Why do "bible believing" Christian use "reality" to justify what they believe?

[know1]

I’m abundantly certain you will disagree with this because you write with such confidence in your own understanding. Not everything you say is wrong because much of it is scripture and that’s why you give your borrowed words so much value. That’s why you aren’t blind but you don’t see clearly either. You are guilty of cognitive bias. You condemning others for something you are doing also, just from a different direction. Context is everything. Name it and claim it is not only a Christian doctrine. That is how God made us. It is a reality doctrine. Self help gurus like Tony Robins are well aware that belief, precedes fruition and that you need to change your mind before you can change your life. Prosperity preaching is an effective tool because it helps us put our faith in an all powerful God to bless us, rather than faith in a repeated failure like ourselves. It’s the confidence (faith) in a abundance that ushers in abundance. However, this is the snare. When we believe to receive material wealth, we increase our kingdom. When we believe to receive spiritual wealth and gifts to be a better servant, we increase His Kingdom.

The whole message of the Bible is that He is Lord. In order to serve Him, we need restoration. Sin, and more importantly the guilt of our sin separates us spiritually. In order to remove the obstacle (guilt) we need forgiveness. This was achieved through sacrifice in the OT. It wasn’t a dead animal that absolves sin. It is the repentant heart (desire for God), and faith that this action sanctified them, released their guilt. Since Christ is the perfect Sacrifice, it is this belief that allows us to believe we CAN be forgiven. This lack of guilt is what opens our ears to hear His voice and our eyes to see. The restoration is necessary for the process to be grafted into the Vine. We become a digit on Hand of Christ, to do His will, not ours. To use blessings from the Lord to expand your kingdom would be like going to work for an employer and using his office supplies and contacts to run your side jobs while on the clock.

Regardless, I know the next thing I say will sound heretical but the Bible contains the words of God, but is not the Word (Logos) of God. A word is a logos but not all “logos” are words. Some may understand, but those who use scripture verses often out of context, to validate their positions won’t. Its like taking random lines out of a script and rewriting the movie as you think it should be instead of understanding the film as a complete work.

I hope my words find fertile soil in your heart. Be blessed.

Your perception of me is correct, to some degree.
I understand more than you perceive concerning this subject.
I am simply elucidating the verses of discussion, only.
But more to the point, my bias is based on, what is reality, and what shall be.
Everything in this natural world is subject to change, because they are temporal, and the kingdom of God rules the kingdom of men.
Just because we see, feel, hear, or experience something in the natural world, doesn't mean it's real, nor does what you perceive, make it real.
Just because you have the symptoms of a cold, doesn't mean you have to accept it, as though it is.
Or if you see a sore coming out on your skin, doesn't mean it is something or that you have to accept it as being such.
For example, I have applied a negative law of faith to many real circumstances I didn't want, only to watch the "reality" change before my eyes.
It is written, "To him that has not, shall be taken, even that which he thinks he has or seems to have."
Do you know what that is talking about?
How can you not have something you already have, that will soon be taken from you?
When you understand that, then you will begin to understand my bias.
My bias, is well founded in the word of God.
It has to do with what world you live in more.
If you live more in this natural world, then all your experiences with your natural senses, will dictate what is real and what is not, according to your natural view or understanding.
But if you live in the world of faith more than you do this natural world, then your perception of what is real changes drastically.
Now, what I envision is more real than what I am experiencing with my natural senses.
Can you tell me how one lives in the world of faith or kingdom of heaven when they are here on earth?
Or how we can be seated in heavenly places in Christ Jesus, when we are here in this world?
Those who live in the natural world are subject to what is before them and or the circumstance they are in, because that is their reality, and that is what their faith is in.
Those who live in the world of faith are not subject to what is in the natural.
We are at first, but the natural world is subject to the word of God, and it is the sent word of God itself that changes the situation.
It is the word of God that manifests or brings, what we have or don't have, into reality, or what we received or rejected, to be.

