Lordship salvation vs. "easy believism"
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John 10 are the same LOST sheep he has come for .Thats the ministry of the JEWISH messiah. Who came with Jewish signs , miracles ect . Jewish Disciples ect .
right up to here the disciples are only going to the lost sheep .Acts 11:19
“Now they which were scattered abroad upon the persecution that arose about Stephen travelled as far as Phenice, and Cyprus, and Antioch, preaching the word to none but unto the Jews only.”
right up to here the disciples are only going to the lost sheep .Acts 11:19
“Now they which were scattered abroad upon the persecution that arose about Stephen travelled as far as Phenice, and Cyprus, and Antioch, preaching the word to none but unto the Jews only.”
So the one fold is two groups of Jews. The Gentiles who would later believe are not part of that fold and are excluded. Doesn't sound right to me. Or else, Jesus never read or understood the Tanach and did not know the Gentiles would eventually be included into the commonwealth. Sounds even more unlikely
Because Jesus is still Shepherd of God's flock. Is the flock that is alive today Jewish only or Jews and Gentiles both?
Because Jesus is still Shepherd of God's flock. Is the flock that is alive today Jewish only or Jews and Gentiles both?
The problem with your argument is this...Jesus did not stop being a shepherd after the day of Pentecost. That is the Achille's Heel of your argument. Some of your premises are correct, but the conclusion is false. So the correct premises deceptively make it look like a sound argument, but the fact that Jesus did not stop being a shepherd after Pentecost makes your conclusion invalid.
Jesus came for the lost sheep of Israel. Correct premise
The Lost sheep He came for were jews. Correct premise.
therefore Jesus is not our shepherd. Incorrect conclusion.
On the day of Pentecost, Jesus became shepherd of the church, which is the :New Testament flock of God. 1 Peter 5"1-4
Jesus came for the lost sheep of Israel. Correct premise
The Lost sheep He came for were jews. Correct premise.
therefore Jesus is not our shepherd. Incorrect conclusion.
On the day of Pentecost, Jesus became shepherd of the church, which is the :New Testament flock of God. 1 Peter 5"1-4
Thank for your respons.
I don't know what exactly you believe on that teaching.
One of my friend believe no matter what you do after conversion, will not make you loose your salvation. So he steal money from his credit card, because he believe God die for his sin.
I am not expert in theology, but seem to me any teaching that encourage doing sin is not inline with the gospel of Jesus Christ.
Jesus want us to be like Him, not stealing or murder.
To me the teaching osas open the door to do sin.
I don't know what exactly you believe on that teaching.
One of my friend believe no matter what you do after conversion, will not make you loose your salvation. So he steal money from his credit card, because he believe God die for his sin.
I am not expert in theology, but seem to me any teaching that encourage doing sin is not inline with the gospel of Jesus Christ.
Jesus want us to be like Him, not stealing or murder.
To me the teaching osas open the door to do sin.
I think all the terms in the way your putting them are to the Jews only . We have to recognise that Jesus presenting Himself to the lost sheep of the House of Israel and it being a geniune appeal for them to accept THEIR messiah was genuine. Thats the programme Jesus came for . We come in by their rejection. We now no longer have to become a prostlyete. But that was the deal before. Prior we had no hope .
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Context . Because Jesus is being specific about reassuring those coming to him at that time . its the issue why we have those that believe we need to keep the law . Those that teach baptism is necessary and those that teach John 6.44as the gospel. Because they don't rightly divide and discern things different are not the same.
Notice something about TF's theology? I've read them here for these many pages.
TF won't answer a direct question with a direct answer. They answer a question with a question so as to obfuscate the fact they're not telling you what they believe. They're appointing the converse argument to what you show them you believe.
If you read through this thread you'll see they've been thought to be Calvinist and followers of other doctrines as well.
Some argue Jesus wasn't sent to save Gentiles but only the lost Jews. This due to what is in Matthew 15.
A Canaanite Woman’s Faith
21 After going out from there, Jesus went to the region of Tyre and Sidon. 22 A[x] Canaanite woman from that area came[y] and cried out,[z] “Have mercy on me, Lord, Son of David! My daughter is horribly demon-possessed!” 23 But he did not answer her a word. Then[aa] his disciples came and begged him,[ab] “Send her away, because she keeps on crying out after us.” 24 So[ac] he answered, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” 25 But she came and bowed down[ad] before him and said,[ae] “Lord, help me!” 26 “It is not right[af] to take the children’s bread and throw it to the dogs,”[ag] he said.[ah] 27 “Yes, Lord,” she replied,[ai] “but even the dogs eat the crumbs that fall from their masters’ table.” 28 Then[aj] Jesus answered her, “Woman,[ak] your faith is great! Let what you want be done for you.” And her daughter was healed from that hour.
