Christ is God
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The scriptures define the gospel. As it teaches us we abide in him . Not Creed writers
You have a messed up the one source of Christian faith as it is written . Anything outside of it is to disagree with God.
Not as it is written in creeds according to your law .
The bible was created to define what a Christians must believe. Not the private interpretation of men as their own personal bias or creed . Creeds are not laws .They are personal opinions .
note that in KJV 'my' is italicized: indicating that it is not in the actual text.
this is John 10:30 in Greek --
ἐγὼ καὶ ὁ πατὴρ ἕν ἐσμεν
ἐγὼ = I
καὶ = and
ὁ = the
πατὴρ = Father
ἕν = one
ἐσμεν = are
this is the greek word for 'my'
μου
believe what?
believe what Thomas believes, in the context. this is what Thomas believes: that the risen one who stood in front of him is his Lord and God. Thomas saw Him, and Thomas believed. he is not an example of unbelief but belief, and we are blessed, because we have not seen, but even so, we believe.
believe what?
Please tell us where in the creeds there is anything contrary to the Bible. The early elders wrote them to define what a Christian must believe. Refute that if they are wrong!!
CREEDS
When disputes flared up over the trinity of God and the doctrine of the nature of Jesus Christ, creeds were formulated. The standard for their formulation was the New Testament, that is the doctrine of Christ and His Apostles.
The Apostles' Creed (Apostolicum), the Creed of Nicaea-Constantinople, and the Athanasian Creed thus came into being. The basic tenets of the Apostles' Creed were summarised in the second century and lightly expanded in the fourth century. The Creed of Nicaea-Constantinople brings the trinity of God to special expression.
THE APOSTLES CREED
First there was a Roman statement of faith which was expanded into the Roman Creed. By 212 it was expanded into the Apostles Creed.
I believe in God the Father Almighty, Maker of Heaven and Earth; And in Jesus Christ, His only Son, our Lord, who was conceived by the Holy Spirit, born of the virgin Mary, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, dead, and buried. The third day he rose again from the dead. He ascended into Heaven, and sits at the right hand of God the Father Almighty; from there He shall come to judge the living and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy universal 2 church, the communion of saints, the forgiveness of sins, the resurrection of the body, and the life everlasting.
Amen.
NICENE CREED (ORIGINAL 325)
Created by the first Council of Nicea called by Emperor Constantine because of the emerging conflict over who and what Jesus was that was threatening to split the church.
We believe in one God, the Father Almighty, Maker of all things visible and invisible.
And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, begotten of the Father the only-begotten; that is, of the essence of the Father, God of God, Light of Light, very God of very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father; By whom all things were made both in heaven and on earth;
Who for us men, and for our salvation, came down and was incarnate and was made man; He suffered, and the third day he rose again, ascended into heaven; From thence he shall come to judge the quick and the dead.
And in the Holy Ghost.
But those who say: 'There was a time when he was not;' and 'He was not before he was made;' and 'He was made out of nothing,' or 'He is of another substance' or 'essence,' or 'The Son of God is created,' or 'changeable,' or 'alterable'— they are condemned by the holy catholic and apostolic Church.
NICENE CREED (REVISED 381)
Modified at the first Council of Constantinople. It is the only authoritative ecumenical statement of the Christian faith accepted by the Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, Anglican, and the major Protestant denominations. Also known as the Niceno–Constantinopolitan Creed.
I believe in one God, the Father Almighty, Maker of Heaven and Earth, and of all things seen and unseen.
And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all ages; God of God, Light of Light, true God of true God; begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father; by whom all things were made.
Who, for us all for our salvation, came down from Heaven, and was incarnate by the Holy Spirit of the virgin Mary, and was made man; and was crucified also for us under Pontius Pilate; He suffered and was buried; and the third day He rose again, in accordance with the Scriptures; and ascended into Heaven, and sits at the right hand of the Father; and He shall come again, with glory, to judge the living and the dead; whose kingdom shall have no end.
And I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord and Giver of Life; who proceeds from the Father; 2 who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified; who spoke by the prophets.
And I believe in one holy universal 3 and apostolic Church. I acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins; and I look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come.
Amen.
I am learning a good understanding as to how the "Son of man" is used in comparison to the "Son of God" is vital in hearing God through those portions. It can get confusing. But God is not that kind of author or it would seem to me.
Yes, Faith does not come by seeing. Its the other way around. Natural man walks by sight. He has no faith by which he could believe as a way of seeing him who has not literal face as a rudiments of this world . we do not know Christ after the rudiments of this world. He cannot be found in a science laboratory 101 . The Faithful Creator is set apart from His creation. .
