Biblical Mary!

[Magenta]

She has not said that the word of God is not truth. She said show in the scripture where it is written Sola Scriptura. I believe Christ remains the foundation of the RCC. I think you need to be more enlightened on their doctrine and practices. When Moslems declare that Jesus is neither God nor the Son of God, their belief does not in any way make us Christians to disbelief what we know as truth. Same way, I do not think it matters to them how you misrepresent them. They know what they believe. It will follow that if you cannot show where Sola Scriptura is written in the bible, then, perhaps, you are also following a faulty foundation? Have you thought about that? I think we should all stop these bashings of the Roman Catholic Church.

You seem to contradict yourself.

Besides which, pointing out error is not bashing.

Pretending an outsider to the RCC can neither know nor understand what the RCC teaches
is also error and a misrepresentation. I have seen that idea try to fly around here also.

 

[infinitekhanol]

There is no other authority.

Paul taught only God's word, on the one occasion where he gives his opinion he makes it clear that he is giving his opinion.

The Holy Spirit is the Authority in all church matters, He will never contradict the word of God. Could He inspire new scriptures? yes, will He? no. There is no need.

What we need is to understand the scriptures we have better. The church has only scratched the surface.

What pope or what council of bishops or any other person or persons have ever spoken a word or produced a written work which even comes close in weight and authority and glory of the bible. The book of Mormon for eg is a book of mutterings and nonsense.

You are not getting it, it seems. She is saying that Paul passed on his teachings through two ways -- word of mouth and written scripture in accordance with the scripture. Your inferences from her post seem faulty in my opinion.

The Pope and the Council of Bishops have never had the intention to write new scripture or a body of work to replace it. Never seen or heard about such motive. I think they are only doing what the Council of Apostles did in Jerusalem in Acts 15 to bring better understanding of the word of God and unity in the Church.

 

[infinitekhanol]

Written bible is enough as constitution of the doctrine. Catholic try to make a reason to make lie doctrine for example purgatory, if one question where in the Bible is purgatory than catholic able to lie and say that is unwritten teaching.

The scripture tells us that it is wrong to malign others or to bear false witness.

 

[Evmur]

You are not getting it, it seems. She is saying that Paul passed on his teachings through two ways -- word of mouth and written scripture in accordance with the scripture. Your inferences from her post seem faulty in my opinion.

The Pope and the Council of Bishops have never had the intention to write new scripture or a body of work to replace it. Never seen or heard about such motive. I think they are only doing what the Council of Apostles did in Jerusalem in Acts 15 to bring better understanding of the word of God and unity in the Church.

Do you know then what Paul preached that we don't have in scripture? There is no comparison whatever between the apostles and elders who met in Jerusalem and the councils of bishops ... none at all.

 

[infinitekhanol]

Jesus said in Matthew 15:9 "They worship me in vain; their teachings are merely human rules.'"

Unfortunately, this scriptural verse cuts across all Christian denominations. Not peculiar to RCC.

 

[Magenta]

Unfortunately, this scriptural verse cuts across all Christian denominations. Not peculiar to RCC.

We are discussing Mariology and the errors of the RCC.

The RCC elevates Mary. Jesus never did.

 

[Evmur]

You are not getting it, it seems. She is saying that Paul passed on his teachings through two ways -- word of mouth and written scripture in accordance with the scripture. Your inferences from her post seem faulty in my opinion.

The Pope and the Council of Bishops have never had the intention to write new scripture or a body of work to replace it. Never seen or heard about such motive. I think they are only doing what the Council of Apostles did in Jerusalem in Acts 15 to bring better understanding of the word of God and unity in the Church.

Pope Francis says anyone who claims they have a personal relationship with Christ is a fanatic

... to be fair he is only saying what my dad said, it's what Catholics believe ... it shows how far off they are from the truth.

 

[Dino246]

I think we should all stop these bashings of the Roman Catholic Church.

I respect your right to hold such an opinion, but it is far more likely that the "bashings" will continue until they get their soteriology and ecclesiology fixed.

 

[peldom10]

Pope Francis says anyone who claims they have a personal relationship with Christ is a fanatic

... to be fair he is only saying what my dad said, it's what Catholics believe ... it shows how far off they are from the truth.

