More pieces fall into place
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I believe that while prophets can be used to give a prophecy they are mainly used to inspire encourage and build his church, they are the ones who always point other to Christ who deepen their walk in him who bring them closer to his heart. They are voice of God when you hear that song come on just at the right time they are the people whose wrtings can still a raging soul into a calm sea they are the one that are given inspiration to post a scripture and not have any idea why they were lead to do so
Of course the role of a prophet goes deeper than that they are often times inspired to say something and at the time they say it it feels solid and true but then later they wonder why they said it only to find out it either happened or it deeply impacted a person. I have found that many prophets have a keen sense of his voice they can hear his voice in anything and everything and he speaks to them through most everything even something that seemingly has nothing to do with him.
They also seem to be sensitive people as well easily emotional and able to bear the burden of another persons trials they carry it with them. I think that people with such hearts make the best kind of prophet because they are easily influenced by God easily inspired easily tuned into his voice but this also means they are easily affected by the enemy as well.
I have seen many so called prophets on youtube it doesn't take much these days to convince a lot of people your a prophet and the views you get on your channel are a whole lot but there are many false prophets and if they were wise they would understand that they more so than anyone will be held accountable for what they claim to speak in his name and the price is very heavy.
Of course the role of a prophet goes deeper than that they are often times inspired to say something and at the time they say it it feels solid and true but then later they wonder why they said it only to find out it either happened or it deeply impacted a person. I have found that many prophets have a keen sense of his voice they can hear his voice in anything and everything and he speaks to them through most everything even something that seemingly has nothing to do with him.
They also seem to be sensitive people as well easily emotional and able to bear the burden of another persons trials they carry it with them. I think that people with such hearts make the best kind of prophet because they are easily influenced by God easily inspired easily tuned into his voice but this also means they are easily affected by the enemy as well.
I have seen many so called prophets on youtube it doesn't take much these days to convince a lot of people your a prophet and the views you get on your channel are a whole lot but there are many false prophets and if they were wise they would understand that they more so than anyone will be held accountable for what they claim to speak in his name and the price is very heavy.
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Many may not know the name Wayne Grudem or his book The Gift of Prophecy in the New Testament and Today; or maybe you do. Apparently it's a popular book in charismatic circles.
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Grudem's main argument is that New Testament prophets differ from Old Testament prophets in the sense that New Testament prophets aren't always right.
He says God gives true prophecies to the prophet, but since the prophet is a fallible human the message may get lost in transmission. He even gives an example of why Agabus was wrong when he prophesied Paul would be bound and handed over to the Romans in Acts 21. It's a ridiculous idea that can easily be disproven.
But the story doesn't end there. Recently a Prophetic Standards Statement was issued and signed by a group that's made up nearly entirely of people from the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR). I'll post a few of the more ridiculous notions and comment on them; but you really have to read the whole thing for yourself to get a sense of how ominous it really is.
"WE RECOGNIZE that prophets do not serve as spiritual fortune tellers or prognosticators, nor is their role to satisfy our curiosity about the future or reveal abstract information." This statement is directly contradicted by other statements that come later. For example: "WE UNDERSTAND that prophecies can be conditional and that many prophecies will take time to come to pass"; and "On the other hand, if a prophetic word is delivered containing specific details and dates in which the stated prophetic word will come to pass and that prophecy contains no conditions to be met in order to be fulfilled, and that word does not come to pass as prophesied, then the one who delivered the word must be willing to take full responsibility, demonstrating genuine contrition before God and people." Sure sounds like prognosticating to me. It continues: "Any statement of apology and/or explanation/clarification should be delivered to the audience to whom the erroneous word was given. For example, if it was given to an individual, the apology (and/or explanation/clarification) should be delivered to the individual. If the word was delivered publicly, then a public apology (and/or explanation/clarification) should be presented." Notice what it says: the prophet doesn't have to be right, only willing to show genuine contrition. This idea comes directly from Grudem's book.
And there's more, unfortunately:
"Finally, while we believe in holding prophets accountable for their words, in accordance with the Scriptures, we do not believe that a sincere prophet who delivers an inaccurate message is therefore a false prophet." Prophecy falsely? No worries, as long as you're sincere.
