Why have the Sign Gifts Ended

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throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#41
Ultimately, the same thing as always: God's sovereignty.
That's a general response. We have a verse that says the Jews require/ seek after a sign . Along with the history of ' signs ' accompanying the message all through the bible, to Israel . I don't see how turning water into wine necessarily displays his sovereignty?
 
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
113
#42
That's a general response. We have a verse that says the Jews require/ seek after a sign . Along with the history of ' signs ' accompanying the message all through the bible, to Israel . I don't see how turning water into wine necessarily displays his sovereignty?
There is a very good parallel explanation between the first recorded miracle by Jesus, at the wedding, and the first recorded sign by the Holy Spirit, at the temple entrance in Acts 3.

When Jesus turned water into wine at the wedding feast in Cana, it is significant that He did this at the beginning of His public ministry to announce this special event, while getting Israel’s attention. It was through this miracle that Jesus was glorified, and the Disciples believed on Him (verse 11).

This miracle is a picture of Israel going into the Kingdom with great joy, with the wine representing joy. Wine is a type of the Holy Spirit and both are associated with joy (Zechariah 10:7; 1 Thessalonians 1:6; Acts 13:52).

Just as Jesus produced abundant wine for the wedding feast, Israel will experience much joy in the Spirit as they enter the Millennial Kingdom and become wedded to their Messiah for all eternity.

In the same way, Peter’s first miracle was also significant and full of meaning. His first miracle, after the ascension of Jesus Christ, was used to get the attention of the people, and it also showed that he had God-given authority.

The miracle of healing the lame man was also very significant. Israel is pictured as lame from birth. Israel was “birthed” out of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (Exodus 4:22—23; Hosea 11:1).

However, Israel quickly turned away from God and went their own way. They were lame, spiritually, almost as soon as they were “born.”

However, Peter is giving Israel a glimmer of hope through what he is preaching. Israel can be made whole and go leaping and praising God into the imminent Kingdom. This will be made possible in the name (authority) of Jesus Christ. After leaping up, the formerly lame man went into the temple.

The temple is the location that Jesus Christ and the Disciples will be ruling the world.
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#43
There is a very good parallel explanation between the first recorded miracle by Jesus, at the wedding, and the first recorded sign by the Holy Spirit, at the temple entrance in Acts 3.

When Jesus turned water into wine at the wedding feast in Cana, it is significant that He did this at the beginning of His public ministry to announce this special event, while getting Israel’s attention. It was through this miracle that Jesus was glorified, and the Disciples believed on Him (verse 11).

This miracle is a picture of Israel going into the Kingdom with great joy, with the wine representing joy. Wine is a type of the Holy Spirit and both are associated with joy (Zechariah 10:7; 1 Thessalonians 1:6; Acts 13:52).

Just as Jesus produced abundant wine for the wedding feast, Israel will experience much joy in the Spirit as they enter the Millennial Kingdom and become wedded to their Messiah for all eternity.

In the same way, Peter’s first miracle was also significant and full of meaning. His first miracle, after the ascension of Jesus Christ, was used to get the attention of the people, and it also showed that he had God-given authority.

The miracle of healing the lame man was also very significant. Israel is pictured as lame from birth. Israel was “birthed” out of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (Exodus 4:22—23; Hosea 11:1).

However, Israel quickly turned away from God and went their own way. They were lame, spiritually, almost as soon as they were “born.”

However, Peter is giving Israel a glimmer of hope through what he is preaching. Israel can be made whole and go leaping and praising God into the imminent Kingdom. This will be made possible in the name (authority) of Jesus Christ. After leaping up, the formerly lame man went into the temple.

The temple is the location that Jesus Christ and the Disciples will be ruling the world.
Agreed 👍 The miracles were specific and not general. Meaning they are not simply a arbitrary display of power ect .
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#44
Read the actual passage and know that miracles are not going to end. Just tongues, prophecies, and knowledge.

