Yes, but He does not determine everything that comes to pass. That would be fatalism.
Chosen by God - A study in Election
- Thread starter cv5
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
- Status
Yes, but He does not determine everything that comes to pass. That would be fatalism.
The truth is that God in free and sovereign grace chose one man, Abraham, and in Abraham, a nation, and in that nation, his Elect, his Son, the Lord Jesus Christ, the true and singular “Seed of Abraham,” and in him, all believers (Acts 7:2–3; Gen. 12:1–3; 17:1–7; Jn. 8:31–56; Rom. 2:28–29; 4:9– 17; 9:6–30; Gal. 3:6–16; 4:4–5).
The Scriptures further draw a distinction between national or physical Israel—the “seed of Abraham” (spe?rma 'Abraa?m), i.e., the Jews, and the “children of Abraham” (te?kna A' braa?m), i.e., believers from among both Jews and Gentiles.
Dr. W. R. Downing • Pacific Institute for Religious Studies Sovereign Grace Baptist Church of Silicon Valley
That my friend is an erroneous statement, which you and several others on this board have made numerous times. Election many times DEFINES salvation. Allow me to demonstrate.
2Pet 1:10 The elect are saved Christians
Therefore, brothers, be all the more diligent to confirm your calling and election, for if you practice these qualities you will never fall.
Matt 24:31 The angels gather the elect redeemed
And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
Rom 8:33 Paul is referring to saved redeemed Christians
Who shall bring a charge against God’s elect? It is God who justifies.
Col 3:12 Again Paul is referring to saved redeemed Christians
Therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, put on tender mercies, kindness, humility, meekness, longsuffering;
yawn.....one a prophet with a particular mission and the other an apostle with a particular mission....neither suggests the Calvinist charade.....!
That's what the depraved mind of man says is fatalism. Such human philosophy is irrelevant so far as Scripture is concerned.
Col 2:8
Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit
Amen....and being chosen as an apostle was after they were saved!
No. No Calvinists around here. No Calvinists looking back at me from my mirror during my morning shave. You got that all wrong.
Bbrdrd,
[Except if the only difference between the saved and the damned is God's sovereign decree they have no power to not dismiss it.]
[God has already chosen them for damnation through choosing not to save them.]
Wrong once again...
Chapter 3: Of God's Decree
1._____ God hath decreed in himself, from all eternity, by the most wise and holy counsel of his own will, freely and unchangeably, all things, whatsoever comes to pass; yet so as thereby is God neither the author of sin nor hath fellowship with any therein; nor is violence offered to the will of the creature, nor yet is the liberty or contingency of second causes taken away, but rather established; in which appears his wisdom in disposing all things, and power and faithfulness in accomplishing his decree.
( Isaiah 46:10; Ephesians 1:11; Hebrews 6:17; Romans 9:15, 18; James 1:13; 1 John 1:5; Acts 4:27, 28; John 19:11; Numbers 23:19; Ephesians 1:3-5 )
2._____ Although God knoweth whatsoever may or can come to pass, upon all supposed conditions, yet hath he not decreed anything, because he foresaw it as future, or as that which would come to pass upon such conditions.
( Acts 15:18; Romans 9:11, 13, 16, 18 )
3._____ By the decree of God, for the manifestation of his glory,
some men and angels are predestinated, or foreordained to eternal life through Jesus Christ, to the praise of his glorious grace;
others being left to act in their sin to their just condemnation, to the praise of his glorious justice.
( 1 Timothy 5:21; Matthew 25:34; Ephesians 1:5, 6; Romans 9:22, 23; Jude 4 )
[So what benefit is the gospel to them since if they believe it to be true it does nothing but torture them early since they have no ability to change their fate according to Calvinists.]
Everyone believing the gospel will be saved. The gospel is offered to all who get to hear it preached or taught.
Do not blame God as if you know better what he should have done, or His purpose was in any way defective.
[It is not the true God I malign with my accusations but the idol present within the theological system known as Calvinism.]
Calvinists know the biblical God revealed in scripture. When you malign and profane His truth, you do the very thing you deny...I would reconsider what you are posting as you clearly do not represent any Calvinist i Know.
[Except if the only difference between the saved and the damned is God's sovereign decree they have no power to not dismiss it.]
[God has already chosen them for damnation through choosing not to save them.]
Wrong once again...
Chapter 3: Of God's Decree
1._____ God hath decreed in himself, from all eternity, by the most wise and holy counsel of his own will, freely and unchangeably, all things, whatsoever comes to pass; yet so as thereby is God neither the author of sin nor hath fellowship with any therein; nor is violence offered to the will of the creature, nor yet is the liberty or contingency of second causes taken away, but rather established; in which appears his wisdom in disposing all things, and power and faithfulness in accomplishing his decree.