"WE REJECT the notion that a contemporary prophetic word is on the same level of inspiration or authority as Scripture or that God always speaks inerrantly through prophets today, since the Bible says we only know in part and prophesy in part (1 Cor. 13:9). It is the written Word alone that can lay claim to being "the Word of God" (2 Tim. 3:16); prophecies, at best, are "a word from the Lord," to be tested by the Word of God." But again this is directly contradicted by their very first statement: "WE BELIEVE that the gifts of the Holy Spirit, including the gift of prophecy and the ministry of the prophet, are essential for the edification of the Body of Christ and the work of the ministry, which is why Scripture exhorts us to earnestly desire spiritual gifts, especially that we may prophesy." So apparently God's word isn't sufficient after all, since prophecy is also "essential." If everything must be tested against God word, what need do we have for prophecy?
"WE RECOGNIZE the unique challenges posed by the internet and social media, as anyone claiming to be a prophet can release a word to the general public without any accountability or even responsibility. While it is not possible to stop the flood of such words online, we urge all believers to check the lives and fruit of those they follow online and also see if they are part of a local church body and have true accountability for their public ministries and personal lives. We also urge prophetic ministers posting unfiltered and untested words purportedly from the Lord to first submit those words to peer leaders for evaluation." The internet poses a serious threat to these false prophets, and so we see their contempt for it.
Throughout the Statement, there's talk of prophets needing to fall under the authority of peer groups and other ministers to have their "prophecies" evaluated.
What this Statement amounts to simply is a power grab by the NAR to tighten its grip on the prophetic community, bringing it under their control; and to recruit new supporters.
A lot of people signed this. Many names are unfamiliar but they have ties to the NAR. You may recognize some of them. Notice Wayne Grudem among them.
View attachment 233260
Grudem's main argument is that New Testament prophets differ from Old Testament prophets in the sense that New Testament prophets aren't always right.
But the story doesn't end there. Recently a Prophetic Standards Statement was issued and signed by a group that's made up nearly entirely of people from the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR). I'll post a few of the more ridiculous notions and comment on them; but you really have to read the whole thing for yourself to get a sense of how ominous it really is.
"WE RECOGNIZE that prophets do not serve as spiritual fortune tellers or prognosticators, nor is their role to satisfy our curiosity about the future or reveal abstract information." This statement is directly contradicted by other statements that come later. For example: "WE UNDERSTAND that prophecies can be conditional and that many prophecies will take time to come to pass"; and "On the other hand, if a prophetic word is delivered containing specific details and dates in which the stated prophetic word will come to pass and that prophecy contains no conditions to be met in order to be fulfilled, and that word does not come to pass as prophesied, then the one who delivered the word must be willing to take full responsibility, demonstrating genuine contrition before God and people." Sure sounds like prognosticating to me. It continues: "Any statement of apology and/or explanation/clarification should be delivered to the audience to whom the erroneous word was given. For example, if it was given to an individual, the apology (and/or explanation/clarification) should be delivered to the individual. If the word was delivered publicly, then a public apology (and/or explanation/clarification) should be presented." Notice what it says: the prophet doesn't have to be right, only willing to show genuine contrition. This idea comes directly from Grudem's book.
And there's more, unfortunately:
"Finally, while we believe in holding prophets accountable for their words, in accordance with the Scriptures, we do not believe that a sincere prophet who delivers an inaccurate message is therefore a false prophet." Prophecy falsely? No worries, as long as you're sincere.
"WE REJECT the notion that a contemporary prophetic word is on the same level of inspiration or authority as Scripture or that God always speaks inerrantly through prophets today, since the Bible says we only know in part and prophesy in part (1 Cor. 13:9). It is the written Word alone that can lay claim to being "the Word of God" (2 Tim. 3:16); prophecies, at best, are "a word from the Lord," to be tested by the Word of God." But again this is directly contradicted by their very first statement: "WE BELIEVE that the gifts of the Holy Spirit, including the gift of prophecy and the ministry of the prophet, are essential for the edification of the Body of Christ and the work of the ministry, which is why Scripture exhorts us to earnestly desire spiritual gifts, especially that we may prophesy." So apparently God's word isn't sufficient after all, since prophecy is also "essential." If everything must be tested against God word, what need do we have for prophecy?
