Which Delivered Us from the Wrath to Come. (1Th 1:10)

[Jimbone]

There is no temple in heaven. Temple temporal representation of the glory of God not seen.

Revelation 21:22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.

It identified as the temple reveals the hidden things inside. The things inside are the glory called the hidden manna in Revelation 2.

The faithless Jew turned that inside out or upside down talking away the understanding of the builder. by an oral tradition of the fathers. The thing framed say to him who framed it you made me not. an abomination of desolation making void the word of God .

We can see that in the parable of the ark of the covenant the golden hidden measure of faith. The book of the law as to the letter death was placed on the outside of the ark .It then as a perfect law reveals the things hidden by the law of faith.

We are the temple revealing the gospel the secret things of God. Again like the hidden manna .Manna was used to stop the complaining of those desiring to return to the bondage of sin . Manna literally meaning : What is it ?" (foreign from our understanding) . No familiarity with God .He is not a man

He works in us to familiarize us with his Spirit that does dwell in these bodies of death. God looks can look inside we look on the outside mixing the two we can find the hidden treasures of the mysteries made know by the gospel. The hidden revealing. Not what do men say.

2 Corinthians 4:7 But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.

Excellent, this truth makes the idea of a 3rd temple even more impossible. Any business that was supposed to take place in Gods earthly temple better have been taken care of, because it fulfilled it's purpose and was removed from the earth in Gods judgment on the covenant breakers, you know the coming judgement Jesus warned "that generation" about, the one that while on the way to the cross Jesus stopped and told the woman not to cry for Him, to cry for her children because He knew the judgement was coming. The time of Gods earthly temple is over now, Jesus fulfilled all and brought His kingdom. I know because I'm in it. and am still in awe of the reality of Him.

 

[cv5]

My conclusion when taken in context ...

10 And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come. 1 Thessalonians 1:10 (CWSB)

is that this will include the wrath unleashed on this world just before His Coming and is not speaking of hell/lake of fire which is not spoken of in all of 1Thess.

Book of Revelation
The "wrath of the Lamb" (1 time)
The "wrath of God" (11) times

 

[crossnote]

Book of Revelation
The "wrath of the Lamb" (1 time)
The "wrath of God" (11) times

True, but I was referring to First Thessalonians which covers the context of 1Th 1:10

 

[crossnote]

Excellent, this truth makes the idea of a 3rd temple even more impossible. Any business that was supposed to take place in Gods earthly temple better have been taken care of, because it fulfilled it's purpose and was removed from the earth in Gods judgment on the covenant breakers, you know the coming judgement Jesus warned "that generation" about, the one that while on the way to the cross Jesus stopped and told the woman not to cry for Him, to cry for her children because He knew the judgement was coming. The time of Gods earthly temple is over now, Jesus fulfilled all and brought His kingdom. I know because I'm in it. and am still in awe of the reality of Him.

"That generation" could also include the generation living when 'these things begin to happen.'
Don't worry the third Temple is often called the antiChrist temple, and rightly so.
But the fourth Temple won't be (Ezel 40-48).

 

[cv5]

True, but I was referring to First Thessalonians which covers the context of 1Th 1:10

Yes I know. I was pointing out the wrath that we will be rescued from.

 

[Ahwatukee]

My conclusion when taken in context ...

10 And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come. 1 Thessalonians 1:10 (CWSB)

is that this will include the wrath unleashed on this world just before His Coming and is not speaking of hell/lake of fire which is not spoken of in all of 1Thess.

And speaking of that same earthly wrath which is quickly approaching:

"Since we have now been justified by his blood, how much more shall we be saved from God’s wrath through him!" - I Thess.5:9

"But since we belong to the day, let us be sober, putting on faith and love as a breastplate, and the hope of salvation as a helmet. For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ." - Rom.5:9

"Because you have kept the word of My patient endurance, I also will keep you out of the hour of the trial being about to come upon the whole inhabited world, to try those dwelling upon the earth.

 

[garee]

And speaking of that same earthly wrath which is quickly approaching:

"Since we have now been justified by his blood, how much more shall we be saved from God’s wrath through him!" - I Thess.5:9

"But since we belong to the day, let us be sober, putting on faith and love as a breastplate, and the hope of salvation as a helmet. For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ." - Rom.5:9

"Because you have kept the word of My patient endurance, I also will keep you out of the hour of the trial being about to come upon the whole inhabited world, to try those dwelling upon the earth.