( Isaiah 46:10; Ephesians 1:11; Hebrews 6:17; Romans 9:15, 18; James 1:13; 1 John 1:5; Acts 4:27, 28; John 19:11; Numbers 23:19; Ephesians 1:3-5 )
2._____ Although God knoweth whatsoever may or can come to pass, upon all supposed conditions, yet hath he not decreed anything, because he foresaw it as future, or as that which would come to pass upon such conditions.
( Acts 15:18; Romans 9:11, 13, 16, 18 )
3._____ By the decree of God, for the manifestation of his glory,
some men and angels are predestinated, or foreordained to eternal life through Jesus Christ, to the praise of his glorious grace;
others being left to act in their sin to their just condemnation, to the praise of his glorious justice.
( 1 Timothy 5:21; Matthew 25:34; Ephesians 1:5, 6; Romans 9:22, 23; Jude 4 )
[So what benefit is the gospel to them since if they believe it to be true it does nothing but torture them early since they have no ability to change their fate according to Calvinists.]
Everyone believing the gospel will be saved. The gospel is offered to all who get to hear it preached or taught.
Do not blame God as if you know better what he should have done, or His purpose was in any way defective.
[It is not the true God I malign with my accusations but the idol present within the theological system known as Calvinism.]
Calvinists know the biblical God revealed in scripture. When you malign and profane His truth, you do the very thing you deny...I would reconsider what you are posting as you clearly do not represent any Calvinist i Know.
Sorry, you do not know what you are talking about.
Fatalism is an impersonal force.
God's purpose is by Divine decree, which you and others post against
Is is idiotic to say God determines every course of every human action.....that clearly places every sinful action on the shoulders of God if he determines everything that comes to pass......God is not the author of sin....he does not determine every course of action under the son by man.....!
I would disagree with this view....both saints and elect are descriptive words directed at the saved and two different sides of of the coin.
Believers are described by many descriptions, this post is foolish.
The term born again does not appear in the book of Acts, does that mean those saved were not born again???
What a foolish idea. Sometimes you guys are just objecting to object.
Says your Calvin institute where you get your info from.
No one said that. It is a wicked twisting of what was posted clearly...can you not help yourself from doing this???
Chapter 3: Of God's Decree
1._____ God hath decreed in himself, from all eternity, by the most wise and holy counsel of his own will, freely and unchangeably, all things, whatsoever comes to pass; yet so as thereby is God neither the author of sin nor hath fellowship with any therein; nor is violence offered to the will of the creature, nor yet is the liberty or contingency of second causes taken away, but rather established; in which appears his wisdom in disposing all things, and power and faithfulness in accomplishing his decree.
( Isaiah 46:10; Ephesians 1:11; Hebrews 6:17; Romans 9:15, 18; James 1:13; 1 John 1:5; Acts 4:27, 28; John 19:11; Numbers 23:19; Ephesians 1:3-5 )
2._____ Although God knoweth whatsoever may or can come to pass, upon all supposed conditions, yet hath he not decreed anything, because he foresaw it as future, or as that which would come to pass upon such conditions.
( Acts 15:18; Romans 9:11, 13, 16, 18 )
3._____ By the decree of God, for the manifestation of his glory, some men and angels are predestinated, or foreordained to eternal life through Jesus Christ, to the praise of his glorious grace; others being left to act in their sin to their just condemnation, to the praise of his glorious justice.
( 1 Timothy 5:21; Matthew 25:34; Ephesians 1:5, 6; Romans 9:22, 23; Jude 4 )
I'm not sure if this scripture had been posted on this thread so here we go....
Gal 1:15
But when he who had set me apart before I was born, and who called me by his grace,
Paul is not confused about being foreordained before the founding of the world, nor does he fail to comprehend that the call does come during the lifetime of the previously chosen individual, which in his case was the effectual saving call aka the miraculous phenomenon of being born from above by the Holy Spirit, the new birth.
Gal 1:15
But when he who had set me apart before I was born, and who called me by his grace,
Paul is not confused about being foreordained before the founding of the world, nor does he fail to comprehend that the call does come during the lifetime of the previously chosen individual, which in his case was the effectual saving call aka the miraculous phenomenon of being born from above by the Holy Spirit, the new birth.
Another stupid post...I know God in love has Decreed whatsoever comes to pass.Scripture has been offered and you go you your usual personal attack, without dealing with the scripture.
But elect is not referring to salvation but service. One has to be saved to be elected for service.
- Status