The Gospel continues to be misunderstood

[Hevosmies358]

Excellent presentation brother Nehemiah.
Cosign 100%!

 

[Guojing]

Umm, MAD, the dry baptism, age of Grace does not begin with Paul. It begins with Christ.

If you share that view, then you have to believe that water baptism is necessary for salvation.

Jesus commanded that in mark’s version of the great commission. Peter followed that to the letter in his first preaching in acts 2

 

[Nehemiah6]

But once the age of Grace came thru Paul, he tells us, "Christ did not send me to baptize", this practice is no longer required for anything...

If you mean by that that water baptism is not necessary for Christians today, that too is incorrect. The quotation from Paul simply established that his primary responsibility was to preach the Gospel, but in the same context baptism was required and others baptized new converts while Paul baptized only a few.

1 CORINTHIANS 1 (WATER BAPTISM NECESSARY)
13 Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?
14 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but [except] Crispus and Gaius;
15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.
16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Even though the Gospel is quite simple, it continues to be misunderstood and/or misrepresented. Many people are not sure to this day whether salvation is by grace through faith in Christ and His finished work of redemption, or whether baptism is necessary for salvation, or perhaps other good works, or the sacraments, are necessary for salvation. Then there are some who claim that God arbitrarily elects some for salvation, and others for damnation (which would be a violation of the character of God as well as a travesty of the Gospel). Therefore we need to be clear from Scripture are to what exactly is the Gospel, and how God saves sinners purely by His grace.

1. Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners: This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief. (1 Tim 1:15)

2. God sent His Son into the world so that the whole world of humanity would be saved: For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. (John 3:17)

3. Sinners are saved by believing on the Lord Jesus Christ and calling upon the Name of the Lord: And [he] brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house... [no mention of baptism at this point, but baptism must follow immediately, as seen in the next few verses]

That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. (Acts 16:30,31; Rom 10:9-13).

4. The Gospel is the Good News that Christ died for our sins and rose again for our justification: Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the Gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures... And therefore it was imputed to him [Abraham] for righteousness. Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him; But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead; Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification. (1 Cor 15:1-4; Rom 4:22-25)

5. We are saved (justified) by grace through faith in Christ alone, and His finished work of redemption, not by works of righteousness which we have done: Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God... For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. (Rom 5:1,2; Eph 2:8,9)

6. Repentance is necessary for the remission of sins and for salvation: And [Christ] said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem... Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost... Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord... And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent (Lk 24:46,47; Acts 2:38; 3:19; 17:30).

Most confusion comes when dealing with our hearts, who we truly are and our emotional reaction to life.
I have seen formula believers, who believe the words in isolation, yet live as if the words are not true.

Others who believe the ideas, yet try and live a righteous life without love, with a heart focused on
the world.

The idea of being born again, starting life with Christ as a child, relearning every aspect of how
we relate and why is not part of their approach. To even talk about open hearts and transformation
is resisted as if this is evil and wrong.

Little wonder therefore such believers cause so much strife as not only are they preaching a different
gospel they have no spiritual experience to actually discover Jesus or grow in faith, as their God is
not the God of repentance and rebirth, but sinners going to heaven where God does everything, and
the believer just rests.......

 

[fredoheaven]

If you share that view, then you have to believe that water baptism is necessary for salvation.

Jesus commanded that in mark’s version of the great commission. Peter followed that to the letter in his first preaching in acts 2

You must somehow know the language of the KJV you use and immerse yourselves before we go in. My view, water baptism is still today but it can't save. It only pictures the Gospel of Christ, the basis of which is Christ dbr. 1 Cor. 15

 

[Guojing]

You must somehow know the language of the KJV you use and immerse yourselves before we go in. My view, water baptism is still today but it can't save. It only pictures the Gospel of Christ, the basis of which is Christ dbr. 1 Cor. 15

Mark 16

15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Acts 2

37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

These words present difficulty to believers who don't believe that with the salvation of Paul, there was a change in dispensation.

They can only ignore these verses and claimed that it was actually the DBR of Jesus that saved, but they forgot, ironically, that this "secret/mystery" was revealed only to the Apostle Paul and not to the 12.

You cannot have it both ways, either you believe that the Gospel of Grace only came thru the Apostle Paul, or you stick to the Gospel of the Kingdom that was revealed in Jesus during the 4 Gospels, with different rules for how one can be saved.

 

[Guojing]

If you mean by that that water baptism is not necessary for Christians today, that too is incorrect.

So if a Christian don't get water baptized now, what do you think will happen to him?

 

[fredoheaven]

Mark 16

15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Acts 2

37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

These words present difficulty to believers who don't believe that with the salvation of Paul, there was a change in dispensation.

They can only ignore these verses and claimed that it was actually the DBR of Jesus that saved, but they forgot, ironically, that this "secret/mystery" was revealed only to the Apostle Paul and not to the 12.

You cannot have it both ways, either you believe that the Gospel of Grace only came thru the Apostle Paul, or you stick to the Gospel of the Kingdom that was revealed in Jesus during the 4 Gospels, with different rules for how one can be saved.