That point is the back bone...if u will...of the RCC's existence. This is validated by the rule that no catholic should have or study their bible. Only the priest should do that. Thus members are only taught .... what the RCC wants the member to know.

Sad.

 

[arthurfleminger]

The simple fact is that Paul, in his letters/Scripture said to hold fast to all that we have taught, orally and in writing. In fact, many haven't heeded Paul. Instead they've rejected all that he and the early church taught orally. One poster asked, where is the oral teaching of Paul today? For sure, it's not with you or your church, but it still exists, where is it taught? You've abandoned it in favor of the unbiblical doctrine of Sola Scriptura. Sola Scriptura is not taught in the bible. Simple as that. So go ahead and abandon Paul's scriptural teachings for Luther's false sola scriptura. PS Don't bet your soul on Luther.

 

[Jackson123]

I do not think that anybody has mentioned anywhere that she is God. No, she is not God and therefore not omnipresent.

Have you considered the way prayer works? Have you considered why St Paul was always asking his converts to pray for him and his fellow workers in the vineyard of God? Unity of purpose in prayer yields answers to petitions. He prays on his own, off course, but he understood the importance of unity in prayer or joint prayer. Was Paul present with each of the different churches at the same time they were all offering prayers on his behalf? or rather, were they present with Paul, all at the same time? Yes, spiritually, not that Paul or they are omnipresent.

When we truly pray ( not with wondering mind while we seem to be praying), we spiritually partake in heavenly things. right in the presence of God, his angels and saints. We unite in Spirit. Same thing that happens when we are continually walking in the light or in the Spirit. She does not need to be everywhere to hear us pray or join in our prayers. For, we have come unto Mount Zion, unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem and to the innumerable company of angels. To the general assembly and church of the Firstborn which are written in heaven and to God, the judge of all and the spirits of just men made perfect. And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant and to the blood of sprinkling that speaks better things than of Abel. Hebrew 12:22 -24. When we commune with God with the right frame of mind, irrespective of where we dwell, even if all are praying at the same time, we are in his presence with the heavenly hosts. The RCC pray to God through our Lord Jesus Christ. They ask her and the saints for intercessory prayers. They understand Jesus is the only way and their prayers are directed through him.

In John's vision about the heavenly throne, he saw the importance of the prayers of the saints before the throne of the Lamb. Their prayers were so precious that they were placed in golden bowls (Rev5:7-9). That is, the prayer of those who have died in the Lord, together with the saints who are living in the world are like incense before the throne of God.

In Rev 8:1- 4, we see another vision of St John. He saw the prayers of the saints being offered on a golden altar before the throne, He also saw that the prayers of the saints were presented to God by angels who stood before the throne. Before the Lamb and God the Father, were seen the prayers of those who believe in Jesus Christ (both the dead and living) as giving glory to God.

If we can ask our Pastors or fellow believers for prayers, why can't we ask her or any of the saints? After all, when she was on earth, she interceded for people at the wedding at Cana and her Son obliged her. Why do you think he will not oblige her again?

So you believe when you ask Mary pray for you she able to hear you?
How you prove it?

 

[Evmur]

So you believe when you ask Mary pray for you she able to hear you?
How you prove it?

... they pray it 10 times mind ... that ought to do it.

 

[Evmur]

The simple fact is that Paul, in his letters/Scripture said to hold fast to all that we have taught, orally and in writing. In fact, many haven't heeded Paul. Instead they've rejected all that he and the early church taught orally. One poster asked, where is the oral teaching of Paul today? For sure, it's not with you or your church, but it still exists, where is it taught? You've abandoned it in favor of the unbiblical doctrine of Sola Scriptura. Sola Scriptura is not taught in the bible. Simple as that. So go ahead and abandon Paul's scriptural teachings for Luther's false sola scriptura. PS Don't bet your soul on Luther.

Are you saved?

 

[arthurfleminger]

Luther was a liar of the worst sort. He tried to alter Scriptural writings to profess what he wanted, not to the Holy Spirit's word. Rather than adjust his theology, Luther adjusted the Bible. In his translation of Romans, Luther added the word alone to verse 3:28 (making it say “man is justified by faith alone apart from the deeds of the law”) in order to make it appear that he had biblical support.

