Less than 9% of Christians have a Biblical Worldview

[posthuman]

so its not really something in the bible it has to do with these barna.com research people?

of course the survey did not come word-for-word from the Bible. but the specific questions that the survey asked, which were interpreted as 'Biblical worldview' in the context of the responses, are basic precepts that do seem to come from the Bible.

i reposted the link because i saw a couple of you questioning the methods ((or questioning statistical survey analysis in general)) -- well, the research group of course disclosed their methods. y'all just need to click the link and read it to find the answer to many of these questions, and to have an actual basis of knowledge to argue from, if you want to criticize the study. which is fine, to criticize the study - of course it should be critically analyzed; any statistician would totally agree with that in principle. what any statistician would disagree with, tho, is criticizing a study without knowing any of the details of it. by all means, look critically at the assumptions they made to do the study. but it's silly to just say 'well their assumptions are wrong and this is all meaningless' if you don't actually have any idea what the assumptions actually are.

here's a quote from the link:

For several years, The Barna Group has been tracking how many people possess a “biblical worldview.” The organization defines such a life perspective on the basis of several questions about religious beliefs. The definition requires someone to believe that absolute moral truth exists; that the source of moral truth is the Bible; that the Bible is accurate in all of the principles it teaches; that eternal spiritual salvation cannot be earned; that Jesus lived a sinless life on earth; that every person has a responsibility to share their religious beliefs with others; that Satan is a living force, not just a symbol of evil; and that God is the all-knowing, all-powerful maker of the universe who still rules that creation today. ​

so, they are concluding that a person does not have a worldview that aligns with the Bible if the person does not believe the things described above.
now that you know what they were thinking and what they base their 'Biblical worldview' conclusion on, what do you think?
is it from the Bible, or is it totally human-origin ideas?

i'm just providing y'all with a more legitimate basis for criticism - so we're not just pooh-poohing in ignorance. i'm not defending the study or attacking it, i'm just laying out facts as well as i can find them.

 

[Grandpa]

Did it look like that that thing down there 👇? If so I will keep a look out .
Blessings
Bill

Yep, it looked just like that.

If you find the guy tell him good job...

 

[jaybird88]

Well, yes, research people do the survey to see if one has a marxist worldview or a humanist worldview or a Biblical worldview.

dont you think some of those marxist or humanist read the bible and if one was within those circles it would be a biblical worldview.

 

[jaybird88]

of course the survey did not come word-for-word from the Bible. but the specific questions that the survey asked, which were interpreted as 'Biblical worldview' in the context of the responses, are basic precepts that do seem to come from the Bible.

i reposted the link because i saw a couple of you questioning the methods ((or questioning statistical survey analysis in general)) -- well, the research group of course disclosed their methods. y'all just need to click the link and read it to find the answer to many of these questions, and to have an actual basis of knowledge to argue from, if you want to criticize the study. which is fine, to criticize the study - of course it should be critically analyzed; any statistician would totally agree with that in principle. what any statistician would disagree with, tho, is criticizing a study without knowing any of the details of it. by all means, look critically at the assumptions they made to do the study. but it's silly to just say 'well their assumptions are wrong and this is all meaningless' if you don't actually have any idea what the assumptions actually are.

here's a quote from the link:

For several years, The Barna Group has been tracking how many people possess a “biblical worldview.” The organization defines such a life perspective on the basis of several questions about religious beliefs. The definition requires someone to believe that absolute moral truth exists; that the source of moral truth is the Bible; that the Bible is accurate in all of the principles it teaches; that eternal spiritual salvation cannot be earned; that Jesus lived a sinless life on earth; that every person has a responsibility to share their religious beliefs with others; that Satan is a living force, not just a symbol of evil; and that God is the all-knowing, all-powerful maker of the universe who still rules that creation today. ​

so, they are concluding that a person does not have a worldview that aligns with the Bible if the person does not believe the things described above.
now that you know what they were thinking and what they base their 'Biblical worldview' conclusion on, what do you think?
is it from the Bible, or is it totally human-origin ideas?

i'm just providing y'all with a more legitimate basis for criticism - so we're not just pooh-poohing in ignorance. i'm not defending the study or attacking it, i'm just laying out facts as well as i can find them.

biblical worldview sounds like mainstream doctrine acceptance to me. IMO we should question all teachings of man rather than jump right in blindly.
i dont agree with the worldview quote, guess i dont have a biblical worldview according to this group of men. but then again groups of men have been wrong about many things throughout the history of mankind.

 

[KDW4Him]

And then there is this out of the UK sayin 25% of Christians don't believe the resurrection was literal. Article here What is Christianity then if Jesus wasn't raised from the dead? What is your faith in?

 

[Lanolin]

dont you think some of those marxist or humanist read the bible and if one was within those circles it would be a biblical worldview.

Thats weird why would a marxist or humanist read the bible. And why those two 'isms'.
They could have done a survey that tried to find out the other ismS. Like calvinists and open theists and universalists and rapturists and dispensationalists and adventists....Each would argue they had a biblical worldview....