 

[know1]

sorry, this might be somewhat off topic here, just been on my mind and seems like a good spot to throw it out there at.

when it comes to words of faith, one thing many people often forget (and often do not teach about) is a certain little word called "TIME".....
there are 3 parts:

SEED
TIME
HARVEST

many people seem to want to make it only 2 parts
SEEDTIME (as in the time you are planting the seed)
HARVEST

I have often heard it referred to more like this:

SEED
TIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIME
HARVEST

you see, when a farmer plants his seed, the harvest isn't instantaneous. It takes TIME for it to take root and sprout before growing into a full blown harvest.

I need to make a correction here.
This interim period or time of waiting, which also tends to be the time of testing, also know as the will of God, I'm sure you know, does NOT mean simply waiting while doing nothing but wait.
To those who do just that, I can guarantee you this one thing, your gonna have a very long wait ahead of you.
Just waiting for the seed to grow, will NOT produce a harvest.
It involves work.
More specifically, faith work or words of faith, such as, praising God for answering your prayer, before it manifests.
I have watched people who "wait on God", without doing anything, and noticed, they NEVER get what they are waiting on God for.
The seed gets planted in our hearts, and during that interim period, we need to tend to the soil of our heart, the seed is planted in, to get a good harvest.
If we don't, the either the devil will take the seed, or will stop believing and fall away, like the former ordained Baptist miniter who turn atheist, or the seed will get chock by other things entering in.
We cannot sit idle, just waiting for something to happen. It never will if we do.
We still need to fight the good fight of faith during the tiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiime of waiting.

 

[Adstar]

Really, then why are you speaking words of faith?
You clearly don't know what WOF is.
Part of what WOF is, is speaking what you believe is, as though it is, without actually seeing it.
Based on your declaration, you believe you are born again, most likely, without any physical evidence.
So, the very thing you say you don't believe, you unwittingly just used.
In your eye, you are just stating a fact, but it is not, until you decree it, as you just did.

What a load of absolute garbage..

A fact is a fact whether i decree it or if i don't decree it..
Truth is truth no matter if a person believes it or not..
I thank God i have not been brain washed with such utter brain dead garbage..

 

[CS1]

What a load of absolute garbage..

A fact is a fact whether i decree it or if i don't decree it..
Truth is truth no matter if a person believes it or not..
I thank God i have not been brain washed with such utter brain dead garbage..

I agree with the context of "wof' from the examples of those who have used it to fleece the flock.

However, word of faith is not an unbiblical doctrines but subject to abuses as all doctrines can be. I am a word of faith person but in in the context of those you see on tv that I too find error.

It was Jesus who said ask anything in my name, it was Jesus who taught the lesson of Importunity.

But the KEY is according to HIS will we ask not or own.

 

[Adstar]

I agree with the context of "wof' from the examples of those who have used it to fleece the flock.

However, word of faith is not an unbiblical doctrines but subject to abuses as all doctrines can be. I am a word of faith person but in in the context of those you see on tv that I too find error.

It was Jesus who said ask anything in my name, it was Jesus who taught the lesson of Importunity.

But the KEY is according to HIS will we ask not or own.

Yes it is all about HIS will.. We hope His will is in alignment with our will when we pray..

 

[Guojing]

What a load of absolute garbage..

A fact is a fact whether i decree it or if i don't decree it..
Truth is truth no matter if a person believes it or not..
I thank God i have not been brain washed with such utter brain dead garbage..

How do you know you are saved right now?

 

[blueluna5]

