Jesus is not coming back. He already did in 70 A.D.

[TheDivineWatermark]

^ It seems to me that Isaiah 65:15 ("for the Lord God shall slay thee, and call his servants by another name") corresponds quite well to Romans 9:26 [/Hosea 1:10] regarding Israel (whereas Rom9:25/Hos2:23b speaks of "the Gentiles"), where Romans 9:26 states:

"26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people [i.e. Lo Ammi]; there shall they be called the children/sons of the living God." [the "where it was said unto them" can only be referring to Israel... how do you see this differently?? Romans 9-11 is covering the SUBJECT of "nations": "Israel [singular nation]" and "the Gentiles [plural nations]," and the Olive Tree representing "God's governmental ways upon the earth" (...as opposed to the Olive Tree representing "salvation" or "Jesus" or "Israel" or other...)]


[that whole Matt22:7 THEN verse 8 thing]

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

^ adding: [in the pre-trib, pre-mill view] we believe that Daniel 12 is speaking of a specific future time period, and that the CONTEXT pertains to Israel (vv.1-4 not a PHYSICAL/BODILY resurrection [but Israel coming up out of the graveyard of nations, where scattered]; whereas in v.13 it IS a PHYSICAL/BODILY resurrection from the dead); So, with the context being "thy [Daniel's] people," verse 1, even we still acknowledge that there will be TWO DISTINCT groups among/OF THEM: "the WISE [of Israel]" who "WILL understand" (at that future time period) in contrast to "[but] NONE of the WICKED [of same] shall understand," verse 10 (both, though, being "of Israel" the nation). It will be "the WISE [of them]" that will GO ON TO "turn many to righteousness" (having themselves come to faith WITHIN the tribulation period... just like Hosea 5:15-6:3 agrees [and which I believe ALSO corresponds to Matt25:40 "the least of these My brethren" who are NOT the ones BEING separated/judged in Matt25:31-46 but "the Gentiles/nations" of that time frame, instead, are the Sheep and goats being judged/separated, in that context]).

 

[tourist]

We live in the new heavens and earth. Christ's kingdom. The new heavens and earth is not a literal place. Many theologians in the past have correctly recognized this like John Owen, John Lightfoot, Sir Isaac Newton and Charles Spurgeon to name a few.

Read Isaiah 65: 1-16 carefully. What do you see it describing there? It is describing old covenant Israel who was unfaithful to God. They constantly rebelled and grieved him. It also talks about God calling His servants by a new name (the Gentiles).

Now pay attention to verses 17 & 18. The new heavens and new earth are a New Jerusalem whose people are a joy to God. Not a literal place. It's a kingdom. Christ's kingdom. Made up of people who are filled with His spirit. Christians.

Notice also in Rev 21 that the New Jerusalem coming down out of heaven is the church. The foundations of the city have the names of the 12 apostles which are the men that Christ began His church with. How do you write the names of people on the foundation of a city? This is symbolism. It is not a literal place but a kingdom.

If the new heavens and new earth are not a literal place than what exactly is the point of all of the drama being played out on earth through the centuries? Seriously, why even bother to read the bible if one is unable to tell what is real from what is not real? Makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. I guess that the truth is whatever one choses to believe.

 

[dcontroversal]

Yeah, the new heavens and new earth were created in the first century yet the earth continues to deteriorate. No mention either of Jesus setting up His 1000 year reign or Satan being bound for a 1000 years until he could deceive the nations once again. Don't see a New Jerusalem either. That would be kind of a hard thing to miss. No mention of the Two Witnesses either who were to prophesy for 3 1/2 years until they were killed only to be raised from the dead after 3 days. No mention either of the battle of Armageddon. That battle is going to have some serious boots on the ground. The Abomination of Desolation is notably absent either. Delirious indeed, and perhaps delusional as well.

Fully agree.......and if that did happen in 70 A.D.....by 1070 A.D. all evil would he defeated, the Great White Throne judgment of the Lost would have taken place and NEW JERUSALEM would be sitting on a New Earth with No sea and we would be in eternal, glorified, celestial bodies......it is utter ridiculous to believe that the end came and went in 70 A.D......

 

[dcontroversal]

You are shure that you understand it?
If this all has already came. In what Part of History we are Now?

He tells me that I don't understand.....I can read and there are so many events that prove that the NEW HEAVEN AND THE NEW EARTH WHEREIN DWELLETH NO SEA has not come in 70 A.D......one must be as dense as lead to believe that drivel......

 

[wolfwint]

We live in the new heavens and earth. Christ's kingdom. The new heavens and earth is not a literal place. Many theologians in the past have correctly recognized this like John Owen, John Lightfoot, Sir Isaac Newton and Charles Spurgeon to name a few.

