THE LIE IN LORDSHIP SALVATION THEORY

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Sudakar said:
"Absolute perfection, sinless, without fault or defect, flawless for us will not become a reality until we are present with the Lord, but that is the goal to strive for. Yet teleioi is also used to refer to the maturity of an adult."

You are eisegeting into Mathew 5:48 what Jesus neved stated to suit your sinfulness & prove you've saving faith.
Click to expand...
I disagree and I can see that having this conversation with you is fruitless waste of time. :rolleyes: Moving on..
 
  • Like
Reactions: John146
EleventhHour said:
The indwelling of the Holy Spirit, the result of faith, for the believer is the proof they are saved
Click to expand...

I still say scripture is the best proof. Some may not “feel” the Holy Spirit in their lives. Feelings are never good proof. Scripture states that the believer has the seal of the Holy Spirit. That’s good enough for me.
 
Sudakar said:
The Holy Spirit continually testifies about Christ's atonement and thus preserves our faith which is the confidence we have saving faith.
Click to expand...

You do not preach sinless perfectionism do you?

It is a little unclear from your posts.
 
mailmandan said:
I disagree and I can see that having this conversation with you is fruitless waste of time. :rolleyes: Moving on..
Click to expand...
You abuse the 1John3 passage to suit your degree of sinfulness in order to prove you have saving faith. That is works based salvation as follows:
Claim 1: Works prove saving faith.
Claim 2: Saving faith saves.
Your conclusion: Lack of works means no salvation.

Thus you preach the heresy of works based salvation.

You aren't yet saved.
 
Sudakar said:
I believe in sinless perfectionism by imputation through faith not through my works.
Col 2:10
Click to expand...

The thing is many believe works prove salvation, however it does not mean that they are not saved.

I think that works give evidence of salvation in that it should line up with our testimony and witness as James teaches.

There is much confusion around "dead faith" and works proving faith .. when James was really speaking about the nature of faith to a group of people who had a works mindset.
 
  • Like
Reactions: John146
Sudakar said:
1 Cor 1:18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing.
Click to expand...

Here you go to far... you are making assumptions about people being saved when you yourself are making a case that works do not give proof of salvation.

So you are contradicting yourself.
 
  • Like
Reactions: miknik5
EleventhHour said:
The thing is many believe works prove salvation, however it does not mean that they are not saved.



I think that works give evidence of salvation in that it should line up with our testimony and witness as James teaches.

There is much confusion around "dead faith" and works proving faith .. when James was really speaking about the nature of faith to a group of people who had a works mindset.
Click to expand...
True fruit of salvation is the confession of faith.

If good works is the evidence of saving faith, evil works is the evidence for the absence of saving faith. It is two way.

James is talking to those who believe there is one God and not to those who believe in Christ's atonement.
 
EleventhHour said:
Here you go to far... you are making assumptions about people being saved when you yourself are making a case that works do not give proof of salvation.

So you are contradicting yourself.
Click to expand...
I don't. Why?

Claim 1: Good works prove saving faith.
Claim 2: Saving faith saves.
Their conclusion: Evil works means no salvation.

Thus they preach the heresy of works based salvation. How can they be assumed to be saved?
 
Sudakar said:
True fruit of salvation is the confession of faith.

If good works is the evidence of saving faith, evil works is the evidence for the absence of saving faith. It is two way.

James is talking to those who believe there is one God and not to those who believe in Christ's atonement.
Click to expand...

Well you have James wrong then.

And evidence is important....otherwise our words are hollow.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mailmandan
Sudakar said:
1 Cor 1:18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing.
Click to expand...
2 Corinthians 4:3 - But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: 4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
 
  • Like
Reactions: EleventhHour
EleventhHour said:
Well you have James wrong then.

And evidence is important....otherwise our words are hollow.
Click to expand...
Having faith in Christ's atonement to save isn't hollow. Demons don't have that faith.

If you trust in your good works for evidence you have saving faith, your evil works prove you lack saving faith. And you aren't saved! It boils down to that.
 
Sudakar said:
Having faith in Christ's atonement to save isn't hollow. Demons don't have that faith.

If you trust in your good works for evidence you have saving faith, your evil works prove you lack saving faith. And you aren't saved! It boils down to that.
Click to expand...


Since we all still sin then no one is saved.
 
mailmandan said:
2 Corinthians 4:3 - But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: 4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
Click to expand...

Your trust in good works to prove your saving faith and your trust in evil works to disprove your saving faith proves you don't know whether you'll have saving faith till your last breath. You can have no joy and assurance you are saved.
 
Sudakar said:
So what do your evil works speak for, blabbermouth?
Click to expand...
I call Jesus Himself to my defense.
(John 10:32)
Jesus answered them, “I have shown you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you going to stone me?”

FROM THE FATHER
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom
Back