Not By Works
- Thread starter dcontroversal
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Hebrews 4. one of the gold standard verses for judeaizers. one of you guys ( and girls) favs.
so, as usual, you ignore context. Hebrews 3 is a warning about missing the rest in Christ because of unbelief, as Israel missed the promised land the first time due to unbelief. chapter 4 is farther commentary on that point.
and, none of you have ever described how you " enter " into twilight fri. if that is what is being said in Hebrews 4. ( which it is not).
so, as usual, you ignore context. Hebrews 3 is a warning about missing the rest in Christ because of unbelief, as Israel missed the promised land the first time due to unbelief. chapter 4 is farther commentary on that point.
and, none of you have ever described how you " enter " into twilight fri. if that is what is being said in Hebrews 4. ( which it is not).
-
1
- Show all
Here is a lady that is AS addicted to highlighters as I used to be. I used as MANY highlighters as she does, back when I could read the NIV Thompson Chain. That small of Font Size, I found it to be almost impossible to read about 15 years ago. So when I finally bought the New King James BIBLE, I gave up the highlighters too:
Bringing in the Greek to find a "rest from work/labour now, rest later" type of reference and I don't see it here.
Hebrews 4:1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.
We should fear therefore lest ever left remaining of the promise to enter into the rest of Him should seem any of you to have fallen short
Hebrews 4:2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
And for we are {those] having had the gospel preached just as they [did] but not did profit the message of [their] hearing them, not having been united with the faith of those having heard
Hebrews 4:3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
We enter for into the rest those having believed as He has said So I swore in the wrath of me Not shall they enter into the rest of Me And yet the works from the foundation of the world have been finished.
Hebrews 4:4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.
He has spoken for somewhere concerning the seventh [day] in this way And rested God on the day seventh from all of the works of Him.
Hebrews 4:5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.
And in this [passage] again [Not} shall they enter into the rest of Me
Hebrews 4:6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief
Since therefore it remains [for] some to enter into it, and those formerly having received the good news not did enter in because of disobedience.
Hebrews 4:7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.
Again a certain He appoints day, Today through David saying after so long a time just as it has been said Today if the voice of Him you shall hear, not harden the hearts of you
Hebrews 4:8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
If for to them Joshua had given rest, not about another He would have spoken after this day
Hebrews 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
So then there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God
Hebrews 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
The [one] for having entered into the rest of Him, also he rested from the works of him as from the own God [did]
Hebrews 4:11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.
We should be diligent therefore to enter into that rest so that not by the same anyone example should fall of disobedience.
Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
Living is for the word of God and active and sharper than any sword two-edged even penetrating as far as the division of soul and the spirit of joints and also marrows, and able to judge [the] thoughts and intentions of [the] heart.
Hebrews 4:13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.
And not there is creature hidden before Him all things however [are] uncovered and laid bare to the eyes of Him to whom [is] our reckoning
Hebrews 4:14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession.
Having therefore a high priest great having passed through the heavens Jesus the Son of God we should hold firmly to [our] confession
Hebrews 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.
Not for have we a high priest not being able to sympathize with the weaknesses of us [one] having been tempted however in all things by the same way, without sin.
Hebrews 4:16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.
We should come therefore with boldness to the throne of grace so that we may receive mercy and grace may find for in time of need help
Hebrews 4:1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.
We should fear therefore lest ever left remaining of the promise to enter into the rest of Him should seem any of you to have fallen short
Hebrews 4:2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
And for we are {those] having had the gospel preached just as they [did] but not did profit the message of [their] hearing them, not having been united with the faith of those having heard
Hebrews 4:3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
We enter for into the rest those having believed as He has said So I swore in the wrath of me Not shall they enter into the rest of Me And yet the works from the foundation of the world have been finished.
Hebrews 4:4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.
He has spoken for somewhere concerning the seventh [day] in this way And rested God on the day seventh from all of the works of Him.
Hebrews 4:5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.
And in this [passage] again [Not} shall they enter into the rest of Me
Hebrews 4:6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief
Since therefore it remains [for] some to enter into it, and those formerly having received the good news not did enter in because of disobedience.
Hebrews 4:7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.
Again a certain He appoints day, Today through David saying after so long a time just as it has been said Today if the voice of Him you shall hear, not harden the hearts of you
Hebrews 4:8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
If for to them Joshua had given rest, not about another He would have spoken after this day
Hebrews 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
So then there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God
Hebrews 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
The [one] for having entered into the rest of Him, also he rested from the works of him as from the own God [did]
Hebrews 4:11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.
