Not By Works

[YourTruthGod]

"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

We have to believe that we have to obey Jesus.

John 8:51 Very truly I tell you, whoever obeys my word will never see death."

 

[YourTruthGod]

But these have been written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing you may have life in His name.

Romans 16:25-27 Now to him who is able to establish you by my gospel and the proclamation of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery hidden for long ages past, but now revealed and made known through the prophetic writings by the command of the eternal God, so that all nations might believe and obey him–to the only wise God be glory forever through Jesus Christ! Amen.

 

[gb9]

Definition of sin https://www.gotquestions.org/definition-sin.html

Some attempt to use defining sin, to block the idea we can walk like Jesus.

Poor in spirit, mourning, meek, hungering after righteousness, merciful, pure in heart, peacemakers.
Their treasure is in heaven, they are not angry, but bless, they do not lust after sexual desire, they love their
enemies, they do their acts of righteousness in private not for show, they pray meaningful prayers expecting
the Lord hears and will answer, they forgive from the heart, they do not worry about wealth but the Lords ways,
they do not judge but desire to help and encourage others.
Matt 5 - 7
Jesus's example

So if Christs approach is our calling, what is so difficult, unless of course this reality is rebelled against
so strongly, to be like Christ is thought of becoming irrelevant or nothing.

The reality of personality, is like the apostles though they walked like Jesus, they were very much
individuals with their way of expressing themselves.

So the possibility is it is really just unbelievers are trying to push their own faith, and have no real
handle of Jesus and Christ himself.

just wanted to pull this up, to show that this person 100% linked to gotquestions.org to get his definition of sin.

 

[YourTruthGod]

One for the O.T. deniers that say the O.T. does not point to Christ or teach Jesus

"Of Him all the prophets bear witness that through His name everyone who believes in Him receives forgiveness of sins."

Believe him: "I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish."

 

[YourTruthGod]

And through Him everyone who believes is freed from all things, from which you could not be freed through the Law of Moses.

All the scriptures that say 'believe', they do NOT nullify the scriptures that say 'obey'.

 

[YourTruthGod]

Is our goal to be like Jesus in our walk, in our prayer life, in our expectations?
Are we like Jesus today?

How will we make up the gap, and does scripture call us to put effort in to do
this very thing, or is it all sloth of spirituality or called resting in God and He does it all?

If we claim to know Jesus yet abiding in sin is the slavery to which we must get used
to, of what benefit to us is faith?

Who believes someone who says, Yes I will do that, but does nothing compared to one
who both declares their intentions and carries them out?

We are saved through faith in Jesus and the cross for the forgiveness of our sins, but
this does not work if we stay as we are, because our faith and forgiveness are just words
with no impact.

Your lax attitude about God's Truth is not right either.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Paying attention

I love people, but sometimes their tendency to jump on bandwagons without studying the meaning.
I will defend anyone who people just attack for taking a general position, before they have found
out what that position really is.

People are not safe on unsafe they are who they are and we are called to love them.
Through our witness we hope they either come to Christ or go deeper and further with Him.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

just wanted to pull this up, to show that this person 100% linked to gotquestions.org to get his definition of sin.

The reason I did this was simply to explain this is not a simple subject, like some would have
you believe. Paul went so far as to say he did not judge himself, rather trusted God and walked
in love.

It is always possible to be self condemning and end up OCD on the floor scrubbing everything
to get rid of every spot and wrinkle when you have been declared cleansed. The pharisees are
prime examples of getting the zest right but focusing it wrongly.

What I would also point out, again is simply the question, are we to walk like Jesus?

If one believers unbelief is the way, and the cross does not redeem us and cleanse us to walk
in His ways, one is not a follower of Jesus. Jesus declared the disciples clean.

But ocd legalists who fail only can repeat we fail, woe is me, undone with no solution.
Yet Jesus asks, do you have faith to believe I can lift you up to walk like me?

 

[Budman]

You describe yourself.

Shouldn't you be off this site and out helping little old ladies across the street to keep your salvation?

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Stay humble, keep forgiving others, harm no one, repent if you sin, overcome.

stay humble - amen, knowing our place in Him is the beginning of life
keep forgiving others - without forgiving we cannot be forgiven for out debt is large and theirs is small
harm no one - loving does no harm to your neighbour, loving ones neighbour fulfils the law
repent if you sin - we are to know our sins and turn from them to God accepting His forgiveness and walking His ways
overcome - we overcome the world in Christ through our faith and heart driven by His Holy Spirit and love.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

What do you say to a man who says the truth but has a way to go?

Amen for the truth, and God bless you on your journey.
If they are going the right way what is the fruit of beating them up?
It just leads to discouragement and fewer people who will walk the way of Jesus.

So either these folk hate Jesus and want to harm His people or they believe they
are God's rebuke, which certainly is not Christs example.

A bruised reed he will not break, and a smoldering wick he will not snuff out, till he leads justice to victory.
Matt 12:20

 

[50C1AL0N3]

To rep we my...what is the true definition of that?

 

[mailmandan]

Whoever believes that they have to obey Jesus.

You really get hung up on the word "obey" and continue to spin passages of scripture that mention the word "obey" into salvation by works. Perverting the gospel by teaching salvation by works is not obeying Jesus.

