Slavery and the Law of Moses
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Well I will comment. The law of God, given to Moses, makes a lot of provisions for slaves. Which, of course, was common in Moses' day. It teaches responsible ownership of slaves. The mistreatment of slaves was discouraged just like the mistreatment of animals. Other than that acknowledgment, I don't know what you would gain by bringing up a subject no longer practiced. 
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Well I will comment. The law of God, given to Moses, makes a lot of provisions for slaves. Which, of course, was common in Moses' day. It teaches responsible ownership of slaves. The mistreatment of slaves was discouraged just like the mistreatment of animals. Other than that acknowledgment, I don't know what you would gain by bringing up a subject no longer practiced.
there is certainly a distinction made between an Hebrew slave and a slave from other peoples. the law in Exodus is written like this: 10 commandments, the law of the altar, the law of an Hebrew slave. a very prominent position!
any man bought as a servant from their own people was to be set free on the 7th year, along with anyone belonging to him when he was brought into service - with the provision that he be pierced as an identifier, if he willingly chose for himself to remain a servant: because he loves his master and does not wish to leave.
permanent servitude of one's own people was to be only on a voluntary basis - out of love. they were never to 'own' one of their kindred, never to 'buy' a person outright with money - however for love, a person could 'give' themselves to another. and this precept is front-and-center in the Sinai covenant. your brother and sister are not merchandise!
what does it say about a non-Hebrew servant?
any man bought as a servant from their own people was to be set free on the 7th year, along with anyone belonging to him when he was brought into service - with the provision that he be pierced as an identifier, if he willingly chose for himself to remain a servant: because he loves his master and does not wish to leave.
permanent servitude of one's own people was to be only on a voluntary basis - out of love. they were never to 'own' one of their kindred, never to 'buy' a person outright with money - however for love, a person could 'give' themselves to another. and this precept is front-and-center in the Sinai covenant. your brother and sister are not merchandise!
what does it say about a non-Hebrew servant?
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Slavery is an interesting question people avoid.
It struck me where survival is a hard battle on every front, if you have the choice to all
be killed or be forced into servitude, would you not choose service to a master over dying.
And if you have debts you can never meet, being sold to another, rather than rotting in a jail,
likely to die of some illness, is surely a better fate.
You will notice God sentenced some towns and cities to death, and others only the men died,
the women and children were taken.
39 "'If one of your countrymen becomes poor among you and sells himself to you, do not make him work as a slave.
40 He is to be treated as a hired worker or a temporary resident among you; he is to work for you until the Year of Jubilee.
Lev 25:39-40
42 Because the Israelites are my servants, whom I brought out of Egypt, they must not be sold as slaves.
43 Do not rule over them ruthlessly, but fear your God.
Lev 25:42-43
Israel could not make slaves out of their own countrymen.
It struck me where survival is a hard battle on every front, if you have the choice to all
be killed or be forced into servitude, would you not choose service to a master over dying.
And if you have debts you can never meet, being sold to another, rather than rotting in a jail,
likely to die of some illness, is surely a better fate.
You will notice God sentenced some towns and cities to death, and others only the men died,
the women and children were taken.
39 "'If one of your countrymen becomes poor among you and sells himself to you, do not make him work as a slave.
40 He is to be treated as a hired worker or a temporary resident among you; he is to work for you until the Year of Jubilee.
Lev 25:39-40
42 Because the Israelites are my servants, whom I brought out of Egypt, they must not be sold as slaves.
43 Do not rule over them ruthlessly, but fear your God.
Lev 25:42-43
Israel could not make slaves out of their own countrymen.
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K
Well I will comment. The law of God, given to Moses, makes a lot of provisions for slaves. Which, of course, was common in Moses' day. It teaches responsible ownership of slaves. The mistreatment of slaves was discouraged just like the mistreatment of animals. Other than that acknowledgment, I don't know what you would gain by bringing up a subject no longer practiced.
All the inhabitants of the cities within the boundaries of Canaan were to be completely destroyed - men, women, and children. Those cities that lay outside the boundaries of Canaan with whom Israel made war were to be given the option of serving Israel as vassal nations or being put to the sword. If they chose to go to war, all the men of the city were to be put to the sword and all the women and children were to be taken as contraband.