The Bible speaks of two wraths. The daily wrath, the suffering of the wage of sin (the pangs of hell) which began in the garden of Eden when the glory of God departed and corruption began being revealed from heaven ."the first death" And the final wrath the last day ."the second death" .

Death its self after the the letter of the law . 1st and 2nd. No need to add other signs as false wonders.

Death as to the letter of the law will not rise again and condemn through corruption another entire creation.

 

[garee]

Excellent, this truth makes the idea of a 3rd temple even more impossible. Any business that was supposed to take place in Gods earthly temple better have been taken care of, because it fulfilled it's purpose and was removed from the earth in Gods judgment on the covenant breakers, you know the coming judgement Jesus warned "that generation" about, the one that while on the way to the cross Jesus stopped and told the woman not to cry for Him, to cry for her children because He knew the judgement was coming. The time of Gods earthly temple is over now, Jesus fulfilled all and brought His kingdom. I know because I'm in it. and am still in awe of the reality of Him.

The commandment is ...No temples made with corrupted human hands. Believers like Abel the first martyr are the temple .How beautiful are their feet shod with the gospel They plant the seed and water it with the doctrines of God hoping Christ will cause growth.

He moves men according to his good will that works in us, just as it worked in Jesus earthen body .Yet Jesus knew no sin.

He always did the will of the unseen father that worked in his prophet apostle Jesus and not the will of the flesh. He said of his own flesh it profits for nothing. It is the spirit that gives spiritual breath of life .

Acts 17:23-25 King James Version (KJV) For as I passed by, and beheld your devotions, I found an altar with this inscription, To The Unknown God. Whom therefore ye ignorantly worship, him declare I unto you. God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;
Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;

If the first one. "Kings in Israel" was an abomination of desolation. Any that followed that pattern would be the same .Therefore making the Holy unseen place of faith desolate.

The 1st century reformation has come. Many it would seem are still waiting for something?

1 Samuel 8: 7 And the Lord said unto Samuel, Hearken unto the voice of the people in all that they say unto thee: for they have not rejected (make desolate) thee, but they have rejected (make desolate) me, that I should not reign over them.

That rebellion called witchcraft against the word of God .)No temples made with corrupted human hand did make the word of God without effect or desolate.

Believers rather than focusing on the temporal Making it as it is written to no effect using the temporal things seen .Describes the abomination of desolation.

I would suggest should make it a goal to walk by faith the eternal not seen as we are instructed. The kingdom does not come by observation as if we did wrestles against flesh and blood.

2 Corinthians 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

Seeking after temples made with human hands would seem to show where a person treasure is. we have that treasure in these bodies of Death but its His power working in us with us by which we can rest from our own

1 Samuel 15:23For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the Lord, he hath also rejected(make desolate)) thee from being king.

Many it would seem turn that kind of rebellion upside down and lose the purpose of what I call the golden unseen measure of faith. Mixing faith, the unseen will with the things seen .The gospel of rest

Hebrews 4 King James Version (KJV) Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it. For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it. For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

 

[Jimbone]

"That generation" could also include the generation living when 'these things begin to happen.'
Don't worry the third Temple is often called the antiChrist temple, and rightly so.
But the fourth Temple won't be (Ezel 40-48).

I disagree, the ONLY way it says that, is if you add to it. Jesus does not say "the generation that see's these things", He says "Truly I say to "YOU" that "THIS GENERATION" will not pass. First off what you're saying really doesn't make sense at all in the context of the whole conversation that is taking place. Jesus tells them of all these things that are going to happen, they ask "when", He says to them, "this generation will not pass away before ALL these things take place". It the context of this conversation there is no possible way you can pull "the generation that see's these things" from the text. It's just not there. Without bringing your assumption too the text it just isn't there. I reject completely the assertion that "what Jesus really meant was...". With respect of course, and I understand 100% completely why you believe it means that, but the simple truth is that the words of Jesus just do not say what you're asserting they do, "the generation that see's these things" has to be brought to the text, undeniably.

 

[Jimbone]

"That generation" could also include the generation living when 'these things begin to happen.'
Don't worry the third Temple is often called the antiChrist temple, and rightly so.
But the fourth Temple won't be (Ezel 40-48).

Not only that you believe Dan, Isiah, Rev, and the prophesy of the coming end of the age were in the Anti-temple? Because everything I read, or have been taught was that these things take place in the Holy place, in Gods temple, never have I ever even heard the most fringe group teach of a counterfeit temple, again would have to be added to a bunch of text #1, but the even bigger problem in my opinion is how can you desolate a false temple? It was built desolate. See my point?

This happens every time, the more you look at and think about a "future temple" the more you see it doesn't make sense on ANY level.