Read Isaiah 65: 1-16 carefully. What do you see it describing there? It is describing old covenant Israel who was unfaithful to God. They constantly rebelled and grieved him. It also talks about God calling His servants by a new name (the Gentiles).

Now pay attention to verses 17 & 18. The new heavens and new earth are a New Jerusalem whose people are a joy to God. Not a literal place. It's a kingdom. Christ's kingdom. Made up of people who are filled with His spirit. Christians.

Notice also in Rev 21 that the New Jerusalem coming down out of heaven is the church. The foundations of the city have the names of the 12 apostles which are the men that Christ began His church with. How do you write the names of people on the foundation of a city? This is symbolism. It is not a literal place but a kingdom.

O K , you must have much fantasy.
Show me the place then here where there is no pain and sickness and death. If we live in new heavens and new earth. So far i know, this earth has not changed since the flood. And the ocean is still there.

 

[Locutus]

"WHEREIN DWELLETH NO SEA"



Can't wait for the BBC series "Dry Planet"

 

[Endoscopy]

Have you read Ezekiel 8 & 9? Those chapters led to the destruction of the first temple. I think something similar took place with the destruction of the second temple most likely. I think John is drawing some of his imagery for Rev 13 from Ezekiel 8 & 9.

I think the only people who were capable of setting up the "abomination of desolation" were the Jews themselves. I could definitely see the zealots setting up an image. Read Ezekiel 8.

Just my thoughts on the matter. What say ye?

Back then there was almost an abomination of desolation. The Roman emperor had a gold statue was created and ordered it put in the Holy of Holies in the temple. It was damaged before it could be done.

A new temple is being prepared to be rebuilt on the site of the previous 2 temples. The religious Jews in Israel have been working on getting all the paperwork done and are raising the money now. When it is rebuilt then the abomination of desolation can occur.

 

[Absolutely]

I see him as trying his best to answer the question of who could have fulfilled the MotB by ad70,(but literal instead of spiritually,lol). The problem still is Revelation 13:15 and Revelation 19:21 in aspect to our latter dialog.

The ones who do worship the image in Revelation 13:15 are spiritually dead(they worship the image) but they are not physically/literally killed by the beast.

The ones in Revelation 13:15 who do not worship the beast are not deceived and are killed because they refuse to worship the image of the beast. And so they are not spiritually dead and so the only other way the beast could kill them and fulfill Revelation 13:15 is to literally/physically "kill them".

In Revelation 19:21 those who are deceived and receive the mark and worship the image of the beast are given to the sword and the fowl eat their flesh. So they are spiritually dead(deceived/worship the image) and again the only other option of dead/killed is literal/physical.

In both Scriptures the bible gives proof that this is not a spiritual fulfillment .

.....and a big thank you for that insight.
I shall borrow that

 

[Absolutely]

So just who is this guy,lol? No offense but this seems like old school preterism ,which is mostly a literal approach,but not always. Some I see exhaust Nero until they see the err their own selves and others suggest psaltery boxes worn by the Jews. Some bring up third and fourth century letters and try to tie them to ad66-70. Some show the generals standing up their eagle in support of Titus at the end of the siege. None so far have sufficed an old man shaving his face in the mirror in the morning while contemplating the things to say to his family about the scriptures. How be it though say who this guy is and we will set it on the scale and the bible on the other side.

I don't like either of the two so to speak. If I could choose I suppose spiritual would be worse than literal from an Amill. vrs. peterist position in that I would still be in danger of receiving the mark,being decieved, and worshiping the image ect. in Amill. where in the preterist camp it is past tense and no longer any threat. Any way though being outside the camps provides the liberty of not defending any camp and being able to agree with the Scriptures alone.

Nicely put.
I was actually shaving,and contemplating what u said

 

[Oseas]

Over 1 million Jews were put to the sword by the Romans in 70 A.D. under Titus....one h--- of a reward hey.....the Second coming dis not happen in 70 A.D......that is about as idiotic as it comes!!

In the year 70, yes, in the year 70, fulfilled itself LITERALLY one if not the most punishment that fell upon the nation of Israel in fulfilment what said Moses in Deut.28:v.15-68 (a list of plagues described in 53 verses), and also in fulfilmente the prophetic words of JESUS (the testimony of JESUS is the spirit of prophecy) written in Matt.24:1-2, as follow:

1 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple. (Oh! very beautiful)

2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, they will be totally destroyed — not a single stone will be left standing!”