"WE RECOGNIZE the unique challenges posed by the internet and social media, as anyone claiming to be a prophet can release a word to the general public without any accountability or even responsibility. While it is not possible to stop the flood of such words online, we urge all believers to check the lives and fruit of those they follow online and also see if they are part of a local church body and have true accountability for their public ministries and personal lives. We also urge prophetic ministers posting unfiltered and untested words purportedly from the Lord to first submit those words to peer leaders for evaluation." The internet poses a serious threat to these false prophets, and so we see their contempt for it.
Throughout the Statement, there's talk of prophets needing to fall under the authority of peer groups and other ministers to have their "prophecies" evaluated.
What this Statement amounts to simply is a power grab by the NAR to tighten its grip on the prophetic community, bringing it under their control; and to recruit new supporters.
A lot of people signed this. Many names are unfamiliar but they have ties to the NAR. You may recognize some of them. Notice Wayne Grudem among them.
My problem is that they are the blind leading the blind except if you tell an actual blind person they will be like duh but if you tell these people you are attacked by a swarm of followers.
To many do not know God's voice well enough and so they mistake his voice for something else and many for whatever reason want to be prophets yet fail to understand that by claiming to be one they are putting themselves in a very trying position because on one hand if they actually know his voice it will resonate with scripture even if not quoting scripture it will be of scripture and they will be used in great ways on the other hand for every one of his precious sheep they mislead they will be held accountable.
A prophet is a position that should not be taken lightly and some even do so knowing full well what they are doing others are ignorant but have good intentions and others still just want to be prophets and think it's something that if you practice enough then you can be one but its' not.
To many do not know God's voice well enough and so they mistake his voice for something else and many for whatever reason want to be prophets yet fail to understand that by claiming to be one they are putting themselves in a very trying position because on one hand if they actually know his voice it will resonate with scripture even if not quoting scripture it will be of scripture and they will be used in great ways on the other hand for every one of his precious sheep they mislead they will be held accountable.
A prophet is a position that should not be taken lightly and some even do so knowing full well what they are doing others are ignorant but have good intentions and others still just want to be prophets and think it's something that if you practice enough then you can be one but its' not.
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Having known a true prophet for 30 years or so, I think I can answer your question.
Prophets are not just those who foretell. They receive revelation from God which makes His word clear. For example, my friend and mentor received a revelation of how to forgive from the heart. I know of only one other person (Derek Prince) who received the same revelation. My friend received many revelations. The Lord often used examples that he could relate to. He was a pilot so a number of the examples related to flying.
He also had a gift of insight into the personal condition of people around him. He could read them like a book. That drew a lot of people who were fascinated by this gift. However, when it got too close to seriously wrong attitudes, they often left rather than deal with the problem. In our small fellowship, there was no place to hide. So some people pulled out, including one who was committing adultery. He was the least likely looking womaniser imaginable. But God knew. My friend confronted this man and that was the last we saw of him.
As an aside, everyone can receive revelation from God. Paul prayed that all believers would receive the Spirit of Wisdom and Revelation. Paul said that there are people called to be teachers of God's word. He also said that elders should be able to teach. So the gifts to the church (apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors and teachers) are for the edification of the church generally. The gifts of the Spirit are for the edification of the local church.
The prophet is usually very much alone. He may be a "people person" as my friend was, but telling people the truth does not endear the prophet to the hearer. His first pastor recognised this gift. He said that my friend would be one of the most despised people in Christendom. And that turned out to be true.
The prophet should pass on the knowledge gained to a teacher. The teacher will then pass on that knowledge to a much broader group. Perhaps the best example I know of is Watchman Nee. He was greatly helped (often by being corrected) by an English missionary living in China. Very few people know the Bible as Watchman Nee knew it. He would discuss his studies with Margaret Barber, who would correct him. Nee tried to get Margaret Barber to preach and teach, but that was not her calling. Watchman Nee is one of the most famous Christians of the 20th century. Margaret Barber? If not for mentions by Watchman Nee, no one would have heard of her.
