earth is curved. I can tell from a place I visit from time to time. I can see the city of Melbourne, which is next to the bay, from where I live. When I travel about 40 km away, I can see only the upper half of the buildings. Mariners have a similar effect as a vessel comes over the horizon.

"The earliest documented mention of the concept dates from around the 5th century BC, when it appears in the writings of Greek philosophers. In the 3rd century BC, Hellenistic astronomy established the roughly spherical shape of the Earth as a physical fact and calculated the Earth's circumference."

The shadow of the earth as it moves across the moon is round. How do flat earthers explain that?

So,...what your saying is....God is wrong???!!!

 

[Lynx]

PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT: Arguments in internet forum threads usually don't change anything... except raising blood pressure levels all around. It's probably safe to not stress too much about winning an argument here or anywhere else in the forum.

Also... well... you just never know how normal the person you're arguing with is.





Just saying. It might not matter so much that somebody on an internet forum disagrees with you. In fact if you knew some people in person you might be GLAD you see things a different way than they see them.

 

[TheLearner]

The ancient Greeks were better at this. They believed that the earth was curved in the 5th century BC. Mariners have always known that the earth is curved. I can tell from a place I visit from time to time. I can see the city of Melbourne, which is next to the bay, from where I live. When I travel about 40 km away, I can see only the upper half of the buildings. Mariners have a similar effect as a vessel comes over the horizon.

"The earliest documented mention of the concept dates from around the 5th century BC, when it appears in the writings of Greek philosophers. In the 3rd century BC, Hellenistic astronomy established the roughly spherical shape of the Earth as a physical fact and calculated the Earth's circumference."

The shadow of the earth as it moves across the moon is round. How do flat earthers explain that?

 

[TheLearner]

So,...what your saying is....God is wrong???!!!

The Human authors of the Bible were using language of appearance. It is stupid for you to say he is blaming God.

 

[TheLearner]

PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT: Arguments in internet forum threads usually don't change anything... except raising blood pressure levels all around. It's probably safe to not stress too much about winning an argument here or anywhere else in the forum.

Also... well... you just never know how normal the person you're arguing with is.


View attachment 233625


Just saying. It might not matter so much that somebody on an internet forum disagrees with you. In fact if you knew some people in person you might be GLAD you see things a different way than they see them.

I only seek to have friendly discussion and learn how others think friend.

 

[TheLearner]

View attachment 233614

What movie is this from?

 

[GaryA]

The shadow of the earth as it moves across the moon is round. How do flat earthers explain that?

In the FE model, there is no earth shadow. Any shadow on the moon would have to be caused by something else.

 

[Gideon300]

In the FE model, there is no earth shadow. Any shadow on the moon would have to be caused by something else.

Such as? If the sun is shining on the earth, how can it not cast a shadow? The earth is not transparent. Why is it so hard to believe that the earth is a sphere? Everything points to it being spherical and nothing proves that it is flat. Even the Greeks in 500 BC worked that out.