Not By Works

[stonesoffire]

Amen, on Mine also!!

and me too!

 

[Budman]

If you keep teaching works then you might be there. Not saying will be but I wouldn't want to test the Lord.

Am going to post some Hebrew translation.

I will go on the record to say that anyone who claims "salvation must be earned" as Fran has, is lost.

 

[stonesoffire]

I said it before. I still think it is true

I think she just like to argue. and this chatroom gives her a place to do that.

Thats also why I stopped giving her an audience..

It could be. I knew a forum member who divided groups into sides for debate. That person could be changing sides even yet just to keep the debate going.

But, that was another forum.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I will go on the record to say that anyone who claims "salvation must be earned" as Fran has, is lost.

and to back this up.

Is their faith in god? or saves, or in self, who helps save..

One can believe all you want, but unless you have faith. Last I heard, your not saved.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

It could be. I knew a forum member who divided groups into sides for debate. That person could be changing sides even yet just to keep the debate going.

But, that was another forum.

Amen

I am just going off past dealings.. Once she collects her clan Its on,, They try to get people mad so they can say stuff which will get them banned. I have lost a few close friends who fell for their tactics.. Unlike her though, they take their punishment and walk..

thats why these people should not be enabled in my view, if they come back, we need to let them know we will not stand for their sin.. Take away their audience and they will leave. Who wants to talk to nobody?

 

[Budman]

They try to get people mad so they can say stuff which will get them banned. I have lost a few close friends who fell for their tactics.. Unlike her though, they take their punishment and walk..

Says it all right there!

 

[UnderGrace]

Include yourself in that stellar list of mentors, not only to me, but to so many others here. You have a surgical knack of getting right to the bone of an issue. In one sentence, you can say more than most who post a whole pageful.

We are truly blessed to have you here.

Well, sadly one learns a lot the hard way when one follows the wrong teachers and ends up like a lost sheep (still justified ) in "BRAMBLES"




Jesus is indeed the faithful shepherd....all glory to Him!!!

 

[Budman]

We still have the sin nature...
IT'S KEPT UNDER SUBMISSION to the Holy Spirit.
It sometimes still affects us....our thinking....our actions....our omissions.

Then it's not really under submission, is it?

I'd post the definition of the word, but you don't like that. Since you define words as you feel they should be defined.

 

[GodsGrace101]

Posting scripture is getting people mad?
I wonder why?

• 

 

[Budman]

Posting scripture is getting people mad?
I wonder why?

• 

You are clearly talking about yourself.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You are clearly talking about yourself.

oh they love their scripture. They just hate everyone elses..

 

[stonesoffire]

Now we are the sheep of God?

Just to think about..

Hebrew to English

Gal: 2: 11 Furthermore when Kefa came to Antioch, I opposed him publicly, because he was clearly in the wrong. For prior to the arrival of certain people from the community headed by Ya'akov, he had been eating with the Gentile believers; but when they came, he withdrew and separated himself, because he was afraid of the faction who favored circumcising Gentile believers. And the other Jewish believers became hypocrites along with him, so that even BarNabba was led astray by their hypocrisy. But when I saw that they were not walking a straight path, keeping in line with the truth of the Good News, I said to Kefa, right in front of everyone, "if you who are a Jew, live like a goy and not like a Jew, why are you forcing the Goyim to live like Jews? We are Jews by birth, not so called Goyishe sinners; even so, we have come to realize that a person is not declared righteous by God on the ground of his legalistic observance of Torah commands, but through the Messiah Yeshua's trusting faithfulness. Therefore, we too have put our trust in Messiah Yeshua and become faithful to Him in order that we might be declared righteous on he ground of the Messiahs trusting faithfulness and not on the ground of our legalistic observance of Torah commands. For on the ground of legalistic observance of Torah commands, no one will be declared righteous.

We are saved by Yeshua's trusting faithfulness, and being one with Him, we too have trusting faithfulness.

 

[Hevosmies]

My floors need done too. How much an hour?

7,50€/hour!

 

[BillG]

you believe the prodigal son has to do with the loss of salvation brother?

In a nutshell?

No.

There is a bit more to it as it is the 3rd parable in a trilogy.
Lost Sheep, Lost Coin being the other 2.
And we must remember the context, Jesus eating with sinners and the Pharisees complaining about it.

Sheep and coin sought out.

Prodical son returns.
If he had lost his salvation or got the point of losing it he would not care about it at all.

Interesting that he is not sought out, but the Father is waiting, and sees him from far off, then runs to him (which was not common practice)

So the prodical has gone astray and is now on his knees.