We should be diligent therefore to enter into that rest so that not by the same anyone example should fall of disobedience.
Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
Living is for the word of God and active and sharper than any sword two-edged even penetrating as far as the division of soul and the spirit of joints and also marrows, and able to judge [the] thoughts and intentions of [the] heart.
Hebrews 4:13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.
And not there is creature hidden before Him all things however [are] uncovered and laid bare to the eyes of Him to whom [is] our reckoning
Hebrews 4:14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession.
Having therefore a high priest great having passed through the heavens Jesus the Son of God we should hold firmly to [our] confession
Hebrews 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.
Not for have we a high priest not being able to sympathize with the weaknesses of us [one] having been tempted however in all things by the same way, without sin.
Hebrews 4:16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.
We should come therefore with boldness to the throne of grace so that we may receive mercy and grace may find for in time of need help
But they did miss the rest of God and not until Jesus went back and offered it through grace did they receive. But they had all died before they received it. God worked then rested when the work was done. Jesus worked and then rested when the work was done. Doesn't it make sense to you THAT IN THE WAY OF REST FROM LABOURS, we should finish our labour before we rest also?? We are already resting from the burden of the law. Now you don't want to work either when there is so much work to be done??? How does Gods Word get spread to the whole world if all those who come to Christ stop and rest???
Once again, I have no idea what you are talking about. I would need chapter and verse from Gods Word. I know nothing about being "Jewish" except what is written in there. I have absolutely no recall of seeing twilight fri ever, whether you think I should know this or not. And why you say I keep it eludes me, and will until you explain what it is.
How about you document your points with Verses from God as that would really speed things up. You never comment on all the points I make using Gods word for the dividing of the law so I don't know what part you find in error. You say I miss the point but you wont tell me where to find your point. As usual, I guess.
Yes, someone did keep the law perfectly. And it isn't about being justified by the works of the law, it is getting PAST being justified, PAST being saved, getting PAST being made righteous, PAST the very first steps, PAST the 'milk' and ON TO THE MEAT so that you can be USEFUL to God. Learning the "deeper" things.
Hebrews 5:9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Hebrews 5:10 Called of God an high priest after the order of Melchisedec.
Hebrews 5:11 Of whom we have many things to say, and hard to be uttered, seeing ye are dull of hearing.
Hebrews 5:12 For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.
Hebrews 5:13 For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.
Hebrews 5:14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.
Hebrews 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
Hebrews 6:2 Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.
Hebrews 6:3 And this will we do, if God permit.
Hebrews 5:9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Hebrews 5:10 Called of God an high priest after the order of Melchisedec.
Hebrews 5:11 Of whom we have many things to say, and hard to be uttered, seeing ye are dull of hearing.
Hebrews 5:12 For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.
Hebrews 5:13 For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.
Hebrews 5:14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.
Hebrews 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
Hebrews 6:2 Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.
Hebrews 6:3 And this will we do, if God permit.
The Jewish day begins at shortly before Sunset, so the SABBATH is from approximately Sunset on Friday to approximately
Sunset on Saturday.
https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/526873/jewish/The-Jewish-Day.htm
https://www.chabad.org/library/arti...Why-do-Jewish-holidays-begin-at-nightfall.htm
HE TOLD YOU CORRECTLY:
Wikepedia:
According to halakha (Jewish religious law), Shabbat is observed from a few minutes before sunset on Friday evening until the appearance of three stars in the sky on Saturday night.[1] Shabbat is ushered in by lighting candles and reciting a blessing.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shabbat
It is based on GOD's TIMETABLE:
Genesis 1:5 (ASV)
5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, one day.
-
3
- Show all
I meet people where they are in life. You obviously haven’t been taught much of anything regarding grace through faith.
I respond to you worker bees so people who are new to the faith don’t become imprisoned by incorrect teachings that take away from the fullness of Jesus Christ.
I respond to you worker bees so people who are new to the faith don’t become imprisoned by incorrect teachings that take away from the fullness of Jesus Christ.
