Blaspheme of the Holy Spirit

[eternally-gratefull]

That's OK, I am no one you should fear by not believing, that is between You and God!!
But since you claim to be of God and know Him, your stance makes it apparent that you find the connection between John and Polycarp and what Polcarp to claim is false:

I am glad you have made that clear!!

All I have said, is when it comes to scripture and polycarp I will chose scripture all the time

If polycarp says somethign that can not be proven in scripture. I will not give it a second thought


But it is good to see you are just as proud as usual. So proud you think you know what everyone thinks.

Yeah, Good luck with that

 

[obedienttogod]

All I have said, is when it comes to scripture and polycarp I will chose scripture all the time

If polycarp says somethign that can not be proven in scripture. I will not give it a second thought


But it is good to see you are just as proud as usual. So proud you think you know what everyone thinks.

Yeah, Good luck with that

I don't have to know what you think, your answer is clear what you think. Your answer reflects that you do not even want to acknowledge this claim could be factual. But still, even using the Bible, Paul said, Tongues CEASE (when that which is PERFECT has come):

Since the Holy Spirit had already arrived and was established, we know Paul is not speaking of the Holy Spirit. That only leaves one other option, When Yeshua returns. And since we know He has not returned, and we know He is the only thing left to come that is PERFECT, (the antichrist and false prophet would obviously never fit this bill) leaves us to the return of Yeshua.

And by proxy of Him not yet returning, we know Tongues have not ceased.

Polycarp, is just an example of providing example that Tongues and ALL GIFTS were still active and remained active because Yeshua had not yet returned!!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I don't have to know what you think, your answer is clear what you think. Your answer reflects that you do not even want to acknowledge this claim could be factual. But still, even using the Bible, Paul said, Tongues CEASE (when that which is PERFECT has come):

Since the Holy Spirit had already arrived and was established, we know Paul is not speaking of the Holy Spirit. That only leaves one other option, When Yeshua returns. And since we know He has not returned, and we know He is the only thing left to come that is PERFECT, (the antichrist and false prophet would obviously never fit this bill) leaves us to the return of Yeshua.

And by proxy of Him not yet returning, we know Tongues have not ceased.

Polycarp, is just an example of providing example that Tongues and ALL GIFTS were still active and remained active because Yeshua had not yet returned!!

I never said tongues has ceased. In fact i have stated over and over I do not believe that is the case

Dude stop trying to think you are this great man of wisdom and know everyone you talk to

You keep sticking your foot in your mouth because you have utterly no idea what your talking about concerning what others believe.

Polycarp is not proof of anything. But hey, if you think so. All the power to you. Just for once, I suggest you stop thinking you know what everyone thinks.

 

[obedienttogod]

I never said tongues has ceased. In fact i have stated over and over I do not believe that is the case

Dude stop trying to think you are this great man of wisdom and know everyone you talk to

You keep sticking your foot in your mouth because you have utterly no idea what your talking about concerning what others believe.

Polycarp is not proof of anything. But hey, if you think so. All the power to you. Just for once, I suggest you stop thinking you know what everyone thinks.

As a human being with limited knowledge I do not have a clue about you.
But as one with the Gift of Discernment, I do see more than you want me to.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

As a human being with limited knowledge I do not have a clue about you.
But as one with the Gift of Discernment, I do see more than you want me to.

You do not see Jack. (About me) , You have multiple times tried to tell me what I believe and gotten it wrong

Stick to the word. And lets discuss the word. And stop trying to think you know everyone.. We have far to many people who think they have that gift, who just make themselves look bad by continually trying to discern what others think.

 

[corazondeldei]

Remember the op. It states if someone is a Cessationist. That they basically are doomed forever with no hope of repentance.

why? Because the blasphemy of the spirit will NEVER BE FORGIVEN. Once you commit the sin, Your lost with no hope.