God revelation is complete and it now becomes the responsibility of man to search out the things God has placed therein.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

claudia22

New member
Feb 12, 2019
21
15
3
#45
The argument that it has ceased is straightforward, with the necessary scripture:
  1. Signs are for the nation Israel. (Exodus 4, Psalms 74:9, Judges 6:13)
  2. The Messiah was promised to Israel and prophecy stated that he will perform many signs and wonders to prove his identity (Luke 7:20-23)
  3. When Jesus appeared, he performed all the necessary signs to testify to the nation Israel (John 20:30-21, Acts 2:22, Hebrews 2:4)
  4. Despite the numerous signs, Israel rejected him by putting him on the cross. (Luke 20:14, Acts 2:36)
  5. God gave Israel a one year extension as God's favored nation (Luke 13:8-9, Acts 3:26), by sending the Holy Spirit at Pentecost, who performed numerous signs and wonders again in Acts 2-7, in a final attempt to convince Israel to repent of murdering the Messiah and be converted (Acts 3:19-21).
  6. Israel rejected the Holy Spirit by their leaders stoning Stephen (Acts 7)
  7. Israel the nation fell and now salvation has been released to the gentiles thru their fall, as God has planned since the foundation of the world (Romans 11:11)
  8. Paul was given signs and wonders temporary to alert Israel of the change in dispensation (Acts 15:12)
  9. By the time Acts 28 arrived, even the diaspora of Israel has rejected Jesus (Acts 28:28).
  10. Signs and wonders have completely ceased at Acts 28.
Any comments and different perspectives?
Praise Jesus
Referring to your statement signs and wonders cease.
Thats not correct.
The bible tells us
In Mark 16 verse 17 to 18.
And these signs shall follow them that believe. Etc.
You can complete the balance of the scripture.
Pls.
The bible is the same yesterday today and forever.
The bible is complete
It tells you in Deuteronomy 4 vs 2.
Jesus saith.
You must not add anything to what I command you.
Or to take anything from it.
Bless you
Thanks
Claudette
 

claudia22

New member
Feb 12, 2019
21
15
3
#46
The argument that it has ceased is straightforward, with the necessary scripture:
  1. Signs are for the nation Israel. (Exodus 4, Psalms 74:9, Judges 6:13)
  2. The Messiah was promised to Israel and prophecy stated that he will perform many signs and wonders to prove his identity (Luke 7:20-23)
  3. When Jesus appeared, he performed all the necessary signs to testify to the nation Israel (John 20:30-21, Acts 2:22, Hebrews 2:4)
  4. Despite the numerous signs, Israel rejected him by putting him on the cross. (Luke 20:14, Acts 2:36)
  5. God gave Israel a one year extension as God's favored nation (Luke 13:8-9, Acts 3:26), by sending the Holy Spirit at Pentecost, who performed numerous signs and wonders again in Acts 2-7, in a final attempt to convince Israel to repent of murdering the Messiah and be converted (Acts 3:19-21).
  6. Israel rejected the Holy Spirit by their leaders stoning Stephen (Acts 7)
  7. Israel the nation fell and now salvation has been released to the gentiles thru their fall, as God has planned since the foundation of the world (Romans 11:11)
  8. Paul was given signs and wonders temporary to alert Israel of the change in dispensation (Acts 15:12)
  9. By the time Acts 28 arrived, even the diaspora of Israel has rejected Jesus (Acts 28:28).
  10. Signs and wonders have completely ceased at Acts 28.
Any comments and different perspectives?
 

claudia22

New member
Feb 12, 2019
21
15
3
#47
The argument that it has ceased is straightforward, with the necessary scripture:
  1. Signs are for the nation Israel. (Exodus 4, Psalms 74:9, Judges 6:13)
  2. The Messiah was promised to Israel and prophecy stated that he will perform many signs and wonders to prove his identity (Luke 7:20-23)
  3. When Jesus appeared, he performed all the necessary signs to testify to the nation Israel (John 20:30-21, Acts 2:22, Hebrews 2:4)
  4. Despite the numerous signs, Israel rejected him by putting him on the cross. (Luke 20:14, Acts 2:36)
  5. God gave Israel a one year extension as God's favored nation (Luke 13:8-9, Acts 3:26), by sending the Holy Spirit at Pentecost, who performed numerous signs and wonders again in Acts 2-7, in a final attempt to convince Israel to repent of murdering the Messiah and be converted (Acts 3:19-21).
  6. Israel rejected the Holy Spirit by their leaders stoning Stephen (Acts 7)
  7. Israel the nation fell and now salvation has been released to the gentiles thru their fall, as God has planned since the foundation of the world (Romans 11:11)
  8. Paul was given signs and wonders temporary to alert Israel of the change in dispensation (Acts 15:12)
  9. By the time Acts 28 arrived, even the diaspora of Israel has rejected Jesus (Acts 28:28).
  10. Signs and wonders have completely ceased at Acts 28.
Any comments and different perspectives?
 

