Speaking in tongues

[obedienttogod]

What truth do you run to show them stupid ones?

Tongues is prophecy, the gift of God spoken in other languages other than Hebrew . Look to the foundation of the doctrine of tongues. Isaiah 28

The fulfilment is in Acts 2 .The law reintroduced and defined as confirming God mocking the jews stammering lips as a sign against them who refuse to hear the word of God, prophecy found in 1 Corinthians 14:21-22

For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear. But the word of the Lord was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken. Wherefore hear the word of the Lord, ye scornful men, that rule this people which is in Jerusalem.Isaiah 28

I show them the actual Greek interpretation, since we know Paul wrote Corinthians in Greek!!

 

[obedienttogod]

The gift has not ended just new prophecy .The gift keeps on given.

If you look to the context. For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. It is speaking of prophecy, God's word . Revelation 22: is still the last chapter in the book of prophecy, God's word.

And verse 10 claims they end at the Second coming of Christ, which means they are very much still active today.

 

[garee]

And verse 10 claims they end at the Second coming of Christ, which means they are very much still active today.

I understand that Christ is coming at the end of the age. But the age is not the context as to what we have in part. The context is the word of God prophecy from where we get knowledge of God not seen, it has ceased . Revelation is still the last chapter in the book of prophecy ,God's word. The warning is to not add or substract now that we have the perfect or complete.

 

[notuptome]

And you have no idea as to what a church is … a church is merely a fellowship of individuals.
God gives gifts to individuals within a church for the edification and working of the spiritual life of a church body.
That is why the nine gifts of the Holy Spirit are alive and well and fully operational in a Bible obedient Pentecostal church.

Sorry you just proved you do not know what the church is since the church is by biblical definition. The body of Christ the Bride of Christ and a living organism that Christ is building even to this day. The church is all believers united by the indwelling Holy Spirit.

Local assemblies of the church yep. Men in the church called and gifted to preaching yep.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[notuptome]

The Bible says that that which is in part will be done away. You want them to be done away with already. You are the one 'interpreting away' what the Bible says with his theory.

If you look at the book of Revelation, as a dispensationalist, you must see the prophesying and miracles of the two witnesses as future events. If prophecy has ceased (and God working miracles through people if you hold to that idea-- a cessationist contrivance that has not so much as a misinterpreted proof text behind it), then how do you get the two witnesses prophesying and doing miracles like shutting up the heavens in the end times? Do you revive the gift of prophecy (and miracles if you think it ceased) for another dispensation? That's a very confused way of dealing with scripture, and inconsistent. If the two witnesses prophesy, then it makes no sense to say prophecy will cease before then. And there is no scripture about the working of miracles ceasing ever. It's up to God if He wants to cause that to cease because the saints are transformed if it is no longer necessary, but the Bible teaches nothing about it.

We should interpret Paul's writings about 'that which is in part shall be done away' consistent with what Paul writes in the rest of the book. I Corinthians 1:7 says, 'So that ye come behind in no spiritual gift, waiting for the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.' It makes no sense to argue that Paul thought the very gifts that he was about to write about would cease before the coming of this Lord in like of this verse. We should therefore not teach that these gifts have ceased. Intepreting 'that which is perfect' in this context to refer to the completed canon is a classic case of eisegesis. There is nothing in the passage to support the idea. In fact, there is scripture that argues against it.

The theory does not work out historically, either, since there is evidence that prophecy continued on and was accepted by the church as a legitimate gift in the second century, the third century, and there is evidence for it at later times, especially in the Ante-Nicene time period.

The part is the OT. The OT is the shadow of the things now made open in Christ. The OT expectation of the coming Messiah is completed. Yes the three gifts have ended. What you claim today is not biblical or Spiritual but earthly.