It use to be, years ago, most would use scripture as their authority, to argue their point.
Now, most use the real world as their authority and to trump the truths of the bible.
I hear many say they believe the bible as the truth and even that it is the inerrant word of God, written through holy men of old who were moved by the Holy Ghost, only for them to completely ignore what is written and state what others are doing or what happened to others or themselves, as though, by stating such, proves said statement is the evidence of what is the real truth and true authority to follow.
The bible seems to have become irrelevant in today's church and to so-called believers.
I ask many, "what is written?", only for it to go ignored or for them to tell me what happened to someone or what so and so did, or what is happening in the "real world".
What in God's green earth, does that have to do with what truth is?
They don't live in a pipe dream world..., no..., reality dictates what is fact, (considered by them to be truth,) and what is fiction.
If the interpretation doesn't line up with "reality", then it's fiction, and therefore we need to change said interpretation to line up with our FAILED experiences.
Reality therefore, dictates what they should believe and not believe, or what doctrines to believe and which ones to call "doctrines of the devil".
And now, even doctrines used by those who produce, so-called, "bad fruit", are considered bad or evil doctrines, and lies of the devil, while that which truly is bad and evil, such as sickness and poverty, are considered blessings of and from God.
What happened to scripture being the foundation of doctrines?
Words of faith, is a doctrine straight out of the scriptures, yet it is called a lie of the devil, and those whose teach such, such as yours truly, are called heretics, cultist, liars, evil, and corrupt teacher of doctrines of devils, and the like.
So what is your doctrinal authority in and how do you justify it, if it is not in the word of God?
And how can we tell which interpretations are of the truth, both of and from God, and which ones are not, when reality, or the real world, is involved?

I think there are 2 extremes with this. Even in the Bible verse mentioned the important part wasn't mentioned. It's not the poverty or sickness that is the blessing, it's because those people have hope in the future. Faith is always the key that brings joy.

Often suffering occurs when you love another. For example you're sick but have a little one, so you continue to take care of them dispite how horrible you feel. Jesus suffered on the cross bc that's how we could be saved. You may suffer being a Christian. But suffering without cause is foolishness. Suffering itself is not a blessing, but it often leads to a blessing.

Everything should be measured by the words of the Bible. However if you study the Bible incorrectly than your interpretation of it is incorrect. The holy Spirit will keep reminding you of it so you can fix. So for example all the prophets sinned so you really have to finish a book before you understand the lesson.

 

[pottersclay]

It use to be, years ago, most would use scripture as their authority, to argue their point.
Now, most use the real world as their authority and to trump the truths of the bible.
I hear many say they believe the bible as the truth and even that it is the inerrant word of God, written through holy men of old who were moved by the Holy Ghost, only for them to completely ignore what is written and state what others are doing or what happened to others or themselves, as though, by stating such, proves said statement is the evidence of what is the real truth and true authority to follow.
The bible seems to have become irrelevant in today's church and to so-called believers.
I ask many, "what is written?", only for it to go ignored or for them to tell me what happened to someone or what so and so did, or what is happening in the "real world".
What in God's green earth, does that have to do with what truth is?
They don't live in a pipe dream world..., no..., reality dictates what is fact, (considered by them to be truth,) and what is fiction.
If the interpretation doesn't line up with "reality", then it's fiction, and therefore we need to change said interpretation to line up with our FAILED experiences.
Reality therefore, dictates what they should believe and not believe, or what doctrines to believe and which ones to call "doctrines of the devil".
And now, even doctrines used by those who produce, so-called, "bad fruit", are considered bad or evil doctrines, and lies of the devil, while that which truly is bad and evil, such as sickness and poverty, are considered blessings of and from God.
What happened to scripture being the foundation of doctrines?
Words of faith, is a doctrine straight out of the scriptures, yet it is called a lie of the devil, and those whose teach such, such as yours truly, are called heretics, cultist, liars, evil, and corrupt teacher of doctrines of devils, and the like.
So what is your doctrinal authority in and how do you justify it, if it is not in the word of God?
And how can we tell which interpretations are of the truth, both of and from God, and which ones are not, when reality, or the real world, is involved?

Shall the clay tell the Potter what it shall be?

 

[know1]

What a load of absolute garbage..
A fact is a fact whether i decree it or if i don't decree it..
Truth is truth no matter if a person believes it or not..
I thank God i have not been brain washed with such utter brain dead garbage..

What part of God's word are you referring to as "garbage"?
And you have NO proof of said fact, so you don't know if it is indeed a fact or just what you think or hope to be true or fact.

Mar 11:23 For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto..., and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith. [JUST LIKE JESUS DID.]
Mar 11:24 Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and [THEN] ye shall have them.

