Not By Works

[EleventhHour]

What I DO preach is against those who take the grace of God for granted. And you and your friends do this when you kick against Holiness and label this "works".

@Chris1975 more slander... We make no apologizes for preaching by faith alone apart from any and all works.
Deeds never saved... what you call holiness is works because you make it part of salvation.
At the very least admit what you teach.

Read this everyday twenty times a day maybe it will sink into your heart and mind...

8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast.

 

[EleventhHour]

The church at Laodicea were very secure!
Paul knew he could be disqualified for the prize. He said "If by any means I may attain to the resurrection from the dead." O, but you lot have it tied up. I wish I could be so complacent.
"Keep yourself in the love of God." Guess that wasn't written to you either.

Salvation is not a prize so perhaps you have not understood Paul yet.
Keeping myself in the love of God is not salvation either.

Back to the drawing board for you... salvation one thing... discipleship, sanctification another.

 

[CherieR]

TIC mode off.
Responses in Red

The main trouble I see with examining fruit is that it is so very easy that one could take that and depend on themselves rather than Jesus or judge incorrectly whether the self or others. One may judge others outside of Christ when they are not. One may judge the self outside of Christ when it is not so. Or one may judge oneself in Christ and look down on others. People can and do take things like examining fruit to extremes. Not always but it does happen.

I wonder if the key could be love. After Peter denied Jesus, he was very grieved and wept. This response I believe is because Peter did love Jesus. So, could the question of faith be do you have love for Jesus?


According to 1 John 4: 20-21...:
If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen? And this commandment have we from him, That he who loveth God love his brother also. 1 John 4:20‭-‬21 KJV https://bible.com/bible/1/1jn.4.20-21.KJV

 

[RebuildJesussChurch]

Salvation is not a prize so perhaps you have not understood Paul yet.
Keeping myself in the love of God is not salvation either.

Back to the drawing board for you... salvation one thing... discipleship, sanctification another.

You insult, which is ungodly, you ignore what you can't respond to and then have the pride to declare yourself victorious.
The necessity of humility must not be for you either.

 

[EleventhHour]

Ok. Lets do this. What is your answer to the example used of the Satanist. Is he saved or not?

Just a Yes or No.

All you are demonstrating is that you believe your works save you... because this the lowest argument to show how self worthy you are of salvation.

Once saved always saved .... and you prove nothing... deeds never saved.. it is not a sin issue for the believer... all sin was dealt with at the cross...... anger, murder, hate and every vile thing.. wrap your head around that for once... it is a grace issue.

 

[EleventhHour]

You insult, which is ungodly, you ignore what you can't respond to and then have the pride to declare yourself victorious.
The necessity of humility must not be for you either.

Insult... how is the truth insulting?

I preach Christ and secure salvation in Him... a gift that cannot be earned... what do you preach?

....becoming perfect to be saved.. that is not the Gospel... the Gospel is accepting and receiving Christ's perfection.

 

[EleventhHour]

You insult, which is ungodly, you ignore what you can't respond to and then have the pride to declare yourself victorious.
The necessity of humility must not be for you either.

I ignore.. hahaha .. I answered directly to your assertion... salvation is not a prize.

 

[Chris1975]

All you are demonstrating is that you believe your works save you... because this the lowest argument to show how self worthy you are of salvation.

Once saved always saved .... and you prove nothing... deeds never saved.. it is not a sin issue for the believer... all sin was dealt with at the cross...... anger, murder, hate and every vile thing.. wrap your head around that for once... it is a grace issue.

So no response.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

E-G "if continues to believe is required. Then we will continue to thirst."

Yep
according to that passage that is correjesus did not say you will never thirst unless you stop believing. That’s your twist

I have always maintained that a child Will continue to believe there is no must about
so stop your lies confess your sin or be seen as the sinner you are

 

[EleventhHour]

So no response.

Listen...

I answered very clearly stated once saved always saved. I am not afraid of your outlandish accusations ...

I am not going to avoid the truth of grace from fear that it may give a person the right to sin....
to deny that truth because it may give a person a right to sin........... is the same thing as saying that teaching the opposite of grace (or law) will keep a person from sinning,

Do you understand you preach law.

That's a very prevalent attitude today in religianity.

Desiring to teach law, thinking that the law restrains sin. This is an absurd idea according to the apostle Paul!

And like I stated you defame the message of grace.

When the grace message is being spoken of and in that grace message you're revealing what Christ accomplished for people's sins on the cross that He died upon for those sins, to defame that message and say that that message promotes the right to sin, that is the same thing as defaming the message of grace and the Gospel!