No, I am not just trying to be cute. You just lack some understanding as to what all constitutes charismata. There are people who are gifted to preach the Gospel effectly. So I do not agree that no one gets saved through gifts. God uses other things to help bring people to Christ. Cornelius saw an angel who directed him to call for Peter. He got saved through hearing and believing the word, but there were other circumstances that led him to hear the message and be open to it. In his case, an angel appeared to him. In the case of some of the Samaritans, seeing Philip perform signs among them encouraged them to pay careful attention to the Gospel. In Sergius Paulus' case, he believed the word he heard preached, but he believed it after he saw Paul declare Elymas blind and it came to pass. There are plenty of people who hear the word and believe without seeing a miracle. But God may use circumstances to open their hearts up. They might witness a Christian's prayer being answered or other things that do not have much to do with the Christians in their lives.

People get saved by grace through faith, and faith comes by hearing, and hearing through the word of God. But that does not mean that spiritual gifts or other things the Lord has happen to them does not help them to come to faith.

To say that spiritual gifts can have nothing to do with individuals being saved is not Biblical.

It is what the bible clearly states. The gospel is propagated by preaching not by wonders or miracles or tongues as claimed by the charismatic or Pentecostal assemblies.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[notuptome]

look whose talking, LOl uses pagan practices to discredit the word of God.

This is a baseless accusation. Good luck.

Re 2:4 Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Dino246]

The part is the OT. The OT is the shadow of the things now made open in Christ. The OT expectation of the coming Messiah is completed. Yes the three gifts have ended. What you claim today is not biblical or Spiritual but earthly.

I suggest you rethink this. If by "in part", Paul meant the old covenant, he would therefore mean that the perfect had already come at that time, and wouldn't be talking about what would happen in the future. He wouldn't say that tongues "would" cease, because they would have already ceased before he left Antioch the first time.

 

[CS1]

This is a baseless accusation. Good luck.

Re 2:4 Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

take your meds

 

[obedienttogod]

I understand that Christ is coming at the end of the age. But the age is not the context as to what we have in part. The context is the word of God prophecy from where we get knowledge of God not seen, it has ceased . Revelation is still the last chapter in the book of prophecy ,God's word. The warning is to not add or substract now that we have the perfect or complete.

There are events from the Book of Daniel, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, the minor prophets, Matthew, some of Paul's writings, and obviously the Book of Revelation yet to be fulfilled. So, until these are fulfilled, Tribulation takes place, the sun turns to darkness and the moon to blood, then Jesus returns and the angels gather the Elect, every gift of the Holy Spirit is still active.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but your answers make it obvious that you don't have a clue about how to interpret scripture!!

 

[Waggles]

Sorry you just proved you do not know what the church is since the church is by biblical definition. The body of Christ the Bride of Christ and a living organism that Christ is building even to this day. The church is all believers united by the indwelling Holy Spirit.

Therefore the gifts of the Holy Spirit are given to individuals within a church body - not to the church.
To one is given the gift of … to another is given the gift of … individual saints put into operation the gifts of the Holy Spirit.
One exercises the gift of speaking in an unknown tongue, another person gives an interpretation by the Spirit, afterwards
individuals operate the gifts of prophesying for the edification of the church body.
Gifts of knowledge and wisdom are given to individuals. The working of miracles along with the gifts of faith and healing apply
specifically to the people directly involved in exercising these gifts (often with laying hands on a person with needs).

The church does have descriptive titles as you mentioned, but it is still an ecclesia (an assembly of believers) for worship.
All the Christians in a particular city, whether they assembled together in one place or in several places for religious worship,
were an ecclesia. Thus all the disciples in Antioch, forming several congregations, were one church ( Acts 13:1 ); so also we read
of the "church of God at Corinth" ( 1 Corinthians 1:2 ), "the church at Jerusalem" ( Acts 8:1 ), "the church of Ephesus" ( Revelation 2:1 ).

And the nine gifts of the Holy Spirit are alive and well and functioning within my Pentecostal church, and distributed to individuals
as believers seek to use these gifts within the life and vitality of the body of Christ.

