The absurdity and heresy of Preterism

[John146]

There's only been one gospel from the beginning of time, I'm not going off on a tangent about 5 different gospels.

I never mentioned the word gospel. There's only one gospel unto eternal salvation and that is the death, burial and resurrection of Christ for sins. I'm merely stating what those OT saints were required to do to have their sins forgiven.

 

[KJV1611]

They were made right with God, but it was self righteousness and not God's righteousness. That's what the law provided until the cross. Here's an example:

Luke
5 There was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.
6 And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.

How were they righteous before God? By walking blameless in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord.

You mean their filthy rags covered their sins until Christ came?

Isa 64:6 But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

 

[John146]

Abraham trusted in the death burial and resurrection for sins, he was before the cross. He SAW JESUS ON THE CROSS.

Really? Abraham saw Jesus on the cross? Paul said the cross was hidden until after. Abraham believed that God was going to make his seed a blessing. That's what Abraham believed and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

 

[KJV1611]

Really? Abraham saw Jesus on the cross? Paul said the cross was hidden until after. Abraham believed that God was going to make his seed a blessing. That's what Abraham believed and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

Joh 8:56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.

 

[John146]

You mean their filthy rags covered their sins until Christ came?

Isa 64:6 But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

Yep, that's why they needed help out of the pit.

 

[John146]

Joh 8:56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.

Yes, the day the Jewish promised Messiah would come. The cross was hidden.

 

[John146]

You mean their filthy rags covered their sins until Christ came?

Isa 64:6 But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

Compared to the righteousness of Jesus Christ and His works, any works are as filthy rags when pertaining to salvation.

 

[KJV1611]

Yes, the day the Jewish promised Messiah would come. The cross was hidden.

Where does the bible say the cross was hidden?

 

[John146]

Where does the bible say the cross was hidden?

Paul says it several times. It was hidden from the disciples.

Romans 16:
25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,
26 But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:

Luke 18
31 Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished.
32 For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on:
33 And they shall scourge him, and put him to death: and the third day he shall rise again.
34 And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken.

 

[KJV1611]

Paul says it several times. It was hidden from the disciples.

Romans 16:
25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,
26 But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:

Luke 18
31 Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished.
32 For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on:
33 And they shall scourge him, and put him to death: and the third day he shall rise again.
34 And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken.

I don't know what mystery Paul was talking about in Romans, maybe that the church was hidden in the Old Testament or something like that, but it wasn't grace and Jesus paying for our sins.

(1Pe 1:10) Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:
(1Pe 1:11) Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

 

[KJV1611]

@John146
I don't know if you noticed this or not but the Spirit of Christ, the same Spirit of Christ that is in us, was IN THEM, the Old Testament prophets.

(1Pe 1:10) Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:
(1Pe 1:11) Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

 

[SoulWeaver]

Their sins were forgiven, but not cleared. Sins were forgiven, but not washed away. If they did not offer sacrifices for their trespasses, they were cut off from God. The best these sacrifices could do is land them up in Abraham's bosom upon death.

Exodus 34
4 And he hewed two tables of stone like unto the first; and Moses rose up early in the morning, and went up unto mount Sinai, as the Lord had commanded him, and took in his hand the two tables of stone.
5 And the Lord descended in the cloud, and stood with him there, and proclaimed the name of the Lord.
6 And the Lord passed by before him, and proclaimed, The Lord, The Lord God, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abundant in goodness and truth,
7 Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear the guilty; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children, unto the third and to the fourth generation.

You're mixing the undisputed forgiveness of God with the law of reaping and sowing so God will not be mocked... When we mess up, we have to deal with consequences of our actions, they are not magically cleared. David was forgiven for his adultery and murder of Uriah, but his son with Bethsheba died and the sword never departed from his house. This is what it means, by no means clear the guilty.

 

[SoulWeaver]

P.S. my phone acted out so it mixed up a long post on study about the day of the Lord with my previous post I edited it out but if you read it please do not respond to it and take it out (I just don't want to get into debate about it here)

 

[KJV1611]

P.S. my phone acted out so it mixed up a long post on study about the day of the Lord with my previous post I edited it out but if you read it please do not respond to it and take it out (I just don't want to get into debate about it here)

I just tried to find your first post about this but I couldn't find it. It looks the post you made here is same, is it the same one?

 

[SoulWeaver]

I just tried to find your first post about this but I couldn't find it. It looks the post you made here is same, is it the same one?

Yeah that's the same study from before, it was still on draft to post here then I decided nahh, and I couldn't see that was still in draft because slow phone and tiny screen. Lol

 

[KJV1611]

Yeah that's the same study from before, it was still on draft to post here then I decided nahh, and I couldn't see that was still in draft because slow phone and tiny screen. Lol

I wouldn't even attempt that on a phone lol. I read your original this morning and pretty much agree with you. It is a long post so I have to wait till I have time to respond. The Lord has been showing me stuff about the 1000 year reign and the resurrection so I had to work that out also.

 

[SoulWeaver]

I wouldn't even attempt that on a phone lol. I read your original this morning and pretty much agree with you. It is a long post so I have to wait till I have time to respond. The Lord has been showing me stuff about the 1000 year reign and the resurrection so I had to work that out also.

I wrote that post on pc, but it stayed memorized on site, I didn't expect it to be on phone. Looking forward to hear your findings on 1000yrs.

 

[KJV1611]

I wrote that post on pc, but it stayed memorized on site, I didn't expect it to be on phone. Looking forward to hear your findings on 1000yrs.

It's here.

 

[John146]

I don't know what mystery Paul was talking about in Romans, maybe that the church was hidden in the Old Testament or something like that, but it wasn't grace and Jesus paying for our sins.

(1Pe 1:10) Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:
(1Pe 1:11) Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

Lol, you need to continue the passage...

12 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.

The prophets wrote without understanding. The understanding was for those after the cross.

 

[John146]

@John146
I don't know if you noticed this or not but the Spirit of Christ, the same Spirit of Christ that is in us, was IN THEM, the Old Testament prophets.

(1Pe 1:10) Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:
(1Pe 1:11) Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

Yes, the Spirit moved them to write the Scripture of prophecy, but it was for us after the cross.