We know that In the year 70 Israel was banned from their land, hundreds of thousands were killed and those who remained alive were scattered around the world in gentile lands.

Israel has been punished many times for destruction and persecutions due their rebellious behavior against God Almighty. They always were warned by Moses about severe punishments and harsh curses due their disobedience. Deut. 28: 15-68 (53 verses of plagues), and these curses and punishments fell upon Israel in the year 70 and whenever they disobeyed the commandments and instructions of the Lord given through Moses.

The testimony of JESUS is the spirit of prophecy.

The worst thing done by the Jewsl was the crucifixion of Jesus.

The worst thing done by Israel was the crucifixion of Jesus, yeah, the worst of all was to crucify Jesus, the Messiah, who was sent by the most High GOD for their salvation, and by whom God the Father established the new Covenant, which Israel rejected. What was the consequence of this insane behavior? From the year 70 to the year 1948, they were severely punished and they remained without nation for 1,878 anos, the curses which Moses had listed against them, all of them fell upon all the Jews wherever they went.

And now, what will happen with the nation of Israel that has returned to their land, in fulfillment of all that is written about them in the Word of God? They yet reject JESUS and His Gospel

 

[Endoscopy]

We live in the new heavens and earth. Christ's kingdom. The new heavens and earth is not a literal place. Many theologians in the past have correctly recognized this like John Owen, John Lightfoot, Sir Isaac Newton and Charles Spurgeon to name a few.

Read Isaiah 65: 1-16 carefully. What do you see it describing there? It is describing old covenant Israel who was unfaithful to God. They constantly rebelled and grieved him. It also talks about God calling His servants by a new name (the Gentiles).

Now pay attention to verses 17 & 18. The new heavens and new earth are a New Jerusalem whose people are a joy to God. Not a literal place. It's a kingdom. Christ's kingdom. Made up of people who are filled with His spirit. Christians.

Notice also in Rev 21 that the New Jerusalem coming down out of heaven is the church. The foundations of the city have the names of the 12 apostles which are the men that Christ began His church with. How do you write the names of people on the foundation of a city? This is symbolism. It is not a literal place but a kingdom.

Here is Jesus talking about the second coming. The whole world will see him coming on the clouds of heaven!! When did that happen? That could only happen in today's world. With satellite TV the whole world can see whatever big event is happening within a few seconds.
Propagation delay for very long distance. Only currently can this be happening


Matthew 24 NIV
26 “So if anyone tells you, ‘There he is, out in the wilderness,’ do not go out; or, ‘Here he is, in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. 27 For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. 28 Wherever there is a carcass, there the vultures will gather.
29 “Immediately after the distress of those days
“‘the sun will be darkened,
and the moon will not give its light;
the stars will fall from the sky,
and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.’
30 “Then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. And then all the peoples of the earth will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory. 31 And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.
32 “Now learn this lesson from the fig tree: As soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. 33 Even so, when you see all these things, you know that it is near, right at the door. 34 Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. 35 Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.

In the year 70, yes, in the year 70, fulfilled itself LITERALLY one if not the most punishment that fell upon the nation of Israel in fulfilment what said Moses in Deut.28:v.15-68 (a list of plagues described in 53 verses), and also in fulfilmente the prophetic words of JESUS (the testimony of JESUS is the spirit of prophecy) written in Matt.24:1-2, as follow:

1 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple. (Oh! very beautiful)

2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, they will be totally destroyed — not a single stone will be left standing!”

We know that In the year 70 Israel was banned from their land, hundreds of thousands were killed and those who remained alive were scattered around the world in gentile lands.

Israel has been punished many times for destruction and persecutions due their rebellious behavior against God Almighty. They always were warned by Moses about severe punishments and harsh curses due their disobedience. Deut. 28: 15-68 (53 verses of plagues), and these curses and punishments fell upon Israel in the year 70 and whenever they disobeyed the commandments and instructions of the Lord given through Moses.

The testimony of JESUS is the spirit of prophecy.

The worst thing done by the Jewsl was the crucifixion of Jesus.

The worst thing done by Israel was the crucifixion of Jesus, yeah, the worst of all was to crucify Jesus, the Messiah, who was sent by the most High GOD for their salvation, and by whom God the Father established the new Covenant, which Israel rejected. What was the consequence of this insane behavior? From the year 70 to the year 1948, they were severely punished and they remained without nation for 1,878 anos, the curses which Moses had listed against them, all of them fell upon all the Jews wherever they went.