 

[obedienttogod]

That all sounds awfully end-timezish (is that a word ). Doesn't this sound like some of the very stuff that Paul warned us about in 2 Timothy 3, and then warned Timothy about a chapter later?

2 Timothy 3​

1 But realize this, that in the last days difficult times will come.​

2 For men will be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, arrogant, revilers, disobedient to parents, ungrateful, unholy,​

3 unloving, irreconcilable, malicious gossips, without self-control, brutal, haters of good,​

4 treacherous, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God,​

5 holding to a form of godliness, although they have denied its power; Avoid such men as these.​

​

2 Timothy 4​

3 The time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires,​

4 and will turn away their ears from the truth and will turn aside to myths.​

Pretty depressing stuff, yes Of course, if this really means that the end of this age is drawing nigh, then....................................

~Deut

I agree. It sounds very much as part of the great falling away foretold by both Paul and John.

 

[posthuman]

i dont agree with the worldview quote, guess i dont have a biblical worldview according to this group of men. but then again groups of men have been wrong about many things throughout the history of mankind.

which part?
i'm not sure i believe everyone has a responsibility to share their religious beliefs. i'm taking that to mean that all Christians ought to be evangelists, and i'm not sure that's true. not that some of us ought to hide our beliefs in any way, or refuse to talk about them, but i wonder if 'evangelism' isn't a sort of gift of the Spirit, and that many believers are used by God in many other ways, in other words, we're not all meant to be do missionary work, we're not all cut out to do so, and we're not all even well-versed in doctrine enough to really be trusted to do so. not every part of the body is a mouth, in other words.
in that case, i'd question the survey design, whether that question or set of questions really belongs, or whether it ought to be phrased differently. if i were taking the survey, i imagine i'd pause and have a problem interpreting such questions - which i'd analyze/criticize from what i think is a Biblical worldview but not necessarily answer in a way that they researchers have decided is a 'positive' response.

 

[KDW4Him]

dont you think some of those marxist or humanist read the bible and if one was within those circles it would be a biblical worldview.

And if surveyed would be reflected as such. I think you are diving too deep into the question. Everyone has a worldview, the point is if you say you are Christian then why doesn't your worldview align with Christian principles? If you claimed to have a marxist worldview but touted capitalism and representative democracy principles you wouldn't align with the claim of marxist worldview. It's just that simple.

 

[Lanolin]

And then there is this out of the UK sayin 25% of Christians don't believe the resurrection was literal. Article here What is Christianity then if Jesus wasn't raised from the dead? What is your faith in?

I was thinking they just asked regular churchgoers...I think the Barna people do this research for organisations for pay for large organised churches...if your church is big enough you ask these people to do 'market research' kind of like mystery shopping. Then they make up a survey to figure out what kind of people shop at your church.

After they give you a big report of statistics and pie graphs and all that kind of jazz, you then go out and tailor your sermons to the rest of the 93% who dont believe the Bible.

 

[KDW4Him]

which part?
i'm not sure i believe everyone has a responsibility to share their religious beliefs. i'm taking that to mean that all Christians ought to be evangelists, and i'm not sure that's true. not that some of us ought to hide our beliefs in any way, or refuse to talk about them, but i wonder if 'evangelism' isn't a sort of gift of the Spirit, and that many believers are used by God in many other ways, in other words, we're not all meant to be do missionary work, we're not all cut out to do so, and we're not all even well-versed in doctrine enough to really be trusted to do so. not every part of the body is a mouth, in other words.
in that case, i'd question the survey design, whether that question or set of questions really belongs, or whether it ought to be phrased differently. if i were taking the survey, i imagine i'd pause and have a problem interpreting such questions - which i'd analyze/criticize from what i think is a Biblical worldview but not necessarily answer in a way that they researchers have decided is a 'positive' response.

I didn't take specific gifts or roles to be part of

"For several years, The Barna Group has been tracking how many people possess a “biblical worldview.” The organization defines such a life perspective on the basis of several questions about religious beliefs. The definition requires someone to believe that absolute moral truth exists; that the source of moral truth is the Bible; that the Bible is accurate in all of the principles it teaches; that eternal spiritual salvation cannot be earned; that Jesus lived a sinless life on earth; that every person has a responsibility to share their religious beliefs with others; that Satan is a living force, not just a symbol of evil; and that God is the all-knowing, all-powerful maker of the universe who still rules that creation today."

 

[Lanolin]

Ok if the surveys are basic and lets assume they are all legit and well researched and fair, if 93 percent dont believe the Bible and they go to church reguarly, is it the churches fault or is it these peoples fault for not reading their Bibles. Maybe theres just too many churches where they have preachers who just preach a lecture instead of the Word of God.

 

[posthuman]

I didn't take specific gifts or roles to be part of

"For several years, The Barna Group has been tracking how many people possess a “biblical worldview.” The organization defines such a life perspective on the basis of several questions about religious beliefs. The definition requires someone to believe that absolute moral truth exists; that the source of moral truth is the Bible; that the Bible is accurate in all of the principles it teaches; that eternal spiritual salvation cannot be earned; that Jesus lived a sinless life on earth; that every person has a responsibility to share their religious beliefs with others; that Satan is a living force, not just a symbol of evil; and that God is the all-knowing, all-powerful maker of the universe who still rules that creation today."

