Calvinist Kitchen...stirring the pot

[EleventhHour]

If I may ask how do you see it as works salvation? Just curious

Interesting I made the same analysis and was rebuked

 

[EleventhHour]

That's right, you shouldn't question an accurate presentation of God's Word

You trust the interpretation of one man who interpreted another man.

These were more fair-minded than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so.
Acts 17:11

No one who searches the word finds Calvinism unless they were indoctrinated first.
The Bereans found truth because they were given the truth.

 

[EleventhHour]

The sinner wills sin, but God allows him to

Does God allow any man to be saved?

 

[EleventhHour]

@ScottyPchristian

This was my full thought did not get posted in my response.

The Bereans found truth because they were given the truth.

And they searched the scriptures to see if it was the truth.

 

[lenna]

All we can do is hope that our particular denomination has cracked the code and we get a ticket to heaven, for being lucky enough to be a member of the winning team. So at this point in time, the truth is relevant as we all pick the bits of scripture which suit our view and throw the rest away.

so we are saved through a denomination?

and luck?

you have quite the skewed outlook on things and here you are calling yourself a Christian, so does that mean you have cracked the code and won a ticket to heaven?

 

[EleventhHour]

The problem we have is the 40,000 different interpretations of Scripture within the Christian denominations. We can make the Bible say anything we want it to say, some have used it to justify the murder of fellow Christians.

All we can do is hope that our particular denomination has cracked the code and we get a ticket to heaven, for being lucky enough to be a member of the winning team. So at this point in time, the truth is relevant as we all pick the bits of scripture which suit our view and throw the rest away.

I also have news for you, Reformed Theology did not crack the code... the Bible is not a code.

I am thinking now you defend a theology you have not really studied against scripture.

You have just accepted it and hoped your entrance into that denomination makes you one of the elect.

No one is saved unless....... it is by grace through faith.

 

[Duskey]

God said there's a way that seems right to a man, but it leads to destruction

calvinism ^^^^

 

[Duskey]

If God has chosen you before the foundation of the world, then there would never be a time when you were the object of God’s wrath.

Way to stoke their egos, John.

 

[Blue_Of_Lake]

Wonder why is it so difficult to admit that all of us believe in some form of limited atonement.

We just don’t like that phrase because of its association with tulip is it?

No one is laying traps here, but then again, you won't believe it

another thing difficult for people to admit or to even be aware of it seems, is that they -- don't (always/in all ways) know. which of course means that they could be wrong about various things, even about many things... because they don't actually know -- many things.


"... for now we see through a glass darkly (dimly, not very well, without enough light, with missing vision, only in part, without the other part/parts, incompletely, unholistically, less than perfectly, undivinely, not like God, lower than God-Vision, alot lower than God-Vision?, lower than the angels?, unknowingly, not 100% vision, an unknown percentage of vision, while still sinning at times [not perfect people]--not perfected vision, without divine revelation straight from God, ect.?)... "


although maybe God's Spirit can and does Reveal things to us also but when listening to Other people and Teachings we Might not know whether or not it is True though some things can 'Speak' to us, and others not So Much. so we need to be careful and let God speak to us (Spirit), be careful who we are hearing from: God ..................................... or Human Understanding (non-spiritual, not true/not as true/muddled/or backwards). also, to keep in mind often that we might at any given time of 'getting' something about something, and with the Spirit's help ----------------------- Still only be seeing a part of it, not Necessarily the Whole ...


because: "... for now we see through a glass darkly"

 

[Duskey]

another thing difficult for people to admit or to even be aware of it seems, is that they -- don't (always/in all ways) know. which of course means that they could be wrong about various things, even about many things... because they don't actually know -- many things.

John 3:16-18
Romans 10:9-10
I’ll give you a nickel if you find anything wrong about adhering to the simple, yet unmitigated tenants of God’s Word above.

 

[EleventhHour]

John 3:16-18
Romans 10:9-10
I’ll give you a nickel if you find anything wrong about adhering to the simple, yet unmitigated tenants of God’s Word above.

I will up the ante .... going all out.. a Loonie (Canadian Dollar)

 

[dcontroversal]

God authorized it

HAHAHHAHAHHAAHHAHAHAHHSAHHSHHSHSHHSHSHBXIEUHDIEJSOWJSBXBDJIEIJSJSNJDJJDJSKSKSKS

I bet you are like the preacher and deacons I heard say.....Paul and Jesus preached out of the King Jimmy and if it was good enough for them, it is good enough for me!