And now, what will happen with the nation of Israel that has returned to their land, in fulfillment of all that is written about them in the Word of God? They yet reject JESUS and His Gospel

The assertion that the worst thing the Jews did was crucify Jesus is horrid. You ignore the fact that the majority of the Jews did not want that. It was the religious leaders that caused his crucifixion. Pilate found no fault but was forced to do it by the religious leaders saying Rome would be upset if he didn't and there was an uprising. He said it was on them and they accepted it.

 

[Oseas]

The assertion that the worst thing the Jews did was crucify Jesus is horrid. You ignore the fact that the majority of the Jews did not want that. It was the religious leaders that caused his crucifixion. Pilate found no fault but was forced to do it by the religious leaders saying Rome would be upset if he didn't and there was an uprising. He said it was on them and they accepted it.

John the Apostle generalized saying: He came unto His own, and His own received Him not. Or yet, He came to His own homeland,
yet his own people did not receive Him. John 1:v.11

Luke22:v.46-48CJB - Complete Jewish Bible
46 Yeshua said to His disciples: “Why are you sleeping? Get up and pray that you won’t be put to the test!”
47 While he was still speaking, a crowd of people arrived, with the man called Y’hudah (one of the Twelve!) leading them. He came up to Yeshua to kiss him,
48 but Yeshua said to him, “Y’hudah, are you betraying the Son of Man with a kiss?”

Luke 23:v.3-4 CJB -
3 Pilate asked him, “Are you the king of the Jews?” And He answered him, “The words are yours.” 4 Pilate said to the head cohanim and the crowds, “I find no ground for a charge against this man.

Mark 15:v.1-2 & 7-15
1 As soon as it was morning, the head cohanim held a council meeting with the elders, the Torah-teachers and the whole Sanhedrin. Then they put Yeshua in chains, led him away and handed him over to Pilate.
2 Pilate put this question to him: “Are you the King of the Jews?” He answered him, “The words are yours.”
7 There was in prison among the rebels who had committed murder during the insurrection a man called Bar-Abba. 8 When the crowd came up and began asking Pilate to do for them what he usually did, 9 he asked them, “Do you want me to set free for you the ‘King of the Jews’?” 10 For it was evident to him that it was out of jealousy that the head cohanim had handed Him over. 11 But the head cohanim stirred up the crowd to have him release Bar-Abba for them instead. 12 Pilate again said to them, “Then what should I do with the man you call the King of the Jews?” 13 They shouted back, “Put Him to death on the stake!” 14 He asked, “Why? What crime has He committed?” But they only shouted louder, “Put Him to death on the stake!” 15 So Pilate, wishing to satisfy the mob, set Bar-Abba free for them; but he had Yeshua whipped and then handed Him over to be executed on the stake.

As we can see through Scriptures, the crowd guided by their religious guide, preferred Barabbas instead JESUS.

We can see also that opinions are not above what is written in the Scriptures, that is, in the Word of God. What prevails is the Word of God. The Word is the invisible God.

In the other hand, Barabbas is a prototype of the false messiah of the Jews who will manifest himself very soon. The Jews are waiting the manifestation of their own "messiah", not JESUS. Then will fulfil LITERALLY the prophecy o JESUS, saying to the Jews: John 5:v.43 -

43 I have come in my Father’s name, and you don’t accept me; if someone else comes in his own name (an IMPOSTER, a false messiah), him you will accept. Yeah, the Jews preferred Barabbas, instead JESUS. Paul also spoke of the false messiah, the son of perdition and man of sin: 2Thes.2:v.2-12

The abomination of desolation is at door. The Christian people must be alert and taking care.

 

[Locutus]

Here is Jesus talking about the second coming. The whole world will see him coming on the clouds of heaven!! When did that happen? That could only happen in today's world. With satellite TV the whole world can see whatever big event is happening within a few seconds.
Propagation delay for very long distance. Only currently can this be happening

Too bad you don't understand the nature of hyperbole used in the bible:

John 12:19 The Pharisees therefore said among themselves, Perceive ye how ye prevail nothing? behold, the world is gone after him.

 

[Endoscopy]

John the Apostle generalized saying: He came unto His own, and His own received Him not. Or yet, He came to His own homeland,
yet his own people did not receive Him. John 1:v.11

Luke22:v.46-48CJB - Complete Jewish Bible
46 Yeshua said to His disciples: “Why are you sleeping? Get up and pray that you won’t be put to the test!”
47 While he was still speaking, a crowd of people arrived, with the man called Y’hudah (one of the Twelve!) leading them. He came up to Yeshua to kiss him,
48 but Yeshua said to him, “Y’hudah, are you betraying the Son of Man with a kiss?”

Luke 23:v.3-4 CJB -
3 Pilate asked him, “Are you the king of the Jews?” And He answered him, “The words are yours.” 4 Pilate said to the head cohanim and the crowds, “I find no ground for a charge against this man.