• absolute moral truth exists
  • agree
• the source of moral truth is the Bible
  • agree.. sort of - i would state, God is the source of moral truth, and His truth is revealed in the Bible
• the Bible is accurate in all of the principles it teaches
  • agree
• eternal spiritual salvation cannot be earned
  • agree
• Jesus lived a sinless life on earth
  • agree
• every person has a responsibility to share their religious beliefs with others
  • this is IMO open to a bit of interpretation, and i'd personally want to clarify, not sure i totally agree
• Satan is a living force, not just a symbol of evil
  • agree
• God is the all-knowing, all-powerful maker of the universe who still rules that creation today
  • agree

so for me, 6 out of 8 unquestionably agree, 2 out of 8 i would have a small semi-technical issue with, mounting basically to being in terms of phrasing the question accurately. i think the survey methodology would stamp me as 'Biblical worldview'

at any rate, i really doubt that the small amount of questionable interpretation in these 8 facets would make the difference of 17% of Christians and 95% of Christians being identified as having a worldview that aligns with the Bible. there's not an huge amount of wiggle room here. we could pick at this and wind up with *maybe* 25% of nominal Christians actually having a worldview that matches the Bible ((in terms of these 8 things)), at the max end of the statistical window of error, but that's still incredibly disturbing.

 

[KDW4Him]

I was thinking they just asked regular churchgoers...I think the Barna people do this research for organisations for pay for large organised churches...if your church is big enough you ask these people to do 'market research' kind of like mystery shopping. Then they make up a survey to figure out what kind of people shop at your church.

After they give you a big report of statistics and pie graphs and all that kind of jazz, you then go out and tailor your sermons to the rest of the 93% who dont believe the Bible.

Did you read the Barna page?

 

[jaybird88]

which part?
i'm not sure i believe everyone has a responsibility to share their religious beliefs. i'm taking that to mean that all Christians ought to be evangelists, and i'm not sure that's true. not that some of us ought to hide our beliefs in any way, or refuse to talk about them, but i wonder if 'evangelism' isn't a sort of gift of the Spirit, and that many believers are used by God in many other ways, in other words, we're not all meant to be do missionary work, we're not all cut out to do so, and we're not all even well-versed in doctrine enough to really be trusted to do so. not every part of the body is a mouth, in other words.
in that case, i'd question the survey design, whether that question or set of questions really belongs, or whether it ought to be phrased differently. if i were taking the survey, i imagine i'd pause and have a problem interpreting such questions - which i'd analyze/criticize from what i think is a Biblical worldview but not necessarily answer in a way that they researchers have decided is a 'positive' response.

i few parts, but it really shouldnt matter. my views should be fun for debate but not used to decide who is right and wrong. i have always been opposed to groups telling us what to believe.
im not a big supporter of missionary work. we should defiantly talk to others about the bible when the spirit moves us, but IMO many churches are over doing it. i dont get the point in raising millions to send missionaries across the sea to a land that already has churches, bible and preachers, why not let the preachers already there worry about the lost souls. i also get sick of listening to missionaries that come back and will not shut up about how primitive and unsophisticated non western cultures are. you also have the history of missionaries that say one thing and do another liike Hawaii and India.

 

[KDW4Him]

• every person has a responsibility to share their religious beliefs with others
  • this is IMO open to a bit of interpretation, and i'd personally want to clarify, not sure i totally agree

But in it's basic form one who has the Son should share that fact. In a broader form if you have the Son you couldn't conceal it, your joy would be overflowing to the point of others noticing.

 

[KDW4Him]

i dont get the point in raising millions to send missionaries across the sea to a land that already has churches, bible and preachers, why not let the preachers already there worry about the lost souls.

A church service isn't about reaching the lost but equipping us to reach the lost. Eph 4 And didn't Jesus himself say something about taking the Gospel everywhere? Are you saying those aren't Biblical principles?

 

[jaybird88]

A church service isn't about reaching the lost but equipping us to reach the lost. Eph 4 And didn't Jesus himself say something about taking the Gospel everywhere? Are you saying those aren't Biblical principles?

i remember Jesus saying (and doing) feed the hungry, heal the sick, house the homeless. IMO one should be an example first, then a teacher, equipping people without helping people are nothing but empty words.

 

[Locoponydirtman]

100% of survey statistics are affected by the surveyers and or analyst bias. So statistically they are as flawed as the researchers. 100% of humans are flawed.

 

[Lanolin]

Did you read the Barna page?

Yep it said they asked 'practising christians who went to church at least once a month" . I.e churchgoers.
Whether these churchgoers belive the bible is another thing...it doesnt say 'born again christians' just 'practising christans'. Well this could mean something like people who practise but havent yet got the Holy Ghost in them. Like how the disciples were learning but they didnt werent born again and truly believing until pentecost.

Anyway. i would offer there is no way people wouldnt believe what the Bible says or have a 'biblical worldview' without the Holy Ghost. Because he leads us into all truth. Without the gift of salvation, the Bible is just another book to people.