God did not authorize the King James bible which is not only a transliteration, but practically copied verbatim from a previous English version and is loaded with transliterational errors that allowed the Episcopalian Priests that put it together to keep their heads attached.....

Geesh......

 

[dcontroversal]

I would agree with you, but you must first show me how to sweep the 120 passages of scripture which speak of election under the carpet

Yawnnnnnnn

God would have ALL MEN to be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth.

And it is a simple concept....Before God cast the world down, he determined that ALL WHO COME TO HIM through his SON would be CHOSEN........

It is pure POPPYCOCK to say God chose MAN A for heaven and MAN B THRU Z to burn in hell.

 

[dcontroversal]

The problem we have is the 40,000 different interpretations of Scripture within the Christian denominations. We can make the Bible say anything we want it to say, some have used it to justify the murder of fellow Christians.

All we can do is hope that our particular denomination has cracked the code and we get a ticket to heaven, for being lucky enough to be a member of the winning team. So at this point in time, the truth is relevant as we all pick the bits of scripture which suit our view and throw the rest away.

Yeah like Calvin himself? And those that are still peddling his ramblings?

And I do not buy the above for one micro second....JOHN SAID CLEARLY...these things are written so that you may KNOW...........end of story!

 

[SoulWeaver]

The problem we have is the 40,000 different interpretations of Scripture within the Christian denominations. We can make the Bible say anything we want it to say, some have used it to justify the murder of fellow Christians.

All we can do is hope that our particular denomination has cracked the code and we get a ticket to heaven, for being lucky enough to be a member of the winning team. So at this point in time, the truth is relevant as we all pick the bits of scripture which suit our view and throw the rest away.

I'd take this opportunity to thank Jesus that all who are born again enter the Kingdom of God, because they are a new creature.
If salvation depended upon us understanding the Scripture perfectly, then no one besides the apostles would be saved.
Even apostle Peter made a mistake in pushing Mosaic law ordinances upon the Gentile believers... even apostle Peter went through the learning process and was corrected and educated about clean and unclean...
That would be to assume that if someone dies as a young Christian, maybe not having enough time to be corrected as he goes through the process of learning and study, goes to hell because of imperfect belief system...

 

[Nehemiah6]

The problem we have is the 40,000 different interpretations of Scripture within the Christian denominations.

Make that 40, then cut it in half. There are probably about two dozen denominations ( if you ignore any sub-divisions). And among non-Catholic Christians all believe in the Five Solas (unless they have become thoroughly liberal)

All we can do is hope that our interpretation is correct, as there's no way to prove anything to anyone.

But this is false. Rightly dividing the Word of Truth, comparing Scripture with Scripture, using all legitimate Bible study tools, and understanding the mind of God and Christ as revealed in Scripture will DEFINITELY lead to the truth. Indeed God says that the Holy Spirit will lead us into ALL TRUTH, and that we have an *unction* or anointing from the Holy Spirit.

The real issue is "DO YOU WANT THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH?"

 

[EleventhHour]

This thread was brought up again for a reason............ but it is time for it to go back to forgotten.

 

[Nehemiah6]

I make the case that this is just subtle works salvation , inspite of it resting on 'election ' . its simply Lordship salvation .

It would seem that you are misunderstanding several things here. Sanctification -- which includes good works -- is not *works salvation* but WORKING OUT YOUR SALVATION with fear and trembling. This is what some might call the perseverance of the saints, but that is not a biblical term.

As to "Lordship salvation" no one can rightly be saved unless he or she believes that Jesus is BOTH Lord and Christ. See Romans 10, and many other passages.

 

[throughfaith]

It would seem that you are misunderstanding several things here. Sanctification -- which includes good works -- is not *works salvation* but WORKING OUT YOUR SALVATION with fear and trembling. This is what some might call the perseverance of the saints, but that is not a biblical term.

As to "Lordship salvation" no one can rightly be saved unless he or she believes that Jesus is BOTH Lord and Christ. See Romans 10, and many other passages.

What do you take to mean by 'work out your salvation in fear and trembling ? Phil 2.12 .
And do you mean practical sanctification or positional sanctification ?

 

[Grandpa]

This would be incorrect.

Jesus paid for the sins of all humanity, this does not mean all are saved.
Calvinism is drawing a conclusion that does not exist in scripture.

It absolutely WOULD mean all are saved.

If Jesus paid for the sins of ALL humanity then God has nothing to judge anyone by. The Blood of Jesus has Atoned for EVERYONE. Therefore, everyone is saved.

This, of course, is NOT true. God has plenty to judge people by. Because the Atonement of Christ is only for Believers that have been drawn by God to Christ.