The Millennium is a Pharisee Doctrine

[Jackson123]

No, there is not 1000 year kingdom. The kingdom is eternal. If you can see the spiritual kingdom, you won't look for a physical kingdom of the future.

Rev 20
4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony about Jesus and because of the word of God. They[a] had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands.

They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

How do you interprate the last sentence of rev20:4

Why this. Verse they come to life and reigned with Christ for 1000 years

Who are they? Born again that physically die.

You say only eternal kingdom, why they not reigned eternal If the kingdom eternal

 

[Jackson123]

Hi David
Let me ask your favor to think about it

You say we are in the 1000 years kingdom as rev 20 say.

Rev 20 also say satan is bound 1000 years so he not deceive nations

And you believe It happening now

Why a Lot of drug user, thief and crime in the world, who decieve them?

A Lot of people do not believe in Jesus now, who deceive them? Do,you believe satan that is Being bound able to deceive while the reason for bounding satan is to make him not able to decieve human

 

[Ahwatukee]

Dave-L is now in my ignore box

But I will continue to pray that God would reveal the truth to Dave-L regarding the truth of this Biblical issue.

 

[Adstar]

That would be well-nigh impossible. See Revelation 19.

I have read the entire book of revelation and i do not see a pre-tribulation rapture..

 

[Dave-L]

Rev 20
4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony about Jesus and because of the word of God. They[a] had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands.

They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

How do you interprate the last sentence of rev20:4

Why this. Verse they come to life and reigned with Christ for 1000 years

Who are they? Born again that physically die.

You say only eternal kingdom, why they not reigned eternal If the kingdom eternal

Jesus refutes a physical millennium. Until you study him, Revelation will remain off limits for a true understanding.

 

[Dave-L]

You say 1000 years is not the kingdom.

Rev 20 say Jesus reigned for 1000 years so Jesus reigned what?

Then you say in the end of 1000 years satan attack kingdom

No kingdom but attack kingdom confusing me

1000 years? A sketch would be;

The angel = Greek for messenger

the chain = the message (gospel); The gospel sent to the whole world.

the 1000 years = Satan bound from deceiving the elect. The saints rule over him. the 1000 years end = Satan loosed.

Note the 1000 years are not the kingdom. It is still here when the 1000 years end. Satan attacks the kingdom when they end and he is loosed.

Satan loosed = the Post Christian era (we now live in = imminent return of Christ) the gospel message falls on deaf ears, the world assails the Church from all quarters ushering in the end.


So in essence, Revelation 20 is a panorama of the entire New Covenant era. Not a physical kingdom of the future.

 

[Dave-L]

What’s it look like? Can you see Jesus on the throne?

You see the effects of the kingdom and Christ's ruling the nations with a rod of iron. You cannot see electricity, but if you know its traits, you can see the effects.

 

[Dave-L]

So King David's throne was/is in Heaven, at the right Hand of the Father? Show me ANYWHERE in Scripture where King David sat on his throne in heaven please.

THIS, is where Jesus is RIGHT NOW:

Acts 7:55–56; Romans 8:34; Ephesians 1:20; Colossians 3:1; Hebrews 1:3; Hebrews 8:1; Hebrews 10:12; Hebrews 12:2; 1 Peter 3:22; Revelation 3:21; Matthew 22:44; Acts 2:33
55 But he, full of the Holy Spirit, gazed into heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God. 56 And he said, “Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God.”
34 Who is to condemn? Christ Jesus is the one who died—more than that, who was raised—who is at the right hand of God, who indeed is interceding for us.
20 that he worked in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places,
Put On the New Self
3 If then you have been raised with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God.
3 He is the radiance of the glory of God and the exact imprint of his nature, and he upholds the universe by the word of his power. After making purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high,
Jesus, High Priest of a Better Covenant
8 Now the point in what we are saying is this: we have such a high priest, one who is seated at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in heaven,
12 But when Christ had offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God,
2 looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God.
22 who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, with angels, authorities, and powers having been subjected to him.
21 The one who conquers, I will grant him to sit with me on my throne, as I also conquered and sat down with my Father on his throne.
44 “‘The Lord said to my Lord,
“Sit at my right hand,
until I put your enemies under your feet”’?
33 Being therefore exalted at the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the
Holy Spirit, he has poured out this that you yourselves are seeing and hearing.