I mean it is one thing to defend your belief, but it is a far cry other to condemn a whole group of people, Imagine how many people have truly received Christ, and did many works through the power of God, and was a mature brother in christ, being sent to hell because he did not believe in a few gifts

It is interesting to know who is working inside a person. Calling a person who is manifesting a gift of the Spirit as demonic is like calling the one who leads that person to manifest a certain gift like the gift of healing as beelzebub or "NOT OF GOD" just as this phrase is usually or regularly used by a certain group as I see it in another thread to refer to those who are preaching or promoting obedience to God, which i'm sure that belzeebul will not lead someone to do.

Just my view.

NIV1984 Matthew 12:22-32
Jesus and Beelzebub Then they brought him a demon-possessed man who was blind and mute, and Jesus healed him, so that he could both talk and see. All the people were astonished and said, “Could this be the Son of David?” But when the Pharisees heard this, they said, “It is only by Beelzebub, the prince of demons, that this fellow drives out demons.” Jesus knew their thoughts and said to them, “Every kingdom divided against itself will be ruined, and every city or household divided against itself will not stand. If Satan drives out Satan, he is divided against himself. How then can his kingdom stand? And if I drive out demons by Beelzebub, by whom do your people drive them out? So then, they will be your judges. But if I drive out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you. “Or again, how can anyone enter a strong man’s house and carry off his possessions unless he first ties up the strong man? Then he can rob his house. “He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters. And so I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.

God bless.

 

[KnowMe]

No one.

I know that all to well, hehe...

 

[eternally-gratefull]

It is interesting to know who is working inside a person. Calling a person who is manifesting a gift of the Spirit as demonic is like calling the one who leads that person to manifest a certain gift like the gift of healing as beelzebub or "NOT OF GOD" just as this phrase is usually or regularly used by a certain group as I see it in another thread to refer to those who are preaching or promoting obedience to God, which i'm sure that belzeebul will not lead someone to do.

Just my view.

NIV1984 Matthew 12:22-32
Jesus and Beelzebub Then they brought him a demon-possessed man who was blind and mute, and Jesus healed him, so that he could both talk and see. All the people were astonished and said, “Could this be the Son of David?” But when the Pharisees heard this, they said, “It is only by Beelzebub, the prince of demons, that this fellow drives out demons.” Jesus knew their thoughts and said to them, “Every kingdom divided against itself will be ruined, and every city or household divided against itself will not stand. If Satan drives out Satan, he is divided against himself. How then can his kingdom stand? And if I drive out demons by Beelzebub, by whom do your people drive them out? So then, they will be your judges. But if I drive out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you. “Or again, how can anyone enter a strong man’s house and carry off his possessions unless he first ties up the strong man? Then he can rob his house. “He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters. And so I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.

God bless.

Is that person lost forever with no hope of salvation or not?

Can you answer the question?

 

[corazondeldei]

Is that person lost forever with no hope of salvation or not?

Can you answer the question?

Hi there bro. I am not the judge but the scripture says that blasphemy to the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven. Does the scripture not say that the WORD will judge us?

NIV1984 John 12:44-50
Then Jesus cried out, “When a man believes in me, he does not believe in me only, but in the one who sent me. When he looks at me, he sees the one who sent me. I have come into the world as a light, so that no one who believes in me should stay in darkness. “As for the person who hears my words but does not keep them, I do not judge him. For I did not come to judge the world, but to save it. There is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words; that very word which I spoke will condemn him at the last day. For I did not speak of my own accord, but the Father who sent me commanded me what to say and how to say it. I know that his command leads to eternal life. So whatever I say is just what the Father has told me to say.”

Jesus said that God's command leads to eternal life just as HE also said that He will be with His disciples until the end, those who would preach the Gospel of salvation, baptize and teach obedience unto all nations, to them who are in the body of Christ which HE WILL SAVE. The body of Christ WILL BE presented to Him as a pure virgin. The body is made up of many parts that does it's work.

NIV1984 Ephesians 4:11-16
It was he who gave some to be apostles, some to be prophets, some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers, to prepare God’s people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ. Then we will no longer be infants, tossed back and forth by the waves, and blown here and there by every wind of teaching and by the cunning and craftiness of men in their deceitful scheming. Instead, speaking the truth in love, we will in all things grow up into him who is the Head, that is, Christ. From him the whole body, joined and held together by every supporting ligament, grows and builds itself up in love, as each part does its work.