On this kind of subject I have wondered about numbers.
We learn about Jericho and the walls falling down.
Now if Jericho had 20,000 people in it, and the whole encampment of Israel was 2 million, that is quite
different from an encampment of 100,000 or less.
On the side of behaviour, child sacrifice and sexual practises of temple prostitutes etc was common place
in these parts, as well a going to war and wiping out your enemy. I say this because it puts things into
context of what is the behaviour, innocence or otherwise of these groups and what they regarded as
fair behaviour. I think in their eyes what Israel did is the same as what they all did in war.
The idea of rights or prisons or returning soldiers was not their way. Slavery or death.
It strikes me people approach this subject with the sensibilities of todays wealth and power, and understanding
of education, responsibility to all levels of society, while in these cultures you were doing well if you were only
abused.
We learn about Jericho and the walls falling down.
Now if Jericho had 20,000 people in it, and the whole encampment of Israel was 2 million, that is quite
different from an encampment of 100,000 or less.
On the side of behaviour, child sacrifice and sexual practises of temple prostitutes etc was common place
in these parts, as well a going to war and wiping out your enemy. I say this because it puts things into
context of what is the behaviour, innocence or otherwise of these groups and what they regarded as
fair behaviour. I think in their eyes what Israel did is the same as what they all did in war.
The idea of rights or prisons or returning soldiers was not their way. Slavery or death.
It strikes me people approach this subject with the sensibilities of todays wealth and power, and understanding
of education, responsibility to all levels of society, while in these cultures you were doing well if you were only
abused.
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Yes, very much so. I am sure you are familiar with the incident surrounding their deception of Joshua. The Lord had commanded that ALL the inhabitants of the land were to be annihilated, men, women, and children. That included the inhabitants of Gibeon. When the Gibeonites deceived Joshua, and Joshua gave them his word that he would not destroy their city, the Lord held him to his word. However, when the deception was discovered, the inhabitants were made slaves forever.
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Slavery is bondage, yet Jesus breaks the yoke.
I think in the context for the nations outside the boundaries of Canaan, they had to pay tribute in some way to israel, and if they didnt have enough money they had to serve them some other way to pay off the debt. Which might have been working in their fields or being servants.
In much the same way that the israelites only came into egypt because there was a famine, so they offered themselves as workers, but over time, they became naturalised and enslaved, Im sure at first, the egyptians didnt treat them harshly, cos they wanted them to work. And then of course the egypt didnt want to let them go, they worked them harder. It took an act of God and ten plagues for them to be freed.
Then when they did get free, the laws of Moses reminded them not to treat others the way they were treated in egypt. Esp foreigners.
Im some people try to read this the opposite way and justify slavery, but really its treating those foreign to you as servants, but not being harsh with them its actually not what some people think it means. If the foreigners as in the case of Joshua and the gibeonites had deceived the israelites then ok they could cursed to serve as their servants, but that doesnt mean they could be abused. It just mean they didnt have any priveliges. People who are enslaved or serving know this. They are not the ones in authority, and they are not friends, they are workers and employees. They are in bondage.
The hebrews knew, when they were in egypt, that that land was not actually theirs, and could never be. In much the same way as tenants have to pay a bond to their landlord, the land they live on can never be their own and is at the whim of the landlord. But that still doesnt mean the landlord has a right to treat them harshly or abuse them.
I think in the context for the nations outside the boundaries of Canaan, they had to pay tribute in some way to israel, and if they didnt have enough money they had to serve them some other way to pay off the debt. Which might have been working in their fields or being servants.
In much the same way that the israelites only came into egypt because there was a famine, so they offered themselves as workers, but over time, they became naturalised and enslaved, Im sure at first, the egyptians didnt treat them harshly, cos they wanted them to work. And then of course the egypt didnt want to let them go, they worked them harder. It took an act of God and ten plagues for them to be freed.
Then when they did get free, the laws of Moses reminded them not to treat others the way they were treated in egypt. Esp foreigners.