The part that tells says you will have whatsoever you say, or the part that says God will give you whatever YOU desire IF you believe you already have it or that it is already done when you prayed, THEN it WILL be given.
That garbage is basically what I told you in my previous post to you.
The difference here is, one of us see, understands, agrees with, and has received what is written, and the other has not and apparently cannot.
The above verse are just two among many, saying the same thing, over and over again.
That being, what we believe and act upon, redefines and recreates our reality.
How could I say something you see as heresy?
Because it is NOT I or those who believe, doing the work, it is God doing it via and by His word. And His word did that because we who believe, sent it to do that, KNOWING, it would not come back to us void, but would accomplish that which we please, and prosper in the thing whereto we sent it.
Just the way He designed it to be with His creation, who is made in His image, and following Jesus' examples.

 

[garee]

Yes it is all about HIS will.. We hope His will is in alignment with our will when we pray..

He is of one mind and always does what so ever his soul desires. He performs that which is appointed to us .We should believe without murmuring . better things accompany us he promises us the will not forget the good works we offer towards His name when he does work from within. . So it is Word of Faith but whose words if not His faith as the one source? Satan as with Peter in Mathew 16.? Its a place where two different kind of wisdoms meet.

It would seem to be the way God has designed the things of this world so that men can discover nothing about the future. Not one day one our, or minute. In our anxieties we look up to where our help comes from.

Wisdom is better if you also have property. Wise people will get more than enough wealth. Wisdom and money can protect you. But knowledge gained through wisdom is even better—it can save your life. Look at what God has made. You cannot change a thing, even if you think it is wrong. When life is good, enjoy it. But when life is hard, remember that God gives us good times and hard times. And no one knows what will happen in the future.Eccl 7;11-14

Anything that is not after the faith of Christ as it is written is sin.

We cannot move the hand of God it works to soften our new hearts.

 

[know1]

I agree with the context of "wof' from the examples of those who have used it to fleece the flock.

However, word of faith is not an unbiblical doctrines but subject to abuses as all doctrines can be. I am a word of faith person but in in the context of those you see on tv that I too find error.

It was Jesus who said ask anything in my name, it was Jesus who taught the lesson of Importunity.

But the KEY is according to HIS will we ask not or own.

If we were in a court of law and I told the truth BUT intentionally left out or omitted a key part of a fact, to present a negative narrative for you but favorable one for me, did I or did I not, tell the truth?
Some might say both, yes and no.
But the courts not only demand we tell the truth, but the WHOLE truth and nothing but the truth, right?
And according to the law, lying occurs when an important fact is left out or omitted, in order to foster a misconception.
So if I told a little child, you can have anything in this store, but fail to say, "according to, or if it be, my will", which changes the whole promise, then according to the law, I just lied to that child.
There are a couple of MAJOR flaws with the theory or belief that God will give you the things you ask for ONLY if it is His will.
One being, God still gives that which is NOT His will to them that ask, though it usually comes with a curse of some type.

1Sa 8:5 And said unto him, Behold, thou art old, and thy sons walk not in thy ways: now make us a king to judge us like all the nations.
1Sa 8:6 But the thing displeased Samuel, when they said, Give us a king to judge us. And Samuel prayed unto the LORD.
1Sa 8:7 And the LORD said unto Samuel, Hearken unto the voice of the people in all that they say unto thee: for they have not rejected thee, but they have rejected me, that I should not reign over them.
1Sa 8:8 According to all the works which they have done since the day that I brought them up out of Egypt even unto this day, wherewith they have forsaken me, and served other gods, so do they also unto thee.
1Sa 8:9 Now therefore hearken unto their voice: howbeit yet protest solemnly unto them, and shew them the manner of the king that shall reign over them.

Second, as already stated, adding His will to only some of the promises, changes the whole meaning and context of the promise.

Third, by adding His will to a statement He already said was true means, it was not true, but a lie, by omission of a pertinent fact. IF that was the "whole truth", or what God really meant.

Forth, you are being selective in what promises you are applying, His will, to. Which is wrong and corrupt.
For example, you have not applied, His will, to Jn 3:16.
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish [IF IT IS HIS WILL], but have everlasting life [IF IT IS HIS WILL FOR THAT PERSON].