John the Baptist was the last and greatest of the OT prophets. He had the ability to get under the skin of those who rejected God's ways. He knew that the Lord Jesus was the "Lamb of God". How? He received revelation from God. He knew that the Pharisees, who were generally respected by the average Jew, were in fact like snakes. How? God showed him. And he did the prophet thing and told them the truth about themselves. For his trouble, John was executed like a common criminal.
Prophets do not win popularity contests. My friend was an outgoing, friendly kind of guy who would light up a room when he came in (sanguine for those familiar with the temperaments). Yet he also provoked negative reactions from many and he learned to endure this. At least he kept his head until he passed away at the age of 74.
Prophets are not just those who foretell. They receive revelation from God which makes His word clear. For example, my friend and mentor received a revelation of how to forgive from the heart. I know of only one other person (Derek Prince) who received the same revelation. My friend received many revelations. The Lord often used examples that he could relate to. He was a pilot so a number of the examples related to flying.
He also had a gift of insight into the personal condition of people around him. He could read them like a book. That drew a lot of people who were fascinated by this gift. However, when it got too close to seriously wrong attitudes, they often left rather than deal with the problem. In our small fellowship, there was no place to hide. So some people pulled out, including one who was committing adultery. He was the least likely looking womaniser imaginable. But God knew. My friend confronted this man and that was the last we saw of him.
As an aside, everyone can receive revelation from God. Paul prayed that all believers would receive the Spirit of Wisdom and Revelation. Paul said that there are people called to be teachers of God's word. He also said that elders should be able to teach. So the gifts to the church (apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors and teachers) are for the edification of the church generally. The gifts of the Spirit are for the edification of the local church.
The prophet is usually very much alone. He may be a "people person" as my friend was, but telling people the truth does not endear the prophet to the hearer. His first pastor recognised this gift. He said that my friend would be one of the most despised people in Christendom. And that turned out to be true.
The prophet should pass on the knowledge gained to a teacher. The teacher will then pass on that knowledge to a much broader group. Perhaps the best example I know of is Watchman Nee. He was greatly helped (often by being corrected) by an English missionary living in China. Very few people know the Bible as Watchman Nee knew it. He would discuss his studies with Margaret Barber, who would correct him. Nee tried to get Margaret Barber to preach and teach, but that was not her calling. Watchman Nee is one of the most famous Christians of the 20th century. Margaret Barber? If not for mentions by Watchman Nee, no one would have heard of her.
John the Baptist was the last and greatest of the OT prophets. He had the ability to get under the skin of those who rejected God's ways. He knew that the Lord Jesus was the "Lamb of God". How? He received revelation from God. He knew that the Pharisees, who were generally respected by the average Jew, were in fact like snakes. How? God showed him. And he did the prophet thing and told them the truth about themselves. For his trouble, John was executed like a common criminal.
Prophets do not win popularity contests. My friend was an outgoing, friendly kind of guy who would light up a room when he came in (sanguine for those familiar with the temperaments). Yet he also provoked negative reactions from many and he learned to endure this. At least he kept his head until he passed away at the age of 74.
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RA, so you understand, he actually was answering your question. Agabus prophesied that Paul would be bound and taken captive when he went to Jerusalem. This information is not found in any of the Old Testament books, nor in the Gospels, nor stated explicitly in any of the epistles. It was prophetic utterance, and was needed because Paul needed to be fully prepared for his coming martyrdom. Thus, the Spirit of God was warning him with certainty that it was about to take place.
You don't think Christians today are facing situations where they will soon face imminent danger, spiritually or physically, and thus be in need of exhortation to prepare for it? No offense, but this seems like a nonsensical position to me, even an uncaring one. You would defend a doctrinal position at the expense of other people's spiritual and/or physical welfare.
You don't think Christians today are facing situations where they will soon face imminent danger, spiritually or physically, and thus be in need of exhortation to prepare for it? No offense, but this seems like a nonsensical position to me, even an uncaring one. You would defend a doctrinal position at the expense of other people's spiritual and/or physical welfare.
You’ll know by the anointing of the Holy Spirit and God will tell you, He’ll make sure you know and understand.