 

[Jimbone]

"That generation" could also include the generation living when 'these things begin to happen.'
Don't worry the third Temple is often called the antiChrist temple, and rightly so.
But the fourth Temple won't be (Ezel 40-48).

Dang, so much about such a short comment, but why did you reference Ezel 40:48? This was about the temple God was commanding be built and it's exact specifications in that time, what does this have to do with a now forth temple?. This also reminds me of another crucial point concerning another temple, God commands Hid temples built personally and is very specific. In these last days He speaks through His Son right? And what does Paul say about ANYONE that adds to His word. Does His word contain the very specific instruction for a temple to be built? The dilemma compounds itself.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Acts 3:21 -

"[...Jesus Christ] 21 whom indeed it behooves heaven to receive until the times of restoration of all things of which God spoke by the mouth of His holy prophets from the age." [that is, re: OT prophets and their prophecies]



[and recall, when He "RETURNS" to the earth Rev19, it is "to judge and to reign"... so He will be reigning (Rev19:15b "future tense" to even that point in the chronology--"and He SHALL [future tense] shepherd/rule them [/the nations] with a rod/sceptre of iron [righteousness and strength]")]

 

[garee]

I disagree, the ONLY way it says that, is if you add to it. Jesus does not say "the generation that see's these things", He says "Truly I say to "YOU" that "THIS GENERATION" will not pass. First off what you're saying really doesn't make sense at all in the context of the whole conversation that is taking place. Jesus tells them of all these things that are going to happen, they ask "when", He says to them, "this generation will not pass away before ALL these things take place". It the context of this conversation there is no possible way you can pull "the generation that see's these things" from the text. It's just not there. Without bringing your assumption too the text it just isn't there. I reject completely the assertion that "what Jesus really meant was...". With respect of course, and I understand 100% completely why you believe it means that, but the simple truth is that the words of Jesus just do not say what you're asserting they do, "the generation that see's these things" has to be brought to the text, undeniably.

I would suggest the generation of faith the golden . The generation of Christ, the spiritual seed that works in the believer .Not of them (false pride) We known that wile of the spirit of error. Look up then forward.

Not the generation of corrupt mankind, in Adam all die.

His Truth sets us free from that burden so that we can rest in him.

You could say I believe, the seed that kept on working in the hearts of men even after the seeds of flesh met its end in the geanalolgy ending with the Son of man. Jesus

Matthew 1:1 The book of the generation of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham.

The generation of Adam is represented as a generation of vipers or the evil generation that rather seeks after experience, lying wonders, faithless. Represented by two witnesses . Pharisees with Sadaucesss .

Matthew 3:7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, "who" hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?

 

[Jimbone]

I would suggest the generation of faith the golden . The generation of Christ, the spiritual seed that works in the believer .Not of them (false pride) We known that wile of the spirit of error. Look up then forward.

Not the generation of corrupt mankind, in Adam all die.

His Truth sets us free from that burden so that we can rest in him.

You could say I believe, the seed that kept on working in the hearts of men even after the seeds of flesh met its end in the geanalolgy ending with the Son of man. Jesus

Matthew 1:1 The book of the generation of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham.

The generation of Adam is represented as a generation of vipers or the evil generation that rather seeks after experience, lying wonders, faithless. Represented by two witnesses . Pharisees with Sadaucesss .

Matthew 3:7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, "who" hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?

Um.. I don't know about all that, it definitely doesn't say ANY of that. They are all nice thoughts and sentiments, but it's just not what I'm looking for. All I'm trying to get to is what Jesus meant to them when He said these things. He is clearly warning them that these things are coming, the judgement that brings the end of the age. It just so happens that right within that generation history records an event in Jerusalem that completely removes the whole Jewish religious system off the face of the earth, effectively ending the Mosaic age, the age of the law and sacrifices, ALL of which were pointing to what? That's right our King, and He came. All was fulfilled, the temples purpose is over. I mean please let it mean in your heart whatever the Spirit guides you to believe, He is who we follow, but come on man this is just what you feel it means, I'm interested in what Jesus meant.

 

[crossnote]

I disagree, the ONLY way it says that, is if you add to it. Jesus does not say "the generation that see's these things", He says "Truly I say to "YOU" that "THIS GENERATION" will not pass. First off what you're saying really doesn't make sense at all in the context of the whole conversation that is taking place. Jesus tells them of all these things that are going to happen, they ask "when", He says to them, "this generation will not pass away before ALL these things take place". It the context of this conversation there is no possible way you can pull "the generation that see's these things" from the text. It's just not there. Without bringing your assumption too the text it just isn't there. I reject completely the assertion that "what Jesus really meant was...". With respect of course, and I understand 100% completely why you believe it means that, but the simple truth is that the words of Jesus just do not say what you're asserting they do, "the generation that see's these things" has to be brought to the text, undeniably.