If you apply God's will to one promise, you therefore must do the same with ALL the promises of God, otherwise you are being impartial. Which again, is wrong.

Fifth, the above addition changes the promise from a guaranteed certainty, to a conditional, iffy possibility, making it IMPOSSIBLE to believe God WILL do what He said He would do, to a wishy-washy, impotent, MAYBE He will do that for the person or MAYBE He won't.

Sixth, one's faith is contingent upon knowing the will of God, when in most cases, the person doesn't know what that is. Especially if said person were just coming to Christ or is a new believer.

Seventh, you are perverting scripture by adding what is not written, in an otherwise true statement or promise, which, as I have already stated, changes the whole meaning and context, from a foregone conclusion, to a conditional iffiness.

Eighth , and since the promise has been altered by injecting, the will of God, into it, faith is eradicated, and replaced by hoping, wishing, and especially, WONDER.

Most people's understanding of what faith in God and His word is, is fully confident or assured in both, and if you don't know what God's will is, then all you will be doing is hoping, wishing, and wondering what God will do, and that is NOT what faith is. And we all know, the ONLY way to please God is through and by faith or confidence in both Him and His Word, which is Christ, and that fact that God does NOT answer prayers of hoping, wishing, and wondering.
Why?
Because faith is present tense, as in NOW, Mk 11;24, while hoping, wishing, and wondering about what God WILL DO SOME DAY, is in the future tense. Big difference.
And another big difference is, faith is a noun, where hoping, wishing, and wondering what God will do, is a verb.

Heb 10:22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
Heb 10:23 Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised

If you don't know what God's will is, BECAUSE YOU ALTERED THE PROMISE BY INJECTING HIS WILL INTO IT, then you will not have ANY full assurance He will do anything for you, because you won't know what that will is for you specifically, or for anyone else, for that matter.

Now having said all that, I am NOT trying to remove God's will from His promise, but to say, His will is ALREADY WRITTEN in the promises.
If He said, "what things soever YOU DESIRE...", then that IS God's will for those who can receive it.
And if God said, "as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name.", then that IS the will of God already written in His promise.
This shouldn't be hard to see, nor difficult to understand, and neither does it pass the shoe on the other foot, test.
Leave the promises AS IS, and believe what is written, without altering or watering it down to fit, or line up, with your understanding or experiences, or that of others.

 

[know1]

Yes it is all about HIS will.. We hope His will is in alignment with our will when we pray..

As stated in post 71, God's will is already written in His promises. We don't need to alter it by adding, His will, to make it the whole council of God.
Like the spaghetti sauce commercial stated, "It's [already] in there".

 

[know1]

I think there are 2 extremes with this. Even in the Bible verse mentioned the important part wasn't mentioned. It's not the poverty or sickness that is the blessing, it's because those people have hope in the future. Faith is always the key that brings joy.

Often suffering occurs when you love another. For example you're sick but have a little one, so you continue to take care of them dispite how horrible you feel. Jesus suffered on the cross bc that's how we could be saved. You may suffer being a Christian. But suffering without cause is foolishness. Suffering itself is not a blessing, but it often leads to a blessing.

Everything should be measured by the words of the Bible. However if you study the Bible incorrectly than your interpretation of it is incorrect. The holy Spirit will keep reminding you of it so you can fix. So for example all the prophets sinned so you really have to finish a book before you understand the lesson.

Try telling that to those who have lost loved one due to the so-called "blessing" of God, when they have lost a loved one to the said sickness.
Oh, you just did, and I find NO hope or comfort in that.
And you completely missed what Jesus was saying concerning suffering.
It is was about suffering FOR CHRIST OR THE TRUTH, NOT for the things He suffered for and both bore and took upon Himself for us, so we wouldn't have to suffer the same.
Jesus came to destroy the works of the devil, and sicknesses and poverty are curses of and from the devil.
Luk 13:11 And, behold, there was a woman which had a spirit of infirmity eighteen years, and was bowed together, and could in no wise lift up herself.
Luk 13:16 And ought not this woman, being a daughter of Abraham, whom Satan hath bound, lo, these eighteen years, be loosed from this bond on the sabbath day?