Im some people try to read this the opposite way and justify slavery, but really its treating those foreign to you as servants, but not being harsh with them its actually not what some people think it means. If the foreigners as in the case of Joshua and the gibeonites had deceived the israelites then ok they could cursed to serve as their servants, but that doesnt mean they could be abused. It just mean they didnt have any priveliges. People who are enslaved or serving know this. They are not the ones in authority, and they are not friends, they are workers and employees. They are in bondage.
The hebrews knew, when they were in egypt, that that land was not actually theirs, and could never be. In much the same way as tenants have to pay a bond to their landlord, the land they live on can never be their own and is at the whim of the landlord. But that still doesnt mean the landlord has a right to treat them harshly or abuse them.
"As for your male and female slaves whom you may have—you may acquire male and female slaves from the pagan nations that are around you. Then, too, it is out of the sons of the sojourners who live as aliens among you that you may gain acquisition, and out of their families who are with you, whom they will have produced in your land; they also may become your possession. You may even bequeath them to your sons after you, to receive as a possession; you can use them as permanent slaves.” Leviticus 25:44-46
This is in distinct contrast to the indentured servant mentioned earlier is chapter 25.
This is in distinct contrast to the indentured servant mentioned earlier is chapter 25.
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Or if you prefer the KJV, "Moreover of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them shall ye buy, and of their families that are with you, which they begat in your land: and they shall be your possession. And ye shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your bondmen for ever: but over your brethren the children of Israel, ye shall not rule one over another with rigour."
The word used here for 'bondmen is ta·‘ă·ḇō·ḏū which refers to those consigned to forced labor.
The word used here for 'bondmen is ta·‘ă·ḇō·ḏū which refers to those consigned to forced labor.
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Yes and your point? It just means the Isrselites could keep foreigners in their land cos they had bought them and rule over them. They were to be in their possession.
But you couldnt buy your own brothers.
Its not saying anything about 'forced labour' thats something youve added of your own interpration. The foreigners could always say they didnt want to be bought. But if you did buy them, they were yours. Thats why people bought and sold people, people actually did put themselves up for sale.
But you couldnt buy your own brothers.
Its not saying anything about 'forced labour' thats something youve added of your own interpration. The foreigners could always say they didnt want to be bought. But if you did buy them, they were yours. Thats why people bought and sold people, people actually did put themselves up for sale.
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K
In India and many other country’s the practice is still going on, in India 18.3 million People are in forms of modern slavery, such as bonded labour, child labour, forced marriage, human trafficking, forced begging, among others, not sure if bond labour is that thing they do in India where some parents owe money and dies before paying the loan off their children are owned by the lender to the parents until the debt is payed.
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Well. the language of the text is quite clear. It is not my interpretation of the word ta·‘ă·ḇō·ḏū. This is simply what the word means. You may want to consult Brown-Driver-Briggs on the definition of the word. He gives a rather thorough examination of the word.
Perhaps it would help to compare some other translations.
English Standard Version
You may bequeath them to your sons after you to inherit as a possession forever. You may make slaves of them, but over your brothers the people of Israel you shall not rule, one over another ruthlessly.
Berean Study Bible
You may leave them to your sons after you to inherit as property; you can make them slaves for life. But as for your brothers, the Israelites, no man may rule harshly over his brother.
New American Standard Bible
'You may even bequeath them to your sons after you, to receive as a possession; you can use them as permanent slaves. But in respect to your countrymen, the sons of Israel, you shall not rule with severity over one another.
King James Bible
And ye shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your bondmen for ever: but over your brethren the children of Israel, ye shall not rule one over another with rigour.
Christian Standard Bible
You may leave them to your sons after you to inherit as property; you can make them slaves for life. But concerning your brothers, the Israelites, you must not rule over one another harshly.
Holman Christian Standard Bible
You may leave them to your sons after you to inherit as property; you can make them slaves for life. But concerning your brothers, the Israelites, you must not rule over one another harshly."
International Standard Version
You may give them as inherited property to your children after you, to own as properties in perpetuity. You may make bond slaves of them, but no one is to rule over his fellow Israeli with harshness.
NET Bible
You may give them as inheritance to your children after you to possess as property. You may enslave them perpetually. However, as for your brothers the Israelites, no man may rule over his brother harshly.
