Not By Works
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UG wanted to make the point to me(unwisely in responding to the sower) that justification is immediate at conversion. In the parable of the sower in the second example, according to UG belief they must of been in a saved state before they fell away. The response I got was: its not about staying saved. Oh well
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Well, it's 2 am here.
I do believe she's reading it now and will answer.
I try hard to understand eternal security...but I really don't.
It's GOD we're talking about here...not our neighbor down the street.
God never changed...Hes' the same yesterday, today and tomorrow.
I hear here a mixture of easy believism, calvinism, it's really confused.
I do believe she's reading it now and will answer.
I try hard to understand eternal security...but I really don't.
It's GOD we're talking about here...not our neighbor down the street.
God never changed...Hes' the same yesterday, today and tomorrow.
I hear here a mixture of easy believism, calvinism, it's really confused.
Controversial is the one who triggered the inspiration for what follows concerning the thief on the cross who was not saved by works. I have added this to my study, it still needs editing, especially for those still leaning on understanding.
Going on to maturity is carried by the Holy Spirit and could be years after the night of following Christ in our understanding:
"Strive to enter in at the straight gate, for many I say to you will seek to enter in and shall not be able."
We come as we are to wait on the Lord and be empowered by His Spirit; powerless otherwise to put away our divided spirit and go on to perfection. The two thieves on the cross with Him, represent the whole world: with free will taken away all that is left is a believer willing to suffer with Him and find mercy, and a would be believer needing proof by being delivered from suffering and given His free will back: to have his life back. But If we live like the thief who wants his like back, we still suffer but our work is in vain, not putting off our old life we have no reward for our work, "But a fearful looking for judgment. "The thief on the cross who believed in Jesus is the first to experience "Having fellowship in the sufferings of Christ, being made conformed to his death." Two obvious reasons and one not so obvious: He believed, and had free will taken, and was not offended to suffer with Him. This is the experience of the night of the Spirit with Jesus, our free will overtaken in the will of God. The dim Light we have in Christ, sufficient influence of Grace to lose our life and follow Him to the Resurrection. "I have the Power to lay down My Life and I have the Power to take it up again." As we seek first the Kingdom of God, we have a glimpse of His Resurrection, by His Spirit sharing His victory with His friends. "In a race all compete but there is only One winner." "This is the rest were You will cause the weary to rest, nor by might not by power but by My Spirit sais the Lord." His yoke is easy, as He already finished the work by Himself, but requires our agreement, "As laborers working together with Him." The work is adjusted for the stronger to bear more of the load and He lets us bear what we can handle to develop in "Faith that works by Love," that we may obtain a crown of Life and not remain among the nations of the saved. Left to follow Him in bearing the Cross as Simon did for the Lord. "Fulfilling what is left behind of the sufferings of Christ for the Church." "A new commandment I give to You, that you Love one another; as I Love You, that you also Love one another." Loving His enemies struggling in pride of achievement under the law to prove themselves to God and insisting others struggle as they do: without seeing Unconditional Love of God. "Those who compare themselves among themselves are not wise." The Holy Spirit giving us rest, we cease from our own labor as God did from His. "Now we are laborers in agreement with God, encouraging you to be reconciled to God." Those who obtain rest from dualistic thinking in knowledge of good and evil are no longer dominated by ego: the fruit of the sin nature is a divided spirit in knowledge of good and evil: I'm right and your wrong. Love is the Power of the Holy Spirit to turn an enemy into a friend. "Let no one turn you away from the simplicity of Christ. "We are delivered from causing divisions as we walk in the Spirit, "Perfect Love delivers us from all fear," and satisfies our heart so that we no longer thirst after the world. As long as we continue to Live in the sight of God and don't take things in our hands again, we remain in the will of God and drink from the source of Living Water. If we fall "We have an advocate with the Father, in Jesus Christ."
Going on to maturity is carried by the Holy Spirit and could be years after the night of following Christ in our understanding:
"Strive to enter in at the straight gate, for many I say to you will seek to enter in and shall not be able."
