The Tribulation and the Church, WHEN?

[GaryA]

No, it doesn't mean that Jesus has to be on the earth. Don't you think that God can mete out His wrath through the angels? If what you said was the truth, how do you explain the following which Jesus interjects after the 6th bowl has been poured out?

"The sixth angel poured out his bowl on the great river Euphrates, and its water was dried up to prepare the way for the kings from the East. Then I saw three impure spirits that looked like frogs; they came out of the mouth of the dragon, out of the mouth of the beast and out of the mouth of the false prophet. They are demonic spirits that perform signs, and they go out to the kings of the whole world, to gather them for the battle on the great day of God Almighty.

“Look, I come like a thief! Blessed is the one who stays awake and remains clothed, so as not to go naked and be shamefully exposed.”

If Jesus was already on the earth during that time, He wouldn't be saying "Look, I come like a thief" at the opening of the 6th seal.

As far as "thinking about this for a while," I have spent the last 45 years studying this. Jesus is not going to return to the earth until after the 7th bowl has been poured out.

Nope. Sorry. Jesus will be here - probably "in the air" - for the entire duration of all of the vials.

 

[GaryA]

There is no resurrection post trib.

The only post 7yr trib resurrection is the general resurrection after the mil.

There is no 7-year tribulation period.

The pre-trib position interpretation of Daniel 9:24-27 is totally incorrect.

 

[GaryA]

The wrath of God is the entire tribulation period, which is seven years in length.

Wrong, and wrong.

In fact, the WoG is entirely outside of the span of time that is the GT.

It is post-trib.

Until you and others understand this, you will always err in your interpretation of end-time events.

Unless and until you and others reach the point of realization and understanding that all of the "legs" that hold up the pre-trib platform are lies of Satan and not the truth, you will always err in your interpretation of end-time events.

 

[GaryA]

Revelation is about God's wrath and all related information.

The WoG is the 'Vials' - no more and no less.

 

[GaryA]

Where in the world did you get the idea that the 144,000 are the only saved people on the earth?

Revelation 7:

3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.

All who are saved are sealed.

At that point in time, there are only 144,000 born-again Christians on earth.

 

[GaryA]

The male child is a collective name representing the 144,000 who will be caught up to God and His throne in the middle of the seven years.

The male child in Revelation 12 is Jesus.

 

[GaryA]

Post it.
It says "from heaven"
Gathered FROM HEAVEN.
That is what it says.
Not what you want or hope.

Mark 13:

27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

 

[GaryA]

Several.
According to the bible

Would you care to list them?

Keep in mind that each-and-every-one of them needs to match the criteria of my question.

 

[GaryA]

Re read it.
They are indeed gathered after the gt.
FROM HEAVEN...NOT EARTH.

By any chance have you read the account from the book of Mark?

(see post #447)

 

[jb]

By their claim of the church going through the time of God's wrath...

The Great Tribulation is NOT the wrath of God, it is caused by the wrath of the Devil because he has been cast out of the heavenlies into the earth and knowing that his time left upon earth before he is put in the Abyss at the Lord's 2nd Coming is short! Rev 12v7-9,12-14, 20v1-3, Dan 12v1,6,7.

 

[Absolutely]

At the moment of resurrection - during the change from old mortal body to new glorified body - the old body [literally] dies. I believe this is sufficient for the requirement...

In other words, those who go through "the change" alive - still - technically - die.

No they don't.
You made that up or were "taught" it

 

[Absolutely]

Mark 13:

27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

Yes .
Two statements from heaven and one "from the uttermost" of earth.
But your deal needs "from earth" if you transpose 1 thes 4 onto mat 24.

Confusion if you try to make tje rapture at the second coming.

Would you care to list them?

Keep in mind that each-and-every-one of them needs to match the criteria of my question.

Jesus in acts
The 2 witnesses
Rev 14
1 thes 4

 

[Absolutely]

The Great Tribulation is NOT the wrath of God, it is caused by the wrath of the Devil because he has been cast out of the heavenlies into the earth and knowing that his time left upon earth before he is put in the Abyss at the Lord's 2nd Coming is short! Rev 12v7-9,12-14, 20v1-3, Dan 12v1,6,7.

Look who sends the 4 horsemen and what they do.
Many times in the ot God judged israel THROUGH using other nation to bring tribulation.
In a sense you are correct,but the entire 7 yr period is tribulation/wrath.

 

[Absolutely]

The WoG is the 'Vials' - no more and no less.

Tribulation can come from God,man,storms,pestilence or the devil.

 

[Absolutely]

Wrong, and wrong.

In fact, the WoG is entirely outside of the span of time that is the GT.

It is post-trib.


Unless and until you and others reach the point of realization and understanding that all of the "legs" that hold up the pre-trib platform are lies of Satan and not the truth, you will always err in your interpretation of end-time events.

I can PROVE postrib is false.
You string verses together and leave the pretrib rapture verses out.
You guys MUST SHOW a postrib rapture .
Even Jesus used Noah and lot.
BOTH PRETRIB dynamics.
None of the "taken" settings is in a tore up earth or running cave to cave from the ac.

But the RAPTURE / TAKEN /
GATHERING/HARVEST of rev 14 is a gathering DURING the gt.
So 1 thes "dead in Christ rising first" must be pauls mistake since you say they rise after rev 14.
You have the living preceeding the dead in christ of 1 thes 4.

Postrib is the product of the early church.
Israel was scattered . Removed from prophecy. They were hamstrung as far as seeing the bible prophecy.
Postrib rapture is impossible

 

[Absolutely]

Wrong, and wrong.

In fact, the WoG is entirely outside of the span of time that is the GT.

It is post-trib.


Unless and until you and others reach the point of realization and understanding that all of the "legs" that hold up the pre-trib platform are lies of Satan and not the truth, you will always err in your interpretation of end-time events.

The rapture is the gathering of the bride.

You,nor any postrib adherents bring that to the table.

The greatest event about to happen and you are oblivious.

You are doctrine centered.
Trib/earth/earthling/waiting on the appearance of the ac.....centered.
You see the entirety of the gt from earth.
Heaven sees it from heaven and from the gathering of the bride.
But show me ANY trib or wrath with ANY "TAKEN" dynamics.

Ruth/Boaz
Two in a field/two working together (mat 24)
1 thes 4
Lot
noah
The 5 wise virgins.

Nothing.
All dynamics point to normal life during the rapture harvest.

You place it in a war zone with NO NATURAL LIVING ON THE PLANET

 

[Absolutely]

There is no 7-year tribulation period.

The pre-trib position interpretation of Daniel 9:24-27 is totally incorrect.

A week is 7
We see a 3.5 yr period in rev. We see a time frame AFTER the 3.5 yr.
(Middle)
Two 3.5 yr periods
No brainer
7 yr gt

 

[Absolutely]

Wrong, and wrong.

In fact, the WoG is entirely outside of the span of time that is the GT.

It is post-trib.


Unless and until you and others reach the point of realization and understanding that all of the "legs" that hold up the pre-trib platform are lies of Satan and not the truth, you will always err in your interpretation of end-time events.

Pot <> Kettle

 

[Absolutely]

Nope. Sorry. Jesus will be here - probably "in the air" - for the entire duration of all of the vials.

Postrib rapture has so many bizarre bandaids.

You actually end up being anti pretrib rapture instead of having a plausable case.
You must backpeddle over our verses.
None of your verses fits.
All of ours do.

None of the postrib teachers bring in the bride verses/dynamics or our verses.

 

[Absolutely]

Rev 14
A gathering by Jesus,DURING the gt.

Hmmmmm