New Heart English Bible
You may make them an inheritance for your children after you, to hold for a possession; of them may you take your slaves forever: but over your brothers the children of Israel you shall not rule, one over another, with harshness.
JPS Tanakh 1917
And ye may make them an inheritance for your children after you, to hold for a possession: of them may ye take your bondmen for ever; but over your brethren the children of Israel ye shall not rule, one over another, with rigour.
New American Standard 1977
‘You may even bequeath them to your sons after you, to receive as a possession; you can use them as permanent slaves. But in respect to your countrymen, the sons of Israel, you shall not rule with severity over one another.
Jubilee Bible 2000
And ye shall possess them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit as a possession; they shall be your bondmen for ever; but over your brethren, the sons of Israel, ye shall not rule over one another with rigor.
King James 2000 Bible
And you shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your slaves forever: but over your brethren the children of Israel, you shall not rule one over another with harshness.
American King James Version
And you shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your slaves for ever: but over your brothers the children of Israel, you shall not rule one over another with rigor.
American Standard Version
And ye shall make them an inheritance for your children after you, to hold for a possession; of them shall ye take your bondmen for ever: but over your brethren the children of Israel ye shall not rule, one over another, with rigor.
Brenton Septuagint Translation
And ye shall distribute them to your children after you, and they shall be to you permanent possessions for ever: but of your brethren the children of Israel, one shall not oppress his brother in labours.
Douay-Rheims Bible
And by right of inheritance shall leave them to your posterity, and shall possess them for ever. But oppress not your brethren the children of Israel by might.
Darby Bible Translation
And ye shall leave them as an inheritance to your children after you, to inherit them as a possession: these may ye make your bondmen for ever; but as for your brethren, the children of Israel, ye shall not rule over one another with rigour.
English Revised Version
And ye shall make them an inheritance for your children after you, to hold for a possession; of them shall ye take your bondmen for ever: but over your brethren the children of Israel ye shall not rule, one over another, with rigour.
Webster's Bible Translation
And ye shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession, they shall be your bond-men for ever: but over your brethren the children of Israel, ye shall not rule one over another with rigor.
World English Bible
You may make them an inheritance for your children after you, to hold for a possession; of them may you take your slaves forever: but over your brothers the children of Israel you shall not rule, one over another, with harshness.
Young's Literal Translation
and ye have taken them for inheritance to your sons after you, to occupy for a possession; to the age ye lay service upon them, but upon your brethren, the sons of Israel, one with another, thou dost not rule over him with rigour.
Please understand Lanolin, I am just as opposed to slavery as you are but, no matter hoe we may feel about that does not change what the Law of Moses had to say about the acquisition, ownership, and treatment of slaves in Israel. Nor does it change the language of these texts.
Perhaps it would help to compare some other translations.
English Standard Version
You may bequeath them to your sons after you to inherit as a possession forever. You may make slaves of them, but over your brothers the people of Israel you shall not rule, one over another ruthlessly.
Berean Study Bible
You may leave them to your sons after you to inherit as property; you can make them slaves for life. But as for your brothers, the Israelites, no man may rule harshly over his brother.
New American Standard Bible
'You may even bequeath them to your sons after you, to receive as a possession; you can use them as permanent slaves. But in respect to your countrymen, the sons of Israel, you shall not rule with severity over one another.
King James Bible
And ye shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your bondmen for ever: but over your brethren the children of Israel, ye shall not rule one over another with rigour.
Christian Standard Bible
You may leave them to your sons after you to inherit as property; you can make them slaves for life. But concerning your brothers, the Israelites, you must not rule over one another harshly.
Holman Christian Standard Bible
You may leave them to your sons after you to inherit as property; you can make them slaves for life. But concerning your brothers, the Israelites, you must not rule over one another harshly."
International Standard Version
You may give them as inherited property to your children after you, to own as properties in perpetuity. You may make bond slaves of them, but no one is to rule over his fellow Israeli with harshness.
NET Bible
You may give them as inheritance to your children after you to possess as property. You may enslave them perpetually. However, as for your brothers the Israelites, no man may rule over his brother harshly.
New Heart English Bible
You may make them an inheritance for your children after you, to hold for a possession; of them may you take your slaves forever: but over your brothers the children of Israel you shall not rule, one over another, with harshness.
