Not By Works

[Macabeus]

@Lightskin So then either show me where I taught “works or else” or admit you misspoke.

Saying that I said “works or else” could be a error on your part, but to maintain it while confronted would be a lie

So will you admit you had no basis for saying that. Because if you don’t, you are maintaining it, which is a lie. And so far, Undergrace is still maintaining that I said regeneration maintained by good works. If she admits her error, well. But she does not have a good track record in similar situations

@Lightskin So if you and undergrace are not liars, you will both either back up your claims or withdraw them

When I misquoted @dcontroversal and he corrected me, I thought he said faith was not a gift from God, I went back and reread saw that i mispoke
and admitted my mistake and apologized.

If you want to present the postss) you misunderstood, I will give some added clarification

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I can never understand why those who think they don`t have to obey any commands will be accepted by God. The goats are sent away because of sins they haven`t repented for.

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Name one?

Name one person who thinks it is ok to sin?

I have only met a few in my whole entire life that thought this. And they did not stick around the church very long

 

[Macabeus]

Name one?

Name one person who thinks it is ok to sin?

I have only met a few in my whole entire life that thought this. And they did not stick around the church very long

When I quote descriptive verses about obedience, several here accuse me of being a works salvationist. That basically backs up what he said

Do you want post numbers. I can only give numbers, because I don’t know how to do links on my cell

 

[Lightskin]

Well, if she has integrity, she will either give substance to her accusation or admit she was mistaken. But this has happened with her many times in the past, and I can’t remember one time she did either that’s why I call her hit and run. She lies about you and then when called on it, she goes silent on the matter

You said I lied about you as well and I wouldn’t do that; misunderstood you maybe, but didn’t lie. With that, I must lean towards UG’s innocence.

 

[VCO]

The last trump is the end of judgment. It’s time for true believers to leave Earth because they’re not scheduled for wrath. All that is left is wrath.

There will be a shift.

All true believers will not suffer God’s wrath.

It is the Last TRUMP of Rash HaSanah, and it has been called by that name for 3000 years, AND PAUL ATTENDED THE FEAST OF TRUMPETS, or Rash HaSanah almost every year of his Adult life. What do you think an adult strict JEW would think the LAST TRUMP meant ? ? ? Does the LAST TRUMP mean Something HE WAS VERY FAMILIAR WITH, or Something that would not be written until 31 years or so, after his DEATH.

(Quote) . . .
More specifically, you will learn in this article that “the last trump” that is part of the Rapture description in the Apostle Paul’s first letter to the Church in Corinth is actually a clear reference to the 100th trumpet blast of the Feast of Trumpets. The 100th Trump is “the last trump.”

100 Trumpet Blasts
During the Feast of Trumpets

This is because 100 trumpet blasts are actually blown during the Feast of Trumpets. Moreover, there are different kinds of trumpet blasts and they have different names and descriptions associated with them. The last trump has a name as well, and we will see what it is in just a few moments.

So “the last trump” of the Feast of Trumpets is not the last time that a trumpet will ever be blown. It is specifically referring to the last trumpet blast of the Feast of Trumpets which is celebrated every year.

That is trumpet number 100. Every year. During the Feast of Trumpets.
. . .
https://www.the-wise-shall-understand.com/the-last-trump/
(End Quote)



(Quote)
. . .
The Feast of Trumpets

September 25th is also known as Yom Teruah, the Feast of Trumpets.3 Observed on the First and Second of Tishri, the celebration actually begins 29 days earlier: a series of over 90 trumpet blasts accrue for a final blowing of blasts on the climax of the celebration, the Teki'ah Gedolah, the Great Blowing.

In the rabbinical literature, there are many details that are quite provocative. Among the most significant is the use of the shofar, the ram's horn, instead of the usual silver Temple trumpets. (If you visit the Temple Institute in Jerusalem, you can see the silver trumpets that have been fashioned for use in the coming Temple.)

The shofar is associated with the Akedah, Abraham's offering of Isaac on Mount Moriah, as detailed in Genesis 22. Rabbinical tradition associates the left horn of the ram as the "first trump" and the right horn as the "last trump".

A distinguishing feature of the celebration is the last, climactic blast, the Teki'at Shofar. This is not the usual series of short bursts, signalling alarm or bad news. Rather, it is a long blast, signalling victory or good news. It is this last blast that is referred to as the last trump.

Paul's Mystery

In Paul's Resurrection Chapter, I Corinthians 15, he describes that strange event which has now become known as "The Rapture" of the Church:

Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.​

. . .
https://www.khouse.org/articles/1995/105/ (End Quote)


The 100th Trumpet of Rash HaSanah IS the LAST TRUMP, and Paul would have KNOW THAT. The Book of Revelation was not written until 96 AD. Paul died in 70 AD.

1 Corinthians 15:51-53 (ASV)
51 Behold, I tell you a mystery: We all shall not sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

Look at the FAMILIARITY that Paul speaks about the TERM. That most likely would not Be there, IF he were writing about something that would not be WRITTEN about until John wrote Revelation, in 96 AD, 31 years or so, after Paul died.