He reminded Thomas not to be "faithless" but rather "beleive". .Thomas was is one of the few spoken of in 2 Corinthian 5:16 that did know Christ after the corrupted flesh of the Son of man, Jesus.
God is not a man as us and nether is their a fleshly mediator between God and man as a infallible umpire (Job 9:33) called a daysman. or what Catholics must call a Pope.
God is without DNA. The one time demonstration that required corrupted flesh satisfied the just demands of the law of the father. . (Isaiah 53) The father and son working together in prefect harmony and submission to each other . We are healed by the stripes inflicted by the father, as the Son suffered the pangs of hell out for strength he sent messengers to complete the work The peace of God that surpases human unstasning as a understanding reveled by the word of God.
According to the promise of Joel in Acts..
Acts 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
The Father not seen poured out his unseen Holy Spirit on the flesh of Jesus (seen) Who again of his own flesh said; it could never profit as if it was a living Spirit. Roman 8 informs us of his flesh typified as sinful. That it, the demonstration must be corrupted to typify sin . . . to do what the letter of law could not do . . . . "produce as a work of Christ's grace" according to his three day labor of love.
That was accomplished as a result of the ressurection and not in respect to his corrupted fleshly birth as the Son of man. But by the unseen, the spirit of holiness .
No such thing as "the corrupted flesh of holiness". That's a Catholic tradition by which they try and sneak in a queen who they say her flesh is the power of holiness and they appoint their own father as the infallible mediator. We must be careful how we hear.. .
Romans 1:3-5 King James Version (KJV) Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; (that seen) And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name:
No power as the son of man who again clearly informed us his flesh profits for zero .We must walk by faith of the Son of God . Jesus as the Son of man our example, refused to stand in the holy place of the father
Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: Of sin, because they believe not on me; Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more; 7-10
Above "if I go not away," teaches we cannot serve two masters. the flesh seen and the Spirit not seen. The comforter is in respect to one our father in heaven the same brings to our mind that which he ahs previously taiught od by which we do abide in Him
The problem being corrupted flesh gives birth to Corrupted flesh God gies birth to our new spirt that will never die flesh
Regardless who it is as to what the eyes see the prescription below must be applied if we are to walk by faith (the unseen
2 Corinthians 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.
Having the interpretation prescription (20/20) we can apply them on as shown applied in the next chapter. Now you see him was powerless in the flesh . Now you see the flesh not. . Noe w the Spirit can come. The Holy Spirit refused worship in respect to the flesh even with those who were privileged
2 Corinthians 5:16 Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now "henceforth" know we him no more.
That Jesus
oop sorry reply twice, well if you read further on the chapter, verse 31
But these are written that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the son of God;and that believing ye might have life in his name.
Does your bible not have that explanation?
Huh interesting so what does it say for verse 29 cos both times 'My' isnt in italics there.
that's John's express purpose for his gospel, yes. everything in it proclaims who He is; his whole gospel, it is a proof.
that is precisely why John included the fact that Jesus calls Thomas's confession that He is the risen Lord and God "belief" -- this proves who He is, and it is here for you to read so that you also can 'believe' as Jesus defines belief.
see also John 11:25 -- in the same book for the same reason
It would seem to demonstrate where the power to believe comes from Jesus as the Son of God. And not reckoned after Jesus as the Son of man, the temporal what the eyes see. He said His flesh profits for nothing.
The flesh as the Son of man according to his corrupted flesh has no power to save
Romans 1:4 And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:
No power after the birth.
ὁ πατήρ μου ὃ δέδωκέν μοι
ὁ - theπατήρ - father
μου - of me / my
ὃ - who
δέδωκέν - has given
μοι - to me
i'm just reading this from here:
https://biblehub.com/text/john/10-29.htm
i don't know any more Greek than what i can glean from using these tools, and i'm smart enough to know that there are nuances that these tools cannot explain to me that i should know to properly translate & understand what the original language is telling us.
seriously, let's learn Greek together. you're right, unless we are looking at the same text, it's hard to really be on the same page. and the text in this case isn't our native language.
do you have an android phone? we'll find an app and teach ourselves Greek
it will take a while, but there are lots of resources for us am sure. and worth it, i bet
Verily, verily I say unto you, the hour shall come, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear it shall live.
For as the Father hath life in himself, so likewise hath He given to the Son to have life in Himself.
And hath given Him power also to execute judgment, in that He is the Son of man.
Marvel not at this: for the hour shall come, in the which all that are in the graves, shall hear His voice.