What separated the pagans aka Gentiles from God's sheep? Circumcision. Gentiles were not those sheep because they were not in circumcision/covenant. Ah, but don't dare think that means Jesus came to save just the Jews as some would hope to teach you. The first "Christians" were Jews. That doesn't remove the Gentiles from God's plan of salvation though. No, not at all. Remember Paul's teaching about the circumcision of the heart. )
(Here's a fun tidbit. Atheists most commonly, and others of course, insist America was not grounded in any way in Christian/Biblical values from our inception, founding, as a country. In 2020 America, unless you note it on your intake form when in labor, your male child is circumcised. Not to establish God's covenant as in the OT but for health reasons. Still....)
A Covenant Established with Abraham
For the Jews, circumcision was more than a rite of passage. For them it was a sign of their covenant with God. Circumcision marked them as the chosen people – God’s special treasure. Others in their time practiced circumcision, particularly in Egypt. But it seems that only for Israel did it have the significance of marking a covenant relationship with their national deity.
Shortly before Isaac was born, God directed Abraham to circumcise all the males of his household, including himself, Ishmael, and his servants (Gen. 17:1-14). This was to be an ongoing practice. Every male born into his family was to be circumcised on the eighth day after his birth.
During their stay in Egypt, the Jews became deeply immersed in Egyptian culture and religious practice (Jos. 24:14). And along with that, the practice of circumcision likely fell by the wayside. But the practice was renewed on the banks of the Jordan shortly after Israel crossed the river – but before beginning the conquest of Canaan (Jos. 5:2-9).
Genesis 17:8 I will give the whole land of Canaan—the land where you are now residing[v]—to you and your descendants after you as a permanent[w] possession. I will be their God.”
9 Then God said to Abraham, “As for you, you must keep[x] the covenantal requirement[y] I am imposing on you and your descendants after you throughout their generations. 10 This is my requirement that you and your descendants after you must keep:[z] Every male among you must be circumcised.[aa] 11 You must circumcise the flesh of your foreskins. This will be a reminder[ab] of the covenant between me and you. 12 Throughout your generations every male among you who is eight days old[ac] must be circumcised, whether born in your house or bought with money from any foreigner who is not one of your descendants. 13 They must indeed be circumcised,[ad] whether born in your house or bought with money. The sign of my covenant[ae] will be visible in your flesh as a permanent[af] reminder. 14 Any uncircumcised male[ag] who has not been circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin will be cut off[ah] from his people—he has failed to carry out my requirement.”[ai]
15 Then God said to Abraham, “As for your wife, you must no longer call her Sarai;[aj] Sarah[ak] will be her name. 16 I will bless her and will give you a son through her. I will bless her and she will become a mother of nations.[al] Kings of countries[am] will come from her!”
17 Then Abraham bowed down with his face to the ground and laughed[an] as he said to himself,[ao] “Can[ap] a son be born to a man who is a hundred years old?[aq] Can Sarah[ar] bear a child at the age of ninety?”[as] 18 Abraham said to God, “O that[at] Ishmael might live before you!”[au]
(Continued below)
TF won't answer a direct question with a direct answer. They answer a question with a question so as to obfuscate the fact they're not telling you what they believe. They're appointing the converse argument to what you show them you believe.
If you read through this thread you'll see they've been thought to be Calvinist and followers of other doctrines as well.
Some argue Jesus wasn't sent to save Gentiles but only the lost Jews. This due to what is in Matthew 15.
A Canaanite Woman’s Faith
21 After going out from there, Jesus went to the region of Tyre and Sidon. 22 A[x] Canaanite woman from that area came[y] and cried out,[z] “Have mercy on me, Lord, Son of David! My daughter is horribly demon-possessed!” 23 But he did not answer her a word. Then[aa] his disciples came and begged him,[ab] “Send her away, because she keeps on crying out after us.” 24 So[ac] he answered, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” 25 But she came and bowed down[ad] before him and said,[ae] “Lord, help me!” 26 “It is not right[af] to take the children’s bread and throw it to the dogs,”[ag] he said.[ah] 27 “Yes, Lord,” she replied,[ai] “but even the dogs eat the crumbs that fall from their masters’ table.” 28 Then[aj] Jesus answered her, “Woman,[ak] your faith is great! Let what you want be done for you.” And her daughter was healed from that hour.