(Quote) . . .
There are three trumpets that have a name: the first trump, the last trump and the great trump. Each has a specific day in the year: first trump is associated with Pentecost, last trump is associated with Rosh HaShanah and the great trump is associated with Yom Kippur.

[In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. (1 Cor 15:52)]​

"When the Shofar is blown on Rosh HaShana, three different types of noises are sounded. The first is a 'teki'ah.' This sound is one long continuous burst. The second sound is called a 'shevarim.' It consists of three shorter blasts. The third sound is the 'teruah.' The teruah is a set of nine short bursts of sound, a staccato blast. The Gemora in Rosh HaShana tells us that these later two sounds are meant to sound like crying: '. . . drawing a long sigh. . . uttering short piercing cries.' The Ben Ish Chai writes that these sounds are meant to contrast with the tekiah. The tekiah, he explains, is a sound of triumph and joy, while the shevarim and teruah are sounds of pain and suffering. Because of the opposing feelings they represent, when one blows the shofar, he is not to connect the tekiah with the others, by blowing the sounds with the same breath."
. . .
http://www.justgivemethetruth.com/rosh_hashanah.htm

 

[Lightskin]

So then either show me where I taught “works or else” or admit you misspoke.

Saying that I said “works or else” could be a error on your part, but to maintain it while confronted would be a lie

So will you admit you had no basis for saying that. Because if you don’t, you are maintaining it, which is a lie. And so far, Undergrace is still maintaining that I said regeneration maintained by good works. If she admits her error, well. But she does not have a good track record in similar situations

I have already stated that your posts bring forth confusion. I don’t understand how someone who embraces the fullness of God’s grace through faith alone could be misunderstood by so many people. DC, this site’s champion of champions regarding God’s grace has you on ignore. Why?

 

[Macabeus]

You said I lied about you as well and I wouldn’t do that; misunderstood you maybe, but didn’t lie. With that, I must lean towards UG’s innocence.

But you are not interested in checking to see if what you said was accurate. Therefore you are not feeling the need to speak truthfully. If you wanted to speak truthfully, you would want to know if what you said is true. And she would also want to know if what she said is true. But saving face and not humbling yourself to admit an error is possibly more important than speaking accurately and representing people fairly to some. Hope you’re not one.

Can you at least admit that you MIGHT have mispoke when you said I attached or else to obedience. Because that was completely out of the blue. I never said anything close to that

 

[Macabeus]

I have already stated that your posts bring forth confusion. I don’t understand how someone who embraces the fullness of God’s grace through faith alone could be misunderstood by so many people. DC, this site’s champion of champions regarding God’s grace has you on ignore. Why?

Because he believes unrepentant adulterers and idolators go to heaven, and I don’t believe such words are descriptive of believers, per 1 Cor 6:9-11. I already directed you to a link where he said this, but you refused to read it, choosing instead to keep your head buried in the sand

The fact that you called DC a champion shows why you misunderstand. He teaches that a person can be saved 50 years and never do any works. The Bible does not describe believers this way anywhere. In fact, descriptive verses like 1 John 2:3 refute him soundly

Good works are not prescriptive to bring salvation, they are descriptive of those who know God and understand the intent of salvation

So when you abandon your subbiblical theology, you will understand my posts. Your subbiblical views have put blinders on you

 

[UnderGrace]

I have already stated that your posts bring forth confusion. I don’t understand how someone who embraces the fullness of God’s grace through faith alone could be misunderstood by so many people. DC, this site’s champion of champions regarding God’s grace has you on ignore. Why?

I would have to agree and admit I do not understand his posts and I have felt this way all along.
My new concerted effort to not respond!!

This quote to me means sin confession is a requirement for salvation. Anyway it does not matter since most of us know there is only ONE repentance unto salvation not many, and that >>> salvation is eternal.


@Macabeus

You rub elbows with people who say that a believing fornicator, will go to heaven even if he doesn’t repent. You want documentation

 

[Macabeus]

Because he believes unrepentant adulterers and idolators go to heaven, and I don’t believe such words are descriptive of believers, per 1 Cor 6:9-11. I already directed you to a link where he said this, but you refused to read it, choosing instead to keep your head buried in the sand

The fact that you called DC a champion shows why you misunderstand. He teaches that a person can be saved 50 years and never do any works. The Bible does not describe believers this way anywhere. In fact, descriptive verses like 1 John 2:3 refute him soundly

Good works are not prescriptive to bring salvation, they are descriptive of those who know God and understand the intent of salvation

So when you abandon your subbiblical theology, you will understand my posts. Your subbiblical views have put blinders on you

@Lightskin. A dog does not meow, a sheep does not wallow in mud, and an unrepentant adulterer and idolater does not inherit eternal life. DC thinks they do. I think the Bible describes regenerate folks differently.
The things I speak of descriptive of regenerate people, not prescriptions on how to be saved. How is that confusing to you?

