Not By Works

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Guojing said:
What has that got to do with the que about how the Jews understood that message?
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jackrosie said:
I know...but I’m just as bad..I’m always judging her.....I am praying to the Lord about my behaviour..he keeps showing it to me......I need to take a step back....and just observe the posts...

But my mouth gets in the way.....so can you all pray that I take a step back...
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What Stone thinks I meant in her reportedly renewed mind is so far from the scripture I’m shocked. Don’t believe her biased thinking.

JR, you bounce around changing what and who you believe. That’s what that means. That Stone thought something physical tells us where her mind was.
 
stonesoffire said:
no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus JR. Ever! Put on your armor girl and rise up. Mistakes don’t matter. A heart forvJesus does!
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But if you have the chance to slander others, go for it cause they’ll be no condemnation afterwards so enjoy. That your MO???
 
Micaiah-imla said:
I don’t agree with this statement, mailmandan.

This is where the divide lies.

One who falls away fell away from being in the faith.

One who was never in the faith cannot fall away from something he was never in.
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We certainly do disagree and I presume that you believe "depart from the faith" means that born again believers depart from saving faith in Christ and lose their salvation, which is in contradiction to (Psalm 37:28; John 10:27-28; Romans 8:30; Ephesians 1:13-14 etc..)

The words "the faith" (Gr. tês pisteôs) as in 1 Timothy 4:1 means the apostolic faith, the New Testament apostolic body of doctrines. Some who are in a state of professing adherence to the apostolic faith, nevertheless will in both doctrine and practice depart from it, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons. Some "nominal" Christians will abandon the Christian faith, the New Testament apostolic body of doctrines for cults or false religions.

You cannot fall away from the truth if you have not yet heard or had the chance to consider the truth, but that does not mean that you have to fully accept it before you can turn away from it. If I decide to walk across the Brooklyn bridge and I walk right up to it without stepping onto it, but then turn and walk away from it, does that mean I didn't turn away and depart from the bridge just because I wasn't actually on the bridge? No. There are genuine Christians and there are "nominal" Christians. There are genuine believers and there are make believers. Enduring to the end confirms the former.
 
EleventhHour said:
It is still salt.....but loosing "saltiness" is not at all a reference to salvation being lost.
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Really?

Matthew 5:13
[13] Ye are the salt of the earth: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be salted? it is thenceforth good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden under foot of men.

Being good for nothing, being cast out, and to be trodden under foot doesn’t give you pause at all?

I think some believers would be wise to heed the scripture below:

Isaiah 66:2
[2] ...to this man will I look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word.
 
Micaiah-imla said:
This definitely is not the middle ground.

I would only approve this attitude when it comes to defending the truth of the Bible. (But of course you equate OSAS with the Bible itself, so...)
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OSAS is the Gospel.

But tell me what is this middle ground?
 
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EleventhHour said:
tell me what is this middle ground?
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It’s expressed perfectly here:

Philippians 3:11-14
[11] If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead. [12] Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus. [13] Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before, [14] I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.

OSAS has a mind that it has already attained.
 
Micaiah-imla said:
Really?

Matthew 5:13
[13] Ye are the salt of the earth: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be salted? it is thenceforth good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden under foot of men.

Being good for nothing, being cast out, and to be trodden under foot doesn’t give you pause at all?

I think some believers would be wise to heed the scripture below:

Isaiah 66:2
[2] ...to this man will I look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word.
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It gives me pause in that we should not loose the preserving power of salt as believers in the world......not even close to being about losing salvation.

The spiritual intention is to show that in terms of the Christian’s “fruit” (here flavor), and their witness to the world, a worldly Christian is as useless to God as saltless salt is to men.


I feel sad for you, you miss so much from scripture ... truly sad.

All you read are words of condemnation and warning about a "lose-able" salvation that cannot happen.
 
Guojing said:
What has that got to do with the question about how the Jews understood that message?
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If you don’t know what it has to do with the Jews understanding the message...then I’m certainly not going to explain it to you.

I will pray that the Lord will bring you to that understanding....
 
DorothyMae said:
What Stone thinks I meant in her reportedly renewed mind is so far from the scripture I’m shocked. Don’t believe her biased thinking.

JR, you bounce around changing what and who you believe. That’s what that means. That Stone thought something physical tells us where her mind was.
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2Ti 3:6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,

? In another post you state she’s becoming like her teacher. We know who your are referencing.

seduce can mean different things true, but this should never be online in a forum. It’s the responsibility of a fellowship. This isn’t a church.

Im dropping it. I reported it so let the moderator decide.
 
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DorothyMae said:
What Stone thinks I meant in her reportedly renewed mind is so far from the scripture I’m shocked. Don’t believe her biased thinking.

JR, you bounce around changing what and who you believe. That’s what that means. That Stone thought something physical tells us where her mind was.
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What?.....bounce around on what I believe..are you joking.......something physical tells us where her mind was.

What on earth are you talking about?...your bouncing around losing the plot!
 
Micaiah-imla said:
It’s expressed perfectly here:

Philippians 3:11-14
[11] If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead. [12] Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus. [13] Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before, [14] I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.

OSAS has a mind that it has already attained.
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Paul has already stated.....

“For I am confident of this very thing, that He who began a good work in you will perfect it until the day of Christ Jesus.” God will finish what He started in you.

Paul didn’t doubt that he was saved completely

Paul did long for the completion of his salvation through the resurrection of his body as the final act... not that he was earning it or that he would not attain it.
 
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Micaiah-imla said:
And is good for nothing.

Isn’t the kingdom of God “something”?
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Jesus is addressing those who do lose their saltiness.... this does not mean everyone does.

Read scripture in context please.
Why do you deny yourself understanding and truth?
 
There’s a footnote in my Oxford Study bible that states there are some who come under the light but not fully through into the light. Those IMO, could fall away during persecution. It’s what I wrote in my post about enduring till the end. Many go to church as something necessary. If the gospel isn’t preached, there will be no salvation.
 
posthuman said:
my next question is going to be if it is belief, apart from works, which saves - can works or lack of them damn the one who believes?
the answer to which i think will take us at least to Romans 6-8 again.
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Yes, it is belief -- faith -- that saves. "Then he [the jailer] brought them outside and asked, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” They replied, “Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved, you and your household.” Acts 16:30-31 and of course, "For this is the way God loved the world: He gave his one and only Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life."

Works, to the extent that one can do them, are a sign, but not a requirement, that one is saved.
 
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