2 Timothy 3 - This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.

[Dave-L]

Scripture please...I post scripture, you come back with opinions.

“According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:” Ephesians 1:4 (KJV 1900)

 

[Dave-L]

Again, God has perfect knowledge. He knows everything going on. Once you believe on His Son, He has knowledge of it.

= ignorant until you enlighten him. Yikes..........

 

[Dave-L]

Nope, foundation is the starting point.

“According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:” Ephesians 1:4 (KJV 1900)

 

[John146]

“According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:” Ephesians 1:4 (KJV 1900)

The word according takes us back to the previous verse to the spiritual blessings in the heavenly places in Christ. That’s what He has chosen us before the foundation of the world. Notice it does not say, he chose us to BE in Christ. That’s not Scripture. The entire context is what God has chosen in Christ, not who are chosen. Big Calvinist mistake.

As a matter of Scripture, all these things God has chosen in Christ is contingent on verse 12.

12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

 

[Dave-L]

The word according takes us back to the previous verse to the spiritual blessings in the heavenly places in Christ. That’s what He has chosen us before the foundation of the world. Notice it does not say, he chose us to BE in Christ. That’s not Scripture. The entire context is what God has chosen in Christ, not who are chosen. Big Calvinist mistake.

As a matter of Scripture, all these things God has chosen in Christ is contingent on verse 12.

12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

“According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:” Ephesians 1:4 (KJV 1900) Not because we were holy as you say.

 

[John146]

= ignorant until you enlighten him. Yikes..........

What is this verse saying?

9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

 

[Dave-L]

What is this verse saying?

9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

It does not mean God is ignorant as you say.

 

[John146]

“According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:” Ephesians 1:4 (KJV 1900) Not because we were holy as you say.

Yes, that’s part of the spiritual blessings found in Christ. God chose, before the foundation of the world, that all spiritual blessings, including being without blame, would be found in Christ, His Son.

 

[John146]

It does not mean God is ignorant as you say.

Well, what does it mean? Now that ye are known of God?

 

[Dave-L]

Yes, that’s part of the spiritual blessings found in Christ. God chose, before the foundation of the world, that all spiritual blessings, including being without blame, would be found in Christ, His Son.

He chose us to be holy, not because we were.

 

[Dave-L]

Well, what does it mean? Now that ye are known of God?

It means you think God learns which means he is not omniscient (God).

 

[John146]

He chose us to be holy, not because we were.

Yes, He chose us in Christ to be holy.

 

[John146]

It means you think God learns which means he is not omniscient (God).

Define omniscient from Scripture. Never allow man to define a word and then place God in man’s definition.

 

[John146]

It means you think God learns which means he is not omniscient (God).

If there’s knowledge to be known, God knows it perfectly.

Job 36:4 For truly my words shall not be false: he that is perfectin knowledge is with thee.

 

[Dave-L]

Define omniscient from Scripture. Never allow man to define a word and then place God in man’s definition.