Luther decided to lie and write his own Scripture, in opposition to the Holy Spirit's. Luther tried to reject the Book of James, Holy Scripture, to enforce his own view of scripture. Luther was a liar/fraud, not of scripture and not of God. Luther rejected scripture outright and Martin Luther originally wanted the book of James out of the bible, in its vocal verses about faith being accompanied with works. And he tried to change them to his own viewpoint.

 

[infinitekhanol]

There is none righteous, no not one. All have sinned. all fall short of God's righteous standards.

The fact that Mary called Jesus Lord demonstrates that Mary needed salvation.

God used Mary to bring Christ into the world as a human being and that is as far as it goes. She was not sinless, nor did she ascend and it was 'God's grace that she was full of, not her own.

Now, let's talk about that idolatrous Egyptian obelisk that is sitting out in from of what is supposed to be the true church in Rome.

But the scripture called Abraham righteous when it was shown that no one was righteous, not even a single person. Have you wondered why? If Abraham could be held righteous under such condition you mentioned, why would Mary, the mother of our Lord and savior not be held righteous too when God confirmed her to be full of God's grace?

When Solomon took over the throne of his father David, do you think his mother (the queen mother) called him by other name in public other than King? Mary calling him Lord shows her tremendous spirit of wisdom and humility.

For the other issues you raised, I think they have been adequately addressed in previous posts either by @authorfleminger or @infinitecontrol

 

[Jackson123]

They are saying it the way it is in the scripture. There is no ulterior motive.

It is wrong to malign or misrepresent others

Where in the Bible say Mary able to hear billion catholic request pray every day, catholic must give answer and it is easy to say it is unwritten teaching than the lie cover

 

[Evmur]

Luther was a liar of the worst sort. He tried to alter Scriptural writings to profess what he wanted, not to the Holy Spirit's word. Rather than adjust his theology, Luther adjusted the Bible. In his translation of Romans, Luther added the word alone to verse 3:28 (making it say “man is justified by faith alone apart from the deeds of the law”) in order to make it appear that he had biblical support.

Luther decided to lie and write his own Scripture, in opposition to the Holy Spirit's. Luther tried to reject the Book of James, Holy Scripture, to enforce his own view of scripture. Luther was a liar/fraud, not of scripture and not of God. Luther rejected scripture outright and Martin Luther originally wanted the book of James out of the bible, in its vocal verses about faith being accompanied with works. And he tried to change them to his own viewpoint.

People do not get saved because they read Martin Luther, they are saved when they come to Jesus and their sins are washed away.

 

[Evmur]

But the scripture called Abraham righteous when it was shown that no one was righteous, not even a single person. Have you wondered why? If Abraham could be held righteous under such condition you mentioned, why would Mary, the mother of our Lord and savior not be held righteous too when God confirmed her to be full of God's grace?

When Solomon took over the throne of his father David, do you think his mother (the queen mother) called him by other name in public other than King? Mary calling him Lord shows her tremendous spirit of wisdom and humility.

For the other issues you raised, I think they have been adequately addressed in previous posts either by @authorfleminger or @infinitecontrol

We believe Mary was righteous, but she was made righteous by offering the sin sacrifice prescribed by the law. She was poor so she could not afford a lamb so she offered up a pair of turtle doves.

 

[infinitekhanol]

You're doing the same thing arthurfleminger did. You're claiming scriptural authority to say that scripture isn't authoritative.

Okay, let's test the spirit. When you say two sources I assume you mean written and oral. I'll ask you the same thing I asked arthurfleminger: Why would Paul or John pass on something that contradicted their own written letters?

You are now saying what I did not say. I never said that the scripture is not authoritative neither did @ResidentAlien say so. We are saying that scripture is not the only source of God's word. Period. Are you a lawyer? Because lawyers like putting words into people's mouth without them not even having imagined such words.

No one has ever said that the sources contradict themselves. We are saying, as the scripture says, that there are many things Jesus and the Apostles did and said which were not written in the bible. Simple.

 

[infinitekhanol]

People do not get saved because they read Martin Luther, they are saved when they come to Jesus and their sins are washed away.

I think we are getting somewhere now. The RCC know where their salvation lies--in Jesus Christ alone. It is said, what is good for the goose is equally good for the gander. You can now see how non RCC denominations can be said to have faulty foundations too.

We should stop the bashings. if there is need to correct, we should do that with humility.