 

[notuptome]

I suggest you rethink this. If by "in part", Paul meant the old covenant, he would therefore mean that the perfect had already come at that time, and wouldn't be talking about what would happen in the future. He wouldn't say that tongues "would" cease, because they would have already ceased before he left Antioch the first time.

Please read carefully. The NT had not yet been completed by inspiration of the Holy Spirit. The NT show the fulfillment of the OT promises. The OT is the promise of God that a Redeemer shall come to Israel and to the world.

For the cause of Christ
Roge

 

[notuptome]

take your meds

I pity you.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[notuptome]

Therefore the gifts of the Holy Spirit are given to individuals within a church body - not to the church.
To one is given the gift of … to another is given the gift of … individual saints put into operation the gifts of the Holy Spirit.
One exercises the gift of speaking in an unknown tongue, another person gives an interpretation by the Spirit, afterwards
individuals operate the gifts of prophesying for the edification of the church body.
Gifts of knowledge and wisdom are given to individuals. The working of miracles along with the gifts of faith and healing apply
specifically to the people directly involved in exercising these gifts (often with laying hands on a person with needs).

The church does have descriptive titles as you mentioned, but it is still an ecclesia (an assembly of believers) for worship.
All the Christians in a particular city, whether they assembled together in one place or in several places for religious worship,
were an ecclesia. Thus all the disciples in Antioch, forming several congregations, were one church ( Acts 13:1 ); so also we read
of the "church of God at Corinth" ( 1 Corinthians 1:2 ), "the church at Jerusalem" ( Acts 8:1 ), "the church of Ephesus" ( Revelation 2:1 ).

And the nine gifts of the Holy Spirit are alive and well and functioning within my Pentecostal church, and distributed to individuals
as believers seek to use these gifts within the life and vitality of the body of Christ.

It is all the body of Christ, every believer that has been made clean through the blood of Christ.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Dino246]

Please read carefully. The NT had not yet been completed by inspiration of the Holy Spirit. The NT show the fulfillment of the OT promises. The OT is the promise of God that a Redeemer shall come to Israel and to the world.

For the cause of Christ
Roge

We disagree. I'm not going to put further effort into convincing you of the logical inconsistency of your view.

 

[notuptome]

We disagree. I'm not going to put further effort into convincing you of the logical inconsistency of your view.

I see your view as the one that is logically inconsistent. You view conflicts with scripture and is skewed to support a behavior that is not biblical. It simply does not reflect Christ as the center of your belief.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Kavik]

The proper Greek translation claims the word TONGUES, in this verse from Paul, actually is referring to our human languages that we speak,

Yes - when it comes to something spoken, all Biblical references to "tongues" refer to real, rational language(s).

 

[Dino246]

I see your view as the one that is logically inconsistent. You view conflicts with scripture and is skewed to support a behavior that is not biblical. It simply does not reflect Christ as the center of your belief.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

So you turn and attack my faith. I leave you to your slander.

 

[notuptome]

So you turn and attack my faith. I leave you to your slander.

Attack your faith? Not so much as question whether tongues have replaced Christ as the love of your life. I can only hope that you have Christ as the center but I really do.

Re 2:4 Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love.

We all must use care that we do not become like those warned in the church at Ephesus.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Dino246]

Attack your faith? Not so much as question whether tongues have replaced Christ as the love of your life. I can only hope that you have Christ as the center but I really do.

Re 2:4 Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love.

We all must use care that we do not become like those warned in the church at Ephesus.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

You are an ignorant fool indeed if you think that the thoughts I express in this thread represent the sum total of my relationship with Jesus.

 

[notuptome]

You are an ignorant fool indeed if you think that the thoughts I express in this thread represent the sum total of my relationship with Jesus.

Where exacrly do I find the evidence of the Holy Spirit in that statement?

For the cause of Christ
Roger