Does this relate to the lost (non believers) or believers who have gone astray?
Either way does it matter?

Not really because all have repented and returned to the Father.

The fact that the father had been watching and waiting also indicates that the father knew the son would return.

The fact they return is evidence they have not lost their salvation.

Though there will be those who teach they have.
But given the 3 parables that cannot be the case.
Lost found, lost found, came to senses and returns.

 

[Budman]

In a nutshell?

No.

There is a bit more to it as it is the 3rd parable in a trilogy.
Lost Sheep, Lost Coin being the other 2.
And we must remember the context, Jesus eating with sinners and the Pharisees complaining about it.

Sheep and coin sought out.

Prodical son returns.
If he had lost his salvation or got the point of losing it he would not care about it at all.

Interesting that he is not sought out, but the Father is waiting, and sees him from far off, then runs to him (which was not common practice)

So the prodical has gone astray and is now on his knees.

Does this relate to the lost (non believers) or believers who have gone astray?
Either way does it matter?

Not really because all have repented and returned to the Father.

The fact that the father had been watching and waiting also indicates that the father knew the son would return.

The fact they return is evidence they have not lost their salvation.

Though there will be those who teach they have.
But given the 3 parables that cannot be the case.
Lost found, lost found, came to senses and returns.

What's interesting are those who say the Prodigal started as a son, who wandered away and stopped being a son, then came back and was a son again.

The Multiple Regenerations fallacy.

 

[stonesoffire]

7,50€/hour!

Not a bad price but I deal in dollars. lol A plane ticket would wipe me out.

(unless you can drive a tractor. ) lol Do you like hot weather?

 

[NoNameMcgee]

In a nutshell?

No.

There is a bit more to it as it is the 3rd parable in a trilogy.
Lost Sheep, Lost Coin being the other 2.
And we must remember the context, Jesus eating with sinners and the Pharisees complaining about it.

Sheep and coin sought out.

Prodical son returns.
If he had lost his salvation or got the point of losing it he would not care about it at all.

Interesting that he is not sought out, but the Father is waiting, and sees him from far off, then runs to him (which was not common practice)

So the prodical has gone astray and is now on his knees.

Does this relate to the lost (non believers) or believers who have gone astray?
Either way does it matter?

Not really because all have repented and returned to the Father.

The fact that the father had been watching and waiting also indicates that the father knew the son would return.

The fact they return is evidence they have not lost their salvation.

Though there will be those who teach they have.
But given the 3 parables that cannot be the case.
Lost found, lost found, came to senses and returns.

thank you bill i hope it didnt sound like i was assuming anything.... (if it did i am sorry) i just wanted to hear you speak on it....


i value your perspective a lot

.... even when we often disagreed you have been nothing but genuine towards me since day one


God bless you bro

 

[UnderGrace]

I will go on the record to say that anyone who claims "salvation must be earned" as Fran has, is lost.

This is a foundational ........One is saved by coming to God knowing one cannot save themselves ie...apart from works.

Those are His terms.

If we have different/wrong terms then we have not really entered into the covenant??

 

[BillG]

thank you bill i hope it didnt sound like i was assuming anything.... (if it did i am sorry) i just wanted to hear you speak on it....


i value your perspective a lot

.... even when we often disagreed you have been nothing but genuine towards me since day one


God bless you bro

You ask away.
Never feel worried to ask.
I'd much rather that way

 

[NoNameMcgee]

john 6

28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?

29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
1 John 3:4
4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Galatians 2:16
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Romans 3
21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;

22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference

Philippians 3
9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:


Philippians 1:6
6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:
romans 4

5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,

7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.

8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

NNM

A)You need to learn what
BELIEVE MEANS

B)You need to learn what
THE LAW IS.

If you don't know these two concepts,,,you'll never understand the N.T.


1. If one believes in Jesus....
He will obey Jesus.


2. We are no longer under the Law of Moses:
a. The ceremonial Law
b. The civil Law
both of which are part of the 613 laws the Jews had to follow.

BUT

The Moral Law of God will NEVER be abolished...
The 10 commandments which MUST BE OBEYED.

Sorry for the caps,,,,but it's so important.

i added an A and B to make it easier for me to respond


A) I do know what belief means and what it means to believe. Do you?

B) I do know what the law is.... but you don't seem to understand what it is for....


1. How much obedience does your definition of belief require?


2. You believe your salvation depends on how well you uphold the commandments? Would you share with me what you believe the cut off point to be?