Omniscient: See KNOWLEDGE OF, WISDOM OF.
Perfection of: Deut. 32:4; 2 Sam. 22:31 Psa. 18:30. Matt. 5:48; Rom. 12:2; Jas. 1:17 See HOLINESS OF; JUDGE, AND HIS JUSTICE; KNOWLEDGE; WISDOM.
Personality of: Ex. 8:10 Ex. 3:14. Ex. 15:11; Ex. 20:3 Deut. 5:7. Ex. 34:14; Deut. 4:35, 39; Deut. 6:4; Deut. 10:17; Deut. 32:12, 39; Josh. 22:22; Judg. 13:16; 1 Sam. 2:2; 1 Sam. 7:3; 2 Sam. 7:22; 2 Sam. 22:32 Psa. 18:31. 1 Kin. 8:23, 60 2 Chr. 6:14. 2 Kin. 17:36; 2 Kin. 19:15 Isa. 37:16; Psa. 86:10. Ezra 1:3; Neh. 9:6; Psa. 96:5; Isa. 40:25; Isa. 42:8; Isa. 43:10, 11; Isa. 44:6, 8; Isa. 45:5, 6, 21 v. 18.; Isa. 46:5, 9 Isa. 45:22. Jer. 10:6, 7, 10; Jer. 14:22; Jer. 32:27; Hos. 13:4; Mal. 2:10; Matt. 4:10; Matt. 23:9; Mark 12:32; John 14:9; John 17:3; Rom. 1:25; Rom. 3:29; 1 Cor. 8:4–6; 2 Cor. 4:4; Gal. 3:20; Eph. 4:6; Col. 1:15; 1 Thess. 1:9; 1 Tim. 2:5; Heb. 1:3 See UNITY OF.
Power of: Ex. 15:3, 6, 7, 11, 12 vs. 8, 10.; Num. 11:23 Deut. 11:2; Num. 23:20; Deut. 3:24; Deut. 7:21; Deut. 32:39 Job 10:7. Deut. 33:26, 27; Josh. 4:24; 1 Sam. 2:6, 7, 10 v. 8.; 1 Sam. 14:6; 2 Sam. 22:13, 16 Psa. 18. 1 Chr. 29:11, 12; 2 Chr. 14:11; 2 Chr. 16:9; 2 Chr. 20:6; 2 Chr. 25:8, 9; Ezra 8:22; Neh. 1:10; Job 9:4–7, 10, 12, 13, 19 Job 5:9; Job 11:10; Job 12:14, 16 v. 15.; Job 14:20; Job 23:13, 14; Job 26:11, 14 v. 12.; Job 34:14, 15; Job 36:5, 22 vs. 27–33.; Job 37:23 vs. 1–22.; Job 38:8, 11 v. 37.; Job 40:9; Job 41:10, 11; Job 42:2; Psa. 21:13; Psa. 29:3–5 vs. 6–9.; Psa. 33:9; Psa. 46:6; Psa. 62:11; Psa. 65:6, 7; Psa. 66:3, 7; Psa. 68:33 vs. 34, 35.; Psa. 74:13, 15; Psa. 76:6, 7; Psa. 77:14, 16, 18; Psa. 78:26 vs. 12–16, 43–51.; Psa. 79:11; Psa. 89:8, 9, 13; Psa. 90:3; Psa. 93:1, 4; Psa. 97:3–5; Psa. 104:7, 9, 29, 30, 32 Psa. 105; 114:3–8; 135:8–12; 136:10–22. Psa. 106:8; Psa. 107:25, 29; Psa. 111:6; Psa. 114:7, 9; Psa. 115:3; Psa. 118:16; Psa. 135:6; Psa. 144:5; Psa. 145:6, 16; Psa. 147:5, 16, 18; Psa. 148:5, 8; Prov. 21:30; Prov. 30:4; Isa. 14:24, 27; Isa. 17:13 Psa. 2:4, 5. Isa. 19:1; Isa. 23:11; Isa. 26:4; Isa. 27:4; Isa. 31:3; Isa. 33:3, 13; Isa. 40:12, 22, 24, 26, 28; Isa. 43:13, 16, 17; Isa. 44:27; Isa. 46:10, 11; Isa. 48:13; Isa. 50:2, 3; Isa. 51:10 v. 15.; Isa. 52:10; Isa. 59:1; Isa. 60:16; Isa. 63:12; Jer. 5:22; Jer. 10:6, 12 [chapter 51:15.] Jer. 10:13; Jer. 20:11; Jer. 27:5; Jer. 32:17, 27; Jer. 50:44; Dan. 2:20; Dan. 3:17; Dan. 4:35; Dan. 6:27; Joel 2:11; Joel 3:16 Amos 1:2. Amos 4:13; Amos 9:5, 6; Mic. 1:3, 4; Nah. 1:3–6; Hab. 3:6, 9–11, 15; Zech. 9:14; Matt. 3:9; Matt. 6:13; Matt. 10:28; Matt. 19:26 Mark 10:27; Luke 18:27. Matt. 22:29; Mark 14:36; Luke 1:37, 49, 51; Luke 11:20; Rom. 1:20; Rom. 4:21; 1 Cor. 6:14; 2 Cor. 13:4; Eph. 1:19, 20; Eph. 3:20, 21; Heb. 1:3; Heb. 12:26, 29; Jas. 4:12; 1 Pet. 1:5; Rev. 4:11 Rev. 5:13. Rev. 11:17; Rev. 19:1, 6


Swanson, J., & Nave, O. (1994). New Nave’s Topical Bible. Oak Harbor: Logos Research Systems.

 

[Dave-L]

If there’s knowledge to be known, God knows it perfectly.

Job 36:4 For truly my words shall not be false: he that is perfectin knowledge is with thee.

But you say this is not the case.

 

[Dave-L]

Yes, He chose us in Christ to be holy.

You say we had to choose to be holy before he saved us.

 

[John146]

But you say this is not the case.

You interpret this to be all future decisions by man. That’s not biblical. Future decisions are not even knowledge. When the decision is made, God knows it. This is inconceivable to us being there are billions of people.

 

[John146]

You say we had to choose to be holy before he saved us.

Lol, once we are in Christ, we will become holy. That’s our destination. We’re not there yet. Not until we are conformed to the image of Jesus. That’s the future adoption, the redemption of our body.

 

[Dave-L]

You interpret this to be all future decisions by man. That’s not biblical. Future decisions are not even knowledge. When the decision is made, God knows it. This is inconceivable to us being there ate billions of people.

“For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.” Philippians 2:13 (KJV 1900)