Did mind–body dualism exist before original sin?

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OneFaith said:
We are not like God- we had a beginning. Other than Adam and Eve, I believe it is when He “knit us together in our mother’s womb.” Sperm doesn’t have a soul, an egg doesn’t have a soul, but God made those two become one person. And mankind can never separate the dna of a father from the dna of a mother once a child (soul) is conceived.

Sin is not physical. It is a decision. Satan fell from heaven because he sinned, there is no physicality in heaven. This is why Jesus said if you hate your brother you are a murderer- whether you physically carry it out or not. He said the same for an adulterer. The bible says sin is knowing the good you ought to do but choosing not to do it.
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What do you think being made in God's image means? We have an eternal soul because of it. We are able to think somewhat like God because of it and he didn't want robots. The problem being that an eternal soul has to end up somewhere ..either Heaven (Peace, Order) or Hell (Sin, Disorder).

You are suggesting we will be able to "hate" in Heaven. How?
 
pittsburghjoe said:
What do you think being made in God's image means? We have an eternal soul because of it. We are able to think somewhat like God because of it and he didn't want robots. The problem being that an eternal soul has to end up somewhere ..either Heaven (Peace, Order) or Hell (Sin, Disorder).

You are suggesting we will be able to "hate" in Heaven. How?
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I did not suggest we will be able to hate in heaven, we can’t hate now- because hate is murder, and murderers will not inherit the kingdom of God. Our soul is made in God’s image- which I believe He creates at the time of conception. Just like Adam- He made a body and gave it life (soul). And someday our soul will come out of our body. Our body will not exist forever, but our soul will (its only a matter of where it will exist).
 
pittsburghjoe said:
You always do this and I always say Jesus is a special case. God can do whatever he wants. Swapping between environments isn't an issue for him.
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i always tell you this because it is the truth!

we shall be made like Him.
we are being conformed to His image.
He is the Last Adam, the first of many brothers.
just as He was raised bodily and bodily ascended to heaven, we will be physically, materially resurrected and physically, materially taken up with Him.

we will not leave corpses behind.
 
​
Again He said to me, ​
“Prophesy to these bones, and say to them, ‘O dry bones, hear the word of the LORD! Thus says the LORD God to these bones: “Surely I will cause breath to enter into you, and you shall live. I will put sinews on you and bring flesh upon you, cover you with skin and put breath in you; and you shall live. Then you shall know that I am the LORD.” ’ ” ​
(Ezekiel 37:4-6)​
 
pittsburghjoe said:
What do you think being made in God's image means? We have an eternal soul because of it.
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see previous discussion. the animals, tho not the plants, are also called souls and also have the breath of life.
they were likewise formed from physical dust.

therefore: having physical form is not sinful or evil. it is good. it is God's intention.
therefore: having a soul and having the breath of life is not what is meant by being made after the image of God.
 
posthuman said:
where's Christ's physical body right now?
did it rot and decay to dust? did He leave it behind when He ascended? did He leave it in the tomb when He rose?
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He rose into the sky with His body, but He did not enter heaven with His body. How do I know? The bible says “The perishable cannot inherit the imperishable”. All physical bodies decay. God says “Ashes back into ashes, and dust back into dust”. Jesus’ physical body grew just like our bodies- from baby to kid, to teen, to adult, etc. His body would have eventually died of old age, unless He used a miracle to prevent it, but He chose to come live the way we do to identify with our sufferings.

The bible says to store up treasures in heaven- where moth and rust do not destroy and thieves do not break in and steal. Why? because it is not a physical place. Jesus used parables to try to show us what the spiritual realm is like.

Even we go past the earth’s atmosphere with our physical bodies by way of rocket. It does not mean our physical bodies can enter heaven. Jesus told the thief on the cross “TODAY you will be with Me in paradise.” Did Jesus and the thief take their bodies with them? No they did not. God’s holy ones will not see decay, especially His Holy One Jesus. Genuine christians will not be in their bodies when their bodies decay, but evil people will. Like when Joseph predicted his prison mate’s death. That guy felt the birds peck at his eyes and tear his flesh from his body before he went to torment.
 