What separated the pagans aka Gentiles from God's sheep? Circumcision. Gentiles were not those sheep because they were not in circumcision/covenant. Ah, but don't dare think that means Jesus came to save just the Jews as some would hope to teach you. The first "Christians" were Jews. That doesn't remove the Gentiles from God's plan of salvation though. No, not at all. Remember Paul's teaching about the circumcision of the heart. )
(Here's a fun tidbit. Atheists most commonly, and others of course, insist America was not grounded in any way in Christian/Biblical values from our inception, founding, as a country. In 2020 America, unless you note it on your intake form when in labor, your male child is circumcised. Not to establish God's covenant as in the OT but for health reasons. Still....)
A Covenant Established with Abraham
For the Jews, circumcision was more than a rite of passage. For them it was a sign of their covenant with God. Circumcision marked them as the chosen people – God’s special treasure. Others in their time practiced circumcision, particularly in Egypt. But it seems that only for Israel did it have the significance of marking a covenant relationship with their national deity.
Shortly before Isaac was born, God directed Abraham to circumcise all the males of his household, including himself, Ishmael, and his servants (Gen. 17:1-14). This was to be an ongoing practice. Every male born into his family was to be circumcised on the eighth day after his birth.
During their stay in Egypt, the Jews became deeply immersed in Egyptian culture and religious practice (Jos. 24:14). And along with that, the practice of circumcision likely fell by the wayside. But the practice was renewed on the banks of the Jordan shortly after Israel crossed the river – but before beginning the conquest of Canaan (Jos. 5:2-9).
Genesis 17:8 I will give the whole land of Canaan—the land where you are now residing[v]—to you and your descendants after you as a permanent[w] possession. I will be their God.”
9 Then God said to Abraham, “As for you, you must keep[x] the covenantal requirement[y] I am imposing on you and your descendants after you throughout their generations. 10 This is my requirement that you and your descendants after you must keep:[z] Every male among you must be circumcised.[aa] 11 You must circumcise the flesh of your foreskins. This will be a reminder[ab] of the covenant between me and you. 12 Throughout your generations every male among you who is eight days old[ac] must be circumcised, whether born in your house or bought with money from any foreigner who is not one of your descendants. 13 They must indeed be circumcised,[ad] whether born in your house or bought with money. The sign of my covenant[ae] will be visible in your flesh as a permanent[af] reminder. 14 Any uncircumcised male[ag] who has not been circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin will be cut off[ah] from his people—he has failed to carry out my requirement.”[ai]
15 Then God said to Abraham, “As for your wife, you must no longer call her Sarai;[aj] Sarah[ak] will be her name. 16 I will bless her and will give you a son through her. I will bless her and she will become a mother of nations.[al] Kings of countries[am] will come from her!”
17 Then Abraham bowed down with his face to the ground and laughed[an] as he said to himself,[ao] “Can[ap] a son be born to a man who is a hundred years old?[aq] Can Sarah[ar] bear a child at the age of ninety?”[as] 18 Abraham said to God, “O that[at] Ishmael might live before you!”[au]
(Continued below)
Continued)
From that same linked Bible article:
Circumcision of the Heart
In the Bible, circumcision almost always refers to a physical act. And this is true of Paul’s writings as well. But in at least three passages he alludes to a circumcision of the heart, a spiritual circumcision. In Romans 2:28-29, Philippians 3:3 and Colossians 2:11 he discusses this spiritual circumcision. This circumcision, rather than cutting off a small part of the flesh, is a cutting off of the fleshly nature.
Colossians 2:11 especially illustrates this circumcision. “In him you were also circumcised with a circumcision not performed by human hands. Your whole self ruled by the flesh was put off when you were circumcised by Christ.” This circumcision is not done by human hands but by Christ. And it is not just males. All believers have experienced this circumcision of the heart by Christ.
Conclusion
Circumcision means different things to different peoples. To some it was, and still is, a rite of passage into adulthood. To others it is merely a simple medical procedure. But to the Jews it was, and still remains, a sign of God’s covenant with them.
Yet to Christians, physical circumcision has no spiritual or religious value. For us, the closest comparable thing we have to physical circumcision would be baptism. And some do view baptism in exactly that way, as a sign of our covenant relationship with God.
And finally, why Gentiles are those other sheep in the flock, besides the fact we are grafted into the branch that is Christ Jesus? Peter's vision. Not Paul, but Peter too was told of the Gentiles and our salvation plan through God's grace.