-
2
-
1
- Show all
E
rest,
people who are working, need rest, they take rest when they sit to take lunch or sit on break, or sleep, basically they stop working
god promises us who come to him rest, what is this?
it is when we stop working, in the biblical case, stop working at the law. Stop trying to meet some standard you think needs to be met to either make you qualified for entrance to heaven (salvation) or makes you appear like a god fearing god loving person, who is morally good, and acceptable to god as a child (makes him happy)
rest Is not going back to the law and trying to obey it, trying to live up to the standard you can NEVER live up to begin with, rest is sitting still, trusting god to work through you, and moving forward, knowing god has your back no matter what!
Paul spent his years as an apostle fighting the judiasers who continued to try to push gods children to go back to the burden their fathers could never live up to (the law) and its sad 2000 years later we still have people making the same mistake. Then saying they believe In rest
people who are working, need rest, they take rest when they sit to take lunch or sit on break, or sleep, basically they stop working
god promises us who come to him rest, what is this?
it is when we stop working, in the biblical case, stop working at the law. Stop trying to meet some standard you think needs to be met to either make you qualified for entrance to heaven (salvation) or makes you appear like a god fearing god loving person, who is morally good, and acceptable to god as a child (makes him happy)
rest Is not going back to the law and trying to obey it, trying to live up to the standard you can NEVER live up to begin with, rest is sitting still, trusting god to work through you, and moving forward, knowing god has your back no matter what!
Paul spent his years as an apostle fighting the judiasers who continued to try to push gods children to go back to the burden their fathers could never live up to (the law) and its sad 2000 years later we still have people making the same mistake. Then saying they believe In rest
-
3
-
3
- Show all
rest,
people who are working, need rest, they take rest when they sit to take lunch or sit on break, or sleep, basically they stop working
god promises us who come to him rest, what is this?
it is when we stop working, in the biblical case, stop working at the law. Stop trying to meet some standard you think needs to be met to either make you qualified for entrance to heaven (salvation) or makes you appear like a god fearing god loving person, who is morally good, and acceptable to god as a child (makes him happy)
rest Is not going back to the law and trying to obey it, trying to live up to the standard you can NEVER live up to begin with, rest is sitting still, trusting god to work through you, and moving forward, knowing god has your back no matter what!
Paul spent his years as an apostle fighting the judiasers who continued to try to push gods children to go back to the burden their fathers could never live up to (the law) and its sad 2000 years later we still have people making the same mistake. Then saying they believe In rest
people who are working, need rest, they take rest when they sit to take lunch or sit on break, or sleep, basically they stop working
god promises us who come to him rest, what is this?
it is when we stop working, in the biblical case, stop working at the law. Stop trying to meet some standard you think needs to be met to either make you qualified for entrance to heaven (salvation) or makes you appear like a god fearing god loving person, who is morally good, and acceptable to god as a child (makes him happy)
rest Is not going back to the law and trying to obey it, trying to live up to the standard you can NEVER live up to begin with, rest is sitting still, trusting god to work through you, and moving forward, knowing god has your back no matter what!
Paul spent his years as an apostle fighting the judiasers who continued to try to push gods children to go back to the burden their fathers could never live up to (the law) and its sad 2000 years later we still have people making the same mistake. Then saying they believe In rest
HE that believes on the SON is having everlasting life <--JESUS BY FAITH IS OUR REST!
This is the work of God the Father-->>>BELIEVE ON HIM WHOM HE HATH SENT
BE NOT REMOVED FROM THE simplicty found in CHRIST
It pleased God, by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
HER whole premise is false.....Moving on to maturity or not has ZERO impact on our BIRTH which has ALREADY TAKEN PLACE by faith....it is ETERNAL and GIVEN IRREVOCABLY......and for SURE cannot be gained, earned, maintained, procured, embellished etc. by what we do or don't do!
-
4
-
1
-
1
- Show all
E
Amen
the land is theirs, now, how blessed they would be in the land was dependent on how much they trusted god after they got it, but it was and is still there’s, and will be forever.
gods gifts and promises are irrevocable, whether it be land, or salvation.
i am reminded of pauls words when I see people trying to push law
1 Timothy 1:7
desiring to be teachers of the law, understanding neither what they say nor the things which they affirm
the land is theirs, now, how blessed they would be in the land was dependent on how much they trusted god after they got it, but it was and is still there’s, and will be forever.
gods gifts and promises are irrevocable, whether it be land, or salvation.
i am reminded of pauls words when I see people trying to push law
1 Timothy 1:7
desiring to be teachers of the law, understanding neither what they say nor the things which they affirm
-
3
-
2
- Show all