OneFaith said:
He rose into the sky with His body, but He did not enter heaven with His body. How do I know? The bible says “The perishable cannot inherit the imperishable”.
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it also says, He did not see corruption. Christ's body isn't 'perishable' because in Him there is no sin.

connected to this is the body of Moses, who stood in the presence of God - which God hid, and Satan sought, contending over it with Michael. Moses' eyes did not grow dim, and his strength wasn't diminished ((Deut. 34:7)) -- this is unique, why are we told this? why does Satan desire his body, and not someone else's? why did God hide it? but this is 500 pages of discussion to search out.

do you think Christ ascended into the clouds, and then once the clouds obscured the apostle's sight, His body was discarded and fell to the sea? left floating around in orbit, becoming space junk? ooh maybe you can spot it with a telescope, the corpse of Jesus! ha!
you think He ascended bodily & rose bodily in order to deceive the apostles? then when no one was looking, threw away the ruse? ya think that's sound doctrine? really?

compare Elijah's body, which was also taken up in the whirlwind. 50 men searched for it for 3 days ((probably just a coincidence huh)) and it was not found. Elisha, one of the strongest types of Christ in the OT, told them not to look. they badgered him. he acquiesced. they did not find it. he said, i told you so.
 
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I already told you Christ obviously transitioned into God's Kingdom. I also told you we are made of waves ..just not coherent ones until we make the same transition.
 
Benadam said:
NO creature can claim to have always been but can claim to always be. Eternal primarily means changelessness. You seem to confuse the fact that God being the source of immortal life that there are no immortal creatures. Only God is immortal means His existence is not contingent on any other being. It doesn't mean there are no immortal creatures.
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LOL. Scripture unequivocally states that God alone is immortal. You keep ignoring that fact to substitute your error.

Between you and me, if anyone is confused, it is you :)

Salvation is contingent upon being born again of the incorruptible living Word of God.

Only by that means does one attain to life ever after.
 
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pittsburghjoe said:
I already told you Christ obviously transitioned into God's Kingdom. I also told you we are made of waves ..just not coherent ones until we make the same transition.
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many people also already told you that you are wrong, that your ideas contradict physics and contradict scripture.

so what do you think will be gained by you repeating these things?
 
Magenta said:
Salvation is contingent upon being born again of the incorruptible living Word of God.
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Since you mentioned confusion, salvation wasn't being discussed. You didn't address the substance of my refutation of your interpretation.
 
OneFaith said:
His body would have eventually died of old age, unless He used a miracle to prevent it, but He chose to come live the way we do to identify with our sufferings.
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This isn't true. Death had no hold on Jesus' body. If He was going to die He couldn't choose to die and Hid death would not be a sacrifice.
 
Benadam said:
Since you mentioned confusion, salvation wasn't being discussed. You didn't address the substance of my refutation of your interpretation.
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Your error holds no substance, since God alone is immortal. How many times must it be said??? :oops::rolleyes::oops:

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

Did you get it, yet? :unsure::geek::giggle:

Plus, you have some weird ideas that are nowhere to be found in Scripture (n)
 
Magenta said:
Your error holds no substance, since God alone is immortal. How many times must it be said??? :oops::rolleyes::oops:

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

God alone is immortal.

Did you get it, yet? :unsure::geek::giggle:
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Your claim has been refuted. Repeating the scripture we disagree about doesn't add substance to what you think it means.
 
pittsburghjoe said:
Can you guys imagine what wave-particle duality would be if it was only waves?
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the 'wave' in wave-particle duality is not the probability distribution function that the Schrodinger equation describes.
the interference patterns seen in the double-slit experiment are physical, and the result of physical processes, made by physical, material substances which are displaying wave-like behaviour when they are unobserved before passing through the slit. they display particle-like behaviour when they are observed.

your hypotheses are fundamentally misunderstanding quantum mechanical theory.

here's a question you should answer, that will prove it:
what's a photon?
 
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