Please read 1 Corinthians chapter 12 to get a better view.

NIV1984 Ezekiel 3:18-21
When I say to a wicked man, ‘You will surely die,’ and you do not warn him or speak out to dissuade him from his evil ways in order to save his life, that wicked man will die for his sin, and I will hold you accountable for his blood. But if you do warn the wicked man and he does not turn from his wickedness or from his evil ways, he will die for his sin; but you will have saved yourself. “Again, when a righteous man turns from his righteousness and does evil, and I put a stumbling block before him, he will die. Since you did not warn him, he will die for his sin. The righteous things he did will not be remembered, and I will hold you accountable for his blood. But if you do warn the righteous man not to sin and he does not sin, he will surely live because he took warning, and you will have saved yourself.”

When it was written that those who blaspheme against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, what does it mean to you?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Hi there bro. I am not the judge but the scripture says that blasphemy to the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven. Does the scripture not say that the WORD will judge us?

NIV1984 John 12:44-50
Then Jesus cried out, “When a man believes in me, he does not believe in me only, but in the one who sent me. When he looks at me, he sees the one who sent me. I have come into the world as a light, so that no one who believes in me should stay in darkness. “As for the person who hears my words but does not keep them, I do not judge him. For I did not come to judge the world, but to save it. There is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words; that very word which I spoke will condemn him at the last day. For I did not speak of my own accord, but the Father who sent me commanded me what to say and how to say it. I know that his command leads to eternal life. So whatever I say is just what the Father has told me to say.”

Jesus said that God's command leads to eternal life just as HE also said that He will be with His disciples until the end, those who would preach the Gospel of salvation, baptize and teach obedience unto all nations, to them who are in the body of Christ which HE WILL SAVE. The body of Christ WILL BE presented to Him as a pure virgin. The body is made up of many parts that does it's work.

NIV1984 Ephesians 4:11-16
It was he who gave some to be apostles, some to be prophets, some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers, to prepare God’s people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ. Then we will no longer be infants, tossed back and forth by the waves, and blown here and there by every wind of teaching and by the cunning and craftiness of men in their deceitful scheming. Instead, speaking the truth in love, we will in all things grow up into him who is the Head, that is, Christ. From him the whole body, joined and held together by every supporting ligament, grows and builds itself up in love, as each part does its work.

Please read 1 Corinthians chapter 12 to get a better view.

NIV1984 Ezekiel 3:18-21
When I say to a wicked man, ‘You will surely die,’ and you do not warn him or speak out to dissuade him from his evil ways in order to save his life, that wicked man will die for his sin, and I will hold you accountable for his blood. But if you do warn the wicked man and he does not turn from his wickedness or from his evil ways, he will die for his sin; but you will have saved yourself. “Again, when a righteous man turns from his righteousness and does evil, and I put a stumbling block before him, he will die. Since you did not warn him, he will die for his sin. The righteous things he did will not be remembered, and I will hold you accountable for his blood. But if you do warn the righteous man not to sin and he does not sin, he will surely live because he took warning, and you will have saved yourself.”

When it was written that those who blaspheme against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, what does it mean to you?

Once again (why is this so hard a question?)

The op said people who do this have commited the blasphemy of the Holy SPirit

If this is true, they can never be saved again, even if they repent, because blasphemy of HS can never be forgiven

Do you AGREE with the op that those people are doomed forever with no hope of salvation

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Now now, let's play nice. Even if they don't.

It's interesting seeing all these one sided conversations between others and those I've ignored

I was responding to Obedient...not whoever 'they' are. we were playing nice, but I don't we are playing

that is the xcuse so many give for saying gifts (guess which 1) are not for today

so yah know...they don't have knowledge either or they would know different

 

[7seasrekeyed]

I always get a kick thinking about those towns Jesus couldn't heal in because He couldn't prove He was in-network

I suspect he could have healed

but why should He have?

after all, people of no faith today do not get all kinds of blessings dumped on them. they do enjoy the rain though

 

[7seasrekeyed]

1.The bible itself says the gifts will cease; according to you, this means that God will change?!
2.Did the gifts start at Pentecost? does it mean God changed at that moment?
3. Are you serious?