“And when thy days [David] be fulfilled, and thou shalt sleep with thy fathers, I will set up thy seed after thee, which shall proceed out of thy bowels, and I will establish his kingdom. He shall build an house for my name, and I will stablish the throne of his kingdom for ever.” 2 Samuel 7:12–13 (KJV 1900)

Note, this took place while David is still buried.

 

[Dave-L]

Apparently, it's not a thriving peaceful kingdom, more like a third world country. If this is actually the kingdom of Jesus and He has the government upon His shoulders, then I would have to say, based on experience and observation, that His governing style sucks.

The hearts of believers are joyous and peaceful. We live in a hostile world under God's wrath.

 

[Dave-L]

You are entitled to your opinion.

It's biblical fact if you care to look into it.

 

[Dave-L]

The above drivel should be stricken from CC..........it is not only laughable, but reeks of ignorance, a rejection of scripture and and is akin to a Tabloid style news article with no factual evidence....

It's Amillennialism history. You want to censor it?

 

[Dave-L]

I would really enjoy it. And I promise I will listen with an open mind and take great care in going through your verses if you provide any. Zechariah 14, Joel 3 are chapters that should be of great difficulty to the amil view.

If you realize the Church is biblical Israel and the State of Israel is not. All of the yet to be fulfilled prophecies are aimed at the Church. And are fulfilled in the spiritual realm. Go and learn from Jesus the nature of the kingdom and it will become clear.

 

[Dave-L]

(The Law of God)...

“Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm. But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully; Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;” 1 Timothy 1:7–10 (KJV 1900)

 

[tourist]

OK just for the record @preacher4truth :
- you don't believe in the Baptism of the Holy Spirit is relevant any longer
-you don't believe in the Operation of the Gifts of the Spirit today
- you don't believe in a literal 1000 millennial reign of Christ from Jerusalem
-you believe that the words of John (the one whom Jesus loved) was actually influenced by writings from 280BC as opposed to Holy Spirit revelation (as posted by @Dave-L )

You have made a statement that @Dave-L 's doctrine is solid. That's a big statement to make considering how this thread has evolved. Are we to understand from you that you too hold these above positions?

Apparently.

It's biblical fact if you care to look into it.

No it isn't.

 

[Dave-L]

Apparently.
No it isn't.

How do you prove Jesus isn't Israel as revealed in the NT?

 

[tourist]

The hearts of believers are joyous and peaceful. We live in a hostile world under God's wrath.

I am a born again believer and while my heart may be joyous that the Holy Spirit lives inside, there is nothing at all joyous in the world. The peaceful part will come later when Jesus returns to set up His 1000 year reign as stated in the book of Revelation.

 

[Dave-L]

I am a born again believer and while my heart may be joyous that the Holy Spirit lives inside, there is nothing at all joyous in the world. The peaceful part will come later when Jesus returns to set up His 1000 year reign as stated in the book of Revelation.

Revelation is full of violence. No peace there. No peace in the Jewish idea of a millennium. Sickness, sin, and death. Some kingdom that is. Only in the New Heavens and Earth does peace remain forever.

 

[tourist]

How do you prove Jesus isn't Israel as revealed in the NT?

Instead of trying to prove a negative how about you giving a verse that does prove Jesus is Israel in the NT? According to this passage from the book of Revelation Jesus has not yet set up His kingdom.


Rev 20:4-6
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for [a]a thousand years. 5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

 

[Dave-L]

Instead of trying to prove a negative how about you giving a verse that does prove Jesus is Israel in the NT? According to this passage from the book of Revelation Jesus has not yet set up His kingdom.


Rev 20:4-6
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for [a]a thousand years. 5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

This shows it is now happening.


“And when thy days [David] be fulfilled, and thou shalt sleep with thy fathers, I will set up thy seed after thee, which shall proceed out of thy bowels, and I will establish his kingdom. He shall build an house for my name, and I will stablish the throne of his kingdom for ever.” 2 Samuel 7:12–13 (KJV 1900) This happens while David is buried,

 

[tourist]

Revelation is full of violence. No peace there. No peace in the Jewish idea of a millennium. Sickness, sin, and death. Some kingdom that is. Only in the New Heavens and Earth does peace remain forever.

Revelation is indeed a book of violence but is also a book of the blessed assured hope that Jesus will one day return and that God's creation will be made new. Only then will there truly be peace and joy. Just because you don't agree with the book of Revelation you are then free to disregard and put your own unique spin on it to suit your narrative. The book of Revelation is in integral part of the Word of God.