When Jesus anoints you, you’ll feel compelled by the Holy Spirit. If you don’t submit or yield to the Holy Spirit’s prompting it will make you sad. You’ll feel the Holy Spirit grieving inside of you.
However, if you do obey the prompting of the Holy Spirit you’ll overcome fear and experience the Holy Spirit flowing through you doing the works of God in which ever of the five fold ministry to the Body of Christ He has called you.
You’ll have great joy and great persecution. No worries! Great is your reward in Heaven.
God’s Love should always be evident and no fear of people, simply focused on Christ with no agenda of their own.
There will be evidence of God’s power when His Word is preached with His great Love, various forms of deliverance (demons cast out, addictions broken, etc), healings, miracles, etc. Lives changed in powerful ways that ONLY God could do.
Jesus Christ is The Anointed One and according to the Father’s Will, Jesus Christ anoints a Believer as an apostle, prophet, evangelist, pastor, or teacher and then the Holy Spirit which is the Anointing begins to operate in the Believer accordingly.
Remember Isaiah 61:1
The Spirit of the Lord God is upon me; because the Lord hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound;
Isaiah 61:1 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=Isaiah 61:1&version=KJV
It’s the Word with the Anointing that breaks all the yokes, edifies and gives life to the Body of Christ. Amen.
Hello, Gideon.
This is another reason why the gifts are still needed and always will be unto the Lord's return. There is way too much sin being practiced that is not being brought to light and corrected. In truth, much of the church isn't any more ready for correction than that adulterer was, so the end-times are going to be hard on those who harden their hearts and will not take strong correction from the Spirit of God Himself.
But what is better? To continue being mired in sin? I think not. Come Lord Jesus, and may He purify His bride, that she increasingly enter into that time when she is finally fully clothed in that white raiment which is the righteousness of the saints.
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Starting to grow concerned about this myself, quite frankly. There is also the problem of the enemy going after people who walk with you, and if those walking with you are not strong enough to endure what will come (most are not) the enemy turns them against you, or at the very least causes them to distance themselves from you, which can be painful.
Thanks for sharing. It's encouraging to know I am not the only one.
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I am sorry you had to go through this, his post is eerly similar to me I am a people person but often times am alone and have lost many people who I considered close friends because they thought I was calling myself a prophet when I told them some of the things I have seen and heard. Now I don't like to call myself a prophet as I don't consider myself worthy to be one but I do walk in the prophetic and that can be a very hard and lonely road
plus in my opinion if you really are a prophet you won't need to say you are people will just recognize it in you
plus in my opinion if you really are a prophet you won't need to say you are people will just recognize it in you
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We may end up disagreeing on a few things here and there because I'm brand new here and have no idea what everyone teaches, but that post just earned you a follow. I don't identify as a prophet either, but I have had prophecies fulfilled many times now, several of which have saved forums elsewhere from impending spiritual attacks. But even those I have helped protect have sometimes not known exactly what to make of me; it's like I bring the storm with me, and they wonder if I'm not part of the problem. And I'm an emotional man, so it's not pleasant when those I try to help mistrust me. But I stand my ground in what I am, and refuse to back down from my calling, and as a result people tend to come back around, even if they are highly suspicious of me for a time.
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S
I would ask why do we have to be careful or on guard against false prophets?
there would be no false ones if there were no real ones. there would be no need.
but that's too obvious
however, all you actual prophets, should give great care not to say 'thus saith the Lord' because that is often a giveaway as to the actual credibility of your words
there would be no false ones if there were no real ones. there would be no need.
but that's too obvious
however, all you actual prophets, should give great care not to say 'thus saith the Lord' because that is often a giveaway as to the actual credibility of your words
S
Grudem's main argument is that New Testament prophets differ from Old Testament prophets in the sense that New Testament prophets aren't always right.
He says God gives true prophecies to the prophet, but since the prophet is a fallible human the message may get lost in transmission. He even gives an example of why Agabus was wrong when he prophesied Paul would be bound and handed over to the Romans in Acts 21. It's a ridiculous idea that can easily be disproven.
perhaps they should shut down some of those prophet schools and just let God choose whom He will
but then that puts the cessationists in a lurch
whatever shall we do