Peter Defends His Actions to the Jerusalem Church
Acts of the Apostles11:1Now the apostles and the brothers who were throughout Judea heard that the Gentiles too had accepted[a] the word of God.[b] 2 So when Peter went up to Jerusalem, the circumcised believers[c] took issue with[d] him, 3 saying, “You went to[e] uncircumcised men and shared a meal with[f] them.” 4 But Peter began and explained it to them point by point,[g] saying, 5 “I was in the city of Joppa praying, and in a trance I saw a vision,[h] an object something like a large sheet descending,[i] being let down from heaven[j] by its four corners, and it came to me. 6 As I stared[k] I looked into it and saw four-footed animals of the earth, wild animals, reptiles,[l] and wild birds.[m] 7 I also heard a voice saying to me, ‘Get up, Peter; slaughter[n] and eat!’ 8 But I said, ‘Certainly not, Lord, for nothing defiled or ritually unclean[o] has ever entered my mouth!’ 9 But the voice replied a second time from heaven, ‘What God has made clean, you must not consider[p] ritually unclean!’ 10 This happened three times, and then everything was pulled up to heaven again. 11 At that very moment,[q] three men sent to me from Caesarea[r] approached[s] the house where we were staying.[t] 12 The Spirit told me to accompany them without hesitation. These six brothers[u] also went with me, and we entered the man’s house. 13 He informed us how he had seen an angel standing in his house and saying, ‘Send to Joppa and summon Simon, who is called Peter, 14 who will speak a message[v] to you by which you and your entire household will be saved.’ 15 Then as I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell on[w] them just as he did[x] on us at the beginning.[y] 16 And I remembered the word of the Lord,[z] as he used to say,[aa] ‘John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’[ab] 17 Therefore if God[ac] gave them the same gift[ad] as he also gave us after believing[ae] in the Lord Jesus Christ,[af] who was I to hinder[ag] God?” 18 When they heard this,[ah] they ceased their objections[ai] and praised[aj] God, saying, “So then, God has granted the repentance[ak] that leads to life even to the Gentiles.”[al]
Praise Christ! Never let anyone try to teach you that Gentiles are in a separate gospel than that of the Jews. God is good all the time.
From that same linked Bible article:
Circumcision of the Heart
In the Bible, circumcision almost always refers to a physical act. And this is true of Paul’s writings as well. But in at least three passages he alludes to a circumcision of the heart, a spiritual circumcision. In Romans 2:28-29, Philippians 3:3 and Colossians 2:11 he discusses this spiritual circumcision. This circumcision, rather than cutting off a small part of the flesh, is a cutting off of the fleshly nature.
Colossians 2:11 especially illustrates this circumcision. “In him you were also circumcised with a circumcision not performed by human hands. Your whole self ruled by the flesh was put off when you were circumcised by Christ.” This circumcision is not done by human hands but by Christ. And it is not just males. All believers have experienced this circumcision of the heart by Christ.
Conclusion
Circumcision means different things to different peoples. To some it was, and still is, a rite of passage into adulthood. To others it is merely a simple medical procedure. But to the Jews it was, and still remains, a sign of God’s covenant with them.
Yet to Christians, physical circumcision has no spiritual or religious value. For us, the closest comparable thing we have to physical circumcision would be baptism. And some do view baptism in exactly that way, as a sign of our covenant relationship with God.
And finally, why Gentiles are those other sheep in the flock, besides the fact we are grafted into the branch that is Christ Jesus? Peter's vision. Not Paul, but Peter too was told of the Gentiles and our salvation plan through God's grace.
