Not By Works

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lightbearer said:
Comments like this that you made flood these forums when people don't have answer to what is shown them. Sad really.
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You are hilarious! :LOL: What's sad is you constantly proclaim that nobody has an answer to your arguments, even after you have been proven wrong on multiple topics multiple times.
 
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lightbearer said:
Now is the point where you guys flood this thread with posts that are not related to the scripture given. But with posts that try to degrade and defame those whom are in opposition to what you have been taught in regards to the scripture given.

Have fun.....May the Lord have mercy on us all
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Always playing the victim and telling others, "shame on you," then cutting and running. Degrading and defaming is a two way street. Don't act so innocent.
 
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lightbearer said:
No what is in view is not partaking of the Gospel. look again PLEASE


1Cor 9:26 I therefore so run, not as uncertainly ( not aimlessly; not as one who has no fixed goal) so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:


Paul says, "I therefore so run". RUN WHAT? The RACE. HOW SO? Not as uncertainly ( not aimlessly; not as one who has no fixed goal) so fight I, not as one that beateth the air: But as one that is striving for mastery that he obtain the prize, the Gospel, the INCORRUPTIBLE CROWN.

1Cor 9:27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway (REPROBATE, REJECTED).

GOD through Paul described this not running, as AIMLESSLY BEATING THE AIR, He says for one who is running the race to strive for mastery, be temperate in all thing, keep the body, and bring it into subjection. THEN HE STATES WHY he is doing it. He says, "lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway (REPROBATE, REJECTED)."

Then as was shared.....
Our Lord and savior does not stop there though HE CONTINUES WITH THE Same CONTEXT IN THE NEXT CHAPTER. He starts the NEXT CHAPTER WITH THE WORD "MOREOVER". SO let's take a look shall we? And as we look keep in mind what happen to those whom were overthrown in the wilderness. That tempted Christ. Idolaters, murmurers, fornicators, lusting after evil things not bring the body under subjection, a castaway Tempting Christ.
.
1Cor 10:5 But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.
1Cor 10:6 Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.
1Cor 10:7 Neither be ye idolaters, as were some of them; as it is written, The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play.
1Cor 10:8 Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed, and fell in one day three and twenty thousand.
1Cor 10:9 Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents.
1Cor 10:10 Neither murmur ye, as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed of the destroyer.
1Cor 10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.
1Cor 10:12 Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.

But there is hope.

1Cor 10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape (Christ in you), that ye may be able to bear it.

Have a nice I got to go.
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Well if and when you come back...

Paul never teaches salvation is a reward and he makes that very clear in Romans several times.

It is not eternal salvation of which he speaks. We do not obtain the gift of God—eternal life—by diligence or by “running.”

It is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy
(Rom 9:16).

The incorruptible crown is not salvation here.
It is a reward.
Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown, but we an incorruptible (1 Cor 9:25).​
The crowns received in a earthly race fade and tarnish.
We are striving for an imperishable prize, a crown that is incorruptible.
All believers who die will be raised in the first resurrection to incorruptibility (as 1 Corinthians 15 assures us), but the incorruptible crown is the prize for faithfully running the Christian race, which only the saved can do!!
 
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lightbearer said:
see
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When I go into enemy territory at least I anticipate how I will be treated and deal with it... you know we do not agree with you so expect back lash!
And from what I have read it is not like you do not return in kind!!
 
mailmandan said:
Oooh, sensitive. Why don't you tell us the difference between a reward and a gift. Do you see a difference?
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If everyone is acting like you then no one sees that they are wrong.
You are not addressing the points of the post. It says what it says.

God says, in Phil2:12,13 Work out your own salvation (race) with fear and trembling For It is God that works in us, both will do His good pleasure. That is to start and finish the race.

If that is a works based salvation then I say praise God work that work that I may finish the race.
 
lightbearer said:
If everyone is acting like you then no one sees that they are wrong.
You are not addressing the points of the post. It says what it says.

God says, in Phil2:12,13 Work out your own salvation (race) with fear and trembling For It is God that works in us, both will do His good pleasure. That is to start and finish the race.

If that is a works based salvation then I say praise God work that work that I may finish the race.
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Salvation is already a possession in Phil 2:12-13

So then you do believe salvation is a reward.
You contradict scripture plain as day in multiple places
You always try to put us on the defensive ... here deal with these... waiting

It is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy
(Rom 9:16).

Now the wages of the worker are not credited as a gift, but as an obligation.
Romans 4:4
 
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lightbearer said:
If everyone is acting like you then no one sees that they are wrong.
You are not addressing the points of the post. It says what it says.

God says, in Phil2:12,13 Work out your own salvation (race) with fear and trembling For It is God that works in us, both will do His good pleasure. That is to start and finish the race.

If that is a works based salvation then I say praise God work that work that I may finish the race.
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Why do you ignore the posts that prove your theories wrong, using scripture?
 
lightbearer said:
If everyone is acting like you then no one sees that they are wrong.
You are not addressing the points of the post. It says what it says.

God says, in Phil2:12,13 Work out your own salvation (race) with fear and trembling For It is God that works in us, both will do His good pleasure. That is to start and finish the race.