We come as we are to wait on the Lord and be empowered by His Spirit; powerless otherwise to put away our divided spirit and go on to perfection. The two thieves on the cross with Him, represent the whole world: with free will taken away all that is left is a believer willing to suffer with Him and find mercy, and a would be believer needing proof by being delivered from suffering and given His free will back: to have his life back. But If we live like the thief who wants his like back, we still suffer but our work is in vain, not putting off our old life we have no reward for our work, "But a fearful looking for judgment. "The thief on the cross who believed in Jesus is the first to experience "Having fellowship in the sufferings of Christ, being made conformed to his death." Two obvious reasons and one not so obvious: He believed, and had free will taken, and was not offended to suffer with Him. This is the experience of the night of the Spirit with Jesus, our free will overtaken in the will of God. The dim Light we have in Christ, sufficient influence of Grace to lose our life and follow Him to the Resurrection. "I have the Power to lay down My Life and I have the Power to take it up again." As we seek first the Kingdom of God, we have a glimpse of His Resurrection, by His Spirit sharing His victory with His friends. "In a race all compete but there is only One winner." "This is the rest were You will cause the weary to rest, nor by might not by power but by My Spirit sais the Lord." His yoke is easy, as He already finished the work by Himself, but requires our agreement, "As laborers working together with Him." The work is adjusted for the stronger to bear more of the load and He lets us bear what we can handle to develop in "Faith that works by Love," that we may obtain a crown of Life and not remain among the nations of the saved. Left to follow Him in bearing the Cross as Simon did for the Lord. "Fulfilling what is left behind of the sufferings of Christ for the Church." "A new commandment I give to You, that you Love one another; as I Love You, that you also Love one another." Loving His enemies struggling in pride of achievement under the law to prove themselves to God and insisting others struggle as they do: without seeing Unconditional Love of God. "Those who compare themselves among themselves are not wise." The Holy Spirit giving us rest, we cease from our own labor as God did from His. "Now we are laborers in agreement with God, encouraging you to be reconciled to God." Those who obtain rest from dualistic thinking in knowledge of good and evil are no longer dominated by ego: the fruit of the sin nature is a divided spirit in knowledge of good and evil: I'm right and your wrong. Love is the Power of the Holy Spirit to turn an enemy into a friend. "Let no one turn you away from the simplicity of Christ. "We are delivered from causing divisions as we walk in the Spirit, "Perfect Love delivers us from all fear," and satisfies our heart so that we no longer thirst after the world. As long as we continue to Live in the sight of God and don't take things in our hands again, we remain in the will of God and drink from the source of Living Water. If we fall "We have an advocate with the Father, in Jesus Christ."
if your still in terror of sin, like the jewish nation back then , did the animal that went to slaughter save them from death, or would death catch up with them at some point in there history of being human , it kept there mental state clean to stay in gods good books. kept them living in the real world,trying to please god, jesus came to save not destroy mankind, living his life, but to help there mental state from .fear of sin and fear of death.......................... so we could read about about this 2000 year later in the bible. who already saved you, before the bible got to your book shelf.
so you dont live you life on the book shelf.
so you dont live you life on the book shelf.
You do know that there is only ONE TYPE OF SOIL that Produces FRUIT, don't you ? ? ?
Only the GOOD SOIL, Produces a Harvest. While the other 2 are non-producing FRUIT, EVER. BY THEIR FRUIT YOU WILL KNOW THEM.
And the Soil that seed fell on hard path, is pure unbelievers type of soil, HOWEVER, just because A Sprout showed UP, does not mean it is WHEAT. REMEMBER THE TARES, are NOT WHEAT, YET UNTIL THE WHEAT HEAD FORMS, the ones with the WRONG KIND OF HEAD ON IT ARE NOT CHRISTIANS, THEY ARE WEEDS AND THEY WILL FALL AWAY. By their FRUIT YOU SHALL KNOW THEM.
An Enemy has sowed them into the WHEAT FIELD.
ONLY ONE SOIL WILL PRODUCE A HARVEST OF FRUIT.