Peter Defends His Actions to the Jerusalem Church
Acts of the Apostles11:1Now the apostles and the brothers who were throughout Judea heard that the Gentiles too had accepted[a] the word of God.[b] 2 So when Peter went up to Jerusalem, the circumcised believers[c] took issue with[d] him, 3 saying, “You went to[e] uncircumcised men and shared a meal with[f] them.” 4 But Peter began and explained it to them point by point,[g] saying, 5 “I was in the city of Joppa praying, and in a trance I saw a vision,[h] an object something like a large sheet descending,[i] being let down from heaven[j] by its four corners, and it came to me. 6 As I stared[k] I looked into it and saw four-footed animals of the earth, wild animals, reptiles,[l] and wild birds.[m] 7 I also heard a voice saying to me, ‘Get up, Peter; slaughter[n] and eat!’ 8 But I said, ‘Certainly not, Lord, for nothing defiled or ritually unclean[o] has ever entered my mouth!’ 9 But the voice replied a second time from heaven, ‘What God has made clean, you must not consider[p] ritually unclean!’ 10 This happened three times, and then everything was pulled up to heaven again. 11 At that very moment,[q] three men sent to me from Caesarea[r] approached[s] the house where we were staying.[t] 12 The Spirit told me to accompany them without hesitation. These six brothers[u] also went with me, and we entered the man’s house. 13 He informed us how he had seen an angel standing in his house and saying, ‘Send to Joppa and summon Simon, who is called Peter, 14 who will speak a message[v] to you by which you and your entire household will be saved.’ 15 Then as I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell on[w] them just as he did[x] on us at the beginning.[y] 16 And I remembered the word of the Lord,[z] as he used to say,[aa] ‘John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’[ab] 17 Therefore if God[ac] gave them the same gift[ad] as he also gave us after believing[ae] in the Lord Jesus Christ,[af] who was I to hinder[ag] God?” 18 When they heard this,[ah] they ceased their objections[ai] and praised[aj] God, saying, “So then, God has granted the repentance[ak] that leads to life even to the Gentiles.”[al]
Praise Christ! Never let anyone try to teach you that Gentiles are in a separate gospel than that of the Jews. God is good all the time.
No, it is not possible. Jesus said no one will take us from his hand. That means we can't even leap from there.
This is a commentary that will help close the efforts you might encounter in some who want to tell you as a Gentile you're not saved. Or whatever else is their agenda. Beware of those who don't give straight answers while seeking to bring you an anti-gospel message. God is not a bigot. That's a sin people have to suffer or conquer.
What such agenda minded don't know is that Jesus told us what happens when he is lifted up (crucified). He will draw all people unto him.
Remember Paul? 28.There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female--for all of you are one in Christ Jesus. Galatians 3
John 10
Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers
(16) And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold.—The words recall to the mind a question which the Jews had asked at this very feast, “Will He go unto the dispersed among the Gentiles, and teach the Gentiles?” (John 7:35). They asked it in the bitterness of scorn. He asserts that among the Gentiles—who are not of the Jewish fold—He already possesses sheep; just as He says to Paul concerning Corinth, “I have much people in this city” (Acts 18:10). The Old Testament prophets had foretold this coming of the Gentiles, as e.g. Isaiah 52:13 et seq.; Isaiah 53:10 et seq.; Micah 4:2; and it is present to our Lord’s mind here as the result of His laying down His life for the sheep. (Comp. Notes on John 11:52; John 12:32.)
Them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice.—The bringing in of the Gentiles was in the Divine counsel part of the Messianic work which He must therefore needs do. It would result from His being lifted up that all men should be drawn unto Him, and would be accomplished in the mission-work of the Church. These scattered sheep shall hear His voice, for the conscience which knows the voice of God is the heritage of all men; they shall hear it, as the words seem to imply, while the sheep now in the fold refuse to follow it. (Comp. Notes on Matthew 8:11 and Romans 11:17.)
And there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.—Better, There shall become one flock, and one shepherd. The word here rendered “fold,” is quite distinct from that which occurs in John 10:1, and in the earlier clause of this verse. It should be, beyond all doubt, rendered “flock”; but the reader may prove this for himself by comparing the only other passages where it is found in the New Testament—Matthew 26:31; Luke 2:8; 1Corinthians 9:7 (twice). In each of these passages we have “flock”; but here our version has followed the Vulgate and the Great Bible in giving “fold,” whereas both Tyndale and Coverdale had rightly given “flock.” But even “flock” and “shepherd” fail to catch the expressiveness of the Greek, where the words are closely allied, and of nearly the same sound, “There shall be one poimne and one poimèn.” Luther’s German can exactly render the verse. “Und Ich habe noch andere Schafe, die sind nicht aus diesem Stalle. Und dieselben muss Ich herführen, und sie werden meine Stimme hören, und wird eine Herde und ein Hirte werden.”
It is not uniformity which is promised, but unity. The distinction is not merely one of words, but upon it depends a wide and important truth. It is not unity of fold which is regarded as the future of the Church, but unity of flock. There will be many folds, in many nations, in many ages, in many climes. But for all Christians there will be one true Shepherd who layeth down His life for the sheep, and all these differing folds shall, through living unity with Him, make one vast flock.