 

[Lightskin]

But you are not interested in checking to see if what you said was accurate. Therefore you are not feeling the need to speak truthfully. If you wanted to speak truthfully, you would want to know if what you said is true. And she would also want to know if what she said is true. But saving face and not humbling yourself to admit an error is possibly more important than speaking accurately and representing people fairly to some. Hope you’re not one.

Can you at least admit that you MIGHT have mispoke when you said I attached or else to obedience. Because that was completely out of the blue. I never said anything close to that

Not only could I admit being wrong, I would rejoice in being wrong, and I mean that. But again, many people challenge you, and there’s a reason for that. Now please share your thoughts on 1 John 3:9.

 

[Macabeus]

I would have to agree and admit I do not understand his posts and I have felt this way all along.
My new concerted effort to not respond!!

This quote to me means sin confession is a requirement for salvation. Anyway it does not matter since most of us know there is only ONE repentance unto salvation not many, and that >>> salvation is eternal.


@Macabeus

Where is sin confession in that statement? Did you just go and pull a text that is unrelated to your claim, because the one that mentions confession did not work? 🤣And according to Paul, do fornicators go to heaven. See 1 Cor 6:9-11

 

[Macabeus]

Not only could I admit being wrong, I would rejoice in being wrong, and I mean that. But again, many people challenge you, and there’s a reason for that. Now please share your thoughts on 1 John 3:9.

I asked you to do so first. Please proceed.

 

[Lightskin]

Because he believes unrepentant adulterers and idolators go to heaven, and I don’t believe such words are descriptive of believers, per 1 Cor 6:9-11. I already directed you to a link where he said this, but you refused to read it, choosing instead to keep your head buried in the sand

The fact that you called DC a champion shows why you misunderstand. He teaches that a person can be saved 50 years and never do any works. The Bible does not describe believers this way anywhere. In fact, descriptive verses like 1 John 2:3 refute him soundly

Good works are not prescriptive to bring salvation, they are descriptive of those who know God and understand the intent of salvation

So when you abandon your subbiblical theology, you will understand my posts. Your subbiblical views have put blinders on you

When Jesus stated salvation is through faith in Him, He didn’t put any disclaimers on it. Either we have salvation through faith in Jesus alone or we do not. There is nothing we can or can not do to alter His free, irrevocable gift of grace. Not my words, Jesus’.

 

[Macabeus]

Not only could I admit being wrong, I would rejoice in being wrong, and I mean that. But again, many people challenge you, and there’s a reason for that. Now please share your thoughts on 1 John 3:9.

Many people challenge me because I believe verses like 1 John 2:3 are descriptive of believers and they mistake that for works salvation. That is also why they do not understand. They have subbiblical views that color their interpretation of scripture

 

[Macabeus]

When Jesus stated salvation is through faith in Him, He didn’t put any disclaimers on it. Either we have salvation through faith in Jesus alone or we do not. There is nothing we can or can not do to alter His free, irrevocable gift of grace. Not my words, Jesus’.

How does the Bible describe regenerate people. Again, we are not talking about how to get saved. We are talking descriptive statements, ie how does the Bible describe regenerate believers? What else does regeneration accomplish IN US?

 

[Lightskin]

@Lightskin. A dog does not meow, a sheep does not wallow in mud, and an unrepentant adulterer and idolater does not inherit eternal life. DC thinks they do. I think the Bible describes regenerate folks differently.
The things I speak of descriptive of regenerate people, not prescriptions on how to be saved. How is that confusing to you?

Jesus says no one that has been given to Him by our Heavenly Father shall be lost. NO ONE! What don’t you understand about that?

You admittedly disagree. By your standards, the power of sin is greater than the power of the saving grace of Jesus Christ. You need to wake up and realize we serve a Mighty God, not some wet noodle flapping around in the wind.

 

[Macabeus]

@Lightskin. A dog does not meow, a sheep does not wallow in mud, and an unrepentant adulterer and idolater does not inherit eternal life. DC thinks they do. I think the Bible describes regenerate folks differently.
The things I speak of descriptive of regenerate people, not prescriptions on how to be saved. How is that confusing to you?

What happens INSIDE a person when they are regenerated by God, UG? Answer this, and you will have the interpretive key to everything I have said

People in my church, I’m not a pastor understand this. All the great preachers of the past understood what I am saying. What you guys believe is recent and modern

 

[Lightskin]

Many people challenge me because I believe verses like 1 John 2:3 are descriptive of believers and they mistake that for works salvation. That is also why they do not understand. They have subbiblical views that color their interpretation of scripture

You’re stuck on 1 John and yet you admit to still being a sinner. What gives?

 

[Macabeus]

You’re stuck on 1 John and yet you admit to still being a sinner. What gives?

Do you think 1 John teaches we are sinless? Why is my admitting to not being sinless a problem to 1 John?

What does 1 John 3:9 teach. Hint. It does not teach perfection. If you know how to exegete a scripture, you ought to be able to answer in a few words. Read it in its context, that’s part of exegesis