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sorry may be i should have explained better,
there is tell people about the salvation , if they reject this that is there choice, paul was in a losing battle between jewish christains and gentile christains,
one could not exit the law, the other never had the law, so playing religion against religion on these forms, seem someone must be having a laugh, unless you know the religion con men , by only seeking true definition to the bible meaning, and cut out religion and seek there own understand to there own lifes, i understand this from your posts, , and i understand the feeling and frustration of this , so do i become and out cast by telling you this. this was not direct to hurt, you in any shape or form, i could write this about all my post. to each and everyone. but the truth will always be an out cast to a lesser understanding person.
there is tell people about the salvation , if they reject this that is there choice, paul was in a losing battle between jewish christains and gentile christains,
one could not exit the law, the other never had the law, so playing religion against religion on these forms, seem someone must be having a laugh, unless you know the religion con men , by only seeking true definition to the bible meaning, and cut out religion and seek there own understand to there own lifes, i understand this from your posts, , and i understand the feeling and frustration of this , so do i become and out cast by telling you this. this was not direct to hurt, you in any shape or form, i could write this about all my post. to each and everyone. but the truth will always be an out cast to a lesser understanding person.
Thank you. Believing in Him brings repentance and sanctification. Does He say if we anything, He will present us blameless or not? Does the word give Him all the glory? Is His Grace effective to transform us...yes His sufficiency.
I am NOT suggesting, even a little, that His commandments are not of concern...eeks, Heaven forbid!!! In man ,though, it is impossible but in Him all things are possible. Thanking Him also for His perserverence to intercede on behalf of His people.
I will continue to ponder, so thank you. I am not a calvinist or any other denomination, just a sheep here. He is my Shepherd and I shall not want....because I am in His able and merciful Hands.
Lord, forgive any unbelief and bring us to Your Glory, even if it hurts. Trusting and believing in His eternal atonement is what bring right standing with God. Sufficiency is His. He gets all the glory, so I am counting on Him to know my heart and to get me where I need to be, not me.
I love this verse, so much...
But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption, so that, just as it is written, " Let him who boasts, boast in the Lord ."
1 Corinthians 1:30-31 NASB
My flesh and hope rest in Him not me.
God bless you and thank you.
I am NOT suggesting, even a little, that His commandments are not of concern...eeks, Heaven forbid!!! In man ,though, it is impossible but in Him all things are possible. Thanking Him also for His perserverence to intercede on behalf of His people.
I will continue to ponder, so thank you. I am not a calvinist or any other denomination, just a sheep here. He is my Shepherd and I shall not want....because I am in His able and merciful Hands.
Lord, forgive any unbelief and bring us to Your Glory, even if it hurts. Trusting and believing in His eternal atonement is what bring right standing with God. Sufficiency is His. He gets all the glory, so I am counting on Him to know my heart and to get me where I need to be, not me.
I love this verse, so much...
But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption, so that, just as it is written, " Let him who boasts, boast in the Lord ."
1 Corinthians 1:30-31 NASB
My flesh and hope rest in Him not me.
God bless you and thank you.
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if you cannot leave , your own home, the earth,if it spiritual, like the parable, the seed was a seed the sower planted , (the word of god) anything god done in the old testament bare witness to his voice or him his intervention with other humans. when we try to sow as the sower we will bear nothing. all glory goes to god. etc
“Cursed is the ground because of you;
through painful toil you will eat food from it
all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you,
and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow
you will eat your food
until you return to the ground,
since from it you were taken;
for dust you are
and to dust you will return.” Genesis 3
is this book in the torah.
is it an insult or did history prove this to be correct.they are tell people about jesus christ, resurrection.
“Cursed is the ground because of you;
through painful toil you will eat food from it
all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you,
and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow
you will eat your food
until you return to the ground,
since from it you were taken;
for dust you are
and to dust you will return.” Genesis 3
is this book in the torah.
is it an insult or did history prove this to be correct.they are tell people about jesus christ, resurrection.
I agree. It is about different responses to the Gospel. Some are no response, some are temporary faith, some are faith with no fruit to perfection, and some are good soil faith.
How many of the four were genuine conversions, (actually three, because there was no profession in one)
Is all belief saving belief?
How many of the four were genuine conversions, (actually three, because there was no profession in one)
Is all belief saving belief?
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