1. no it doesn't. if tongues ceased, then you have no knowledge either. is that true?

2. what changes daily are people.

3. as serious as death

are you having fun?

you seem to have such fun in these threads

nothing of value though

just the same ole you telling us God is a liar and does not do what He says He does

that's as serious as death

 

[7seasrekeyed]

I think we need to pull this back on topic, blaspheme, altho it's reasonable to touch on specific gifts that are most often denied.

And we must remember there is a difference between being misinformed, and actually coming out and speaking the words. I think the latter is a very small group.

But to re-derail my own thread, I wonder, sometimes...

Paul said we won't all speak in tongues (or healing or et al). So it's ridiculous for any of us to think we all should. For those who don't, could the fact that they don't color their study on the subject? Could there be an element in cessationism, that tries to explain why some people don't receive it in the face of those who falsely claim they must?

well who turned it into tongues again?

and now they are putting words in your mouth

I suggest we do not respond to anymore posts about tongues here

certain people just insert themself and deliberately change the op or try to make it into something it never was

you asked a question. now we are told you reached a conclusion

it's ridiculous

preposterous also

what do they care anyway if we spend all day long doing what they say is of the devil?

are they afraid someone else might inquire of God whether or not these things be true?

 

[Noose]

1. no it doesn't. if tongues ceased, then you have no knowledge either. is that true?

2. what changes daily are people.

3. as serious as death

are you having fun?

you seem to have such fun in these threads

nothing of value though

just the same ole you telling us God is a liar and does not do what He says He does

that's as serious as death

The bible talks of cessation, yes even knowledge ceases:

1 Cor 13:8 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away.

The idea that when Jesus comes, people will be like zombies not knowing nothing- the same idea you are trying to insinuate and teach here is just laughable but also pitiable.

Cessation is nothing close to this idea, cessation is about individuals being gifted with specific capabilities within the congregation so that they use these abilities to enlighten others as they are enlightened by others with different capabilities. The idea that one or two people stand above others with certain capabilities. These ceased in the 1st century after the church was fully established.
In that sense, knowledge ceased so that no one stands above others claiming to be knowledgeable in this church era just as it was prophesied:

Jer 31:
31“The days are coming,” declares the Lord,
“when I will make a new covenant
with the people of Israel
and with the people of Judah.

32It will not be like the covenant
I made with their ancestors
when I took them by the hand
to lead them out of Egypt,
because they broke my covenant,
though I was a husband to d them, e ”
declares the Lord.

33“This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel
after that time,” declares the Lord.
“I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.

34No longer will they teach their neighbor,
or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest,”
declares the Lord.

 

[corazondeldei]

Once again (why is this so hard a question?)

The op said people who do this have commited the blasphemy of the Holy SPirit

If this is true, they can never be saved again, even if they repent, because blasphemy of HS can never be forgiven

Do you AGREE with the op that those people are doomed forever with no hope of salvation

Good morning bro. You have said that we have to stick to the WORD and I also believe that we DON'T have to go beyond what is written(1 Corinthians 4:6).

We know that God is a loving and forgiving God who fulfils His every word and promises. The only problem I see regarding God's forgiveness of the blasphemy is for those unrepentant and DISOBEDIENT people who think that by believing ALONE in that very moment, they were saved and are always saved. That their sins in the past , present and future were all forgiven so they find no need to repent and ask for forgiveness anymore and therefore changing the grace of our God into a license for immorality.

Jesus told the church in Sardis to remember what they have heard and received and to repent and OBEY it because He has not found their deeds complete in the sight of God. Do you think that these people Jesus was referring to have not yet repented and obeyed God? Of course not. And this is the reason why we need to continue and stand firm in our FAITH to the end. We have to ask for forgiveness to the Father as Jesus has taught us in the Lords prayer and FORGIVE those who sinned against us. And if we have committed blasphemy to the Holy Spirit which is said to be unforgivable, if we truly believe in a loving, merciful and forgiving God, then we have to repent and ask for His forgiveness, OBEY His commands, turn away from our wicked life and walk in His Way, as we patiently and eagerly await our Savior from heaven, Jesus Christ our Lord.