In the KJV, Mark 16 doesn’t teach baptismal regeneration here my friend. It is the preaching of the Gospel that saves. The baptism here mention is the result of belief in Christ and his gospel. You have to note that this is already a post resurrection, the Cross has already been served by Christ and it is the same message Paul carries own to preach the message of the cross. Btw, the conjunction “and” is used to mean “before”, introducing a consequence, actual or predictive, hence the word “baptized” is dropped in the second clause. The underlined part seems not to favor what you are inferring. Am I saved if I believed the preaching of the gospel? The Bible says YES! If I don’t believe the Gospel, Mark says I am damned. What if I am baptized(wet) am I saved? NO! But if I believed (saved) and as a result I am baptized, do I still been saved? Jesus says, I AM! The baptism(wet) here mention is actually the fruit of belief in Christ and his Gospel.

In Acts 2:28, this present no baptismal regeneration here as you supposed. Your case system does not in any way harmonizes the whole counsel of God. Your division seems imperfect.

And the Bible says, Gospel kingdom and Grace gospel was preached by Christ and Paul...

 

[Guojing]

And the Bible says, Gospel kingdom and Grace gospel was preached by Christ and Paul...

What Gospel do you think Christ preach during his time on Earth? Are you talking about the Gospel of the Kingdom and the Gospel of Grace?

Or are you saying he preached the same Gospel as what he gave Paul to preach among the Gentiles?

 

[fredoheaven]

What Gospel do you think Christ preach during his time on Earth? Are you talking about the Gospel of the Kingdom and the Gospel of Grace?

Or are you saying he preached the same Gospel as what he gave Paul to preach among the Gentiles?

Mark 1:1 The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;
John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
John 1:17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

The truth is Jesus preached the Gospel of grace, because, grace begins with Christ and not Paul. Paul and the other apostles are only continuing what Christ preached during his earthly ministry. The scripture of truth says of Paul’s doctrine in the later of Acts say soemthing about preaching the kingdom of God.

Acts 28:31 Preaching the kingdom of God, and teaching those things which concern the Lord Jesus Christ, with all confidence, no man forbidding him.

 

[Guojing]

Mark 1:1 The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;
John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
John 1:17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

The truth is Jesus preached the Gospel of grace, because, grace begins with Christ and not Paul. Paul and the other apostles are only continuing what Christ preached during his earthly ministry. The scripture of truth says of Paul’s doctrine in the later of Acts say soemthing about preaching the kingdom of God.

Acts 28:31 Preaching the kingdom of God, and teaching those things which concern the Lord Jesus Christ, with all confidence, no man forbidding him.

So you have never heard of the term the 'Gospel of the Kingdom'?

 

[Magenta]

 

[GtrPkr]

Would it be more accurate to say that repentance is a necessary symptom or sign that one has been baptized in the spirit?

 

[notuptome]

Would it be more accurate to say that repentance is a necessary symptom or sign that one has been baptized in the spirit?

After the caterpillar has become a butterfly is there a noticeable difference? The change is profound when a lost soul is born again into the kingdom of God.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[FollowHisSteps]

After the caterpillar has become a butterfly is there a noticeable difference? The change is profound when a lost soul is born again into the kingdom of God.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

This is so profound, I often wonder how anyone thinks fruit, change of attitude, life, approach,
will not demonstrate themselves straight away. It is like saying a butterfly cannot fly, because
it is hidden but will show itself later. The caterpillar is really a butterfly in slow development.

As if this could ever be true.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Would it be more accurate to say that repentance is a necessary symptom or sign that one has been baptized in the spirit?

The answer is found in Acts 2:38, where the gift of the Holy Ghost is the same as baptism (immersion) with the Holy Spirit. Repentance comes first, then the gift of the Spirit.

 

[Nehemiah6]

So you have never heard of the term the 'Gospel of the Kingdom'?

You will find that term generally in the Gospels. But there is no difference, since Paul was also preaching "the kingdom of God", and Jesus said that except a man be born again he can neither see nor enter the Kingdom of God. Everything pertaining to the Christian and the Church is within the Kingdom of God. So is the Gospel.

And Paul dwelt two whole years in his own hired house, and received all that came in unto him, Preaching the kingdom of God, and teaching those things which concern the Lord Jesus Christ, with all confidence, no man forbidding him. (Acts 28:30,31)

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Umm, MAD, the dry baptism, age of Grace does not begin with Paul. It begins with Christ.

I'm not really wanting to contribute anything to the overall thread here, but this caught my eye and it made me wonder (in view of what you have written here) what you believe about the following verse:

"Now He said this concerning the Spirit, whom those having believed in Him were about to [or, were certain to] receive; for the Spirit was not yet given, because Jesus was not yet glorified." John 7:39

Do you mean the risen and glorified Christ? (or before?)

 

[Sipsey]

I have always been taught that this verse speaks of the Work of the Holy Spirit, is that correct?

Ephesians 4:5-6
5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

 

[Hevosmies358]

So if a Christian don't get water baptized now, what do you think will happen to him?

Not addressed to me but as per usual I will still answer, whatcha gonna do about it?

Nothing will happen to him. HOWEVER: If you have a professing Christian who refuses to get baptized, you can question his conversion, unless there is a good reason for him avoiding water baptism.

I have always said: This is the SELF INFLICTED wound of Christianity, we keep post-poning baptism and we keep debating it instead of just doing it the Bible way, the SECOND someone confesses Jesus as Lord and puts his faith in Jesus, DUNK EM.

Problem solved, debate ended.