And I think Job is another good example of who it is that is the worker of the curses, NOT blessings.
NOTHING the devil does is a blessing.
It is only God who turns the curse into a blessing AFTER someone of faith prays against the situation.

 

[know1]

Shall the clay tell the Potter what it shall be?

You're the potter's clay, I think you're best suited to answer that question.
On a more serious note, what does that have to do with the subject of discussion and what are you referring to exactly?
Your question is too vague and broad.

 

[CS1]

If we were in a court of law and I told the truth BUT intentionally left out or omitted a key part of a fact, to present a negative narrative for you but favorable one for me, did I or did I not, tell the truth?
Some might say both, yes and no.
But the courts not only demand we tell the truth, but the WHOLE truth and nothing but the truth, right?
And according to the law, lying occurs when an important fact is left out or omitted, in order to foster a misconception.
So if I told a little child, you can have anything in this store, but fail to say, "according to, or if it be, my will", which changes the whole promise, then according to the law, I just lied to that child.
There are a couple of MAJOR flaws with the theory or belief that God will give you the things you ask for ONLY if it is His will.
One being, God still gives that which is NOT His will to them that ask, though it usually comes with a curse of some type.

1Sa 8:5 And said unto him, Behold, thou art old, and thy sons walk not in thy ways: now make us a king to judge us like all the nations.
1Sa 8:6 But the thing displeased Samuel, when they said, Give us a king to judge us. And Samuel prayed unto the LORD.
1Sa 8:7 And the LORD said unto Samuel, Hearken unto the voice of the people in all that they say unto thee: for they have not rejected thee, but they have rejected me, that I should not reign over them.
1Sa 8:8 According to all the works which they have done since the day that I brought them up out of Egypt even unto this day, wherewith they have forsaken me, and served other gods, so do they also unto thee.
1Sa 8:9 Now therefore hearken unto their voice: howbeit yet protest solemnly unto them, and shew them the manner of the king that shall reign over them.

Second, as already stated, adding His will to only some of the promises, changes the whole meaning and context of the promise.

Third, by adding His will to a statement He already said was true means, it was not true, but a lie, by omission of a pertinent fact. IF that was the "whole truth", or what God really meant.

Forth, you are being selective in what promises you are applying, His will, to. Which is wrong and corrupt.
For example, you have not applied, His will, to Jn 3:16.
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish [IF IT IS HIS WILL], but have everlasting life [IF IT IS HIS WILL FOR THAT PERSON].

If you apply God's will to one promise, you therefore must do the same with ALL the promises of God, otherwise you are being impartial. Which again, is wrong.

Fifth, the above addition changes the promise from a guaranteed certainty, to a conditional, iffy possibility, making it IMPOSSIBLE to believe God WILL do what He said He would do, to a wishy-washy, impotent, MAYBE He will do that for the person or MAYBE He won't.

Sixth, one's faith is contingent upon knowing the will of God, when in most cases, the person doesn't know what that is. Especially if said person were just coming to Christ or is a new believer.

Seventh, you are perverting scripture by adding what is not written, in an otherwise true statement or promise, which, as I have already stated, changes the whole meaning and context, from a foregone conclusion, to a conditional iffiness.

Eighth , and since the promise has been altered by injecting, the will of God, into it, faith is eradicated, and replaced by hoping, wishing, and especially, WONDER.

Most people's understanding of what faith in God and His word is, is fully confident or assured in both, and if you don't know what God's will is, then all you will be doing is hoping, wishing, and wondering what God will do, and that is NOT what faith is. And we all know, the ONLY way to please God is through and by faith or confidence in both Him and His Word, which is Christ, and that fact that God does NOT answer prayers of hoping, wishing, and wondering.
Why?
Because faith is present tense, as in NOW, Mk 11;24, while hoping, wishing, and wondering about what God WILL DO SOME DAY, is in the future tense. Big difference.
And another big difference is, faith is a noun, where hoping, wishing, and wondering what God will do, is a verb.