Mark 15:v.1-2 & 7-15
1 As soon as it was morning, the head cohanim held a council meeting with the elders, the Torah-teachers and the whole Sanhedrin. Then they put Yeshua in chains, led him away and handed him over to Pilate.
2 Pilate put this question to him: “Are you the King of the Jews?” He answered him, “The words are yours.”
7 There was in prison among the rebels who had committed murder during the insurrection a man called Bar-Abba. 8 When the crowd came up and began asking Pilate to do for them what he usually did, 9 he asked them, “Do you want me to set free for you the ‘King of the Jews’?” 10 For it was evident to him that it was out of jealousy that the head cohanim had handed Him over. 11 But the head cohanim stirred up the crowd to have him release Bar-Abba for them instead. 12 Pilate again said to them, “Then what should I do with the man you call the King of the Jews?” 13 They shouted back, “Put Him to death on the stake!” 14 He asked, “Why? What crime has He committed?” But they only shouted louder, “Put Him to death on the stake!” 15 So Pilate, wishing to satisfy the mob, set Bar-Abba free for them; but he had Yeshua whipped and then handed Him over to be executed on the stake.

As we can see through Scriptures, the crowd guided by their religious guide, preferred Barabbas instead JESUS.

We can see also that opinions are not above what is written in the Scriptures, that is, in the Word of God. What prevails is the Word of God. The Word is the invisible God.

In the other hand, Barabbas is a prototype of the false messiah of the Jews who will manifest himself very soon. The Jews are waiting the manifestation of their own "messiah", not JESUS. Then will fulfil LITERALLY the prophecy o JESUS, saying to the Jews: John 5:v.43 -

43 I have come in my Father’s name, and you don’t accept me; if someone else comes in his own name (an IMPOSTER, a false messiah), him you will accept. Yeah, the Jews preferred Barabbas, instead JESUS. Paul also spoke of the false messiah, the son of perdition and man of sin: 2Thes.2:v.2-12

The abomination of desolation is at door. The Christian people must be alert and taking care.

My cell phone is my Bible. I have biblegateway.com on my browser. Going there I can look up book and chapter. Then I can easily switch translations. I use KJV, NIV, ESV, and AMPC. I detest the CJB because I don't want to keep looking up the Jewish words. It is aimed at the Jews not the rest of us. Keep this in mind when posting scripture. I didn't bother to look up the words in the text you quoted. I'm not Jewish along with most of the people on this site. Why post with a translation with Jewish terminology?

What you ignore is when Jesus entered Jerusalem riding on a donkey the people rejoiced laying down palm branches on the road.

 

[Absolutely]

If the new heavens and new earth are not a literal place than what exactly is the point of all of the drama being played out on earth through the centuries? Seriously, why even bother to read the bible if one is unable to tell what is real from what is not real? Makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. I guess that the truth is whatever one choses to believe.

Since the devil and all with the motb have been thrown into the lof,why are we locking our doors at night?

 

[Absolutely]

Too bad you don't understand the nature of hyperbole used in the bible:

John 12:19 The Pharisees therefore said among themselves, Perceive ye how ye prevail nothing? behold, the world is gone after him.

You only showed that " world" was used once as hyperbole.
Not that " world" can only be viewed as hyperbole.

That error makes the flood local,not worldwide.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

You only showed that " world" was used once as hyperbole.
Not that " world" can only be viewed as hyperbole.

This is a very important point. For example, take a good look at how the word "G2348 - thnḗskō" is used, in its NINE times:

https://biblehub.com/str/greek/2348.htm

...if they ALL meant it in the way that the LAST [ninth usage ONLY] is used, what would that be suggesting??

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You only showed that " world" was used once as hyperbole.
Not that " world" can only be viewed as hyperbole.

That error makes the flood local,not worldwide.

Why is that?

 

[Endoscopy]

Why do many ignore what Jesus said about his return? The whole world would see it. Only in today's world with the worldwide instant video communications can the whole whole world see it happen. Also since no one saw anything in 70AD it didn't happen like Jesus stated. Here are 3 translations about this issue.

Matthew 24 NIV
30 “Then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. And then all the peoples of the earth will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory. 31 And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.

Matthew 24 ESV
30 Then will appear in heaven the sign of the Son of Man, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Matthew 24 AMPC
30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn and beat their breasts and lament in anguish, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory [in brilliancy and splendor].
31 And He will send out His angels with a trumpet call, and they will gather His elect (His chosen ones) from the four winds, [even] from one end of the universe to the other.