claudia22

New member
Feb 12, 2019
21
15
3
#48
The argument that it has ceased is straightforward, with the necessary scripture:
  1. Signs are for the nation Israel. (Exodus 4, Psalms 74:9, Judges 6:13)
  2. The Messiah was promised to Israel and prophecy stated that he will perform many signs and wonders to prove his identity (Luke 7:20-23)
  3. When Jesus appeared, he performed all the necessary signs to testify to the nation Israel (John 20:30-21, Acts 2:22, Hebrews 2:4)
  4. Despite the numerous signs, Israel rejected him by putting him on the cross. (Luke 20:14, Acts 2:36)
  5. God gave Israel a one year extension as God's favored nation (Luke 13:8-9, Acts 3:26), by sending the Holy Spirit at Pentecost, who performed numerous signs and wonders again in Acts 2-7, in a final attempt to convince Israel to repent of murdering the Messiah and be converted (Acts 3:19-21).
  6. Israel rejected the Holy Spirit by their leaders stoning Stephen (Acts 7)
  7. Israel the nation fell and now salvation has been released to the gentiles thru their fall, as God has planned since the foundation of the world (Romans 11:11)
  8. Paul was given signs and wonders temporary to alert Israel of the change in dispensation (Acts 15:12)
  9. By the time Acts 28 arrived, even the diaspora of Israel has rejected Jesus (Acts 28:28).
  10. Signs and wonders have completely ceased at Acts 28.
Any comments and different perspectives?
 

claudia22

New member
Feb 12, 2019
21
15
3
#49
The argument that it has ceased is straightforward, with the necessary scripture:
  1. Signs are for the nation Israel. (Exodus 4, Psalms 74:9, Judges 6:13)
  2. The Messiah was promised to Israel and prophecy stated that he will perform many signs and wonders to prove his identity (Luke 7:20-23)
  3. When Jesus appeared, he performed all the necessary signs to testify to the nation Israel (John 20:30-21, Acts 2:22, Hebrews 2:4)
  4. Despite the numerous signs, Israel rejected him by putting him on the cross. (Luke 20:14, Acts 2:36)
  5. God gave Israel a one year extension as God's favored nation (Luke 13:8-9, Acts 3:26), by sending the Holy Spirit at Pentecost, who performed numerous signs and wonders again in Acts 2-7, in a final attempt to convince Israel to repent of murdering the Messiah and be converted (Acts 3:19-21).
  6. Israel rejected the Holy Spirit by their leaders stoning Stephen (Acts 7)
  7. Israel the nation fell and now salvation has been released to the gentiles thru their fall, as God has planned since the foundation of the world (Romans 11:11)
  8. Paul was given signs and wonders temporary to alert Israel of the change in dispensation (Acts 15:12)
  9. By the time Acts 28 arrived, even the diaspora of Israel has rejected Jesus (Acts 28:28).
  10. Signs and wonders have completely ceased at Acts 28.
Any comments and different perspectives?
No. I believe Luke started telling Theopolus of the things Jesus began to do......Act 1

Acts 2 the Holy Ghost fell and birthed the church and it hasn't stopped and won't stop until the Holy Ghost is called out of the world and when He goes im going with Him
 

claudia22

New member
Feb 12, 2019
21
15
3
#50
No. I believe Luke started telling Theopolus of the things Jesus began to do......Act 1

Acts 2 the Holy Ghost fell and birthed the church and it hasn't stopped and won't stop until the Holy Ghost is called out of the world and when He goes im going with Him
 
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
113
#51
Praise Jesus
Referring to your statement signs and wonders cease.
Thats not correct.
The bible tells us
In Mark 16 verse 17 to 18.
And these signs shall follow them that believe. Etc.
You can complete the balance of the scripture.
Pls.
The bible is the same yesterday today and forever.
The bible is complete
It tells you in Deuteronomy 4 vs 2.
Jesus saith.
You must not add anything to what I command you.
Or to take anything from it.
Bless you
Thanks
Claudette
Mark 16:17-18 is covered under my point 5.