Heb 10:22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
Heb 10:23 Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised

If you don't know what God's will is, BECAUSE YOU ALTERED THE PROMISE BY INJECTING HIS WILL INTO IT, then you will not have ANY full assurance He will do anything for you, because you won't know what that will is for you specifically, or for anyone else, for that matter.

Now having said all that, I am NOT trying to remove God's will from His promise, but to say, His will is ALREADY WRITTEN in the promises.
If He said, "what things soever YOU DESIRE...", then that IS God's will for those who can receive it.
And if God said, "as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name.", then that IS the will of God already written in His promise.
This shouldn't be hard to see, nor difficult to understand, and neither does it pass the shoe on the other foot, test.
Leave the promises AS IS, and believe what is written, without altering or watering it down to fit, or line up, with your understanding or experiences, or that of others.

along read and I am not sure what you are meaning with the first part about lying . And we are not in a court of law and Jesus is very clear that we can and should ask Him for what we need according to HIS will.
Now if you told your child you can have anything in the store and did not set boundaries that is your fault.
God did set boundaries. TO tell someone to ask God for what you need according to HIS will is fully Biblical and not lie. So, your assertion is not contextual to what many are saying and surely not me

There is nothing flawed in asking God to given you something you needed. I guess you did not know your parents well my kids do. They know that id they go to the Store and ask me Can I have 16pk of beer then throw in my face you said to ask you for what ever I want, I would laugh because they have asked What I will not do. God will not given you what is not for HIS glory and HE can say no. You need to learn the lesson of Importunity . And not blankly judge all on the error of a few.

 

[MessageOfTheCross]

Romans 8
“32 He Who spared not His Own Son (concerns the Great Gift of God, i.e., the Lord Jesus Christ), but delivered Him up for us all (the Cross), how shall He not with Him also freely give us all things? (We can have all things that pertain to Life and Godliness, which Jesus paid for at the Cross, providing our Faith is ever in Christ and the Cross [II Pet. 1:3-7].)”

Matthew 6:33

JSM

 

[Guojing]

along read and I am not sure what you are meaning with the first part about lying . And we are not in a court of law and Jesus is very clear that we can and should ask Him for what we need according to HIS will.
Now if you told your child you can have anything in the store and did not set boundaries that is your fault.
God did set boundaries. TO tell someone to ask God for what you need according to HIS will is fully Biblical and not lie. So, your assertion is not contextual to what many are saying and surely not me

There is nothing flawed in asking God to given you something you needed. I guess you did not know your parents well my kids do. They know that id they go to the Store and ask me Can I have 16pk of beer then throw in my face you said to ask you for what ever I want, I would laugh because they have asked What I will not do. God will not given you what is not for HIS glory and HE can say no. You need to learn the lesson of Importunity . And not blankly judge all on the error of a few.

You will never give your child sickness or disease, or decline to get them healed, in order to teach them how to trust in you right?

 

[pottersclay]

You're the potter's clay, I think you're best suited to answer that question.
On a more serious note, what does that have to do with the subject of discussion and what are you referring to exactly?
Your question is too vague and broad.

Hmmmm...just as I thought. Not knowing the meaning of my answer is the answer to your question.
God has purposed everything he has created for his glory. The poor the rich the sick the cripple all have a plan in God's great masterpiece.
Name it and claim it, blab it and grab it, what ever you want to call it is not scriptural. The power of suggestion is a very powerful tool for some, and I am sure that healing has taken place in the stage of the entertainers. Making a mockery of God's order.
But answer me this....was the fruit that Adam and Eve ate good for them? They thought so. After wrestling with the angel all night did Jacob leap for joy or walk away with a limp? Certainly Paul's faith was strong but the pain in his side remained. In fact you say Paul stands on the word of faith and teaches as such but yet he instructs Timothy to drink a little wine to calm his belly.
This earth is not our home, this life is just a vapor, and by God's grace we shall be carried to the place that Jesus has prepared for us.
Paul expresses words such as endurance, fighting the good fight, being content in all things, vengeance is the Lord's. Hardly suggesting anything of the name it claim it theology.
The word of God is all that we have. The son of God is all that we need. The promises of God are all true but in his time not ours.

