Not By Works

[Judges1318]

Some of the hateful things you have said in the past about OSAS believers goes beyond correction.

Like I say, they seem hateful to you because you are immature in the faith.
Disagreeing with you and calling you out for your immature behavior is not being hateful.
Only a child would think that.

I'm only being this blunt to you because I actually think you may be able to take this correction to heart and be made better for it.
I mean that.
So maybe I do still have a shred of respect for you.

 

[CherieR]

Because He said everyone who calls on His name will be saved.
He doesn't turn away the person who calls on Him.
He doesn't deny them because He knows in His omniscience that they will reject Him later.
Israel is a perfect example of this.
Millions of Israelites in hell today, yet He led them out of Egypt anyway.


Of course He does.
He doesn't need to be concerned about anybody leading His own away who want to believe in Him.
Only those who change their mind and don't want to believe in Him can be led away.
That's why we should continue to believe in Him.
That's where the security of salvation is.
Security of salvation doesn't mean you can forsake Him in unbelief and you're still saved.

Thank you for the response. I think I am understanding your position on the topic better.

 

[EleventhHour]

Sinking fast, huh?

 

[Judges1318]

My eyes are wide open and have been wide open for several years now.

If you want to discuss this I'll be more than happy to drill down on any point you want.

You can start by answering this question:

How can the sanctified person in Hebrews 10:29 be a sanctified fake believer when 1 Corinthians 5 and 2 Corinthians 6 make it clear that fake brothers and sisters are NOT sanctified?

You're asking me to ignore these plain passages so that the sanctified person in Hebrews 10:29 can be an unbeliever and not really a believer.

 

[mailmandan]

Like I say, they seem hateful to you because you are immature in the faith.
Disagreeing with you and calling you out for your immature behavior is not being hateful.
Only a child would think that.

I'm only being this blunt to you because I actually think you may be able to take this correction to heart and be made better for it.
I mean that.
So maybe I do still have a shred of respect for you.

Your psychological games will not work on me, but thanks for the laugh!

 

[Judges1318]

Bad sign.
You're laughing at posts that are not humorous.
In the on line forum world that means you're on the defensive.
If I need to leave you alone for awhile that's what I'll do.
I'm not here to destroy brothers and sisters.

 

[Judges1318]

Your psychological games will not work on me, but thanks for the laugh!

Uh, oh.
Now you're doing it.
Laughing at posts that aren't humorous and aren't even meant to be humorous.
Bad sign, dan.

 

[John146]

If you want to discuss this I'll be more than happy to drill down on any point you want.

You can start by answering this question:

How can the sanctified person in Hebrews 10:29 be a sanctified fake believer when 1 Corinthians 5 and 2 Corinthians 6 make it clear that fake brothers and sisters are NOT sanctified?

You're asking me to ignore these plain passages so that the sanctified person in Hebrews 10:29 can be an unbeliever and not really a believer.

Not all Scripture is to the body of Christ. Most is to God’s physical people Israel, as is Hebrews. During the tribulation if one turns from Christ to the anti-christ there is no more forgiveness. He is condemned to eternal torment. Not so for the body of Christ during the Church Age.

 

[azamzimtoti]

Like I say, they seem hateful to you because you are immature in the faith.

Holy moly - you are such a commendable saint - we should be in awe.

 

[Judges1318]

Not all Scripture is to the body of Christ. Most is to God’s physical people Israel, as is Hebrews. During the tribulation if one turns from Christ to the anti-christ there is no more forgiveness. He is condemned to eternal torment. Not so for the body of Christ during the Church Age.

I'm sorry, guy, but this is so far out there it's hard for me to even want to discuss it with you.
There's a lot of John's here and it's hard to keep them straight but I think you're the one I said should read Galatians 3 over again.
There is no such thing as a different covenant for the Jews and another one for the gentiles.
There has never been a covenant of works, let alone a covenant of works for the Jews only.
Justification has NEVER come through works. Never.

 

[Judges1318]

Holy moly - you are such a commendable saint - we should be in awe.

These are the things babies say.

 

[azamzimtoti]

These are the things babies say.

You are just advertising your frustration at being able to win your case.

 

[Judges1318]

"19No doubt there have to be differences among you to show which of you have God’s approval." - 1 Corinthians 11:19

 

[Judges1318]

You are just advertising your frustration at being able to win your case.

Actually, I'm frustrated with the lack of maturity of several of you posters.

If I was frustrated with not being able to win my case I'd post those stupid little 'zzz' and similar emojis.

 

[John146]

I'm sorry, guy, but this is so far out there it's hard for me to even want to discuss it with you.
There's a lot of John's here and it's hard to keep them straight but I think you're the one I said should read Galatians 3 over again.
There is no such thing as a different covenant for the Jews and another one for the gentiles.
There has never been a covenant of works, let alone a covenant of works for the Jews only.
Justification has NEVER come through works. Never.

You need to learn how to rightly divide the word of truth. There are divisions to be made in Scripture, mainly dividing the doctrines to the Jews before the cross, those after the gathering of the body of Christ between those to the body of Christ as in Paul’s letters.

 

[azamzimtoti]

Actually, I'm frustrated with the lack of maturity of several of you posters.

Definition = maturity is agreeing with Yudges understanding.

 

[John146]

I'm sorry, guy, but this is so far out there it's hard for me to even want to discuss it with you.
There's a lot of John's here and it's hard to keep them straight but I think you're the one I said should read Galatians 3 over again.
There is no such thing as a different covenant for the Jews and another one for the gentiles.
There has never been a covenant of works, let alone a covenant of works for the Jews only.
Justification has NEVER come through works. Never.

The Galatian believers did not lose salvation. Period. They were led astray from Paul’s teaching, following false teachers.

 

[Judges1318]

Definition = maturity is agreeing with Yudges understanding.

You just don't get it.
But that is what I noticed about immature believers--even when you call them out they can't be anything but what they are and they will continue to post the way they have been.

But if I'm wrong, show me you have God's approval--1 Corinthians 11:19.

 

[Judges1318]

The Galatian believers did not lose salvation. Period. They were led astray from Paul’s teaching, following false teachers.

You're not getting it.
It has nothing to do with the Galatians themselves.
I'm showing you that the Abrahamic Covenant was never replaced.....for anybody!
The covenant of works does not exist, and never did exist, that somehow the Jews are under it while we gentiles are under a covenant of grace.
No Jew will ever be under a so-called covenant of works for justification, not now, not in times past, or in the future.
Justification has ALWAYS been through faith in God's promise.
The covenant of law did not replace or nullify that.
The premise for your whole doctrine is false.
So everything you've built on it is false too.

 

[azamzimtoti]

I'm sorry, guy, but this is so far out there it's hard for me to even want to discuss it with you..

Actually in some respects John146 is on the right track, he's misapplying it some what, whereas you are totally misunderstanding Hebrews and it's audience relevance and time frame.