God gave Israel a one year extension as God's favored nation (Luke 13:8-9, Acts 3:26), by sending the Holy Spirit at Pentecost, who performed numerous signs and wonders again in Acts 2-7, in a final attempt to convince Israel to repent of murdering the Messiah and be converted (Acts 3:19-21).

Your "us" only came in at point 7

Israel the nation fell and now salvation has been released to the gentiles thru their fall, as God has planned since the foundation of the world (Romans 11:11)
 

Blain

The Word Weaver
Aug 28, 2012
19,502
2,707
113
#52
The argument that it has ceased is straightforward, with the necessary scripture:
  1. Signs are for the nation Israel. (Exodus 4, Psalms 74:9, Judges 6:13)
  2. The Messiah was promised to Israel and prophecy stated that he will perform many signs and wonders to prove his identity (Luke 7:20-23)
  3. When Jesus appeared, he performed all the necessary signs to testify to the nation Israel (John 20:30-21, Acts 2:22, Hebrews 2:4)
  4. Despite the numerous signs, Israel rejected him by putting him on the cross. (Luke 20:14, Acts 2:36)
  5. God gave Israel a one year extension as God's favored nation (Luke 13:8-9, Acts 3:26), by sending the Holy Spirit at Pentecost, who performed numerous signs and wonders again in Acts 2-7, in a final attempt to convince Israel to repent of murdering the Messiah and be converted (Acts 3:19-21).
  6. Israel rejected the Holy Spirit by their leaders stoning Stephen (Acts 7)
  7. Israel the nation fell and now salvation has been released to the gentiles thru their fall, as God has planned since the foundation of the world (Romans 11:11)
  8. Paul was given signs and wonders temporary to alert Israel of the change in dispensation (Acts 15:12)
  9. By the time Acts 28 arrived, even the diaspora of Israel has rejected Jesus (Acts 28:28).
  10. Signs and wonders have completely ceased at Acts 28.
Any comments and different perspectives?
They haven't ended merely slowed down because we live in a generation of unbelief, the holy spirit flows in the same way and the same direction as he always has because God is the same today as he was yesterday he does not change and does not change in how he works through us.
We don't see gifts active much but if we did then would we require faith to believe in them? It's easy to believe when there is plenty to believe in but the gifts are a rare jewel these days and while there is plenty of counterfeit the rare few who walk in them via the holy spirit are those who believe without seeing.
 
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
113
#53
God is the same today as he was yesterday he does not change and does not change in how he works through us.
God commanded physical circumcision in Genesis 17

God no longer required physical circumcision for us now (Galatians 5:2)
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,176
3,700
113
#56
God commanded physical circumcision in Genesis 17

God no longer required physical circumcision for us now (Galatians 5:2)
It is obvious that God's dealings with man changes throughout history, though God's attributes do no change. Why can't people see this?
 

AlmondJoy

Active member
Oct 31, 2020
245
71
28
#57
God commanded physical circumcision in Genesis[/ QUOTE]

Healing is a mercy .....see healing of blind Bartimaus....Lord have mercy on me

Let Israel now say, that his mercy endureth for ever.
Psalms 118:2 KJV

God can do what he wants, with whom he wants, whenever he wants
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,606
13,863
113
#58
That's a general response. We have a verse that says the Jews require/ seek after a sign . Along with the history of ' signs ' accompanying the message all through the bible, to Israel . I don't see how turning water into wine necessarily displays his sovereignty?
Who else can turn water into wine, but the One who designed both water and fermentation in the first place?
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,606
13,863
113
#59
Those with the gift of healing, please send them to the cancer hospitals. Thanks.
Your comment indicates a fundamental misunderstanding of the gifts. For all the study you do, you really should know better.