Your opinion. 'This generation' could easily be referring to the one witnessing'these things'.
Could you please explain what is going on in Ezekiel 40-48?

 

[crossnote]

Dang, so much about such a short comment, but why did you reference Ezel 40:48? This was about the temple God was commanding be built and it's exact specifications in that time, what does this have to do with a now forth temple?. This also reminds me of another crucial point concerning another temple, God commands Hid temples built personally and is very specific. In these last days He speaks through His Son right? And what does Paul say about ANYONE that adds to His word. Does His word contain the very specific instruction for a temple to be built? The dilemma compounds itself.

No need to get worked up.
So why would God command another Temple when they already had a second Temple?

 

[Jimbone]

No need to get worked up.
So why would God command another Temple when they already had a second Temple?

You just need to calm down too, you're getting WAY too excited over nothing? See how dumb that is?
I wasn't "worked up" at all, if I was "worked up" then you're acting like a stark raving maniac.

Okay to your commit, fair enough, I kind of thought this was always taught to be the new Jerusalem that is built after all enemies have been made a footstool for His feet (happening now). But I read a bit more into it for this comment and honestly didn't realize how many different views there are concerning this. I'm going to have to build my knowledge on these verses, and learn more before I form a solid view I'm willing to defend, but that said it seems the persons view on this depends more on the persons eschatology than the verse forming the view the other way around really. Even though kind of impossible to avoid when looking back at it I guess.

 

[Prycejosh1987]

Then would not 'which delivered us from the wrath to come' be referring to the rapture of the Church?

I think it does refer to the rapture, as the wrath to come is the tribulation. The wrath of God and the wrath of the devil will be strife in that time.

 

[tantalon]

The judgement of God is: "the wrath of God against all unrighteousness". It is graphically recorded in Revelation 20: 11-15. The tribulation period is just that- the tribulation period. One should look up words, and their meanings and application, in Vines or Strong's concordances whereby the SALVATION of God's Christ, saves the world from eternal judgement.

 

[Ahwatukee]

The judgement of God is: "the wrath of God against all unrighteousness". It is graphically recorded in Revelation 20: 11-15. The tribulation period is just that- the tribulation period. One should look up words, and their meanings and application, in Vines or Strong's concordances whereby the SALVATION of God's Christ, saves the world from eternal judgement.

Greetings tantalon!

The tribulation period which is described from Revelation chapter 6 thru 18, is God's wrath. To be clear, God's wrath is the tribulation period when the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments will be take place upon the earth. We who are believers have already been saved from judgment through faith in Christ, which is why we cannot and will not be on the earth after the first seal has been opened, which initiates God's wrath.

Revelation 20:11-15 is the resurrection of all the unrighteous dead through all of history. The church is not resurrected here, nor will they be judged here. The second death which is the lake of fire, has power over those who take part in that resurrection which takes place after the thousand years at the great white throne judgment. This resurrection will consist of the unrighteous dead throughout all of history. The fact that it states that their spirits will be released from Hades tells us that they are the wicked, for it is the same place that the rich man went to where he was in torment in flame. And because of this, no one whose spirit is released from Hades, their names will not be found in the book of life.

The church will indeed be judged at the Bema seat of Christ, not for sin, but to receive rewards are loss of reward. We will not be judged for our sins, because Christ already paid for them. And as John states regarding believers, "When we sin, if we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and cleanse us of all unrighteousness. If we are cleansed of our sins when we ask, how can God bring them back up? If God judged believers for their sins the same as the wicked, what difference would be between the righteous and the wicked. For if we even had one sin not covered by Jesus, our place would also be the lake of fire.

Understanding the time of God's wrath is not a matter of looking up words, but the time period and its severity. The seals, trumpets and bowl judgments, along with the plagues that the two witnesses will bring, the beasts kingdom, his image and his mark, are all apart of God's wrath, fulfilling His will for those who have rejected Christ and continue to live according to the sinful nature.

Also, the bowl judgments are specifically referred to as being the last plagues, because with them God's wrath will be completed. Suffice to say, if the bowl judgments make up the last of God's wrath, this would demonstrate that there would have to be plagues of wrath prior to them, which would be the seals and the trumpets.