 

[blueluna5]

Try telling that to those who have lost loved one due to the so-called "blessing" of God, when they have lost a loved one to the said sickness.
Oh, you just did, and I find NO hope or comfort in that.
And you completely missed what Jesus was saying concerning suffering.
It is was about suffering FOR CHRIST OR THE TRUTH, NOT for the things He suffered for and both bore and took upon Himself for us, so we wouldn't have to suffer the same.
Jesus came to destroy the works of the devil, and sicknesses and poverty are curses of and from the devil.
Luk 13:11 And, behold, there was a woman which had a spirit of infirmity eighteen years, and was bowed together, and could in no wise lift up herself.
Luk 13:16 And ought not this woman, being a daughter of Abraham, whom Satan hath bound, lo, these eighteen years, be loosed from this bond on the sabbath day?

And I think Job is another good example of who it is that is the worker of the curses, NOT blessings.
NOTHING the devil does is a blessing.
It is only God who turns the curse into a blessing AFTER someone of faith prays against the situation.

I never said everything in life is a blessing.

 

[know1]

along read and I am not sure what you are meaning with the first part about lying . And we are not in a court of law and Jesus is very clear that we can and should ask Him for what we need according to HIS will.
Now if you told your child you can have anything in the store and did not set boundaries that is your fault.
God did set boundaries. TO tell someone to ask God for what you need according to HIS will is fully Biblical and not lie. So, your assertion is not contextual to what many are saying and surely not me

Did you read it, because you seemed to have ignored just about everything.
The first part had to do with making what is true, AS IS, into a lie, by adding "God's will", to some promises in scripture, such as to, Mk 11:23-24. Because, it is perfect as is, and His will is already stated.
By doing so, you change the entire promise from a guarantee to a maybe or might, from know what God WILL do, to not know, from being full persuaded and assured, to wondering and wavering.
For example, if I get sick, I KNOW what God's will is concerning deliverance from the sickness and healing. I don't wonder what it is, I KNOW what it is. I therefore DON'T ASK for deliverance from the devil's work, I DEMAND IT, by commanding the devil to take it's filth off me, in the name of Jesus, according to Mk 11:23. Now if there was any damage done to my body, due to the sickness, then again, I go to God WITH CONFIDENCE, KNOWING what He WILL do, by ASKING Him to Heal my body, according to Mk 11:24, then act on that confidence by thanking Him for doing so, BEFORE I feel any different.
If I didn't know what God's will was concerning deliverance from the devil's work and healing, then I COULDN'T be certain He would do anything for me, and neither could I go to God with any confidence that He would hear or do what I command in Jesus' name or grant my request for healing. Which translates to, NO FAITH, because the promises are no longer a guaranteed thing.
God does NOT deliver or heal apart from one having faith for those things.
No one gets anything from God by or through hoping, wishing, and/or wondering.
If you don't know what God's will is, then first, you CANNOT, I repeat, CANNOT have ANY confidence God will do anything for you. Like, zero. It is impossible for someone to have ANY FAITH without knowing what God will do, which is the same as know what His will is for you in any particular situation.
The two don't mix.
You either know or you don't, which mean, you either have confidence in God to fulfill His promise or you don't. It can't be both.
If you don't know, then you will have absolutely NO faith for or toward God to do or grant you your request.
And by adding "God's will" to such verses mentioned above, it not only changes the context of the verses, it adds yet another perameter to an already narrow set of guidelines, but it also is only assumed it should be injected, which again, changes the verses from a guaranteed sure thing, to you don't know anymore. Leaving you to wonder what God will do.
Yes, God did set boundaries in His word/promises, but you just added to said boundaries when you injected "God's will" into the mix with verses such as the ones listed above.
Again, God has already set His own boundaries, but you have added another restriction based on either what you were taught, or by yours and/or other's past experiences, or because it makes sense for people's failure to receive from God the thing they requested.
Adding God's will to the promises listed above don't make sense concerning faith though.
Would you explain to me what your concept of faith in God and His promises is, please?
And how you believe in WOF without knowing the will of God and the surety of His word?
And how WOF works, concerning what one believes in their heart? Elaborating on Romans 10:8 in particular.