"Not by works" - false!

[azamzimtoti]

Oh!
You don't know the difference between keeping God's commandments and living under Mosaic law?

I think we've got to the root of your problem.

I don't need to sit here and type out every single one of God's commandments for you, nor should I need to.
I would encourage you to read your Bible.

Have a blessed day.

"I don't need to sit here and type out every single one of God's commandments for you"

I think you do as you seem to be on a promotional campaign.

 

[DBurrage]

You need to read Hebrews 10:26 in context.

I have, and I've told you what God has put in me.

The idea that Hebrews 10:26 only refers to apostasy is derived from the belief that Christians are sinless in the eyes of God, and therefore the only sin we can commit is rejecting Christ.

This is somebody's interpretation that has worked its way worldwide, but which does not correlate with what God has told me.

 

[Fastfredy0]

I don't need to define anything,

Agreed, you don't need to "define anything" ... but if you won't tell us what you mean, then communication is very much obstructed (semi-useless, ambiguous, misinterpreted)

 

[azamzimtoti]

You're accusing anybody who thinks that Christians should make a conscious effort to not rebel against God as trying to emulate those under Mosaic law.

Where did I say "rebel against God?"

I would respectfully advise you to exercise diligence and put greater thought into your words.

I think you need to take your own advice

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

Jesus fulfilled the moral law as well and the law is one unit.

But that doesn’t mean it’s no longer in effect.

 

[DBurrage]

Agreed, you don't need to "define anything" ... but if you won't tell us what you mean, then communication is very much obstructed (semi-useless, ambiguous, misinterpreted)

I've told everybody in the OP exactly what I meant, and subsequently I've said that the interpretation of Hebrews was given to me by God following my own study of the Bible.

What more do you want?

 

[oyster67]

All Christians continue to deliberately sin after receiving grace. Thus you contend that no one is saved unless you can better qualify what you mean by "deliberately sin". The dictionary would define "deliberately sin" as 'intentionally disobey God'.

Aside: There are some (very, very few) Christians that claim they never sin.

This must be repented of in short order.

 

[Fastfredy0]

Nobody here is supporting sinless perfection.

Well, @DBurrage is using Hebrews 10:26 to support "sinless perfection" for he contends that the willfully and deliberately sinning in the verse is any sin. DBurrage, when asked, has yet to give further explanation of what he means by willfully and deliberately sinning.

Hebrews 10:26 For if we go on willfully and deliberately sinning after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice [to atone] for our sins [that is, no further offering to anticipate]

 

[azamzimtoti]

I've said that the interpretation of Hebrews was given to me by God following my own study of the Bible.

We hear this "God told me so I'm right" all the time - dime a dozen.

What more do you want?

Nothing, you just established yourself as God's interpreter of Hebrews so we all roll over and play dead.

 

[Fastfredy0]

What more do you want?

I want your definition of willfully and deliberately sinning as it appears in Hebrews 10:26.

I think you believe is means "intentional disobedience of God's commands". If this be so, then the verse means to you, only Christians that never sin intentionally again are saved (have a sacrifice).
Also, why is it God tells you the meaning of HEbrews 10:26 and not the 4 commentators? Is it possible you are wrong ... that maybe God is not telling you this?

 

[EleventhHour]

We hear this "God told me so I'm right" all the time - dime a dozen.



Nothing, you just established yourself as God's interpreter of Hebrews so we all roll over and play dead.

And he has it wrong to boot!!

 

[DBurrage]

We hear this "God told me so I'm right" all the time - dime a dozen.



Nothing, you just established yourself as God's interpreter of Hebrews so we all roll over and play dead.

I'm not God's interpreter.
It is said that scripture reveals itself, so it may be that as I work my way through the Bible, God reveals a more general principle to me that undermines my current understanding.

I wish to be guided by God, not 'accepted wisdom' or other people's interpretations.

 

[DBurrage]

I want your definition of willfully and deliberately sinning as it appears in Hebrews 10:26.

I think you believe is means "intentional disobedience of God's commands". If this be so, then the verse means to you, only Christians that never sin intentionally again are saved (have a sacrifice).
Also, why is it God tells you the meaning of HEbrews 10:26 and not the 4 commentators? Is it possible you are wrong ... that maybe God is not telling you this?

See post #152, answered to somebody else already.

As regards to willfully and deliberate, what do you think it means?
I mean, grab a dictionary.

 

[mailmandan]

I have, and I've told you what God has put in me.

The idea that Hebrews 10:26 only refers to apostasy is derived from the belief that Christians are sinless in the eyes of God, and therefore the only sin we can commit is rejecting Christ.

This is somebody's interpretation that has worked its way worldwide, but which does not correlate with what God has told me.

So you teach sinless perfection since you believe “sinning willfully” in Hebrews 10:26 includes all sin in general? That doesn’t fit the context.

 

[oyster67]

Well, @DBurrage is using Hebrews 10:26 to support "sinless perfection" for he contends that the willfully and deliberately sinning in the verse is any sin. DBurrage, when asked, has yet to give further explanation of what he means by willfully and deliberately sinning.

Hebrews 10:26 For if we go on willfully and deliberately sinning after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice [to atone] for our sins [that is, no further offering to anticipate]

Can we all agree that it means "ceasing to abide in the vine."?

 

[mailmandan]

The rejection of Christ by one who has been a Christian.

You mean a “nominal” Christian.

 

[Fastfredy0]

I wish to be guided by God, not 'accepted wisdom' or other people's interpretations.

We all wish to be guided by God. Maybe God is using us to guide you. Unless you are a prophet (a person regarded as an inspired teacher or proclaimer of the will of God ), why do you think you are being guided? Deut. 29:29

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Yes, I agree.

Those verses imply that we are no longer under Mosaic law, which we are not.

Do you know the difference between God's commandments and Mosaic law?

"I do not make void the grace of God, for if righteousness [G1343] be through [/by means of] law [*no definite article ('the')]-- then Christ died in vain."

- Galatians 2:21 - https://biblehub.com/text/galatians/2-21.htm

[* Matt22:40 says "the law" with the definite article, for example]

..."by means of law" refers to any law, as I understand it (distinct from the phrase "THE law").


Okay, so that's what Paul said in Gal2:21. What did he say in the preceding verse? Verse 20:

"I have been crucified with Christ, and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. And that which I now live in the flesh, I live in faith, that OF the Son of God, the One having loved me and having given up Himself for me."



[There are verses that say, "faith IN [Him]," and other verses that say, "faith OF [Him]"... this verse ^ uses the latter]




Anyway, verse 21 is saying, "IF righteousness [*G1343] came/be by means of law, then Christ died in vain."


Strong's : "[*G1343] - From dikaios; equity (of character or act); specially (Christian) justification -- righteousness."

 

[DBurrage]

So you teach sinless perfection since you believe “sinning willfully” in Hebrews 10:26 includes all sin in general?

No, I do not believe that Christians are perfect just because they follow Jesus.
Jesus does not teach us that we are perfect and sinless, he teaches us that through our faith in him we will not be judged on our sins.

I believe that if we choose to follow Christ, we have a duty to behave in a way that tries to emulate Christ.
I believe that Hebrews 10:26 is targeted at so called Christians who say they follow Christ, but who think it's acceptable to behave in any way whatsoever.

 

[Fastfredy0]

Can we all agree that it means "ceasing to abide in the vine."?

This does not state WHY we are not on the vine. DBurrage says it because of any intentional sin. The four commentators say it's because of apostasy.