(John 5:25-28, 1599 GNV)
the voice of the Son of God quickens, and the voice of the Son of man judges, and He is One, as God is One.The LORD killeth and maketh alive: bringeth down to the grave and raiseth up.
(1 Samuel 2:6, 1599 GNV)
the voice of the Son is the voice of the LORDthe word of the Son is the word of God; the Son is the Word, and the Words is with God, and the Word is God
I se it a little differently. I would offer..
One voice working together as two. The Father and Son .The voice of the one Spirit. The Holy Spirit of God. The voice of one faith as a work or labor of love. Together bringing the peace of God that surpasses human understanding . That is what make us different then the faithful Creator who is not a creation as us. .
Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, (not seen) that ye believe on him (seen) whom he hath sent. J
Not of their own selves lest they boast in their own flesh
45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me. John 6: 45
We are given a great parable that preaches the gospel. I beleive it can be used as demonstration of the verse above .
The father typified by Moses the law giver teaching the son typified by Aaron the priest . God teaching the priest what to say as the priest seen comes under the authority of one not seen (again signified by Moses, as the law of God.
In that parable God uses Moses to typify our unseen father and God in heaven and Aaron the priest to represent the Son of man, Jesus our high priest after the new testament manner no longer after the flesh of any nation .
And Moses said unto the Lord, O my Lord, I am not eloquent, neither heretofore, nor since thou hast spoken unto thy servant: but I am slow of speech, and of a slow tongue. And the Lord said unto him, Who hath made man's mouth? or who maketh the dumb, or deaf, or the seeing, or the blind? have not I the Lord? Now therefore go, and I will be with thy mouth, and teach thee what thou shalt say. And he said, O my Lord, send, I pray thee, by the hand of him whom thou wilt send. And the anger of the Lord was kindled against Moses, and he said, Is not Aaron the Levite thy brother? I know that he can speak well. And also, behold, he cometh forth to meet thee: and when he seeth thee, he will be glad in his heart. And thou shalt speak unto him, and put words in "his mouth": and I will be with thy mouth, and with his mouth, and will teach you what ye shall do.And he shall be thy spokesman unto the people: and he shall be, even he shall be to thee instead of a mouth, and "thou" shalt be to "him" instead of God. Exodus 4:10-16
Two or three working togehther in perfect harmony and mutual submission to each other .. .. .. never one alone.
The correct term would be "subjection to God the Father" (for both the Son and the Spirit). Not mutual submission.
The same applies within a marriage. Just as the Head of Christ is God (the Father), and as Christ is the Head of the man, the man is the head of the woman (1 Cor 11:3). Not mutual submission as some falsely teach.
Hi Thanks for the reply
I am not sure if its false .It seems to be what Isaiah 53 the( gospel) is saying . The father striking the Son with the letter of the law the Son of man Jesus losing strength crying out to the father ..the father in mutual submission send a messenger to help him finish the labor of their love. It takes two to establish a government of perfect peace .One that surely does surpass human understanding
.I see it like below, today and yesterday
A Loving authority + willing submissiveness = Peace and blessing or peace as a blessing.
Not one person of the one God head ever functions independently of the others.
.I see it like below, today and yesterday
A Loving authority + willing submissiveness = Peace and blessing or peace as a blessing.
Not one person of the one God head ever functions independently of the others.
Different for us fallen creature It surely does surpass human understanding
ROFLlet's learn to read Greek
If you have a smartphone put a web browser on biblegateway.com. Then you can select book and chapter. After that you can select any translation you want. This even includes foreign languages.
My smartphone is my Bible!! Easier to carry. I keep it in my shirt pocket.
In the year that King Uzziah died, I saw the Lord sitting on a throne, high and lifted up, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above it stood seraphim; each one had six wings: with two he covered his face, with two he covered his feet, and with two he flew. And one cried to another and said:
“Holy, holy, holy is the Lord of hosts;
The whole earth is full of His glory!”
The whole earth is full of His glory!”
And the posts of the door were shaken by the voice of him who cried out, and the house was filled with smoke.
(Isaiah 6:1-4)
But although He had done so many signs before them, they did not believe in Him, that the word of Isaiah the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spoke:
“Lord, who has believed our report?
And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?”
And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?”
Therefore they could not believe, because Isaiah said again:
“He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts,
Lest they should see with their eyes,
Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn,
So that I should heal them.”
Lest they should see with their eyes,
Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn,
So that I should heal them.”
These things Isaiah said when he saw His glory and spoke of Him.
(John 12:37-41)
(John 12:37-41)