Think on that!!

 

[VCO]

Listen...

I answered very clearly stated once saved always saved. I am not afraid of your outlandish accusations ...

I am not going to avoid the truth of grace from fear that it may give a person the right to sin....
to deny that truth because it may give a person a right to sin........... is the same thing as saying that teaching the opposite of grace (or law) will keep a person from sinning,

Do you understand you preach law.

That's a very prevalent attitude today in religianity.

Desiring to teach law, thinking that the law restrains sin. This is an absurd idea according to the apostle Paul!

And like I stated you defame the message of grace.

When the grace message is being spoken of and in that grace message you're revealing what Christ accomplished for people's sins on the cross that He died upon for those sins, to defame that message and say that that message promotes the right to sin, that is the same thing as defaming the message of grace and the Gospel!

Think on that!!

I think they are ADDICTED TO ONGOING ARGUMENTS. I think it is time for us OSAS FAITH BELIEVERS to just ignore there posts.

Like I think you once said, "If we do not feed them, they will not reproduce."

 

[VCO]

I am wondering how following scripture makes me all over the place?

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast.

And I will respond to the rest momentarily ...first I need to read over and make notes! LOL

LOOK, that Catholic that hates protestants has rejoined under the name:
MerryChristMassHertics .

 

[EleventhHour]

LOOK, that Catholic that hates protestants has rejoined under the name:
MerryChristMassHertics .

Yes .... like an attention seeking, out of control child.

 

[PS]

Even believers are condemned to hell if they : -

Mat_5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

Mat_5:30 And if thy right hand, offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

Mat_10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell. (false teachers like OSAS)

Mat_11:23 And thou, Capernaum, which art exalted unto heaven, shalt be brought down to hell: for if the mighty works, which have been done in thee, had been done in Sodom, it would have remained until this day.

 

[Chris1975]

Listen...

I answered very clearly stated once saved always saved. I am not afraid of your outlandish accusations ...

I am not going to avoid the truth of grace from fear that it may give a person the right to sin....
to deny that truth because it may give a person a right to sin........... is the same thing as saying that teaching the opposite of grace (or law) will keep a person from sinning,

Do you understand you preach law.

That's a very prevalent attitude today in religianity.

Desiring to teach law, thinking that the law restrains sin. This is an absurd idea according to the apostle Paul!

And like I stated you defame the message of grace.

When the grace message is being spoken of and in that grace message you're revealing what Christ accomplished for people's sins on the cross that He died upon for those sins, to defame that message and say that that message promotes the right to sin, that is the same thing as defaming the message of grace and the Gospel!

Think on that!!

So is that a "Yes" ?

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Even believers are condemned to hell if they : -
[…]
Mat_11:23 And thou, Capernaum, which art exalted unto heaven, shalt be brought down to hell: for if the mighty works, which have been done in thee, had been done in Sodom, it would have remained until this day.

It seems there is a negative ['not'] in this verse:

[see at link] https://biblehub.com/text/matthew/11-23.htm

"And you, Capernaum, will not be exalted to heaven, but will be brought down to Hades! For if the miracles having taken place in you had taken place in Sodom, it would have remained until this day."

This is not a "lose-your-salvation" verse. (be sure to strike that one from your "list")

 

[Discern]

Why do you suppose the 'once saved always saved' church at large is not following their lead then?

Not just the majority of OSAS, the majority of the church, whether OSAS or otherwise.

Why? For many reasons, true of OSAS and NOSAS alike.

a. Many in the visible church aren't even saved.

b. Lack of maturity among believers

c. Lukewarm believers

d. Sunday go to meeting saints. (only put on Christ on Sundays)

e. No vision.

More could be listed...

 

[Discern]

Not just the majority of OSAS, the majority of the church, whether OSAS or otherwise.

Why? For many reasons, true of OSAS and NOSAS alike.

a. Many in the visible church aren't even saved.

b. Lack of maturity among believers

c. Lukewarm believers

d. Sunday go to meeting saints. (only put on Christ on Sundays)

e. No vision.

More could be listed...

D is somewhat inaccurate. You can't put Christ on only on Sundays. I was saying something else, and phrased it wrong.

 

[Chris1975]

1 John 1
6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth.

 

[Chris1975]

1 John 1
7 But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.

> the corollary : If we walk in Darkness, we don't have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus won't cleanse us from our sin.

John 3
18 “He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. 19 And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. 20 For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed. 21 But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be clearly seen, that they have been done in God.”