This is a commentary that will help close the efforts you might encounter in some who want to tell you as a Gentile you're not saved. Or whatever else is their agenda. Beware of those who don't give straight answers while seeking to bring you an anti-gospel message. God is not a bigot.
That's a sin people have to suffer or conquer. What such agenda minded don't know is that Jesus told us what happens when he is lifted up (crucified). He will draw all people unto him.
Remember Paul? 28.There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female--for all of you are one in Christ Jesus. Galatians 3
John 10
Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers
(16) And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold.—The words recall to the mind a question which the Jews had asked at this very feast, “Will He go unto the dispersed among the Gentiles, and teach the Gentiles?” (John 7:35). They asked it in the bitterness of scorn. He asserts that among the Gentiles—who are not of the Jewish fold—He already possesses sheep; just as He says to Paul concerning Corinth, “I have much people in this city” (Acts 18:10). The Old Testament prophets had foretold this coming of the Gentiles, as e.g. Isaiah 52:13 et seq.; Isaiah 53:10 et seq.; Micah 4:2; and it is present to our Lord’s mind here as the result of His laying down His life for the sheep. (Comp. Notes on John 11:52; John 12:32.)
Them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice.—The bringing in of the Gentiles was in the Divine counsel part of the Messianic work which He must therefore needs do. It would result from His being lifted up that all men should be drawn unto Him, and would be accomplished in the mission-work of the Church. These scattered sheep shall hear His voice, for the conscience which knows the voice of God is the heritage of all men; they shall hear it, as the words seem to imply, while the sheep now in the fold refuse to follow it. (Comp. Notes on Matthew 8:11 and Romans 11:17.)
And there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.—Better, There shall become one flock, and one shepherd. The word here rendered “fold,” is quite distinct from that which occurs in John 10:1, and in the earlier clause of this verse. It should be, beyond all doubt, rendered “flock”; but the reader may prove this for himself by comparing the only other passages where it is found in the New Testament—Matthew 26:31; Luke 2:8; 1Corinthians 9:7 (twice). In each of these passages we have “flock”; but here our version has followed the Vulgate and the Great Bible in giving “fold,” whereas both Tyndale and Coverdale had rightly given “flock.” But even “flock” and “shepherd” fail to catch the expressiveness of the Greek, where the words are closely allied, and of nearly the same sound, “There shall be one poimne and one poimèn.” Luther’s German can exactly render the verse. “Und Ich habe noch andere Schafe, die sind nicht aus diesem Stalle. Und dieselben muss Ich herführen, und sie werden meine Stimme hören, und wird eine Herde und ein Hirte werden.”
It is not uniformity which is promised, but unity. The distinction is not merely one of words, but upon it depends a wide and important truth. It is not unity of fold which is regarded as the future of the Church, but unity of flock. There will be many folds, in many nations, in many ages, in many climes. But for all Christians there will be one true Shepherd who layeth down His life for the sheep, and all these differing folds shall, through living unity with Him, make one vast flock.
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We have all the completed scriptures so we have the advantage to look back after the effect. in spite of the exception . Jesus primary mission was .
Matthew 15:24
King James Version
24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
He tells the disciples to ..These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
And still in Acts 11 19¶Now they which were scattered abroad upon the persecution that arose about Stephen travelled as far as Phenice, and Cyprus, and Antioch, preaching the word to none but unto the JEWS ONLY .
Matthew 15:24
King James Version
24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
He tells the disciples to ..These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
And still in Acts 11 19¶Now they which were scattered abroad upon the persecution that arose about Stephen travelled as far as Phenice, and Cyprus, and Antioch, preaching the word to none but unto the JEWS ONLY .
You keep putting Matthew 15:24 into a different context.
They still did not understand Jesus or the prophets, just as Peter also did not until he went to Cornelius in acts 10
You have not healed your arguments Achilles heel. Jesus is still the shepherd of His people. The flock in 1 Peter 5 can only be the church, because there is no Jew or Gentile division in Christ.
The fact that you make the general epistles solely for the Jews and the Pauline epistles for Gentiles to the point that what they say don’t apply to all Christians is pretty much putting the wall that Christ died to break down back up.
They still did not understand Jesus or the prophets, just as Peter also did not until he went to Cornelius in acts 10
You have not healed your arguments Achilles heel. Jesus is still the shepherd of His people. The flock in 1 Peter 5 can only be the church, because there is no Jew or Gentile division in Christ.
The fact that you make the general epistles solely for the Jews and the Pauline epistles for Gentiles to the point that what they say don’t apply to all Christians is pretty much putting the wall that Christ died to break down back up.
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