THERE IS A JUDGMENT DAY AND A JUDGE.

God's Mercy will triumph over judgment.
Glory be to God. Amen.

NIV1984 Ezekiel 3:18-21
When I say to a wicked man, ‘YOU WILL SURELY DIE,’ and you do not warn him or speak out to DISSUADE HIM FROM HIS EVIL WAYS in order to SAVE his life, that wicked man will die for his sin, and I will hold you ACCOUNTABLE for his blood. But if you do WARN the wicked man and he DOES NOT TURN from his wickedness or from his evil ways, he will die for his sin; but you will have saved yourself. “Again, when a righteous man turns from his righteousness and does evil, and I put a stumbling block before him, he will die. Since you did not warn him, he will die for his sin. The righteous things he did will not be remembered, and I will hold you accountable for his blood. But if you do warn the righteous man NOT TO SIN and he does not sin, HE WILL SURELY LIVE because HE TOOK WARNING, and you will have saved yourself.”

 

[7seasrekeyed]

"Noose, post: 3912195, member: 238750"]The bible talks of cessation, yes even knowledge ceases:

1 Cor 13:8 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away.

The idea that when Jesus comes, people will be like zombies not knowing nothing- the same idea you are trying to insinuate and teach here is just laughable but also pitiable.

I never heard of such a thing. more of your personal doctrine then? does it keep you awake at night? I see you are back to your default position of mocking because you are angry. try to control that. it should be beneath you

Cessation is nothing close to this idea, cessation is about individuals being gifted with specific capabilities within the congregation so that they use these abilities to enlighten others as they are enlightened by others with different capabilities. The idea that one or two people stand above others with certain capabilities. These ceased in the 1st century after the church was fully established.
In that sense, knowledge ceased so that no one stands above others claiming to be knowledgeable in this church era just as it was prophesied:

I hear chickens scratching in the dirt. thats' all.

keep running though. one day you might catch up with the truth

Jer 31:
31“The days are coming,” declares the Lord,
“when I will make a new covenant
with the people of Israel
and with the people of Judah.

32It will not be like the covenant
I made with their ancestors
when I took them by the hand
to lead them out of Egypt,
because they broke my covenant,
though I was a husband to d them, e ”
declares the Lord.

33“This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel
after that time,” declares the Lord.
“I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.

34No longer will they teach their neighbor,
or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest,”
declares the Lord.

I think your problem may stem from the fact you do not seem to own a New Testament

 

[Noose]

"Noose, post: 3912195, member: 238750"]The bible talks of cessation, yes even knowledge ceases:

1 Cor 13:8 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away.

The idea that when Jesus comes, people will be like zombies not knowing nothing- the same idea you are trying to insinuate and teach here is just laughable but also pitiable.

I never heard of such a thing. more of your personal doctrine then? does it keep you awake at night? I see you are back to your default position of mocking because you are angry. try to control that. it should be beneath you

So when do you think knowledge will cease and what does it mean knowledge will cease or how will be the situation after knowledge ceases?

 

[Guojing]

Good morning bro. You have said that we have to stick to the WORD and I also believe that we DON'T have to go beyond what is written(1 Corinthians 4:6).

And if we have committed blasphemy to the Holy Spirit which is said to be unforgivable, if we truly believe in a loving, merciful and forgiving God, then we have to repent and ask for His forgiveness, OBEY His commands, turn away from our wicked life and walk in His Way, as we patiently and eagerly await our Savior from heaven, Jesus Christ our Lord.

After all that you stated, I find it amazing you are still unwilling to conclude with a simple "No, I don't believe that blaspheming against the HS is an unforgivable sin".

 

[corazondeldei]

After all that you stated, I find it amazing you are still unwilling to conclude with a simple "No, I don't believe that blaspheming against the HS is an unforgivable sin".

I would consider that as a suggestion but I'll be more interested to hear or read your view regarding this matter as I have done.

Thanks and God bless.