If that is a works based salvation then I say praise God work that work that I may finish the race.
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A race to earn salvation... good luck with that .. it is already to late since you would have to do everything Jesus did and be sinless or figure out a way to pay for your own sins.

It ain't happenin
 
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lightbearer said:
If everyone is acting like you then no one sees that they are wrong.
You are not addressing the points of the post. It says what it says.

God says, in Phil2:12,13 Work out your own salvation (race) with fear and trembling For It is God that works in us, both will do His good pleasure. That is to start and finish the race.

If that is a works based salvation then I say praise God work that work that I may finish the race.
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Acting like me? No matter how I act, if I don't agree with you, then you will find fault with me, regardless. I already addressed 1 Corinthians 9:18-27 in two posts. I don't need to address your points of your post in order to make my points. If you can't see the truth in my two posts, then you won't see it if I take the time to address your post point by point either.

In regards to Philippians 2:12-13, notice that Paul said to "work out" your salvation and not "work for" your salvation. When we "work out" at the gym, we exercise to develop our body that we already have and not to get a body. Farmers "work" the land, not in order to get the land, but to develop the land they already have.

The Greek verb rendered "work out" means "to continually work to bring something to completion or fruition." We do this by actively pursuing the process of ongoing sanctification, which is the result of being set apart for God's work and involves the process of being conformed to the image of Christ. This conforming to Christ involves the work of the person, but it's still God working in the believer to produce more of a godly character and life in the person who has already been justified by faith. Ongoing sanctification has no bearing on justification. That is, even if we don't live a sinless, perfect life (which we won't) we are still justified by faith in Christ (Romans 5:1).

The race is not about earning salvation by works and you do peddle works salvation. :( Whether believers finish the race with a gold medal, silver medal, bronze or no medal (just like an Olympic athlete) they are still justified by faith and are not disqualified from salvation. Just like Olympics athletes are not disqualified from the Olympics for not receiving a medal.
 
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mailmandan said:
Acting like me? No matter how I act, if I don't agree with you, then you will find fault with me, regardless. I already addressed 1 Corinthians 9:18-27 in two posts. I don't need to address your points of your post in order to make my points. If you can't see the truth in my two posts, then you won't see it if I take the time to address your post point by point either.

In regards to Philippians 2:12-13, notice that Paul said to "work out" your salvation and not "work for" your salvation. When we "work out" at the gym, we exercise to develop our body that we already have and not to get a body. Farmers "work" the land, not in order to get the land, but to develop the land they already have.

The Greek verb rendered "work out" means "to continually work to bring something to completion or fruition." We do this by actively pursuing the process of ongoing sanctification, which is the result of being set apart for God's work and involves the process of being conformed to the image of Christ. This conforming to Christ involves the work of the person, but it's still God working in the believer to produce more of a godly character and life in the person who has already been justified by faith. Ongoing sanctification has no bearing on justification. That is, even if we don't live a sinless, perfect life (which we won't) we are still justified by faith in Christ (Romans 5:1).

The race is not about earning salvation by works and you do peddle works salvation. :( Whether believers finish the race with a gold medal, silver medal, bronze or no medal (just like an Olympic athlete) they are still justified by faith and are not disqualified from salvation.
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And salvation can mean different things in context... it is not always a reference to spiritual salvation, the fear and trembling is reverent obedience for those who are saved, we must pour effort into our sanctification, Paul is not addressing justification.
 
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mailmandan said:
You just cannot seem to grasp that deceived make believers are mixed in with genuine believers. Hebrews 4:1 - Therefore, since a promise remains of entering His rest, let us fear lest any of you seem to have come short of it. 2 For indeed the gospel was preached to US as well as to THEM; but the word which THEY heard did not profit THEM, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. 3 For WE who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said: "So I swore in My wrath, 'They shall not enter My rest," although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

Obviously, not all of these Hebrews were genuine believers. Notice that verses 2-3 makes a distinction between US who have BELIEVED and do enter that rest and THEM who heard the word but did not mix faith with what they heard and will not enter that rest because of UNBELIEF.
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Of course I grasp that not all of them were genuine believers. The point I'm contending with is the assertion that since they were unbelievers they were always unbelievers right from the start. The text doesn't say that. You have to add that osas presupposition to the passage in order to get that out of the passage. The passage itself doesn't say that.
 
blue_ladybug said:
If we can lose salvation, then Jesus is surely being kept busy blotting names in and out of the Book of Life.
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Depending on your beliefs about the Book of Life, perhaps more names will be blotted out of the Book than retained.
When is a person's name put in the Book of Life?

"9 Once I was alive apart from the law; but when the commandment came, sin sprang to life and I died. " - Romans 7:9

When does a person's name get removed from the Book of Life? When they sin? When they reject Christ (for the last time). Or when they physically die?

blue_ladybug said:
Not to mention dying over and over again on the cross..
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That is not happening. The Father does not allow that.
Believers who go back to unbelief and are turned over to that unbelief by God can't come back.
God doesn't allow it for the very reason you cite. It crucifies Christ all over again which subjects Him to open shame.
 
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