Now in regards to John 3:36, I often hear works-salvationists quote that verse in the NASB and "stress" the word "obey" to imply that we are saved by obedience/works. In regards to "does not obey the Son" in the New American Standard translation of the Bible, this does not mean that receiving eternal life is received based on the merits of our obedience/works which follows believing in the Son, but obey by choosing to believe in the Son. If John wanted to make obedience the central theme in salvation here, he would have said: "He who believes and obeys the Son has eternal life," but that is not what John said. To obey the Son here is to choose to believe in the Son.

The King James Version renders this same verse as: He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that "believeth not the Son" shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him. The NIV says "rejects the Son" and the CSB says, "refuses to believe in the Son." The Greek word translated as "believeth not" in that verse is apeitheo and it means: "not believe, disobedient, obey not, unbelieving." Strong’s definition of apeitheo is "to disbelieve willfully and perversely." In the context of 3:36, to "not obey the Son" means to reject the Son by refusing to believe in the Son.

 

[50C1AL0N3]

To repent.what is the true definition of that?

 

[mailmandan]

Romans 16:25-27 Now to him who is able to establish you by my gospel and the proclamation of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery hidden for long ages past, but now revealed and made known through the prophetic writings by the command of the eternal God, so that all nations might believe and obey him–to the only wise God be glory forever through Jesus Christ! Amen.

Here is yet another passage of scripture that works-salvationists use in a vain effort to try and support salvation by works. Romans 16:26 - but now made manifest, and by the prophetic Scriptures made known to all nations, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, for obedience to the faith. Also, in Romans 1:5, we read - Through Him we have received grace and apostleship for obedience to the faith among all nations for His name.

Now although Paul can speak of people’s initial response of choosing to believe the gospel as an act of obedience, in which he describes it as "obeying the gospel" (Romans 10:16; 1:16), the purpose of Paul’s apostleship was not merely to bring people to conversion but also to bring about transformed lives that were obedient to God.

*Notice that Paul said they HAVE (already) received grace and apostleship FOR/UNTO obedience to the faith. Just as in Ephesians 2:10, Paul said that we are created in Christ Jesus FOR/UNTO good works. We are clearly saved FOR good works and NOT BY good works (Ephesians 2:8-10). Paul did not say that they did not receive grace and apostleship until they produced obedience afterwards. We have access by faith into grace.. (Romans 5:2) not faith "and obedience/works." We are saved through faith in Christ first, then "unto" obedience/works.

You have the tail wagging the dog, the cart before the horse.

 

[OneOfHis]

You really get hung up on the word "obey" and continue to spin passages of scripture that mention the word "obey" into salvation by works. Perverting the gospel by teaching salvation by works is not obeying Jesus.

Now in regards to John 3:36, I often hear works-salvationists quote that verse in the NASB and "stress" the word "obey" to imply that we are saved by obedience/works. In regards to "does not obey the Son" in the New American Standard translation of the Bible, this does not mean that receiving eternal life is received based on the merits of our obedience/works which follows believing in the Son, but obey by choosing to believe in the Son. If John wanted to make obedience the central theme in salvation here, he would have said: "He who believes and obeys the Son has eternal life," but that is not what John said. To obey the Son here is to choose to believe in the Son.

The King James Version renders this same verse as: He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that "believeth not the Son" shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him. The NIV says "rejects the Son" and the CSB says, "refuses to believe in the Son." The Greek word translated as "believeth not" in that verse is apeitheo and it means: "not believe, disobedient, obey not, unbelieving." Strong’s definition of apeitheo is "to disbelieve willfully and perversely." In the context of 3:36, to "not obey the Son" means to reject the Son by refusing to believe in the Son.

amen

"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved"

praise God
and glory to Jesus whos righteousness is what declares us righteous come judgement

given our own righteousness falls short of the standard of perfection required from start to finish

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Shouldn't you be off this site and out helping little old ladies across the street to keep your salvation?

I had to look who you were talking to. It was not who I thought. But still. So true, if the shoe fits!!

 

[Budman]

So either these folk hate Jesus and want to harm His people
or they believe they are God's rebuke, which certainly is not Christs example.

Aaaaaand our resident martyr falls on that rusty old sword again.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

What do you say to a man who says the truth but has a way to go?

Amen for the truth, and God bless you on your journey.
If they are going the right way what is the fruit of beating them up?
It just leads to discouragement and fewer people who will walk the way of Jesus.

So either these folk hate Jesus and want to harm His people or they believe they
are God's rebuke, which certainly is not Christs example.

A bruised reed he will not break, and a smoldering wick he will not snuff out, till he leads justice to victory.
Matt 12:20

Aaaaaand our resident martyr falls on that rusty old sword again.

I think my friend you missed my point. I was talking about how I try and approach all.
It is easy to see weakness and failure, it is much harder to see God working in the heart of
another and encourage growth.

Some people I know are so annoying, people find it hard to talk to them, without exploding.
These poor people are isolated and lost, a bubble not quite knowing why this happens.

One guy I worked with I just wanted to talk to out of respect as a fellow team member.
He was so cast down, he asked me why I would talk to him. Poor guy, what a way to live.
But that is how I am to Jesus, yet He talks to me and all who will just listen. Amen.

 

[star]

To have the mind of Christ is to have an obedient mind. You go against being obedient to get saved.

You need to read scripture about "having the mind of Christ." As for being obedient to get saved. Yes, I absolutely refute that false teaching.