JPS Tanakh 1917
And ye may make them an inheritance for your children after you, to hold for a possession: of them may ye take your bondmen for ever; but over your brethren the children of Israel ye shall not rule, one over another, with rigour.
New American Standard 1977
‘You may even bequeath them to your sons after you, to receive as a possession; you can use them as permanent slaves. But in respect to your countrymen, the sons of Israel, you shall not rule with severity over one another.
Jubilee Bible 2000
And ye shall possess them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit as a possession; they shall be your bondmen for ever; but over your brethren, the sons of Israel, ye shall not rule over one another with rigor.
King James 2000 Bible
And you shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your slaves forever: but over your brethren the children of Israel, you shall not rule one over another with harshness.
American King James Version
And you shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your slaves for ever: but over your brothers the children of Israel, you shall not rule one over another with rigor.
American Standard Version
And ye shall make them an inheritance for your children after you, to hold for a possession; of them shall ye take your bondmen for ever: but over your brethren the children of Israel ye shall not rule, one over another, with rigor.
Brenton Septuagint Translation
And ye shall distribute them to your children after you, and they shall be to you permanent possessions for ever: but of your brethren the children of Israel, one shall not oppress his brother in labours.
Douay-Rheims Bible
And by right of inheritance shall leave them to your posterity, and shall possess them for ever. But oppress not your brethren the children of Israel by might.
Darby Bible Translation
And ye shall leave them as an inheritance to your children after you, to inherit them as a possession: these may ye make your bondmen for ever; but as for your brethren, the children of Israel, ye shall not rule over one another with rigour.
English Revised Version
And ye shall make them an inheritance for your children after you, to hold for a possession; of them shall ye take your bondmen for ever: but over your brethren the children of Israel ye shall not rule, one over another, with rigour.
Webster's Bible Translation
And ye shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession, they shall be your bond-men for ever: but over your brethren the children of Israel, ye shall not rule one over another with rigor.
World English Bible
You may make them an inheritance for your children after you, to hold for a possession; of them may you take your slaves forever: but over your brothers the children of Israel you shall not rule, one over another, with harshness.
Young's Literal Translation
and ye have taken them for inheritance to your sons after you, to occupy for a possession; to the age ye lay service upon them, but upon your brethren, the sons of Israel, one with another, thou dost not rule over him with rigour.
Please understand Lanolin, I am just as opposed to slavery as you are but, no matter hoe we may feel about that does not change what the Law of Moses had to say about the acquisition, ownership, and treatment of slaves in Israel. Nor does it change the language of these texts.
I am not saying anything about how I feel. Its just you keep describing it as saying its 'forced labour' not the Bible saying. The bible calls is Bondservants, bondmen and bondmaids. Yes in other transaltions, its slavery. but Do you know what a bond is.
Its like when someone gets married, they bind themselves to their husband. They actually do have to pay a dowry to do this. And its for life. And the husband actually rules over the wife. For life. In other words ...slavery! Yet..the wife willingly binds herself because she says yes, she lets herself be sold. And becomes her hsubands possession. Its legal.
So shes not, in many cases, actually forced to marry. And mostly, women cant be forced to marry anyone they dont want to marry. Yes they can be decieved or seduced, but thats another story. That would be called rape. The Bible doesnt condone rape, and it doesnt condone forced labour. Which now seems to be what slavery is...because it has that reputation...but I would argue that people always have a choice, although for a few its between the devil and the deep blue sea.
Its like when someone gets married, they bind themselves to their husband. They actually do have to pay a dowry to do this. And its for life. And the husband actually rules over the wife. For life. In other words ...slavery! Yet..the wife willingly binds herself because she says yes, she lets herself be sold. And becomes her hsubands possession. Its legal.
So shes not, in many cases, actually forced to marry. And mostly, women cant be forced to marry anyone they dont want to marry. Yes they can be decieved or seduced, but thats another story. That would be called rape. The Bible doesnt condone rape, and it doesnt condone forced labour. Which now seems to be what slavery is...because it has that reputation...but I would argue that people always have a choice, although for a few its between the devil and the deep blue sea.